Innosilicon's A4 Dominator, 1.2W/Mhs 14nm ASIC and miner, open for Partners

[QuintLeo]

Innosilicon probably could have done the A4 without any investment at all - they just wanted partners to mitigate the risk, since Scrypt is a much smaller market than SHA256 and 14/16nm development/bring to production costs are a LOT higher than 28nm.

 It's not IMPOSSIBLE that they have their own farm - but there is no evidence supporting that they do, and I suspect they don't understand the risks and rewards of it well enough to consider it worth investing into, whereas making and selling chips is a business they have a LOT of experience and practice at.


 Why does Warren Buffet think Bitcoin is unworthy of investment?
 It's not CONSERVATIVE enough for him to trust.
 (He didn't coin the term "Value Investor", he just has spent 60 years or so LIVING it).


 Why hasn't AMD NVidia or Intel gotten into making mining chips?
 Too small a market - and AMD in particular and NVidia to a lesser degree benefit indirectly from miners buying GPUs.

[mindtrip]

Still no updates on pricing and availability? I got the mining itch needing some new kick ass hardware to fill it

[Searing]

Still no updates on pricing and availability? I got the mining itch needing some new kick ass hardware to fill it

I got an email saying not yet. My expectation the units will go out to the 'bulk' purchasers in probably (my guess) August. This was the over $100k orders min.
Thus you MIGHT see these units to us as individuals sometime in Sept. I also think they will be 4k at least or more now with the BTC and LTC price hikes.

Probably way to 'rich for me' at 14c kwh electric. Also not a big fan of 4k out for a 90 day warranty when all ASIC equipment I know about took about 3 months
to 'kinda' get a working firmware with various pools etc. One big paper weight if their 14nm chips and/or equip does not work well after 90 days. Again imho.

[jadefalke]

Still no updates on pricing and availability? I got the mining itch needing some new kick ass hardware to fill it

I got an email saying not yet. My expectation the units will go out to the 'bulk' purchasers in probably (my guess) August. This was the over $100k orders min.
Thus you MIGHT see these units to us as individuals sometime in Sept. I also think they will be 4k at least or more now with the BTC and LTC price hikes.

Probably way to 'rich for me' at 14c kwh electric. Also not a big fan of 4k out for a 90 day warranty when all ASIC equipment I know about took about 3 months
to 'kinda' get a working firmware with various pools etc. One big paper weight if their 14nm chips and/or equip does not work well after 90 days. Again imho.

i came to the same assumption, last time when they launched the A2. (they asked >10K USD for Batch 1 Devices)
To much Risk involved. Might be interesting if you buy big Quantity and get early Access.

[toptek]

Watch  Zoomhash they allways seems to get stock of any new miners all most the same day there released.


http://zoomhash.com/

[Searing]

Watch  Zoomhash they allways seems to get stock of any new miners all most the same day there released.


http://zoomhash.com/

yeah alibaba also seems to get this stuff up..over priced...but at least you can tell if the stuff exists then (hopefully alibaba may have a lot of scam sales)

but good point on zoomhash forgot about that


someone said these guys take paypal ..have not looked into such...but another maybe option in that they got sfards stuff first I think

http://www.itopshop.net/

[QuintLeo]

Watch  Zoomhash they allways seems to get stock of any new miners all most the same day there released.

http://zoomhash.com/

 I believe I already mentioned that I'm sure Zoomhash was one of their "partners" on the investment thing?

 9-)

[smarterhash]

I would not be surprised if the price for the A4 was just shy of $2,000

[carlosmnk]

I would not be surprised if the price for the A4 was just shy of $2,000

Then the hashrate will rise very fast and up... 

[smarterhash]

I would not be surprised if the price for the A4 was just shy of $2,000

Then the hashrate will rise very fast and up... 

exactly - look at what Baikal has done to Dash

[Longsnowsm]

I would love to hear status updates on the A4's development and release schedule.  Last I heard they have chips but don't have the complete miner yet.  So it would be awesome to see an update on the progress and the timeline.  It is real tempting to jump on the S9, and I almost did... But without updates on the A4 I think people will be lured to jump on the S9.

[Searing]

I would not be surprised if the price for the A4 was just shy of $2,000

I'd get one for that. (2k). I could justify the 'toy' because my 14c kWh electric goes down to
10c kWh in winter. Last year I heated 85% of house with Titans. 😄

Hope you are right and I'm wrong, but I still think 4K for an A4 is likely

[dquancey]

I would not be surprised if the price for the A4 was just shy of $2,000

You'd be lucky.

They will price at $4k as suggested above. $2k is a pipedream and can't see it happening any, I respect miners want their machines at the cheapest price, but the production company hold the key.

[CartmanSPC]

What is a "data hall"? Have seen that posted on btctalk a lot. Don't you all mean "data center"?!

Google search did not come up with much..first result to "what is a data hall" comes back with this link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Data_center


....so why do some of you say "data hall" when it appears it is really "data center"?

Sorry to hijack this thread but it has been buggin me for a while.

Data hall was a term used by KNC for their mining farm in Sweden.  I believe people now use it as a derogatory term in referring to a big farm that screws people.

OMG! Thank you for a good laugh today! I like it.

[smarterhash]

I would not be surprised if the price for the A4 was just shy of $2,000

You'd be lucky.

They will price at $4k as suggested above. $2k is a pipedream and can't see it happening any, I respect miners want their machines at the cheapest price, but the production company hold the key.

thanks - I just wanted to save your quote as is  for future reference.

[QuintLeo]

I would not be surprised if the price for the A4 was just shy of $2,000

Then the hashrate will rise very fast and up... 

exactly - look at what Baikal has done to Dash

 The Baikal is Johnnie-come-Lately - I suspect the other 2 had more to do with X11 hashrate jumps so far.
 I'm still shocked that *3* different entities came out with X11 ASIC at almost the same time, much less AT ALL - and I have to wonder how many if any of them are going to manage to recoup their investment in the chip work.


 I would be SHOCKED to see the A4 start out at $2000 - I'm starting to think I was optimistic planning for it to be INNOSILICON DIRECT priced at $2500.

 Year or two from now, after the initial sales rush has ended, I could see it dropping to the $2k range - or IF someone else actually gets a competative Scrypt miner out the door (seems like the Alcheminer folks aren't going to manage it, didn't raise enough funding for their second-gen miner/chip designs).


 

[Searing]

I would not be surprised if the price for the A4 was just shy of $2,000

Then the hashrate will rise very fast and up... 

exactly - look at what Baikal has done to Dash

 The Baikal is Johnnie-come-Lately - I suspect the other 2 had more to do with X11 hashrate jumps so far.
 I'm still shocked that *3* different entities came out with X11 ASIC at almost the same time, much less AT ALL - and I have to wonder how many if any of them are going to manage to recoup their investment in the chip work.


 I would be SHOCKED to see the A4 start out at $2000 - I'm starting to think I was optimistic planning for it to be INNOSILICON DIRECT priced at $2500.

 Year or two from now, after the initial sales rush has ended, I could see it dropping to the $2k range - or IF someone else actually gets a competative Scrypt miner out the door (seems like the Alcheminer folks aren't going to manage it, didn't raise enough funding for their second-gen miner/chip designs).


 

I tried to be optimistic and re-looked at my views on the 4k (likely) for an A4 being correct. (remember I know zip at one time I drank the BFL kool aid..you've been warned) BUT

just can't feel it. I mean from Innsilicon's point of view with LTC now at around $5 IF they came out with one at 4k imho they'd be patting themselves on the back as being

nice guys and not gouging the 'home miners' (compared to other prices in the past and service/firmware/support from other asic makers of all kinds in the past they'd likely be

correct ..again imho)

So to tell the truth 4k on review looks 'low ball' now...it likely will be somewhat to a lot higher is my conclusion now.

As to the 2nd elephant in the room HOW many will they make? ie ..will they be more into 'bulk' sales and the home miner market is an afterthought (even at 4k price) or will
they go all 'consumer is all' and crank  out bulk sales/chip sales/home miner sales and flood the market...likely in that at this time it is JUST them...again imho they will (if a 4k price)
sell a limited number of these units...a couple months after the units at the bulk price units/bulk chips/whatever have moved out the door and play king of the hill ....actually
the only guys on the hill ..have someone to climb the hill and/or even frigging be within distance of seeing the hill

hard to 'limit' oneself on your product price wise etc if you are the 'only game in town'

They also could easily imho 'justify' a 4k price simply because used Titans on Ebay go for 3.3k (low) to 3.7k (high) if you can find them on ebay. Currently no one is selling since
the last panic dump on the knc class action loss.....zip.....that is if they happened to be really trying to 'guess' the market.

Also is the consensus here the unit is gonna be 400mh and 1150 watts yet? Perhaps someone knows if it is higher then that? I would have to modify my calcs or as I like to say

"big ass guesses' if the A4 units were now 600mh or some such

whatever...again hope I'm wrong and they are 400mh 1150 watts at 2100 bucks ........(the 90 day warranty still bugs the hell out of me however ...live a little make it 6 months?)

[smarterhash]

In the for what it's worth department : this guy will be selling them.

I've bought a bunch of equipment off him and he's trustworthy - so is the guy at Itopshop.net - I've bought from him also.

I'm in the East Coast of the US and stuff arrive in 2 days via DHL

http://www.aliexpress.com/store/227686

[mjgraham]

Is this what were talking about?
http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/New-arrival-Zeus-Scrypt-Miner-All-Solution-Litecoin-Miner-300M-digging-Litecoin-with-power-supply-send/227686_2048732975.html

Of course the description on the page says newest A2 480M miner the link looks to be describe something different.
If so looking at it I find it strange to see what looks like DC-DC converter inductors all over the boards, I thought they were DC-DC less.

[Longsnowsm]

The images on the Aliexpress page look like A2 images.  The description says the A4 prototype won't be available until July.  So what is pictured is not one of the prototypes.  This is a "pre-order" for still unbuilt equipment.  Also from what I have read Innosilicon does not do preorders.  So this person selling either must have a standing order and commitment for a bulk order or he/she is taking wild liberties on the price and number he will have available to sell. 

Thanks for the link.  It at least has a bunch of us all talking and thinking about doing really stupid stuff like a bulk preorder...  Yes, we are that crazy!  I personally am going to wait until something firms up and then figure out where in the world I would put more miners or get more electricity to run them! ROFL