What will happen to all the "traditional" mines once the new ASIC based miners

[LordGreynick]

What will happen to all the "traditional" mines once the new ASIC based miners hit the market?

Apologies if there is already a thread on this but I searched and couldn't find it easily. I'm a slow reader

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[greyhawk]

[LordGreynick]

lol @ greyhawk

so, market forces will just kill traditional GPU based mining pretty much overnight unless ASIC based is all just a scam?

i really do feel for those that have invested into GPU based mines although i suspect their investment is already paid back if they got into it early enough

[memvola]

so, market forces will just kill traditional GPU based mining pretty much overnight unless ASIC based is all just a scam?

There are many different ASIC development companies, it's implausible that all of them are scams. It's just a pretty straightforward but challenging process.

i really do feel for those that have invested into GPU based mines although i suspect their investment is already paid back if they got into it early enough

"if" is the key word. I suspect most mining operations have been a net loss, and it's probably a good indicator.

By the way, check out this thread. CoinLab is developing a platform that will rent your GPU for various tasks and pay you in BTC.

[mtminer]

so, market forces will just kill traditional GPU based mining pretty much overnight unless ASIC based is all just a scam?

There are many different ASIC development companies, it's implausible that all of them are scams. It's just a pretty straightforward but challenging process.

i really do feel for those that have invested into GPU based mines although i suspect their investment is already paid back if they got into it early enough

"if" is the key word. I suspect most mining operations have been a net loss, and it's probably a good indicator.

By the way, check out this thread. CoinLab is developing a platform that will rent your GPU for various tasks and pay you in BTC.

I haven't seen that one before. Anyone had any luck using that pool? Seems like a neat idea to make some more money off my existing hardware.

[tacotime]

mine litecoin

[memvola]

I haven't seen that one before. Anyone had any luck using that pool? Seems like a neat idea to make some more money off my existing hardware.

I've been using it for some time now. It's a very big challenge, I hope they succeed.

[Korbman]

so, market forces will just kill traditional GPU based mining pretty much overnight unless ASIC based is all just a scam?

Other than CoinLab or other similar mining pools, it's quite probable most GPU mining will cease. There's no way even many of the top GPU rigs would be able to keep up with the power ASICs bring to the table.

[hamdi]

we will see a flood of ATI GPU`s on ebay for sale.

and a lot of bitcoiners will end up with a big paypal balance 

[bobitza]

What will happen to all the "traditional" mines once the new ASIC based miners hit the market?

This.

...it's quite probable most GPU mining will cease. There's no way even many of the top GPU rigs would be able to keep up with the power ASICs bring to the table.

I couldn't said it better myself.

lol @greyhawk ; nice find.

[vitruvio]

Many people claim to have free electricity, or is a gamer so won't stop his GPU.

Regards

[crazyates]

Many people claim to have free electricity, or is a gamer so won't stop his GPU.

Regards

If i'm mining with 150GH/s of ASICs, why would I both doubling my power consumption for a measly 700MH/s from my 7970? Even if I did have free electric, the heat isn't worth the pennies I'll make in a day.

I can't wait for ASICs so I can turn my gaming computer off!

[regular]

I'm surprised not more people are using Coinlab to hedge their GPU mining.

[vitruvio]

Many people claim to have free electricity, or is a gamer so won't stop his GPU.

Regards

If i'm mining with 150GH/s of ASICs, why would I both doubling my power consumption for a measly 700MH/s from my 7970? Even if I did have free electric, the heat isn't worth the pennies I'll make in a day.

I can't wait for ASICs so I can turn my gaming computer off!

I agree, I have only have one GPU and I've ordered a couple of jalapeños, when received I'll stop mining with my GPU, even with free electricity, PC components will suffer working 24/7, and will not be payed with so little profit.

Regards

[Korbman]

If i'm mining with 150GH/s of ASICs, why would I both doubling my power consumption for a measly 700MH/s from my 7970? Even if I did have free electric, the heat isn't worth the pennies I'll make in a day.

Exactly. And as vitruvio pointed out, even with free power, running your GPU 24/7 at near max power (or even overclocked) is far from beneficial to the hardware. Don't burn out the hardware in your sexy gaming PC just for a few more MH/s! 

[Sitarow]

If i'm mining with 150GH/s of ASICs, why would I both doubling my power consumption for a measly 700MH/s from my 7970? Even if I did have free electric, the heat isn't worth the pennies I'll make in a day.

Exactly. And as vitruvio pointed out, even with free power, running your GPU 24/7 at near max power (or even overclocked) is far from beneficial to the hardware. Don't burn out the hardware in your sexy gaming PC just for a few more MH/s! 

I try to get the best Mh/s per watt that I can. So I run at

Max 6990 at 850 Mhz 150 Mhz  1.05v
Min  6990 at 775 Mhz 150 Mhz  1.05v

5970 at 700 Mhz   266 Mhz  0.968v

Max 5870 at 800 Mhz 266 Mhz  0.968v
Min 5870 at 775 Mhz 266 Mhz  0.9v

5830 at 700 Mhz   266 Mhz 0.968v

[ElectricMucus]

so, market forces will just kill traditional GPU based mining pretty much overnight unless ASIC based is all just a scam?

There are many different ASIC development companies, it's implausible that all of them are scams. It's just a pretty straightforward but challenging process.

Interesting tell me more.It may be just that.

[yrtrnc]

Judgement day perhaps?

[Xfinity]

Judgement day perhaps?

This!

On topic, I have sold all my GPU rigs and moved on to ASICs.

[Graet]

I'm surprised not more people are using Coinlab to hedge their GPU mining.

I'm not, they have stated their goal is distributed processing on nvidia hardware - ati wont be optimum for the work they are planning. 
99.99% of gpus on Bitcoin are ATI...


on topic my 6950s have well paid for themselves and I have sold the good ones off, my 7970s I could sell and they would cover their cost i.e. earnt Bitcoin + resale value
I have 2 FPGA that will run after I turn off GPUs, not sure if they will cover their costs, but being dev boards I can sell them to someone not planning to Bitcoin mine on them when thier time comes.
I was lucky enough to win a spot in the jalepeno que on a raffle - never trusted BFL enough to send them money, but gambling a few coins in a raffle? no worries
I did order a bASIC and look forward to turning off my hot GPU's now that (my) summer is rapidly approaching

from what I see a lot of "traditional" mines are either stopping mining or moving to next generation mining hardware, everyone has their own situation to consider - hey, even today people still mine Bitcoins on CPU, I am sure in 6 months time there will be "free power" people claiming gpus still make them Bitcoins. which for the returns defies sense

The big change I see coming is newer miners wont be able to jump in and try on existing hardware, mining has brought a lot of people to Bitcoin, soon they will need to buy dedicated hardware to participate.

my 0.0000002BTC worth

[Korbman]

The big change I see coming is newer miners wont be able to jump in and try on existing hardware, mining has brought a lot of people to Bitcoin, soon they will need to buy dedicated hardware to participate.

You bring up a very good point. Given that most tech savvy individuals (really anyone with a computer) have some sort of graphics card in their computer, it was super easy to get into bitcoin and mining. Most participants I know in my [real] life tried out mining just for fun with the hardware they had. At the rate we're going, those same individuals probably wouldn't find the same interest in bitcoin once they learn that serious miners have to dedicate their money to certain hardware.

It's one thing to invest in a high end graphics card that can serve a purpose besides mining, it's a whole other game when the hardware can only do 1 thing.

[crazyates]

They're not for serious miners, but I see Jalapenos as filling that role. Something small that people can get started on.

Still not the same as "Hey, let me turn on my GPU"...

[firefop]

The big change I see coming is newer miners wont be able to jump in and try on existing hardware, mining has brought a lot of people to Bitcoin, soon they will need to buy dedicated hardware to participate.

You bring up a very good point. Given that most tech savvy individuals (really anyone with a computer) have some sort of graphics card in their computer, it was super easy to get into bitcoin and mining. Most participants I know in my [real] life tried out mining just for fun with the hardware they had. At the rate we're going, those same individuals probably wouldn't find the same interest in bitcoin once they learn that serious miners have to dedicate their money to certain hardware.

It's one thing to invest in a high end graphics card that can serve a purpose besides mining, it's a whole other game when the hardware can only do 1 thing.

I understand what you're saying, but I don't think that you drew the correct assumption. As a gamer, if I'm willing to drop 400-600 bucks on a new video card every time one releases, I shouldn't have any problem buying hardware in that same price range if I want to mine.... I could still see some fractional generation of btc as from a video card to 'test it out' enough to decide to buy hardware or not. At some point it becomes a way to earn vs a hobby.

And I'd rather spend on a product that will let me game while mining... Instead of having to choose between income and gaming time.
 

[Transisto]

Take no offense but I think the community will improve with less interest from gamers.

The big change I see coming is newer miners wont be able to jump in and try on existing hardware, mining has brought a lot of people to Bitcoin, soon they will need to buy dedicated hardware to participate.

... As a gamer, if I'm willing to drop 400-600 bucks on a new video card every time one releases, I shouldn't have any problem buying hardware in that same price range if I want to mine.... I could still see some fractional generation of btc as from a video card to 'test it out' enough to decide to buy hardware or not. At some point it becomes a way to earn vs a hobby.

And I'd rather spend on a product that will let me game while mining... Instead of having to choose between income and gaming time.

You will be mining BTCs on a GPU the way you would now with CPUs.  -Completely irrelevant amounts.

[RaTTuS]

in the old days it was easy to get into bitcoins
download the client and run it on your cpu's
then came gpu mining
a bit harder download a miner , find a pool , and join and run it ..., don't bother with cpu mining
next year sometime gpu mining will be out..
it will be hard for people to get into mining
though more people will want to buy coins, the exchanges will become even bigger ,
mining will be more centralised.

[Korbman]

I understand what you're saying, but I don't think that you drew the correct assumption. As a gamer, if I'm willing to drop 400-600 bucks on a new video card every time one releases, I shouldn't have any problem buying hardware in that same price range if I want to mine.... I could still see some fractional generation of btc as from a video card to 'test it out' enough to decide to buy hardware or not. At some point it becomes a way to earn vs a hobby.

And I'd rather spend on a product that will let me game while mining... Instead of having to choose between income and gaming time.

Right, but you're a dedicated miner with disposable income (or at least this is my assumption). What I'm saying is that the bar to entry has been raised for the average joe-shmoe, which makes it that much more likely they won't develop the same interest in bitcoin mining as me or you.

[HDSolar]

My thoughts on this are that with Bitcoin you have a legacy or stable example of crypto currency but as others come about those will offer options for different kinds of equipment to operate that currency.  I almost see this as Bitcoin being the gold standard while others become Siliver, Coper and other precious metals as an example of what could happen in the near future.  As specialized equipment and or code develops over time others will establish options to utilize existing tools to develop less developed projects.  Actually I think this is a great time for all of us because we are getting in and establishing what could be a major effort my only question is what will it turn into as we go.  Now this is all just a guess and by no means am I saying that bitcoin is the gold standard that it will be that way but for now that is how it looks. 
My two cents 

[tacotime]

Today marks the day I switch to litecoin mining, as one the diff change in 10hr for btc I'll be making less mining BTC.  Come join me at http://ltc.kattare.com , just set cgminer --scrypt -g 1 --shaders [number for your card] and then raise your memory speed

[vitruvio]

You did your calculations, I guess. Were you aware that a GPU mining LTC spends more energy that mining BTC?

Regards

[tacotime]

You did your calculations, I guess. Were you aware that a GPU mining LTC spends more energy that mining BTC?

Regards

yeah, but even with the extra 70w i'll be making more with the diff increase.  bitcoin's diff is rising way faster than its price.  not only this, but ltc in going up in value way faster than btc.

[firefop]

Right, but you're a dedicated miner with disposable income (or at least this is my assumption). What I'm saying is that the bar to entry has been raised for the average joe-shmoe, which makes it that much more likely they won't develop the same interest in bitcoin mining as me or you.

Granted - but I think the trade off there is we'll start to see new investors backing bitcoin based businesses... due the increased hash power and much greater stability in the market side. I'm expecting the transactions per block capacity of the network to increase quickly once asics are in the wild... and that should start opening doors to let bitcoin compete with existing payment processing networks (bankwires,  western union, etc).

It should start an upward spiral... the faster the network, the better chance of getting outside money to build a POS system or some service leveraged through existing market penetration --- which would lead to more transaction fees being collected which would help offset the increase in network hash rate (from a mining perspective) and on and on... eventually making mining profitable for the transaction fees, nevermind the block reward.

[Stephen Gornick]

What will happen to all the "traditional" mines once the new ASIC based miners hit the market?

Those with NVidia hardware might want to look at CoinLab's program:

Protect your future GPU mining earnings with CoinLab's 95-97% PPS Pool
  - http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=99643.0


There may be other computational work developments as well.  For example:
 - http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=119611.0
 - http://www.HashBounty.net
 - https://vanitypool.appspot.com/faq

[Edited:  Added Vanitypool mining.]

[Odi]

I was late to the GPU game (found out about BTC in July 2011 and didn't get any hardware worth using until August 2011).  I mined in a pool until I made back my $200 investment in 2x5770's (but I held the BTC instead of selling them), then switched to solo mining with 400MH/s when the pool I was in was eventually shut down because the owner didn't have time to maintain it.  The heat and energy cost was minor (it's just 2 GPUs and I leave my computer on anyway), so I didn't mind paying an extra monthly expense knowing that I could possibly never find a block.

I was lucky and found 2 blocks solo mining in 10 months (the best way is to forget it is in the background...I didn't even know I had found the second block in July until last week when I needed to reboot my computer).  So I used those two lucky blocks to pre-order a bASIC, but if it never shows up, I will probably point that measly 400MH/s to solo mining anyway even if other ASICs deliver.

[abbeytim]

a bunch will switch to ltc (litecoin) mining

[Stephen Gornick]

a bunch will switch to ltc (litecoin) mining

Every time I see that assertion I think of this:




With Bitcoin about $80K USD worth of bitcoins are distributed to the hashing provided by miners.   With Litecoin that is about $2K USD worth of LTC issuance.

Since each addtional GPU becomes essentially another mouth to feed it lowers the revenue for the other miners.  The reason the GPUs will be arriving is because they could no longer mine bitcoin profitably.  They won't stick with mining LTC unless it too can be done so profitably.

i.e., it soon will be time to power down your GPU rigs.

[crazyates]

a bunch will switch to ltc (litecoin) mining

Every time I see that assertion I think of this:




With Bitcoin about $80K USD worth of bitcoins are distributed to the hashing provided by miners.   With Litecoin that is about $2K USD worth of LTC issuance.

Since each addtional GPU becomes essentially another mouth to feed it lowers the revenue for the other miners.  The reason the GPUs will be arriving is because they could no longer mine bitcoin profitably.  They won't stick with mining LTC unless it too can be done so profitably.

i.e., it soon will be time to power down your GPU rigs.

I think most people who are going to jump to LTC will do so hoping the price will increase. But then I wonder, if they're expecting the price to increase just to the point it's profitable, why is the price not going up today, when you can buy them for cheap? My only conclusion: nobody cares.

[Korbman]

I think most people who are going to jump to LTC will do so hoping the price will increase. But then I wonder, if they're expecting the price to increase just to the point it's profitable, why is the price not going up today, when you can buy them for cheap? My only conclusion: nobody cares.

Haha you're probably quite right on this one. I started mining litecoins a few weeks ago, but I don't really see the point. If anything, the price of LTC/BTC is going down.

[tonto]

Many people claim to have free electricity, or is a gamer so won't stop his GPU.

Regards

This.  I've always kept my machine on even before discovering bitcoins.  I typically ran various distributed networking projects such as folding@home, distributed.net, etc.  Plus I'm a pretty avid gamer and will always have top-of-the-line (or a few months old) vid cards and might as well have them contribute to mining.  I may stop them once they become the equivalent of crappier CPUs (that is, only contributing like .5% or worse of my total hashing power).  But I'll only do that to quiet down my man-cave and make my place of Zen again
 
Or if I can figure out how to use the wasted heat from the cards to heat my fish tank, I'll keep 'em going and turn off my tank heaters (since my PC is on a UPS and my fish tank heaters aren't)