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Author Topic: [Resolved] MtGox mishandled sensitive AML info.  (Read 14331 times)
DeathAndTaxes
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Gerald Davis


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October 17, 2012, 03:21:09 PM
 #1

For those who may not be aware MtGox level 3 verification requires a notarized and apostled copy of a government issued ID.  In the US the only entity that can attach an apostle seal is the state government (usually the secretary of the state personally) and thus there is a single office for an entire state.

So the process is:
  • Make a photocopy of your government ID (MtGox prohibits blacking out or redacting any info).
  • Get it notarized locally.
  • Mail it to the state capital.
  • Wait a week.
  • Have the state mail it back (at your expense).
  • Then mail it internationally to Japan.

MtGox website currently reports this is the address for AML documents:
https://mtgox.com/forms/verification  

Quote
Mt.Gox AML
Cerulean Tower 15F,
Sakuragaoka-cho 26-1, Shibuya-ku
Tokyo, Japan
150-8512


So I have spent over a $100 and almost two weeks getting this stupid apostled document to them.  Thankfully my AML limit will be raised.  Lets check USPS this morning.  Hopefully the end of a very long, pointless, and expensive process.

USPS reports:
Quote
, , US   10/17/2012   2:57 PM   ATTEMPTED DELIVERY ABROAD
, , US   10/17/2012   2:49 PM   ATTEMPTED DELIVERY ABROAD

Huh  That doesn't look good.  My money eating, time wasting docs with sensitive information are taking a joy ride through Tokyo.  Let me check with MtGox support; I am sure they have a good reason.

Quote
Hi,

Thank was our old address and I have mentioned below the address to send AML Notarized document's. Please send the documents again to below mentioned address.

Mt.Gox AML
Round Cross Shibuya 5F
11-6 Shibuya 2-Chome, Shibuya-ku
Tokyo, Japan
150-0002

If you have any further enquiries, please do not hesitate to contact Mt.Gox Support either by responding to this email (should the enquiry relate to this ticket) or by using the following support request form:

https://mtgox.zendesk.com/entries/20256702-contact-us.

Thanks,

MtGox.com Team
TICKET MARKED CLOSED/RESOLVED.

I am beyond furious right now.  

On edit:  12 hours later ... yup wrong info still on the site.


Update:  MtGox customer support reports documents have been transferred to the new office.
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October 17, 2012, 03:24:53 PM
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Not to mention they spelled inquiries wrong!  Sheesh!
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October 17, 2012, 03:25:35 PM
 #3

go with www.localbitcoins.com and forget this hassle

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Charlie 'Van Bitcoin' Shrem


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October 17, 2012, 03:28:27 PM
 #4


I am beyond furious right now.  


They just moved to a new office like 2 weeks ago, and probably forgot to update the address on that page of their website.

Although its their fault, I wouldn't be too pissed off because its an easy mistake to overlook and can happen to anyone.

Calling it gross incompetence may be out of line. While your information is extremely sensitive, even you could have made the same mistake if you were in their position.

To rectify the situation, I suggest MtGox pay for the shipping costs all 3 times. If I were in your shoes, that would make me happy.

Also, the AML rules are not their own, they have to follow the standard of both Japan and the USA (Japan being much more strict) but it allows them to stay operationally legal in both jurisdictions.

EDIT:

There have been numerous claims that BitInstant is defending MtGox on this issue. This is not the case. What happend here is totally unacceptable and I've even said I think MtGox should pay financially to this customer for the problems.

At the same time, as of now, I am the only one who got in touch with MtGox on behalf of the OP and told them that I believe this is unacceptable.

BitInstant defends the right of every Bitcoiner, regardless if they are a customer of ours or not.

I apologize of my original comment was not clear enough



go with www.localbitcoins.com and forget this hassle

This is a great site, but serves a much different purpose then MtGox.

OP probably wants to buy high amounts of coin, at the best price, fairly quickly and without leaving his chair.

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deeplink
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October 17, 2012, 03:33:33 PM
 #5

go with www.localbitcoins.com and forget this hassle

 steelx01    xx.x km    8.43 EUR    5000 - 100000 EUR

Right, so I can get 100000 EUR worth of BTC @ 10% below market price?

Seems legit!
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฿itcoin ฿itcoin ฿itcoin


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October 17, 2012, 03:40:19 PM
 #6


I am beyond furious right now.  


They just moved to a new office like 2 weeks ago, and probably forgot to update the address on that page of their website.

Although its their fault, I wouldn't be too pissed off because its an easy mistake to overlook and can happen to anyone.

Calling it gross incompetence may be out of line. While your information is extremely sensitive, even you could have made the same mistake if you were in their position.

To rectify the situation, I suggest MtGox pay for the shipping costs all 3 times. If I were in your shoes, that would make me happy.

Also, the AML rules are not their own, they have to follow the standard of both Japan and the USA (Japan being much more strict) but it allows them to stay operationally legal in both jurisdictions.


go with www.localbitcoins.com and forget this hassle

This is a great site, but serves a much different purpose then MtGox.

OP probably wants to buy high amounts of coin, at the best price, fairly quickly and without leaving his chair.
No, it is gross incompetence, dealing with something that sensitive should not happen pure and simple. It is not a simple and easy mistake to make when you are dealing with peoples identities. They obviously have no logical structure and yet again prove how incompetent they really are.

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Charlie 'Van Bitcoin' Shrem


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October 17, 2012, 03:45:27 PM
 #7

No, it is gross incompetence, dealing with something that sensitive should not happen pure and simple.

Agreed. I'm not defending them. Just saying, shit happens. We are not perfect.

We should be judging them based on how they handle this situation going forward and prevent it from happening again.

If it does, then its gross incompetence.

They obviously have no logical structure and yet again prove how incompetent they really are.

Thats a bold statement to make, happy to hear your understanding and how you came to this conclusion of 'no logical structure.'

-Charlie

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More about me: http://CharlieShrem.com
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October 17, 2012, 03:46:00 PM
 #8


Also, the AML rules are not their own, they have to follow the standard of both Japan and the USA (Japan being much more strict) but it allows them to stay operationally legal in both jurisdictions.


+1


Right, so I can get 100000 EUR worth of BTC @ 10% below market price?

Seems legit!


LOL. you compare this with mtgox? ROFL.

try it, then you see whether its just a teaser or reality.

at mtgox you get the best price at the highest solvency. thats a fact.


bitmessage:BM-2D9c1oAbkVo96zDhTZ2jV6RXzQ9VG3A6f1​
threema:HXUAMT96
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October 17, 2012, 03:46:49 PM
 #9

Doh!

I remember something about they moving at FB, http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.315958005155280.72002.116777141740035&type=1

Unnecessary indeed, maybe it could be tracked and rerouted ?
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October 17, 2012, 03:48:03 PM
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Right, so I can get 100000 EUR worth of BTC @ 10% below market price?

Seems legit!


LOL. you compare this with mtgox? ROFL.

try it, then you see whether its just a teaser or reality.


I agree. I think you missed my sarcasm there :-)
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October 17, 2012, 03:53:42 PM
 #11

They obviously have no logical structure and yet again prove how incompetent they really are.

Thats a bold statement to make, happy to hear your understanding and how you came to this conclusion of 'no logical structure.'

-Charlie
Sorry I should have said something more along the lines of no protocol to adhere to when dealing with changes/updates like this.
Mtgox is not a one man band small time exchange anymore, while I'm sure they have protocols and procedures for doing many of the things they do day to day, its unacceptable that they have been so incompetent to let a user send his identity to a potentially malicious recipient through no fault of his own.

Disclosure: I'm in a bad mood today

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Charlie 'Van Bitcoin' Shrem


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October 17, 2012, 03:58:19 PM
 #12

They obviously have no logical structure and yet again prove how incompetent they really are.

Thats a bold statement to make, happy to hear your understanding and how you came to this conclusion of 'no logical structure.'

-Charlie
While I'm sure they have protocols and procedures for doing many of the things they do day to day, its unacceptable that they have been so incompetent to let a user send his identity to a potentially malicious recipient through no fault of his own.

Disclosure: I'm in a bad mood today

100% Agreed.

I'm sure MtGox will see this, realize the error, fix it, and contact OP to resolve it.

However I agree with you, as Bitcoin companies get bigger, the level of standard gets higher.


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More about me: http://CharlieShrem.com
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October 17, 2012, 04:24:16 PM
 #13

I can see how this can be very frustrating. Including the tone in the correspondence. On the other hand, it's an honest mistake. It happens.  I hope you will soon come back here and tell us that Gox have corrected the problem by reimbursing you for the shipping expenses. Gox, make this right!

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BCJ


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October 17, 2012, 04:45:15 PM
 #14

Charlie,

Instead of sticking up for your buddy at Mt Gox maybe you could message them and give them a lesson customer relations, which you and your team seem to do so well  (seriously) in responding publicly to customer issues.

I find it surprising that you've now responded several time to this thread and we have yet to hear from Mt. Gox.

Is is a slow days at the office?

Are you responding in an official capacity as a member of the Bitcoin Foundation.

Just curious.

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October 17, 2012, 04:45:51 PM
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So, Japanese Postal Service doesn't forward mail when one moves?

Seems legit Roll Eyes

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October 17, 2012, 04:46:54 PM
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yes, i think Gox should pay D&T's expenses for this.
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October 17, 2012, 04:55:46 PM
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And MtGox, instead of closing this as CLOSED/RESOLVED, should fix the address at https://mtgox.com/forms/verification asap before someone else sends his private AML information there.
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Charlie 'Van Bitcoin' Shrem


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October 17, 2012, 05:12:17 PM
 #18

Charlie,

Instead of sticking up for your buddy at Mt Gox maybe you could message them and give them a lesson customer relations, which you and your team seem to do so well  (seriously) in responding publicly to customer issues.

I find it surprising that you've now responded several time to this thread and we have yet to hear from Mt. Gox.

Is is a slow days at the office?


See below....


Agreed. I'm not defending them. Just saying, shit happens. We are not perfect.


Thanks for the kind words about our customer support  Grin

Right now, its 2am in Japan, thats probably why we have not heard back from them.

I did tell Mark that he should see this thread, and gave him the link an hour ago.

It's a crazy day at the office!!


Are you responding in an official capacity as a member of the Bitcoin Foundation.

Just curious.


lol, no.

If I was, I'd sign with "Charlie, Bitcoin Foundation"

-Charlie, BitInstant

Bitcoin pioneer. An apostle of Satoshi Nakamoto. A crusader for a new, better, tech-driven society. A dreamer.

More about me: http://CharlieShrem.com
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October 17, 2012, 05:22:28 PM
 #19

This extremely unprofessional, irresponsible behavior is exactly what I have come to expect from Mt.Gox.

Thanks for the time and energy you have spent dealing with this inexcusable nonsense so that less of the rest of us need to. I'll continue to suggest people buy and sell through you.


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October 17, 2012, 06:03:13 PM
 #20

I think gross incompetence is an understatement.  MtGox is plagued by mismanagement at nearly every step... and that's all well and good, but when you're a) dealing with large quantities of money and b) sensitive personal information, that is just a recipe for disaster in the making.

If you're searching these lines for a point, you've probably missed it.  There was never anything there in the first place.
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