Should people who promote ponzis in their signature be given a negative trust?

[winspiral]

Months ago I was punished...severely punished with 2 negative trust points for my investment system (taken for a ponzi) in my signature:

http://bitcoin.winspiral.net

Since it is always in my signature...but since investors endind 100 days plan have all been paid...

As far as I can see, outside of that horrifically sloppy, barely functional, website of yours, you haven't actually explained where the profit comes from.

Stating that a bunch of investors have all been 'paid' is not proof that you're not using new investors money to repay old.

If you cannot explain how an 'investor' is earning money through your site then it has to be assumed you are not running a legitimate operation.

if I say you the profit comes from my poket you will not believe it or you will believe i'm a fool...

i will return your questions:
lets suppose i proof i have incomes...(it is a supposition)
what will prof that I am not a scammer?
what will proof that I do not only pay investors with new investments?

The problem for investors is that all investment webmasters are potentially scammers...
But the topic is not here...
Proof of income does not avoid scam...
The topic is that people are accuse ponzi scammers without proof...

I can only proof one thing:
In my system i never promise something...
So if I do not make profit...I just return the capital without profit...how can I proof now what i will do in 100 days?
or about my U2cloudmining...
How can I proove that I will pay in the future what i even not promise in the present...
About my U2cloudmining system...
I accept that it is said that it is risky for investors and more risky for big investors...ok
Thant the profit can be low...ok
But I am sorry,I can not accept that it is said my systems are ponzi shames or that i am a scammer.
Warn people so much you want...You will never warn more than meself...
But please do not accuse me like scammer.

The most of big investors of my systems are friends i know already for years...
Do you believe that i will scam them?
The most of investment from my friends has been earned from my systems all over the 20 years...
they know that even if i have sad problems...it will be more hard for winspiral than for investors...

if you interess yourself at my systems...you see that it is always "limited"
...the U2cloudmining is limited...if tou much invested...it is given back because investment means buying shares and buying shares means selling shares...it is a kind of "shift"...
...the 100 days plan..;if you follox you can see that 90% of investment is given back long before the 100 days...

Have a nice day...

[winspiral]

I see one thing...so far none of my investors has been scammed.
They have only made profit...
My red trust points have just help some members here to avoid earning satoshi...
Much thanks dear red trusters...(lol)
I hope you can sleep well...
Have a nice day.

[Aggressor66]

Nobody's taking the Ponzi nonsense seriously anymore because it requires 10 minutes of research to see why it's wrong.
Might want to catch up 

[winspiral]

Nobody's taking the Ponzi nonsense seriously anymore because it requires 10 minutes of research to see why it's wrong.
Might want to catch up 

you are right...
but if people believe that you run a ponzi and it is wrong...what do you do then?
Do you say yes and amen?

[Aggressor66]

Nobody's taking the Ponzi nonsense seriously anymore because it requires 10 minutes of research to see why it's wrong.
Might want to catch up 

you are right...
but if people believe that you run a ponzi and it is wrong...what do you do then?
Do you say yes and amen?

I would never say yes to Ponzi (fraudulent investment).
Most people probably will never going to see there money (investment) again.
The bottom line is with Bitcoin being pricey, it is always luring to find a way to get some for free.

[winspiral]

Nobody's taking the Ponzi nonsense seriously anymore because it requires 10 minutes of research to see why it's wrong.
Might want to catch up 

you are right...
but if people believe that you run a ponzi and it is wrong...what do you do then?
Do you say yes and amen?

I would never say yes to Ponzi (fraudulent investment).
Most people probably will never going to see there money (investment) again.
The bottom line is with Bitcoin being pricey, it is always luring to find a way to get some for free.

Sorry I do not understand the single word of what you mean...

[Raja_MBZ]

IMHO, people who promote ponzi in their signature should NOT by given any sort of trust. That honestly doesn't make sense at all. Everyone understands that there is a risk involved in investing in ponzis/HYIP's, so it's their choice. Other than this, no one would actually put any already-turned-scam ponzi website in their signature space.

Maybe this trend should be re-considered.

[minifrij]

Everyone understands that there is a risk involved in investing in ponzis/HYIP's, so it's their choice.

No, they don't. That is the problem. Newbies see 'Multiply your BTC 2x' and don't understand how the program works, therefore possibly getting scammed.

[winspiral]

Everyone understands that there is a risk involved in investing in ponzis/HYIP's, so it's their choice.

No, they don't. That is the problem. Newbies see 'Multiply your BTC 2x' and don't understand how the program works, therefore possibly getting scammed.

Then explain them the risk...
Then work for forbiding if it is illegal...
the problem is that it is allowed on this forum but red trusted...
and above all if truster see ponzi shemes and scam where no scam is the forum does more confuse that help...
and a forum is not here to do confuse...
People saying I'm a ponzi runner or a scammer do not help the community...Who can admit that every one whi has not proved hes innocence is guilty?
In what kind of world do lieve the red trusters here?

[minifrij]

Then explain them the risk...

However, people don't. People that run/promote Ponzis and HYIPs are not interested in making sure their investors are safe, they are interested in making a profit. If everyone knew how Ponzis worked I'm sure they would get significantly less interest from new users.

the problem is that it is allowed on this forum but red trusted...
and above all if truster see ponzi shemes and scam where no scam is the forum does more confuse that help...

Ponzis inevitably scam due to how they work. You will never find a truly 'legit' Ponzi, as it is impossible. The forum allows these schemes to be posted, however that does not mean that they are trustworthy.
By members marking the people running/promoting these Ponzis, it shows that these users are untrustworthy and to use caution investing in the schemes. People are free to run and promote them, just as others are free to mark them as untrustworthy.

Who can admit that every one whi has not proved hes innocence is guilty?

That is how it has to work on this forum, else truly innocent people get scammed. Especially since Bitcoin is irreversible, if users were to give people running websites like Ponzis the benefit of the doubt and assume their business model is viable they will inevitably be scammed (as the business model would not be viable and the coins would not be returned).
If someone is running a site like this and they can prove the viability of the site's income then people will trust them. Otherwise, they cannot be trusted without innocent people losing their money.

[winspiral]

Then explain them the risk...

However, people don't. People that run/promote Ponzis and HYIPs are not interested in making sure their investors are safe, they are interested in making a profit. If everyone knew how Ponzis worked I'm sure they would get significantly less interest from new users.

the problem is that it is allowed on this forum but red trusted...
and above all if truster see ponzi shemes and scam where no scam is the forum does more confuse that help...

Ponzis inevitably scam due to how they work. You will never find a truly 'legit' Ponzi, as it is impossible. The forum allows these schemes to be posted, however that does not mean that they are trustworthy.
By members marking the people running/promoting these Ponzis, it shows that these users are untrustworthy and to use caution investing in the schemes. People are free to run and promote them, just as others are free to mark them as untrustworthy.

Who can admit that every one whi has not proved hes innocence is guilty?

That is how it has to work on this forum, else truly innocent people get scammed. Especially since Bitcoin is irreversible, if users were to give people running websites like Ponzis the benefit of the doubt and assume their business model is viable they will inevitably be scammed (as the business model would not be viable and the coins would not be returned).
If someone is running a site like this and they can prove the viability of the site's income then people will trust them. Otherwise, they cannot be trusted without innocent people losing their money.

if I understand well:
You agree that I am red trusted even if i have never run or promoted a ponzi sheme.
You agree that I am red trusted just because people believe that I run a ponzi sheme and promote it.
The funniest in this story is that i have never promised the single satoshi in profit...
The only promise i have done is that I refund 100% of the investment after 100 days...
How can i prove that I will give back the investisment?
If I red trust you and ask you to prove that you will be honnest in the next 100 days...how can you prove it? (lol)
And just saying that my disign is horrible and my English poor...is very poor for an complement of argument.

[shorena]

Then explain them the risk...

However, people don't. People that run/promote Ponzis and HYIPs are not interested in making sure their investors are safe, they are interested in making a profit. If everyone knew how Ponzis worked I'm sure they would get significantly less interest from new users.

the problem is that it is allowed on this forum but red trusted...
and above all if truster see ponzi shemes and scam where no scam is the forum does more confuse that help...

Ponzis inevitably scam due to how they work. You will never find a truly 'legit' Ponzi, as it is impossible. The forum allows these schemes to be posted, however that does not mean that they are trustworthy.
By members marking the people running/promoting these Ponzis, it shows that these users are untrustworthy and to use caution investing in the schemes. People are free to run and promote them, just as others are free to mark them as untrustworthy.

Who can admit that every one whi has not proved hes innocence is guilty?

That is how it has to work on this forum, else truly innocent people get scammed. Especially since Bitcoin is irreversible, if users were to give people running websites like Ponzis the benefit of the doubt and assume their business model is viable they will inevitably be scammed (as the business model would not be viable and the coins would not be returned).
If someone is running a site like this and they can prove the viability of the site's income then people will trust them. Otherwise, they cannot be trusted without innocent people losing their money.

if I understand well:
You agree that I am red trusted even if i have never run or promoted a ponzi sheme.
You agree that I am red trusted just because people believe that I run a ponzi sheme and promote it.
The funniest in this story is that i have never promised the single satoshi in profit...
The only promise i have done is that I refund 100% of the investment after 100 days...
How can i prove that I will give back the investisment?
If I red trust you and ask you to prove that you will be honnest in the next 100 days...how can you prove it? (lol)
And just saying that my disign is horrible and my English poor...is very poor for an complement of argument.

It seems you have forgotten, so as a reminder if you can answer the remaining 3 out of 4 questions[1] I will remove the rating. You have demonstrated in the past that you are unable to unwilling to do so. I also offered you to find someone (e.g. one of your investors) that can explain your model to me. I have not been approached by anyone. All I ever read are your passive aggressive posts.

[1] https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1183602.msg12483785#msg12483785

[winspiral]

-snip-
#1 how you make profit (you say from ads)
#2 how it is tied to the investors (if its from ads, why do you need their money?)
#3 why you explain nothing in that regard on your site?

I explaind you 100 times that I need the investors money to dispach the profit.
Explain me how i can manage the percentage invested if people do invest zero satoshi.

it seems that only you do not understand how my site works.
Nothing is explained on my site because it is evidence...
if you see that you own 12.7% of the global investment it is an evidence that you get 12.7% of the profit.
i have in my webmaster life never seen an investment system with so much information.
You can see at the satosho near,each investment of each investors...all the investment,the pending investment and the paid out.Even what they have claimed for free with the booster.
Tell me one site on the net where it is more clear about info.

The problem is ...the day you have understood the system will have closed (because it will close when the last investors will have passed the 100 days)
As you can see...it is not a ponzi because no need for new investors whi pay the old ones.
Soon the system will end and all will be paid with the made profit...

Once you have perhaps understood  that it was not a ponzi and not a scam...you will perhaps remove the red points...but all other 7 red trusters will forgett to follow you and the red will remains.
Then you will discover that this system has merged with my U2cloudmining system...where you understand as well nothing and then you will red trust again...

By the way...on the U2cloudmining system...the money from my investors has been used to pay me for my work...
Are you happy now?
is this scam?
New investors can only invest for free...
And sell the shares for real satoshi.
Do you want a proof that I will payout them?
sorry...i can not prove it because i do not know the future...
Do not worry...i do not need you to pay out 0.3 BTC or so...
if you think that i'm more agressive that your red trust covered with honney is less agressive...ok if you believe it...
You red trust has attracted other red truster who like you have not taken the time to understand...
shorena is respectable...and if he is respectable you can only be a scammer meriting red trust...hopla...one red trust more...(lol)

Have a nice day.

[Heutenamos]

The more you clarify the more you make their troll attempt succeed.You don't wear a signature then why do you care about some unknown,unseen person's opinion ? loll..

[Jet Cash]

Wouldn't it be easier to ban all links and references to ponzi schemes. That would help to clean up the board, and also help to improve the image of Bitcoin.

[winspiral]

Wouldn't it be easier to ban all links and references to ponzi schemes. That would help to clean up the board, and also help to improve the image of Bitcoin.

How do you want ban ponzi shemes links if people here see ponzi shemes every where...
Look my
http://bitcoin.winspiral
all people who do not understand the system bemoeve that it is a ponzi sheme and that I am a scammer.
if after each link you have to explain how the site works you will spend your life for this...and certainly without result.

And above it...if all sites with poor English are taken for ponsi shemes...no end...
And if the site's design is horrible...no end as well (lol)

[Kartikay]

I think it would be better if ponzis are not allowed to run any signature campaign.
It is more logical and fairer than giving people negative trust.

[shorena]

-snip-
#1 how you make profit (you say from ads)
#2 how it is tied to the investors (if its from ads, why do you need their money?)
#3 why you explain nothing in that regard on your site?

I explaind you 100 times that I need the investors money to dispach the profit.

So you dont actually need their money, you just use it as a way to determine who gets which share of the profit you would make without investors anyway. This makes no sense to me and we have been here time and time again. If you just want to give away coins you dont need investors.

Explain me how i can manage the percentage invested if people do invest zero satoshi.

it seems that only you do not understand how my site works.
Nothing is explained on my site because it is evidence...
if you see that you own 12.7% of the global investment it is an evidence that you get 12.7% of the profit.
i have in my webmaster life never seen an investment system with so much information.
You can see at the satosho near,each investment of each investors...all the investment,the pending investment and the paid out.Even what they have claimed for free with the booster.
Tell me one site on the net where it is more clear about info.

The problem is ...the day you have understood the system will have closed (because it will close when the last investors will have passed the 100 days)
As you can see...it is not a ponzi because no need for new investors whi pay the old ones.
Soon the system will end and all will be paid with the made profit...

Once you have perhaps understood  that it was not a ponzi and not a scam...you will perhaps remove the red points...but all other 7 red trusters will forgett to follow you and the red will remains.
Then you will discover that this system has merged with my U2cloudmining system...where you understand as well nothing and then you will red trust again...

By the way...on the U2cloudmining system...the money from my investors has been used to pay me for my work...
Are you happy now?
is this scam?
New investors can only invest for free...
And sell the shares for real satoshi.
Do you want a proof that I will payout them?
sorry...i can not prove it because i do not know the future...
Do not worry...i do not need you to pay out 0.3 BTC or so...
if you think that i'm more agressive that your red trust covered with honney is less agressive...ok if you believe it...
You red trust has attracted other red truster who like you have not taken the time to understand...
shorena is respectable...and if he is respectable you can only be a scammer meriting red trust...hopla...one red trust more...(lol)

Have a nice day.

You can not accuse me of not taking the time to try and understand your system. I have spend plenty of time reading your posts and arguing with you.

[winspiral]

-snip-
#1 how you make profit (you say from ads)
#2 how it is tied to the investors (if its from ads, why do you need their money?)
#3 why you explain nothing in that regard on your site?

I explaind you 100 times that I need the investors money to dispach the profit.

So you dont actually need their money, you just use it as a way to determine who gets which share of the profit you would make without investors anyway. This makes no sense to me and we have been here time and time again. If you just want to give away coins you dont need investors.

Explain me how i can manage the percentage invested if people do invest zero satoshi.

it seems that only you do not understand how my site works.
Nothing is explained on my site because it is evidence...
if you see that you own 12.7% of the global investment it is an evidence that you get 12.7% of the profit.
i have in my webmaster life never seen an investment system with so much information.
You can see at the satosho near,each investment of each investors...all the investment,the pending investment and the paid out.Even what they have claimed for free with the booster.
Tell me one site on the net where it is more clear about info.

The problem is ...the day you have understood the system will have closed (because it will close when the last investors will have passed the 100 days)
As you can see...it is not a ponzi because no need for new investors whi pay the old ones.
Soon the system will end and all will be paid with the made profit...

Once you have perhaps understood  that it was not a ponzi and not a scam...you will perhaps remove the red points...but all other 7 red trusters will forgett to follow you and the red will remains.
Then you will discover that this system has merged with my U2cloudmining system...where you understand as well nothing and then you will red trust again...

By the way...on the U2cloudmining system...the money from my investors has been used to pay me for my work...
Are you happy now?
is this scam?
New investors can only invest for free...
And sell the shares for real satoshi.
Do you want a proof that I will payout them?
sorry...i can not prove it because i do not know the future...
Do not worry...i do not need you to pay out 0.3 BTC or so...
if you think that i'm more agressive that your red trust covered with honney is less agressive...ok if you believe it...
You red trust has attracted other red truster who like you have not taken the time to understand...
shorena is respectable...and if he is respectable you can only be a scammer meriting red trust...hopla...one red trust more...(lol)

Have a nice day.

You can not accuse me of not taking the time to try and understand your system. I have spend plenty of time reading your posts and arguing with you.

i accuse you only to red trust befor understanding...
if I red trust all what i do not understand about...I could only do this all the day.
I have never run ponzi shemes...it's all.
All the people who have seen or who see a ponzi sheme in my 100 days plan are wrong.
if you need 1000 post to understand that people invest and get dividends at prorato of the investment...I can not help you.
But it is endless...because the 100 days plan does not accept new investors
and the U2cloudmining is the same principle...just the payout system is different...
So even if a day you understand the 100 days plan...all the bad storry will restart with the U2cloudmining system.
All my red trust points have just avoid at certain people to earn few satoshi...

[whywefight]

-snip-
#1 how you make profit (you say from ads)
#2 how it is tied to the investors (if its from ads, why do you need their money?)
#3 why you explain nothing in that regard on your site?

I explaind you 100 times that I need the investors money to dispach the profit.

So you dont actually need their money, you just use it as a way to determine who gets which share of the profit you would make without investors anyway. This makes no sense to me and we have been here time and time again. If you just want to give away coins you dont need investors.

Explain me how i can manage the percentage invested if people do invest zero satoshi.

it seems that only you do not understand how my site works.
Nothing is explained on my site because it is evidence...
if you see that you own 12.7% of the global investment it is an evidence that you get 12.7% of the profit.
i have in my webmaster life never seen an investment system with so much information.
You can see at the satosho near,each investment of each investors...all the investment,the pending investment and the paid out.Even what they have claimed for free with the booster.
Tell me one site on the net where it is more clear about info.

The problem is ...the day you have understood the system will have closed (because it will close when the last investors will have passed the 100 days)
As you can see...it is not a ponzi because no need for new investors whi pay the old ones.
Soon the system will end and all will be paid with the made profit...

Once you have perhaps understood  that it was not a ponzi and not a scam...you will perhaps remove the red points...but all other 7 red trusters will forgett to follow you and the red will remains.
Then you will discover that this system has merged with my U2cloudmining system...where you understand as well nothing and then you will red trust again...

By the way...on the U2cloudmining system...the money from my investors has been used to pay me for my work...
Are you happy now?
is this scam?
New investors can only invest for free...
And sell the shares for real satoshi.
Do you want a proof that I will payout them?
sorry...i can not prove it because i do not know the future...
Do not worry...i do not need you to pay out 0.3 BTC or so...
if you think that i'm more agressive that your red trust covered with honney is less agressive...ok if you believe it...
You red trust has attracted other red truster who like you have not taken the time to understand...
shorena is respectable...and if he is respectable you can only be a scammer meriting red trust...hopla...one red trust more...(lol)

Have a nice day.

You can not accuse me of not taking the time to try and understand your system. I have spend plenty of time reading your posts and arguing with you.

i accuse you only to red trust befor understanding...
if I red trust all what i do not understand about...I could only do this all the day.
I have never run ponzi shemes...it's all.
All the people who have seen or who see a ponzi sheme in my 100 days plan are wrong.
if you need 1000 post to understand that people invest and get dividends at prorato of the investment...I can not help you.
But it is endless...because the 100 days plan does not accept new investors
and the U2cloudmining is the same principle...just the payout system is different...
So even if a day you understand the 100 days plan...all the bad storry will restart with the U2cloudmining system.
All my red trust points have just avoid at certain people to earn few satoshi...

i dont understand a single word of what you wrote. someone told me you speak german, can you explain it in german to me?