Bitcoin Forum

Innosilicon, the world renowned creator of the 28nm A2 Terminator, the most successful LTC miner with over 60% market share, is announcing today the availability of the next generation 14nm ASIC code-named A4 Dominator. This is a full custom design with a tremendous focus on efficiency, providing an incredible 1.2W/Mhs in a DCDC less daisy chain configuration. Available as both an ASIC and a complete miner, nothing can touch the A4 Dominator, and it is going to stay that way for quite some time to come!

A4 Dominator ASIC & Miner Specifications:

• A4 ASIC: 3Mhs per chip at 3.6W nominal, support DCDC less PCB
• Extreme Low Power: daisy chained ASIC running at 0.7V, only in 14nm
• Miner Performance: 600Mhs from 720W at the Wall or 850Mhs from 1020W
• PSU Requirements: common PCI-E 8Pins/6+2Pins with 12V output
• Included: Raspberry Pi running the most user friendly A2 terminator Software

Since the A4 Dominator is designed & taped-out in the worlds most advanced 14nm process, with 60% greater efficiency over any 28nm node, and our initial MPW chip/miner will be available soon, we are now entering the next round of full mask mass production with trusted partners. This provides an incredible opportunity to win in this huge market, for the foreseeable future, with zero risk. We also have production partners lined up for this A4 ASIC if you are looking for the finished miners. 14nm provides the pinnacle in LTC miner efficiency, with no better technology supplanting it in the foreseeable future.

Good news for this partnership round: we have opened our A4 ASIC/Miner production to committed partners in order to share in both the cost and the profit. Anyone who commits $1.5 million to this partnership will get to share our ASIC production masks or purchase miners “at cost” for your mining farms. We have fully de-risked the design by shouldering all the R&D and MPW costs for the testchips. Also, we will showcase our testchip and test miners in couple of months to demonstrate the A4’s unsurpassable efficiency. We need only 4 to 5 partners to participate in this incredible risk free win-win partnership round. This is the best ever opportunity to secure the world’s most profitable mining ASIC/Machines for the years to come. Further details will be available in the, limited member, partnership meeting. For parties with genuine interest, please email us today at sales@innosilicon.com or Skype at: Inno.miner.


Thank you all for your support and attention. A4 belongs to all of you. After the A4 Dominator comes out, we will offer a A2 Terminator and Farmboy miner replacement program so that our loyal customers can continue to benefit. The A4 Dominator will continue the A2 Terminator legacy in serving our mining community!

Thank you.
Innosilicon Marketing
www.innosilicon.com

Well this makes older zeus and gridseed units obsolete.

What happened to A3?  ;D

Good question! A3 is actually gonna be a replacement of A1, and will be rolled out at the same time with A4. So A3 and A4 share the same roll out time, and A3 will have sub 0.2w/gh btc mining performance.

So when are you projecting that you'll start selling these?  Since you've finished taping it out the part, that would make me think it's in the 3-6 month timeframe...

I will be following this for sure.  I have the A2 Term and have been very happy with it.  I havnt trusted other manufacturers enough to cough up the money for them.  This might be worth it though.  Can you explain how the A2 replacement program will work and how much I will have to pay in order to get the A4?

As the *unofficial* tweaker of your A2 software (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=672969.0) and hardware my experience with is very positive. The hardware is very sturdy, well build, tweakable, and very hard to break (unless you mess up while modding the hardware, but than that is my fault ofcourse :P ).

I would love to test one of your new A4 miners and write an extensive review about them. I think my reputation on the A2 miner hardware and software would add value to your brand and the new A4's. Maybe we can work something out?

cant wait to get one. hopefully soon not end of next year lol

Missing the most important information.

 Price.

If this is another "introduce at $9995" miner design it's not gonna sell worth beans.

Price and where to get it.  I'm guessing it will be a re-seller in us.   

But still great news as far as scrypt I hope it's fair priced as I really want to get back into LTC some more.

this look very nice by a efficency point of view, 120watt for 100mega is beautiful, almost everyone can make profit with this, it will be overpriced rest assured

Everyone can make a profit with it until everyone has one.  LOL

I agree the market can't handle another 10 grand miner.

Forgot the other important question.

 WHEN is it going to be available?

 I'd guess that might still be up in the air a bit though....

yeah lol you're right, it's important to be the first to have one here, because you have something like 1 month before everyone else will be a owner also

With all investment ready, miners will be mass production in 3 months.

Thanks for your trust and support!

A2 replacement program means that we will give a discount to previous A2 user that we have record of. Detailed information will be provided after official product release, but there will be a promotion program for A2 user specifically at that point.

A4 price is not determined yet and will be discussed internally among the partnership round, it may be roughly similar price as current A2.

Why you don't made collocation service include hosting?

LOL -- are you asking for another ponzi scheme?

what do u mean by "another ponzi scheme" ?

Seriously?  After all of the scams that have happened?  You don't see the possibility of potential abuse if there was a "collocation service?"

Yes, seriously, this is about Innosilicon, who are in the game from a very long time, delivered on time, legit, not one single complain to them; so than again, i ask you, what do u mean by "another ponzi scheme" ?

PS : u might be new to the game and dont know what u are talking about too ...

There's obviously no reason to waste anymore time on this.

Several highly regarded companies (at the time) -- screwed their customers in the end.  No one will know right now - but people should always make good and safe decisions (although most won't).

any word on chip package, same interface, be cool if it was all the same as A2 , drop in replacement with a little regulator adjustment.

Also interested in this product, keep me updated :)

I don't have $1.5MIL, but I'm listening. Can you PM me a newsletter on progress?

+1

For users interested in collaborating in an investment, hit me up on PM. I'm attempting to raise funding to procure hardware.

Anymore news on this? :) Would like to know the cost!

time to sell Knc Titan?

As an extremely satisfied customer I am very happy to hear about this new miner and discount for supporters of your products. Looking forward to purchasing an A4 as soon as it becomes available!

All factors considered, I'd BET that one of Innosilicon's partners on this will be Zoomhash.

You know like ltcgear ;D ;)

Best Regards
d57heinz

I have a lot interest to know how goes the A4 project, when will be released?

ANy update? So i know when to sell my titan:P

Saved

http://www.innosilicon.com/html/news/13.html

Some news? any release date? Prices? I read somewhere there will be an upgrade for A2 owners...

I also own a few titans, don't be so hasty, wait for the price announcement :D

check their annoucment on their website.
everyone is selling their titans on ebay now.
http://www.innosilicon.com/html/news/13.html
A4 Dominator ASIC & Miner Specifications:

A4 Miner: 400Mhs per 1KW power supply in one standard miner box
A4 ASIC: 3.5Mhs per chip performance at 2.5W/MHs nominal, see tables below on modes
Extreme Low Power: ASIC with large memory running at single rail 0.6V
One Start and New PCB: eliminate the need of DC-DC components and enable 14 to 20 A4 chips running off the single 12V DC supply
PSU Requirements: common PCI-E 8Pins/6+2Pins with 12V output
Included: Raspberry Pi running the most user friendly A2 terminator Software
Server Grid Reliability: Built-in high-procession temperature sensor for automatic chip protection and variable frequency operation to maximize chip life time

A4 Miner: 400Mhs per 1KW - makes me supprised
earlier they said:
A4 Dominator ASIC & Miner Specifications:

A4 ASIC: 3Mhs per chip at 3.6W nominal, support DCDC less PCB
Miner Performance: 600Mhs from 720W at the Wall or 850Mhs from 1020W

so question is are we gonna get 850 per 1020w as promised in first annoucment or 400 at 1kw as latest
what you think?

Heh not selling my paid for Roi titans at the above specs a 350 mh 1250w Titan can run just fine with that pack so no need for more $$$ out.  Also new equip for scrypt coin would likely inspire confidence on ltc and all scrypt prices would go up. Win/Win imho.

Same reason I'm not selling my A2s yet. They'll be profitable for quite a lot of difficulty increase - and depending on the price the A4 stuff finally gets released at, diff increase to the point of making my A2s unprofitable might take months or even a couple years.

 8-)

I hope you are correct. From what I understand a 350mh Titan at 1250 watts uses 1/2 the electric you use on your 256-300mh (modded firmware) Alcheminers...again from what I understand.

Thus feel free to float in the 'pool' and soak as long as you like.....if your floating...I'm floating lol :)

I'm in A2 miners, not Alchminers - but from the reviews I've seen the two were very similar on efficiency, depending on how hard you pushed each one more than anything else.

 Titans do beat both on efficiency - but the A2 was definitely a TON more reliable, and from what I've seen the Alcheminer was probably more reliable as well (Titans have been widely reported to have cores die a LOT).

Yeah I have 2 dead dies that happened from day one (knc would not rma them because 1 per cube....they said to overclock all my other dies and then when i hit 306.1mh they
said it was over 300mh and they only RMA on stuff that did not reach that. heh...... At this point they changed the firmware to allow to overclock to 350mh where as before
on such firmware it was locked at 300mh on advanced settings...(evil knc is and they do it well)

I have like 2 dies toggled back to 300mh and 2 dies on a cube at 200 and 175 mh but then again they have been in use for 17 months.

So anyway once you get something up working...YOU MAY be ok on Titans ..but yeah ..in that only used available you take a risk...in that they were orig designed for 90 day

warranty but knc forgot to change the web page on sales thus stuck themselves with previous sha-256 units 1 year warranty heh not that they honored many RMA's imho


So anyway IF this Innsilicon unit comes out in say July 2016 as they say (most asic mnfg's are 2 months late) but lets say July you are golden.....

that will drive up difficulty ..by how much I've no idea.....if they are basically using these units we could get for hell probably 4k (not sure I'd pay that but bet that is what they charge)...

to just use as a proof of concept like sfards and the recent X11 box....ie see we built it ..buy our chips or invest in our large data hall...the units may be very limited


anyway depends on how big bulk chips they sell and data hall

me...I think they probably 'barely' got the IPO $$$ to build the chips for their own data hall (much like spondoolies) and probably we won't see many of these single

non-data hall units...in that ...well ...seems to be the trend....also because at this time scrypt prices are damn low for scrypt data halls their bulk sales also imho will be weak


on the plus side...if they say drive up difficulty 25% more ..that is 2x the difficulty of when I started with LTC in Nov 2014 (1169 gh was the network)

BUT by showing EVERYONE THAT  a new scrypt POW miner....14MM NEXT generation is now out.....showing LTC and all scrypt is NOT DEAD and not just gonna become a KNC Titan end game

well hell if we are lucky the price of LTC say will double and/all other scrypt miners data hall or otherwise (also due to halving) and scrypt pow mining will get some legs back
not look like a POW going no place because of no new equip

anyway best case is double the price and the difficulty doubles from when I started before it plateaus out....(again can't see a lot of scrypt miner data halls off their

chips at these prices.....if scrypt price was to double THEN it would be off to the races ...but starting this summer er not so much imho)

anyway for a bit 2x difficulty but 2x price for Titan users it would be a wash.......(ie same $$$ as now more or less) and for the buyers of these machines you'd likely

ROI within a decent time frame even at 4k a unit ...assuming you get one

as to me ...even if price is say 2k or 3k them dang 90 day warranties are a 'bitch' with the scrypt prices by the time you got these units it would be quite a risk

because all new tech (14mm) is touchy as f*ck...it took KNC 3 months to just get the firmware to work with multi pools...if they would have kept the 90 day plan

they likely would have gone with their original plan saying that they only guaranteed a LTC miner...(got caught going back changing pages with old dates.....forgot

about wayback machine inet archive and got caught) But my point being ..they only got the firmware stable on multi pool because of the year warranty otherwise

they would have just walked imho   

so its the firmware that is gonna work or not....that dash miner the x11 with 90 day warranty is in the throes of this as we speak ....you are locked out of the pi
and cgminer mods from what I recently read....the below link shows how a miner could get really jam'd up with 90 day warranty and no firmware improvements and
or the miner software (and psu) being kinda locked in by the company ...would be ugly..if this trend was the same for the A4

http://cryptomining-blog.com/7752-what-we-dont-like-about-the-ibelink-dm384m-x11-asic-miner/ (http://cryptomining-blog.com/7752-what-we-dont-like-about-the-ibelink-dm384m-x11-asic-miner/)

would be a bad trend if innsilicon did the same..1/4th of my Titan profit is probably gonna be do to the tarky miner 3rd party firmware with temp controls and all the

stuff knc SAID was not possible.best money I ever spent.....a locked up firmware users could not mod would be very bad ..again esp on 90 day warranty..ie stuck

with doorstop maybe after 90 days.


so asic miner innsilicoin so you wanna make bucko  bucks.on these small units...make it a 1 year warranty again and people would pile on the train indeed..hell i'd get

one just to continue home mining even if it ended up an even trade for ltc to btc elec/equp and dollar wise...(guy has to have his toys) you'd kill on sales of the knc level

back in the day...(then again they will probably have a data hall built by this point so why shoot themselves in the foot with making above a success?

whatever my thoughts ..be aware the all my ideas are suspect at one time I drank the BFL kool aid and believed their slogan in '2 weeks' and/or soon (tm) :)

My guess is that the A4 units will come out at around $2500, though I'd actually prefer you to be right and they show up closer to $4000 (fewer sold = less hashrate increase for a while = my A2s pay off more before they hit unprofitable).


 I do love how I can just ignore my A2s for literally months at a time (I've got one that's been up for 4 MONTHS right now no issues - reconfigured my home to "summer mode" this week, and moved the other A2 units, so they've "only" been up for a few days as of right now - they HAD been up for the same 4ish months prior to my moving them) and they just keep hashing.....

RANT BELOW as with all my rants just put me on /ignore already...I don't mind at all :)


yeah...but the data hall they are building....(how large) and MAYBE bulk sales of chips ..but man at these prices for scrypt coins LTC and the rest..I'm kinda surprised they even got the IPO $$$ to build their own data hall (IPO $$$ for build ....they made the chips....so they are golden as far as funding the works themselves)

but yeah....just can't see someone saying...damn.....I want to build a scrypt miner from scratch with bulk chips for my big china data hall......at $3.22 an LTC and
less as you go down the lines of other alts....the stars are gonna align for me on that :) pssst on Ethereum its a fad...scrypt is coming back baby...again..don't see it.

then again people are 'nuts' they did get the IPO $$ for at worse ..a token run of units (I still think 4k) and their very own data hall (whatever size) with the 14mm chips

they made....perhaps they are using this also to leverage their 'expertise' in other kinds of chip endeavors..ie the PR flavor? look what we did 14mm chips!


But anyway...right now the GH of the Litecoin Network says it is at 1,447gh both my miners (one new in Nov 8th  2014 another made in nov 2014 I got later Mar 2015)  the first new one
when I got it the gh when I got it was 1169 gh

so (from what I can determine) for LTC at least the network has ONLY grown as of today by 19.21 % from Nov 8th 2014 when I got my first Titan orig price. That was
17 months and 10 days....again using network gh on LTC.

So....say they make a big ass data hall....shoot some units out ....so what the difficulty goes  up to 40%...I am making 60% of such from Nov 8 2014..
.....I can still play in the sandbox with these new A4 units and
my Titans....(hey I roi'd long ago) NOW whether or not a NEW A4 has can mine long enough to ROI on a 4k investment say might be a different story...but above is do'able)

but hell as I said previously....IF the halving drives up BTC to 650 usd as folk have said (Pollyanna's maybe but still) at 650 usd per LTC that is at the current around say
with BTC halving pump of 0.008 ltc to btc...is 5.20 usd per LTC...hell something like that happens and the above ltc say difficulty goes up from 20% to 40% it makes it up in price and
I'm still making the same $$$ per month ....long way around to get to such ..but still could happen (hope it happens A4 guys if it does likely your equip will last long enough
to ROI imho)


of course at 5.20 ltc EVERYONE would then (6 months or so down the road) either buy these A4 bulk chips for data halls and/or make new scrypt asics to compete....
but the A4's would probably be OK as the first of the herd and Titans (assuming they did not doorstop getting kinda old) same...and the 'parade has to end sometime..but
hell by then I'm into Mar/Apr of 2017 and hell anyone with even an A4 at 4k is probably good for longer...and again imho likely to ROI

the non ROI stuff would be the surge for scrypt (if it happened) equipment IF BTC went to 650 usd and again at say 0.008 ltc to btc ..ltc say went to 5.20 usd at that ratio
then you would see a diff rise madness in scrypt of the btc madness of difficulty we all remember/dread/etc

Likely I'm wrong and they will pump out so many chips (low cost to them now that IPO $$ allowed them to be made) and units/etc....everyone will jump on board and
drive LTC and other scrypt alt coin difficulty to the moon .....and of course BTC being BTC and LTC being yoshi to BTC's mario ....going SIDEWAYS with say a 'modest' pump and
sideways correction at halving...er would be BAD for all of us above :(

well hell 2017 could be another crypto year of 'equipment glut' of the scyrpt variety ...ie round and round she goes....

(silly funny smelling hairless primate humans throwing poo....get me off this planet ..need to hitch a ride) :)

But anyway ..for scrypt to survive it needs NEW equip of SOME kind for pow/scrypt etc or it will all fade away imnho.....I just don't want it to jump in the wading pool
all at once...i want it to WADE in slowly don't ya know (all about me guys and keeping the titans going till OCT 2016 and 4c dump in winter elec hieat per kwh and thru APR 2017 for that free winter heat) :)

That being said the A4 being first COULD ROI imho ..but man if it has a 90 day warranty that also could be a risk...this new end 14mm chip stuff could be 'iffy'

at a 1 year warranty and say 2.5k to 3k I'd be all over this :)

whatever crypto never a dull moment :)

I would happily test one of these units  :)

Ditto 😁


We all would (check my profile on here hint hint)

It is going to be interesting for sure, while I have about squeezed all the performance you can get out of these things and modded them quite a lot to make them a bit more usable, I wonder about some of the changes according to the specs they use anywhere from 8W-13W of power , well so did  the A2 ASICS and they had over 2x the surface area to get rid of that heat, I know it is not a thing most worry over I just wonder if they will be able to run like they say.

I would happily test 100 of these units.

 I'd settle for testing one.


 9-)

they did reply asked me how many I'd like.....I said TWO (minnow that I am) ...likely this will be the last email I shall get :(

But did ask them price as well...we will see...

If they contact me they will do so because they want a few of us 'asic cheerleaders' on here to pass the word on their product.

IF not..then they are just moving stuff ..kinda/sorta to 'show the flag the equip exists' for their data hall IPO


I'm guessing my emails are ...as we speak ..clanking around their 'spam bucket' after my big TWO units reply :(

What is a "data hall"? Have seen that posted on btctalk a lot. Don't you all mean "data center"?!

Google search did not come up with much..first result to "what is a data hall" comes back with this link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Data_center


....so why do some of you say "data hall" when it appears it is really "data center"?

Sorry to hijack this thread but it has been buggin me for a while.

It is a https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calque of Swedish word https://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Datorhall that means the same as what you've quoted.

Well this explanation below (quoted from an above post on this thread) is as good an explantion of any I guess.

Just common in Minnesota (a predominately SWEDISH settled state in USA back in the day). So it all seems to fit.

But this is where I picked it up as an equivalent to data center I'm farily sure. So the below explanation is as good as any I think

ie probably more proper data center term..ie versus the off the cuff data hall....which again around here is used interchangeably.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1251930.msg14623426#msg14623426 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1251930.msg14623426#msg14623426)


So anyway imho that pretty much nailed it. Minnesota predominantly settled by Swedes........again my assumption a slang Midwest USA term

for the same.

Really? I don't know...have seen it soo much here that I would think it was something more than that? I honestly am curious. Not disparaging the use of the term...just wanting to find out why a lot of people use it.

They won't sit on a shelf if they aren't selling, inventory will be mining or they'll drop the price they won't just let them collect dust.

Likely imho they will just be a 'token' amount of these A4 miners (like sfards did) just to show the flag on a unit or two. The main push will be their own data center (did you see that i said data center not data hall) and the uphill fight of selling bulk chips would be their next hurtle.

Anyway it seems that is what asic equip makers of scrypt and/or sha-256 do now. Much more profitable to chase NEWBIE IPO big $$$ money that wants to flow into crypto then those NEWBIE HOME miners with less $$$ as was done in the past.

Same angle but bigger pockets the big money newbie IPO folk have. (again imho)  (My thoughts of this is that they DID at 3.20 LTC or so scrypt prices manage to get enough IPO $$$ to build the chips in the first place..which from my view was quite a feat)

Anyway my 'guess' on how it will play out. Overpriced. Limited amount of units and maybe even like sfards did only available in bulk purchasing of 100 plus.

We will see I guess.( Assuming it is NOT vaporware. Always a consideration)

I think the sales price will be something like $4.000 or 9BTC + shipping, of course. Above that, the miner is overpriced too much, below, the hashrate will rise very fast... :-\

 Last time I checked Innosilicon doesn't HAVE a "data center" or "data hall" or any significant mining operation at all.

 They seem to be the only Cryptocoin Mining Chip/Miner manufacturer that doesn't do a lot of mining themselves - probably because they were a well-established Chip manufacturer before they got into Cryptocoin chip making (and still ARE a manufacturer of lots of other chips).

Unlike every other manufacturer AFAIK making cryptocoin chips, Innosilicon doesn't rely on cryptocoin for most to all of their income, much less most to all of their profit.



I won't talk about some of their DEALERS (and likely partners) that DO in fact mine *cough Zoomhash cough*....

OK I'm confused....what was the IPO money for then? I thought they had the mask etc ready to go and needed IPO $$$

I find it hard to believe that they are betting all on others using bulk chips sales at $3.20 per LTC say or the price of scrypt to carry the load

you could be right ..but spondoolies WAS not as big into data centers but they are now ...;perhaps innsilicon has also gone the way of knc etc in the old 'me first' camp

but I don't know.....you could be correct ..but now I'm really confused .thought I had a handle on why at these low prices they were 'pushing scrypt chips'

perhaps they are into this as the 'equiv' of home mining ...just for the frack of saying they can make a 14mm asic scrypt chip (not sure why thou)

Data hall was a term used by KNC for their mining farm in Sweden.  I believe people now use it as a derogatory term in referring to a big farm that screws people.

Innosilicon probably could have done the A4 without any investment at all - they just wanted partners to mitigate the risk, since Scrypt is a much smaller market than SHA256 and 14/16nm development/bring to production costs are a LOT higher than 28nm.

 It's not IMPOSSIBLE that they have their own farm - but there is no evidence supporting that they do, and I suspect they don't understand the risks and rewards of it well enough to consider it worth investing into, whereas making and selling chips is a business they have a LOT of experience and practice at.


 Why does Warren Buffet think Bitcoin is unworthy of investment?
 It's not CONSERVATIVE enough for him to trust.
 (He didn't coin the term "Value Investor", he just has spent 60 years or so LIVING it).


 Why hasn't AMD NVidia or Intel gotten into making mining chips?
 Too small a market - and AMD in particular and NVidia to a lesser degree benefit indirectly from miners buying GPUs.

Still no updates on pricing and availability? I got the mining itch needing some new kick ass hardware to fill it

I got an email saying not yet. My expectation the units will go out to the 'bulk' purchasers in probably (my guess) August. This was the over $100k orders min.
Thus you MIGHT see these units to us as individuals sometime in Sept. I also think they will be 4k at least or more now with the BTC and LTC price hikes.

Probably way to 'rich for me' at 14c kwh electric. Also not a big fan of 4k out for a 90 day warranty when all ASIC equipment I know about took about 3 months
to 'kinda' get a working firmware with various pools etc. One big paper weight if their 14nm chips and/or equip does not work well after 90 days. Again imho.

i came to the same assumption, last time when they launched the A2. (they asked >10K USD for Batch 1 Devices)
To much Risk involved. Might be interesting if you buy big Quantity and get early Access.

Watch  Zoomhash they allways seems to get stock of any new miners all most the same day there released.


http://zoomhash.com/

yeah alibaba also seems to get this stuff up..over priced...but at least you can tell if the stuff exists then (hopefully alibaba may have a lot of scam sales)

but good point on zoomhash forgot about that


someone said these guys take paypal ..have not looked into such...but another maybe option in that they got sfards stuff first I think

http://www.itopshop.net/ (http://www.itopshop.net/)

 I believe I already mentioned that I'm sure Zoomhash was one of their "partners" on the investment thing?

 9-)

I would not be surprised if the price for the A4 was just shy of $2,000

:)

Then the hashrate will rise very fast and up...  :-[

exactly - look at what Baikal has done to Dash

I would love to hear status updates on the A4's development and release schedule.  Last I heard they have chips but don't have the complete miner yet.  So it would be awesome to see an update on the progress and the timeline.  It is real tempting to jump on the S9, and I almost did... But without updates on the A4 I think people will be lured to jump on the S9.

I'd get one for that. (2k). I could justify the 'toy' because my 14c kWh electric goes down to
10c kWh in winter. Last year I heated 85% of house with Titans. 😄

Hope you are right and I'm wrong, but I still think 4K for an A4 is likely

You'd be lucky.

They will price at $4k as suggested above. $2k is a pipedream and can't see it happening any, I respect miners want their machines at the cheapest price, but the production company hold the key.

OMG! Thank you for a good laugh today! I like it. :)

thanks - I just wanted to save your quote as is  for future reference.

 The Baikal is Johnnie-come-Lately - I suspect the other 2 had more to do with X11 hashrate jumps so far.
 I'm still shocked that *3* different entities came out with X11 ASIC at almost the same time, much less AT ALL - and I have to wonder how many if any of them are going to manage to recoup their investment in the chip work.


 I would be SHOCKED to see the A4 start out at $2000 - I'm starting to think I was optimistic planning for it to be INNOSILICON DIRECT priced at $2500.

 Year or two from now, after the initial sales rush has ended, I could see it dropping to the $2k range - or IF someone else actually gets a competative Scrypt miner out the door (seems like the Alcheminer folks aren't going to manage it, didn't raise enough funding for their second-gen miner/chip designs).


 

I tried to be optimistic and re-looked at my views on the 4k (likely) for an A4 being correct. (remember I know zip at one time I drank the BFL kool aid..you've been warned) BUT

just can't feel it. I mean from Innsilicon's point of view with LTC now at around $5 IF they came out with one at 4k imho they'd be patting themselves on the back as being

nice guys and not gouging the 'home miners' (compared to other prices in the past and service/firmware/support from other asic makers of all kinds in the past they'd likely be

correct ..again imho)

So to tell the truth 4k on review looks 'low ball' now...it likely will be somewhat to a lot higher is my conclusion now.

As to the 2nd elephant in the room HOW many will they make? ie ..will they be more into 'bulk' sales and the home miner market is an afterthought (even at 4k price) or will
they go all 'consumer is all' and crank  out bulk sales/chip sales/home miner sales and flood the market...likely in that at this time it is JUST them...again imho they will (if a 4k price)
sell a limited number of these units...a couple months after the units at the bulk price units/bulk chips/whatever have moved out the door and play king of the hill ....actually
the only guys on the hill ..have someone to climb the hill and/or even frigging be within distance of seeing the hill

hard to 'limit' oneself on your product price wise etc if you are the 'only game in town' :)

They also could easily imho 'justify' a 4k price simply because used Titans on Ebay go for 3.3k (low) to 3.7k (high) if you can find them on ebay. Currently no one is selling since
the last panic dump on the knc class action loss.....zip.....that is if they happened to be really trying to 'guess' the market.

Also is the consensus here the unit is gonna be 400mh and 1150 watts yet? Perhaps someone knows if it is higher then that? I would have to modify my calcs or as I like to say

"big ass guesses' if the A4 units were now 600mh or some such :)

whatever...again hope I'm wrong and they are 400mh 1150 watts at 2100 bucks ........(the 90 day warranty still bugs the hell out of me however ...live a little make it 6 months?)

In the for what it's worth department : this guy will be selling them.

I've bought a bunch of equipment off him and he's trustworthy - so is the guy at Itopshop.net - I've bought from him also.

I'm in the East Coast of the US and stuff arrive in 2 days via DHL

http://www.aliexpress.com/store/227686

Is this what were talking about?
http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/New-arrival-Zeus-Scrypt-Miner-All-Solution-Litecoin-Miner-300M-digging-Litecoin-with-power-supply-send/227686_2048732975.html (http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/New-arrival-Zeus-Scrypt-Miner-All-Solution-Litecoin-Miner-300M-digging-Litecoin-with-power-supply-send/227686_2048732975.html)

Of course the description on the page says newest A2 480M miner the link looks to be describe something different.
If so looking at it I find it strange to see what looks like DC-DC converter inductors all over the boards, I thought they were DC-DC less. ;)

The images on the Aliexpress page look like A2 images.  The description says the A4 prototype won't be available until July.  So what is pictured is not one of the prototypes.  This is a "pre-order" for still unbuilt equipment.  Also from what I have read Innosilicon does not do preorders.  So this person selling either must have a standing order and commitment for a bulk order or he/she is taking wild liberties on the price and number he will have available to sell. 

Thanks for the link.  It at least has a bunch of us all talking and thinking about doing really stupid stuff like a bulk preorder...  Yes, we are that crazy!  I personally am going to wait until something firms up and then figure out where in the world I would put more miners or get more electricity to run them! ROFL

Well assuming I have this correct and all the 'bulk orders' (was it like over 100k they would talk to you) it may be a long time before we see the A4

on the following (my guesses)

Prototype :   JULY 2016

Prototype to Production: say AUG 2016

Bulk Purchases out:  AUG THRU SAY SEPT 2016

1st run of individual units at say (4k) each...would START SHIPPING IN OCTOBER ...now if this is at a 4k price yet...they an't gonna sell many imho.

again above is assuming the timeline has ANY merit and what was in this guys description is legit that is selling the pre-order on aliexpress

 They're not A2 images.

 (1) 5 boards, NOT 6.
 (2) too much open space in the case. NONE of the A2 units I own or have seen pics of have that much open space between the "first" hashboard and the controller boards.
 (3) I don't think the A2 ever came in a black case, but not 100% sure on that.


 They could be using pictures of prototype units provided to them by Innosilicon.
 They also might be recycling Dragon miner pics - I think I remember some Dragons in black cases.



 Innosilicon WAS talking "mass production" in June/July timeframe - one would think they'd have at least a FEW prototype miners built by now for testing and to take pics of.

I have an A2 Terminator that looks exactly like the one pictured. I believe it is the model from LKETC. It just depends if you allow them to be called A2 Terminators but they do exist.

I think this is a really good scope on the possible timeline given the info we have so far.  I received an email from Innosilicon that the miner is not ready yet, but to stay tuned.  Based on the pieces of info we have so far I think this timeline Searing has outlined is probably close to reality. 

On the pre-order thing from Aliexpress I will pass on that one...  This is WAY to speculative for my blood... I would rather sit on the BTC and get something firm in the way of pricing and ship dates.  And I also have seen A2's that look like the pictures.  Also note the description of an A4 says 2 modules...  So way too many things don't add up from the description to the pictures. 

email response from Innosilicon  (A4 miners is open for pre-order now at price of 1800 USD per unit plus shipping fee, 10 units to start, with about 1000W per 260Mhs (+-10% performance variation) each and 30 days parts warranty. Delivery starts from September and max delay is one month.) you would need an order of at least 10 on first come first served, very limited quantities. It is out of my ability to buy right now, just thought I would pass the info on.

wow, this means the titans are not far in eficiency... right now, one of my titans are doing 280Mh/s and draining 1320w (at the wall), so 4.71w/mhs; the new 14nm A4 will do 3.85w/mhs? it is only 18% better?? and i think i can optimice my titan better than now...   :o

And BTW, this miner was initially, "Miner Performance: 600Mhs from 720W at the Wall or 850Mhs from 1020W", so 1.2w/mhs, then they published "A4 Miner: 400Mhs per 1KW power supply in one standard miner box", 2.5w/mhs, but now they are telling 3.85w/mhs... in september they can publish 220mh/s and draining 1150w?? (4.6mh/s)  ??? ??? ???

Are those miners really 14nm? Their performance is a huge disappointment.

 >:(      :(

"Miner Performance: 600Mhs from 720W at the Wall or 850Mhs from 1020W"

not even CLOSE. one really WOULD ask if that's even 14nm ;(

price is way too high if those numbers are right would not pay more than 900 per unit

I get 275MH/s @ 1250w from the wall, giving me about 4.54w/mh. Thats as good as Ive been able to get it even at extremely low clocks.

Yea not sure whats going on here...they seemed like they had sample chips in from the fab last month and published those "tested" 1.5 w/MH specs, which is in line with what a 14nm scrypt chip *should* do. Now they are stating 4 w/mh??? Thats very fishy...I got 5 w/mh efficiency out of the 40nm Alcheminer chip on my USB miner. The only thing I can think of is that yield so horrible that they are only getting 1/4 functional cores per silicon area. That or they are selling an improved version of their 28nm chip and saying its 14nm...

Thats extremely crappy performance / power usage. Is your "email response" even real?

I know it sucks as we are all hoping for a bigger leap in hash and power use, but this is my email in full.

Dave,

The hash rate per box is different from what we expected, but it's based on sample chip performance tested in the lab. And still A4 Dominator has the best efficiency ever, and we determined the price based on the specs.

Are you still interested? How many do you want? Since our first batch has very limited quantities, we will serve batch orders first.

Best regards,
Chloe Zhang
+86 18040500320
Innosilicon Technology Ltd.
www.innosilicon.com.cn

From: Chloe Zhang [mailto:zhangq@innosilicon.com.cn]
Sent: Sunday, June 12, 2016 12:31 PM
To: 'Dave'
Cc: 'sales@innosilicon.com.cn'
Subject: RE: new a4 miner pre orders... Dave

Dear Dave,

I’m doing good. How about you?

A4 miners is open for pre-order now at price of 1800 USD per unit plus shipping fee, 10 units to start, with about 1000W per 260Mhs (+-10% performance variation) each and 30 days parts warranty.

Delivery starts from September and max delay is one month.

Best regards,
Chloe Zhang
+86 18040500320
Innosilicon Technology Ltd.
www.innosilicon.com.cn

From: Dave [mailto:]
Sent: Sunday, June 12, 2016 9:38 AM
To: 'Chloe Zhang'
Subject: new a4 miner pre orders... Dave

Hi Chloe, how are you today?
I was wondering if you are getting close to selling the new a4’s? What would be the final specs and the final pricing, with the farmboy discount? Thanks Dave

Interesting, well if they are as horrible as stated in the email ... then that's great news for my Titan! =)

Well given the specs on the A4 this is a much harder sell.  It is a little more efficient than a Titan, but not mind blowingly so that is for sure.  I know I would still be interested, so I am tossing it out here to see who else might also be interested and possibly we can arrange a group buy?  I would feel a lot better if they had some video up showing the A4 running, and give us something to go on, but so far this is pretty weak.  This 30 day warranty is absolutely horrible.  All kinds of red flags going off in my head about this.

So if others are interested in a group buy please chime in, or PM me and I would like to see if we have enough interest where we can get the 10 unit buy in level at least.  Or if your thinking about buying 10 or more of these in the pre-order and would be interested in letting others tailgate on a larger order that would be great if someone is thinking about something like that.  Thoughts?

yeah from what I figured a common say 325mh (which 350 is ideal but hard to get these days used) so say full out used Titan best you can probably get is 325mh it would be
1250 watts (using gen tarkin's 3rd party eff firmware) or about the equiv of the 260mh at 1000 watts stated

they really are equiv almost of a Titan in watts used vs mh out imho ..

kinda oranges and oranges (assuming my math is right...sigh math is hard!)

30 day warranty scares the crap out of me so I shall yell


LIGHTFOOT

(he should perk right up...a new 'quest' of the ASIC's WTF is going on soap/drama on BTC.   (keeps him busy and out of trouble) :)

but hey....my only concern is they sell these things like toasters...if that is so ...any unit Titan or A4 would be pretty much out of the space heating business by the
end of winter 2017....

this $4.85 LTC price is not helping my mojo either :(

If somewho makes a buy group, i would be in

I also confirmed via email that the info we have seen about the 260mh, roughly 1000w, $1800 for the pre-order miner is true.  This does NOT come with PSU's to keep shipping costs down.  I have asked for pictures and video of the miner and have questions for them regarding the 30 day warranty.  I also asked them about a group buy here on BCT.  So I will start a new thread for the group buy and hope that Innosilicon will partner with us to facilitate the group buy for those that are interested.  If any of you have had experience setting up a group buy before please chime on your experiences and what we can do to make something like this happen and be a smooth experience for all of us interested in taking part in this "adventure".  :-)

i personally would NOT be interested, pre-orders are just throwing yourself at their mercy. i will wait till they have them in hand and come with BTC, snag one. too much can change in the months till we would actually receive the miner. for me anyways ;p

Agreed. No more pre-orders.

Here is the post for following the group buy:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1523298.0

 They also had a table showing a range of efficiencies, at various hashrate/chip.
 4W/Mh was the top hash/chip figure, 1.5W/Mh was the bottom.

 I suspect it depends on what voltage you run the chips at - this is nothing new, though it's a MUCH wider range than anything else I've seen.

It's all too sketchy at the moment. I think i will hold onto my money until more info is available. The figures are changing weekly. The first estimates of 600/800 MH's were fantastic, it then went down to 400/500 still not too bad. Now it's down to 256 how can it go from 800 to 256 ? at 1000w it means i have to get 3 units to get the original 800 MH's at 3000w instead of 800-1200w. I'll hang fire for now.

This reminds me of Blackarrow. Promises and spec changes. More promises and dates. Then missed dates and promises, all the while they are taking preorder BTC. Finally a few units ship and the rest of the bag holders get nothing but a big FU.

Yeah, it would be nice if manufactures were actually honest about their projections. Rather than trying to scam investors into feeding them tons of money to make a shitty product.
Im sure all the "partners", that shoveled millions in to Innosilicons pockets for the A4, are really happy right now.
In the end tho, fuck the investors; its the customers who always get screwed in cryptoworld.
Oh well .... at least the Titan will live on for longer now =)
28nm vs 14nm at nearly same power consumption .... how much shittier can your chip get?! Innosilicon...

The bad thing is Innosolicon is more than an ASIC company (ASIC in terms of crypto mining), they also create chips for other purposes and were around before crypto. Because of this they shouldnt need pre-orders. They should also not scam and give false hopes as it will hurt the other side of their business. They are probably in one of the better positions of all ASIC manufacturers if they would take advantage of it.

We received an update from Innosilicon regarding the availability of the A4.  Here are the latest specs and info regarding the current batch 1 pre-order:

Update: World Most Profitable A4 Dominator Miner is coming soon! Early batch goes fast with best efficiency ever and very limited quantity, and who are the lucky ones to get the access to the first batch will, with no doubt, enjoy the early gain before anybody else, that means big profit.
 
Pre-order price: 1800 USD per unit plus shipping fee, 5 units to start
 
Estimated delivery time: Starts from August and max delay is one month.
 
Warrantee: 45 days parts warranty
 
Specifications:
l  Part Number: INNOSILICON A4 Dominator 280Mhs per unit (+-10% performance, can be over-clocked at user's risk)
l  Size: Length 28cm * Width 12.8cm * Height 25cm
l  Net weight: 11KG (without PSU)
l  ASIC: A4, 80pcs
l  Blade: 4pcs
l  Voltage: +12V
l  Power efficiency: Initial batch will be defaulted at 3.2W/Mhs in Turbo mode, 2.2W/Mhs in Norminal mode, and 1.35W/Mhs in ultra low power mode
l  Required rated PSU: 1000W or above, 8 * PCI-E 6Pin
PSU is external and exclusive to save your international shipping cost, which can be acquired used easily at low cost or reused from old version miners.
l  Included: Raspberry Pi, it is plug and play with your PSU

If you would like to know about the group buy we are organizing you can find that thread here:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1523298.40

noise level ?

150db at 30% fan... ROFL

We don't know yet.  Inno says they will be posting a video soon with the new A4.  Hoping we will get a glimpse and answer some of these questions.

Hi,

I am located in Sweden and intend to order a bunch of A4's.
I am thinking of buying at least 1 for myself, and i might be able to buy a second one.
If anyone is interested in joining in on a group order (minimum 3 is required in total for innisilicon to ship) you are welcome to join in on the order.

Contact me on a PM if you are interested.
(We will of course arrange the setup in a proper and secure way)

/Magnus

I want to buy two units I am located at Europe I can organized one Europe group

Also for Europe

See prev guys post above. You all can make it for more then 3 units.  Go big  find someone in Central Europe equal shipping price 🚊😄

Its a though sell Imo.
After import taxes and shipping costs are around 2300 to get it to my door.
It mines around 2.7 Ltc a day after power costs that leaves me with around 6 usd a day that's a little under 400 days to roi If the diff doesn't jump up because of all the added scrypt power.
Unless u got Free or really cheap power its gonne be close if your able to roi.

you COULD maybe co-locate it in the states get around vat that way ...but me I'm about 15c plus maybe more on such (guy in Iowa) could probably do better in Oregon or some such but he knows Titans..and my rate here at home is 14.6c kwh anyway

on the other hand with so many titans now at the house (from 2 to 4 with the other 5 in Iowa) I sure can't just eat the electric anymore and consider it just added LTC to BTC

So my logic is with most of my electric miners (I'm never home) ALL THE electric I use in the house from now on will be paid for by mining....also I have a decrease of about 4c kwh

for Winter rates the 2nd week of Oct.

In that I heated the house last year at 85% rate with 3000 watts or so....6000 watts or so should not be a problem to do the same :)

Thus the logic ..till they doorstop they pay electric for themselves each month (including my puny home/house use) and they Heat the house this winter......

anyway ..who'd a thunk it?

but anyway such an option of USA hosting ..if you trust someone to send it to them under their name and host it....would get around Vat and also maybe less  expensive

electric costs then Europe?.....probably unworkable but just a thought

right ;/   thats why i couldnt preorder. i kept thinking there was no way without even giving us a vid or having a presence here would they deliver in aug (honestly good luck by end of sept. at this point imo)

by then all those new/old titans will be online, and all buyers have already lost 2 months of mining time waiting where hardware bought from in hand is hashing as we speak.

following same path as all new ascii, by the time consumers get their preorders they will be obsolete, as usual... ;(

"A4 ASIC offers up to 4Mhs per chip LTC hash power with as low as 1.5W/MHs power consumption."

at these rates it would work but what their selling now doesn't work for me.
I'm not sure if their website sais those will become available in the future or whats going on.

Initial testing of the A4 chip showed great promise, but what they are getting when combining chips into PCB's is something different.  So the numbers they posted are not correct.  The corrected numbers we are getting for a miner pre-order is 280mh at roughly 1000w at the wall.  Of course we are still waiting to see one in action and get more specs.  But it is far short of what they expected from the single A4 chip tests.  We know the chip can do it, but when put into a package it appears they have some issues to figure out.

Right now it looks like batch 1 won't ship until September for the pre-orders.  From there I assume you will be able to order from distributors in Oct-Nov time frame. We won't know specs for those batches until we get closer to that happening.

ebay has one for sell or per order

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Newest-A4-280M-SCRYPT-MINER-/232045905945?hash=item3607038819:g:rwIAAOSw6n5XrPts

Heh. A pre-order of a pre-order at 33% more in price. 😄

That's going to be cute, they are promising factory installed PSU's and cables...

What I think has happened is that based on the ever decreasing chip density per device and efficiency of the cards, one of the early adopter partners has pulled out of the deal (remember they were seeking 5 x $1.5M partners), so what we're being offered is their slice of the initial first batch.

I've been playing around with the numbers and would imagine there would have been 3000 of the 400Mh/s machines being built at something like $2500 each for the early partners, bringing the total to $7.5M (600ea). That was my worst case scenario and given the 400 MH/s specs would have had 114 Chips per machine, there could be up to 4167 of the lower effeiciency 280 MH/s miners if all the chips are good. Interestingly the price  stays about the same at around $6.50 per MHs or $22.75 per A4 chip.

So I think this is why we're not seeing fully built prototypes yet, we were never supposed to be getting them this early, and based on the numbers above there would be 600 machines available for every partner who has pulled out.

Based on average pool mining returns at 0.000085 btc/mhs/day, these are still looking very good.  :D
Mind you, there could be up to 1.3 Th/s about to be dropped into a 4.5 Th/s global scrypt network.  :-\

That is a potentially halving in progress...  :o :(
The actual hashrate is 1400 Gh/s, you are talking about 1200 Gh/s more, so all our hash will be rewarded by 1/2... The Litecoin minery will NOT be very reliable...

This certainly will have an overall negative impact for everyone mining scrypt coins. The buyers may have a tough time getting their ROI.

Yep. We need BTC at around 700 bucks imho to play it somewhat safe. At that price at 0.006 LTC to BTC you are looking at $4.20 usd per LTC. NOT Ideal,

but....you could maybe squeak by with a 10 month (with elec use taken out) and ROI on these units in that ballpark of a guess/price.

(check my figures)

A lot of Titan owners spent a lot of 2015 mining LTC on a prayer at 1.30 usd per LTC and a hope it would go up in price. Same angle with these machines

different year imho.

I suppose just to liven things up the Chinese miners (75%) will announce a fork from BTC Core and 8mb blocks just to further muck the crypto universe up

some more. (BTC gets a cold .all the alt coins get pneumonia). It seems a lot of crypto FUD is rinse/wash/repeat I've seen it before.

They don't do per orders if they needed  investors to me that's a per order of sorts it was publicly made  , no per order's to me is selling them when they are ready and not asking for any kind of money other then though private investors. like bitmain does and even Avalon does now, the Avalon 7 is coming when no idea but it is, they posted soft ware support and a image for the miner on there FTP on the 17 of this month .


I thought I  saw Innosilicon talking per orders when the A2 came out on there main site but so far i have yet to see them run any farm because , I'm guessing,  they don't need to because they make more stuff like memory and other PC stuff , not just miners, bitmain only makes miners . I might be wrong or misunderstand how Innosilicon does it other wise . either way i can't afford one if i could i would give it some thought, im sure i would need that cash back sooner then 200 days or how ever long ROI would take or i would have to be willing to waste 1800 on a group buy, i wouldn't try to resell it either, unless i could double the price so i could buy another one i love mining to much to give it up or to pass one of these by, by reselling it.

Innosilicon did not take ANY preorders on the A2 - it came out as a total suprise with ZERO previous announcements, pretty much unique in the cryptocoin mining industry.
 They DID pre-announce their "Farm Boy" units, but I don't remember if they bothered with pre-orders on those.


 The investment needed to get a new 14/16nm chip up and running is a TON higher than working with long-established 28nm tech though, which I'm sure is WHY Innosilicon wanted some investment help on that generation.


 My ballpark guess is that the A4 will fuel about a doubling of hashrate over the first year after it starts shipping, and a continuing slow increase past that point - but only if Litecoin price stays above the $3 level, and even a bit iffy if it keeps drifting down TO that level. Still shouldn't be hard to manage ROI on an A4 if you have VERY VERY cheap electric, but at 10c/KWH might make ROI difficult-to-impossible (and 10c/KWH is fair bit BELOW the average for the US since the EPA/Obama War On Coal has driven US average electric prices UP quite a bit the last few years).

From what I understand Innsilicon is a chip manufacturer foremost. They got the big boys to fund their 14 nm chip equip and line to make asic chips. But after that is done
they will have a fully financed 14nm production line/system for other 14nm chips. Thus it was a no brainer. Get some IPO $$$. Get the 14nm setup funded to make scrypt
asics as such. Make your profit. Then use your new 14nm production on other NON asic related chips of that size.

Kinda brilliant actually.

Some one did some kind per something when the farm boys came out on the forums they were a deal but I was a little short on cash so had to pass . maybe the next A2 deal i come across I will finally get one ... they should drop even more in price once the A4 does came out and still be useful for a while longer, farming alt is a lot different then farming btc direct . there is a lot of them etc etc ...i all way have liked farming script coins more then BTC but still like doing both .

about three month ago i was offered a farm boy deal even had the cash but was asked to late i had just bought a Alchemist 256 then 4 or 5 days later some one i know sent me A email with a really nice group buy deal for some farm boys again I'm not meant to have a A2 i guess ..then one popped on ebay  i was to late buying a month or so ago they sold a mini A2 for 175 they normally sell for 500 or more . zoom hash had some 110 for a nice price a few month ago by the time i got the cash to gather they sold out, i have even more times were i missed out.

cyz

In the web : http://www.innosilicon.com/html/news/14.html

Is this info:

Part Number: INNOSILICON A4 Dominator 280Mhs per unit (+-10% performance, can be over-clocked at user's risk)
Size: Length 28cm * Width 12.8cm * Height 25cm
Net weight: 11KG (without PSU)
ASIC: A4, 80pcs
Blade: 4pcs
Voltage: +12V
Power efficiency: Initial batch will be defaulted at 3.2W/Mhs in Turbo mode, 2.2W/Mhs in Norminal mode, and 1.35W/Mhs in ultra low power mode
Required rated PSU: 1000W or above, 8 * PCI-E 6Pin
PSU is external and exclusive to save your international shipping cost, which can be acquired used easily at low cost or reused from old version miners.
Included: Raspberry Pi, it is plug and play with your PSU


I read before the machine can be at 400-600 or 800mhs awith overclock at 1020W.
Is the 280MHS the default hashrate.  And then I will can overclock to 400 or 600 mhs?

The older numbers were overoptimistic estimates before they had a chance to actually settle down and work with a significant number of chips - *AND* seem to have been based at least in part on using an A2/Dragon sized miner machine with more and larger boards in it.

 If you look at the SIZE spec on the final A4 as announced, it's less than half the size - even accounting for space savings of the power supply in the A2, the A4 is STILL ballpark less than half the size.

Any idea how to buy one unit?

Wait for dealers like ZoomHash to start selling them, or work with other folks in the "group deal" about a combined order.

I think the pre-order time frame is too close now.  I would hang tight now for the A4 to hit distributors like Zoomhash.  I don't think it is going to be that long now before you will start to see some announcements.  We are looking at the end of this month for the pre-buy units to start shipping, and I expect there will be some first unit pains to be dealt with.  So I would stay posted to these threads and follow the progress of the A4 first units and how that goes.

https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/280-300M-Litecoin-scrypt-miner-A4_60539690601.html?spm=a2700.7724838.0.0.6QIoGg (https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/280-300M-Litecoin-scrypt-miner-A4_60539690601.html?spm=a2700.7724838.0.0.6QIoGg)

And try to chat with Amanda (skype: amanda2007520). She says that they can offer two types of miners:

272 MH/s for 2159 USD (for trade insurance order);
136.6 MH/s (40 ASIC chips) for 1150 USD (for trade insurance order).

You can order it at Alibaba (Alibaba offers customer protection).

BIG rant  coming up as I have 3 of these in house  http://www.iqair.com/home-air-purifiers/gcmultigas/buy  at a cost of 3600 usd and about 1000 a year in filter replacement.

http://www.iqair.com/sites/default/files/products/gc_reflect.png  They are better then inhaler medication. In my opinion.

The rant starts below


Fuck coal  and I don't like Obama.   If you understood how much pollution  was dumped by the midwest onto the northeast you would not have made the statement.

   This entire issue should have never been allowed to happen , but Bush  allowed old dirty nasty coal plants a pass on not upgrading their plants to burn clean.  Corporate greed kicked in and no plants were retro fitted to burn cleanly .  Causing a shit ton of lung disease all preventable if the moron power plants had upgraded their power plants to burn clean.

   Having been a life long Asthmatic my research on this is long and deep. BTW I will most likely vote for Trump as part of his plan is to alter the coal industry the correct way.  IE clean coal plants.  If he was to do just this one act as the next president it would make him a very good president.





Back to mining and away from politics  do you have plans to get one of these miners?

Have they shipped any units yet?

Supposedly they have shipped and someone received one -- but I'm skeptical.

I got mine in the mail today and just got it setup and hashing. I am getting 274 mhs at the miner client (around 270mhs at the pool). It is pulling 1070 watts from the wall. I have it hashing in a non climate controlled and warm environment and it gets to a max of 60c (4hrs running now).

Hope that helps people

Pictures please!!

Here are some pics:

https://s17.postimg.org/vudwf1dbf/IMG_0132.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/vudwf1dbf/)

https://s17.postimg.org/6cvhvfvl7/IMG_0133.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/6cvhvfvl7/)

https://s17.postimg.org/3wy9vc2wb/IMG_0135.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/3wy9vc2wb/)

I just restarted the miner to unplug the voltmeter but will update this post in about an hour when I get a more solid sample time for the picture.

Just shy of 4w/MH ....... so, hardly better than a Titan ... long live knc Titan!

Amazing disparity between the Title of this thread and the end result W/mhs ... haha!

yeah its about the same as a Titan, man I wish I had got my hands on some of those cheap titans last year.  Either way this unit is not worth more than 800 usd imo

Ow please  ;D @innosilicon give me one to test, over and underclock and I will give you an honest review and measured userdata in return :)

Best regards emdje,

Your trusted A2 modder: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=672969.0

Yes, Innosilicon, please give him one to test! Emdje, I am eagerly awaiting your a4 custom image ;). I am running your image on my A2 and it is amazing.

Here is a picture of the miner UI after running all night:

https://s22.postimg.org/ukt30z45p/IMG_0137.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/ukt30z45p/)

Thanks for the input. Yes the efficiency is no better than the Titan.

To be honest it is entirely possible I have the mV setting wrong. I had to use a magnifying glass on the picture in the tiny (and i really mean tiny) manual that it comes with in order to read what mV to put the miner at (but hey, at least its something). Initially, it showed the voltage field as just a / with no number, but in the picture I believe it showed the value of 800, so that is what I set it to. Also, in my UI, when you set the voltage and hit confirm, it just resets back to a / (but I know it works, because the only way the miner will stay on is if you input a voltage before hitting start). It says "Voltage(mV)(500-860)" and then gives the ominous warning "Warning: Do not increase voltage at random, easy to burn down." Im hesitant to adjust the voltage much at all due to this warning.

noise level ?

When standing right next to both my A2 and my A4 about 4 feet away, I measured between 78-80 decibels. Made little difference with the A2 off. Definitely much louder than the a2

So if the efficiency is no better than a Titan -- then -- is this a SCAM?

Why would someone overpay to buy these units?  I'm lost here.

It seems that it is basically 2.5x as efficient as the 100Mh/s A2 units (which are selling for about $650 with PSU).

Yea these will drop down to about 800 each in 1-2 months...not sure how you get your power draw 4x worse than planned...

I figured such a small package with 1 fan was going to be louder, that's unfortunate

in a2 units don't go for more than 200

This means the A2's should drop in price may be 500 or less for one and titans should stay about the same ?. this is not a question  just a thought > the A2 's should still be usable for a while longer and Zeus miners  or lower will be dead now for sure .

Since these seem to be very similar to the Titans -- is it possible that no new chips were ever produced and this is just KNC chips (or copies of them) placed in new boards with new software?

Just curious how the stats could be so far off.

Titans MAY stay a bit higher...due to the fact of gen tarkin firmware is a miracle for keeping them running and not shutting off dies etc.....so that is solid. Also lightfoot can
fix them.

With 45 day warranty I can't say the same for the A4's (yet) .....IF the 2 guys above got an A4 to play with I'd not worry too much about the warranty. They are that good

on the above issues. Titans mainly also may go for higher in that you can split up the cubes (5) vs (2) so always may pay a bit more to get that extra cube etc

We will have to see...IF the A4's hang together well enough after warranty..then what will happen with out new players making scrypt miners to compete with the A4's

It very likely will shake out by say Jan or Feb due to difficulty to say an LTC network consisting of Titans and A4's ....and hell we could see another 2 years out of the Titans

and at least an equivalent 2 year run on the A4's ...in other words it could stay 'weird in scrypt crypto land" IF all LTC network is used for is for the Chinese folk to continue

to speculate because the like LTC (don't understand it but I will run my miner's as a merry go round for their enjoyment) :)

 The stats on the CHIPS aren't even close.

KNC liked "big chip" designs, Innosilicon prefers "more chips but smaller".

 Think Spondoolies vs. Bitmain for comparison.


 I would anticipate pricing on the A2 to drop once a significant quantity of A4s start shipping - but not real fast, they're still profitable after all even at near-average Electric pricing.

So the A4 definitely has a new chip design?  And not a whole bunch of A2 chips combined together with a really powerful fan?

If the pricing would drop on this by 50% - I would certainly be interested in some units.  But the noise and temperature are concerning.

Did anyone get to measure the actually noise created by the machine?

And did I read somewhere that after 4 hours the unit got up to 60 degrees C?  Is that right?  Was that temperature based on the air coming out of the machine?  Or the actual temperature on the chip?

If it is air coming out of the machine -- how in the world would one keep your room cool?  If memory serves -- I believe my A2 units would average 33 to 38 degrees C -- depending how many units I had in the room and if I had some AC going.


EDIT:  I believe someone mentioned noise at 88db or so?  That is loud!

Thank you for your compliment  :)

Network Difficulty dropped a lot i guess that's the calm before the storm. so watch out, mine your ass off now with all most any miner . i don't know i don't watch the lite coin Difficulty like i used to with btc's.   

A2s were still going for $650+ on Ebay earlier this month.. 
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_odkw=a2+terminator&LH_Complete=1&LH_Sold=1&_osacat=0&_from=R40&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.Xa2+terminator+mine.TRS1&_nkw=a2+terminator+miner&_sacat=0

Now that the A4 has been released, where do we learn about the A3 that was released with it?

A3 has apparently been dropped. I remember one rumour (from a souce that had the money to be an Innosilicon partner) that it turned out to be BW 1401 level efficiency (or S7 level in BitMain terms).
Dunno if Innosilicon is working on a more efficient version behind the scenes, if that's the case.

Given the final results on the A4, I'm tending to believe that rumour.

Sadly, no its not a scam. Miners will be flocking to these, just like every stupid hardware release ... no matter the price and no matter the efficiency. Its an addiction. Ill probably be the only one not purchasing any.

Nope, not the only one... Unless the price drops. A lot.

Well I was hoping it would hold off as long as possible but I guess they are out there now, would like to see the insides of one, been looking for broken A2 boards on this end, been trying to keep my stuff running as long as I can.

same after reading everything here Id rather by a few A2's  and try to get a titan, the titan has more hash power if all the dies work ,what's the point .

other then

a fool and his money


no offense intended to anyone by that commit .

I was ready to commit to a pre-order buy of 3 of these a couple months back.

 Sadly, the delays caused me to put most of that money in another direction as I couldn't afford to wait.


 Long-term I figure I'll end up buying some at some point.


 Anyone in Central Washington want to buy a couple A2 units, drop me a message. I won't ship them but I will deliver if it's reasonably close.

I currently have a few A2s for sale without PSUs, or can install New 1250 gold rated PSUs. if you prefer.
Even without the PSUs these are Tested and 100% working.

I will ship, but USA only.

PM me if interested.

LOL - I might as well add myself to the list -- have a handful of 88Mh/s A2s with PSUs built-in.  At this time will only consider local pickup in Portland, Oregon.

everyone lives so far away with their old A2s  :'(

If anyone has their A4s and would like to try to earn more money than just mining Litecoins, try mining with us at https://prohashing.com (https://prohashing.com).  We optimized the pool to give good hashrate for Titans, and now with the A4s coming online we're analyzing data and making changes to try to extract the most hashrate from them too.  If you have your A4 on our pool, give us some feedback in our forums where A4 owners are discussing their results at https://forums.prohashing.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=982 (https://forums.prohashing.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=982).

Thanks Chris,  As soon as I get my A4's up I will point them your way and will let you know how it looks.  I should have the A4's online this week if all goes smoothly.   ;D

I am just running a bunch of A2s but I have found Prohashing to work pretty well so far, now if I could just find parts for my A2s that seem to be dieing off slowly.

LiteGuardian has always worked well for me.
As I recall, they were one of the few pools that never had issues with the Alcheminer....

LTC has been pretty stable around $4 (with a brief surge to $5ish) for a year now.

 I don't see ANY issue with an A4 achieving ROI - just won't be in 3-4 months like some miners managed in WAY BACK days.


 If you want high pricing, consider the original GridSeed 80 blade units at $3000 - those probably NEVER DID achieve ROI for anyone, and I suspect most of the ones that sold at $1600 a couple months later never achieved ROI either.

 I don't anticipate an A4 managing to ROI in the "current conditions 9 months or so with very very cheap electric" as the network hashrate and difficulty will climb once they start shipping in numbers, but I DO anticipate them achieving ROI in 12-18 months timeframe as long as LTC pricing doesn't collapse (and right now, it's CLIMBING to follow Bitcoin's recent rise, as usual).


 If you don't like the high A4 pricing though, and your electric is cheap enough, A2s will be profitable for quite a while longer (just not AS profitable as over the last yeah or so). For that matter, the Gridseeds are still marginally profitable if you have VERY VERY cheap enough electric, though I suspect not for a lot longer.

Do any experienced miners who are mining for profit still mine single currencies like LTC exclusively?

I'll be mining a multipool like Prohashing and with current payouts per Mhs at 0.000065 BTC or more (http://poolpicker.eu/table), a single A4 running at 270 Mhs returns approx $12.28 per day (BTC = $700). Subtract power costs (1.080Kwh x 0.11c x 24 = $2.85) and that leaves $9.43 per day profit.

In two years, I would imagine a fully working A4 will still be worth $750 (3 year old A2's are still selling for >$600 today(but not for much longer)), so my ROI target is actually only $1150.

$1150/$9.43 = 122 days ROI and then every day until the day I sell the A4 is pure profit after electricity costs.

Of course it's very likely that payments will drop as network hash rates increase but even a 25% payout decrease will still leave plenty of profit for an A4.The same can't be said for Gridseeds and A2's without cheap power however. Once the various scrypt network hash rates start to rise and payouts decrease, these less efficient miners will cease to be viable.

The same thing happened with A7s when A9's came out. It's not as immediate in the scrypt universe but the affect will be the same.  Of course Titan's will stay viable for much longer but lets keep in mind that these cost $9,995 new and were fraught with serious delivery and quality issues.

I'm mining LTC and move it to BTC when the ratio gets at least 0.0006 LTC to BTC which would mean
$4.20 usd not the 3.94 it is now :(

I used to wait till 0.008 LTC to BTC but with all the new coins like ethereum etc out there ..that
speculative cash has gone elsewhere

I am within 1,000 bucks to the bank of paying off with BTC made so far about 2,750mh of my 3,050mh
with this years equip and some towards used.

using www.litecoinpool.org/calc (http://www.litecoinpool.org/calc)

at current my winter electric of 11c kwh and 3050mh and say 13,000 watts on titans and 3.94 LTC price
I am getting below

24 hours   30.55957031 LTC   120.40 USD   34.32 USD   86.08 USD
7 days   213.91699219 LTC   842.83 USD   240.24 USD   602.59 USD
30 days   916.78710938 LTC   3612.14 USD   1029.60 USD   2582.54 USD

$2,583.54 after rent/expenses/electric per month

the above pool has NO fees and pays out 103%..thus I just wait and move coin (over expenses)
and thus the plan or way I've played it since Nov 8th 2014 :) Of course holding and moving it
at the right time to BTC also is a guess/hope etc for this to work.

IT all depends on what the price of LTC say is next year (or BTC that drives such) If we are looking
and/or what amount/price and such and of course WHEN you get the equipment. (dumb luck plays
a role)

at $5 LTC say.. well a lot of the A4 and other dubious purchases would be forgiven quickly :)

To make a fair comparison as of today, the price of a Titan now on Ebay is about $2800 and those outfitted with Gentarkin software are rocking along nicely.  Continuing to use your logic, the residual value would be~ $500 at the end of the same period due to the age of hardware.  That leaves $2300 to recapture.  Using LTC as a baseline, the increase in difficulty for all scrypt networks is going to decrease returns as the number of A4s come online.  Therefore the new ROI would approximate to September 2017 (worst case).  Bump that $4/LTC to $5 and it drops back to June 2017.
http://www.vnbitcoin.org/detailcalculationltc.php?name=LiteCoin_Mining_Rig&startdate=2016-10-31&costperunit=2300&wattperhour=1250&gigahazarate=270000&daytoincrease=3&testlopfirst=2&diffincrement=0.0268&bitcoinperdollar=4&electriccostinput=.11&begindifflevel=51699

I think that's getting closer and really does show what a good buy the A4 is.  The completed auction you're referring to was for a batch 1 300 MHs Titan with no power supplies

Here's what the buyer said "This batch 1 miner runs a little above 300MH, but it does fall to 250-260MH after a few days, but a quick reboot puts it back up to 300MH. This miner has never once been overclocked, but it has that option for those who choose." 
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Titan-Miner-KNC-Batch-1-300-MH-Scrypt-Litecoin-LTC-Bitcoin-BTC-Digibyte-/262627666129?hash=item3d25d428d1:g:ehYAAOSwvzRX0Emo (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Titan-Miner-KNC-Batch-1-300-MH-Scrypt-Litecoin-LTC-Bitcoin-BTC-Digibyte-/262627666129?hash=item3d25d428d1:g:ehYAAOSwvzRX0Emo)

Given the track record of Titans and the stated instability, I'm amazed that he sold it for $2800, but lets look at this as more closely.

Titan: 300Mhs @ $2800 = $9.33 Mhs
A4: 280Mhs @ 1800 = $6.43 Mhs

Hmm, one is 3 years old, 40% more expensive and has a history of failing dies and burnt out PCIe connectors whereas the A4 is new, has a 45 day warranty and Innosilicon has a good track record with many very happy A2 owners who appreciate the reliability. I'm ignoring the cost of PSU's and freight because they kinda equal out.

Titan 300Mhs @ 1200W = 4w/Mhs (I've read they can actually use up to 1590W OC'ed to 325 Mhs)
A4: 280Mhs @ 1080w = 3.85w/Mhs

Not much difference there, Inno have not improved the efficiency much with their 14nm dies so it's a draw on electricity cost.

ROI: I used to use online calculators like the one above but then I worked out that mining a multipool that pays out in BTC is much more profitable. Zpool paid 0.00011381 BTC per scrypt-Mhs yesterday. Whatever hardware you buy, with BTC=$728 that's 0.08285368c per MHs less electricity.

An A4 @ 280Mhs would return $23.19 per day and a Titan @ 300Mhs would return $24.85 per day
Less power at $3.60 per day and lets call it $19.50 and $21.00 per day respectively so 1800/19.50 = 92 days to totally pay for the A4, whereas $2800/21.00 = 133 days.

Like I said, amazed anyone would buy a Titan for $2800 with no PSU's and known issues vs buying a a new A4. If you choose to stick with mining LTC exclusively your ROI will be longer, but given any consistent benchmark, the A4 is much better proposition IMO.

i agree, but would like to throw in the "admin" problem of these new a4's :/
it seems users are not only having trouble with the miners being set to default gateway (wow), but also users having trouble, if im not mistaken, ssh'ing into them/a.k.a their OWN hardware? 
BUT, let noone forget the rock steady (IMO), stability of innoscilion's miners. (the a2's are stable as shit, almost 4 years later, WITHOUT MODS)**
SO., All in all, i think the A4 is a good buy, given the next few weeks dont report owners saying their's went up in flames heehee (what's up with that microscopic documentation? lol )




**yes, they had the same "growing issues" as these a4's off the bat but there's no denying they are of the "never quit" variety, as compared to the RMA kings Bitmain

Yep, stupid move by Inno to lock down the pi account. As for setting a static IP, you can mount the SD card in Linux and edit the network config file, or simply allocate a new IP to any device you currently have that's using the .254 address and use the UI. That's simple to address if you have some basic IT skills. I've been mining for the past 6 hours on Prohashing using no extra password arguments and my 2hr average is 281.5 Mhs.

I have to say that I strongly suspect that Inno have added some thermal protection to the A4 which limits voltage when they get too hot, as I've experienced a card stop working a couple of times, and different cards each time. This seems to happen in the high 40s. I can't confirm it yet, just suspicious.

My A2's were brilliant, just set and forget. Some times it was months before I even logged on to one, they were that stable. As long as the pool was showing good hash rates I just let them run.
Hoping the A4 will be just as stable.  :D

I had to do that "mount the SD card on a linux system" edit thing on my A2s when I got them from Zoomhash - they had the *last 2* octals of the IP address written on them, but NOT the FIRST 2 - and it turns out they were all on the Class B subnet range and were ALL OVER that subnet.

 I've never been able to SSH into them - but they've been rock-solid reliable since I got them set up on the RIGHT subnet for *MY* network.

Ive updated the php file for the miner web page, nothing which will affect performance or stability, but only GUI features.
I added another pool, and im thinking about adding a pool swap button, similar to the old A2 way of switching pools. Cleaned up some of the english, and correctly numbered the pools as 1-4 rather than 1-1.

Where can you get that miner ?

Well I'd try the main page. They only sell them if you are lucky in lots of 3 at 1800 each w/o shipping wire xfer only just on wire xfer put on when you
contact them on main page that this is a 'bitcointalk group buy' you could get lucky and it still works

otherwise I THINK it is 5 units min buy and 2100 bucks ...but could be just the 5 units at above price

anyway that is how it WAS done ...and told to me (i considered it) Sunday Oct 30th

so heck it is worth a shot...maybe the password will work

send chloe (sp?) an email in sales on their main page

below is this threads main page with info but you will have to contact sales on the page I guess no prices etc listed

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1523298.0;topicseen (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1523298.0;topicseen)

http://www.innosilicon.com/ (http://www.innosilicon.com/)

Thanks for the update. Do you have any problem with your unit? I did read the other thread and look like there is some problem with balde dropping ?

The blades do drop periodically. I have not noticed a pattern yet.
A simple reboot does not fix the issue, it requires a power cycle to get the blade online.
I have resorted to a switched PDU so that a job on the pi can detect when blades are offline and send a command to the PDU to cycle power on the PDU port.

I do not have one (yet?) I helped with the group buy and talked with them about the group buy but got ZEC gpu setup (lovely 2 year warranties)

likely just as silly as an A4 or two..but where I'm at now..anyway what i was told on the above date...worth a shot yet if you plan on getting one

worse they can say is the group buy is over

Hey there, who can provide support for my messed up image for innosilicon dominator. PI does not assign any address to pi on network . That happened after i have changed IP on webgui... :(

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1680082.0 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1680082.0)

Hey Papasmurph,  Which image version do you need? 

Just as a heads up to potential buyers of the A4.  Some of the early Batch 3 miners are now in some forum members hands and they are still reporting dropped cards and restarts.  I will defer to those members to post their results here as I don't want to add to or take away from what they are seeing. 

So if you are thinking about getting an A4 I would suggest waiting unless your willing to take the risk.  Right now it appears that Innosilicon has a plan/policy that is going to leave small purchasers of the Batch 1 and Batch 2 miners to take them to an electronics expert to swap out the MCU at our cost, or for the bigger buyers that bought in large volume they are saying they will ship out a flash programmer jig for them to flash their units.  Again not something for the faint of heart in either scenario.  It appears at this time the support from Inno is non-existent for the B1 and B2 miners.  Innosilicon should be swapping out miners boards that have been corrected to resolve this issue instead of laying this at the feet of customers.

As of this time they(Inno) have reported that Batch 3 miners were fixed, but early reports here are indicating that is not the case.  So if you are thinking about buying A4 miners I would not recommend it at this time until they get this sorted out or you will be in the same boat as "we" the early pre-buy customers and left to twist in the wind with no resolution in sight if your miner has issues that requires correction of the miner firmware itself.  SD card updates have not resolved the issues with these miners. 

So this is a buyer beware NOTICE until Inno gets this sorted out.   

Some update from my end on this topic : https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1680082.0 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1680082.0)

Latest status & issues..

Thanks to all, got it running.

Where can i change the cgminer conf settings pertaining to miner?

Update after running my miner with v2.0.2 version image.Build 11/20/2016 (I assume its batch 3 then...pls. correct me if i am wrong).  Everything stable when running on multi pool auto-switch.No issues found yet. When running straight on e.g GLD pool board drops hash rate with efficiency by 50% after 3-4 hrs. Restart needed.
When in ssh connection make sure to stop miner prior. The connection gets cut out when you move the cursor to much and to fast.Make also sure to not to change the IP address and nameserver when the miner is running. Always stop miner when doing changes. It can mess up the image bad.

Further only fail-over available yet. Innosilicon didn't respond to my request where the file can be modified for the strategy and cgminer options via ext4 sdcard direct.

Other then that hashrate between 136 to 160 MH can be reached.

I will try some solo mining  and see what happens there.


Maybe someone can give me directions for the startegy and conf file issue.

It will be interesting to see, if all it requires is an MCU reflash that shouldn't be to bad, granted not everyone has the tools to do that , now swapping the MCU makes me wonder a bit I pulled the MCU code off the A2 boards and they really hadn't used much of the memory space. I was looking into getting an A4 but I guess I will hold off a little longer although the power savings in my case is about to make my A2s non usable. I have about modified them as much as I can wanted to use them to heat the house this winter so I built a PWM fan controller so they didn't sound like airplanes in the house and I have about repaired all the boards I have parts for.

It sounds like with a custom jig the MCU can be flashed.  Inno is presently trying to setup an arrangement in the US to have someone do the flash updates for us.  I assume they will also do the same for the EU part of the world. 

We are trying to sync up Inno with a member here to do the work.  Hopefully something can be worked out for the B1 and B2 repairs.  B3 miners look like they may be working better.  We should be getting more reports here over the weekend how things are progressing on multipool mining with the B3 miners. 

Good, was holding off on the B3 miners until I heard more feedback.
My B2 miners auto-restart periodically, and that doesn't really bother me.
What bothers me the most is that boards randomly disappear and cannot be brought back online without a power cycle.
I was going to use the guy offering hosting services in Washington, but until we can clear up the boards going offline, I don't see how it could work.
Im currently using a switched PDU in my data center so I can cycle power when I notice the one or more boards MIA.
I don't see how to get the same capability at the site in Washington though, which is my major reason for holding back.

At the moment H2C works well, even when switching to single pool port its running very well. Switch over works on the fly on the UI, on H2C it works as well via pool site. I have between 130-160mh. Once set to auto start it works smooth when re-powered by blackout/power outage, it doesn't work when performing forced reboot via ssh.
I am happy now besides the problem with the miner UI and not being able to adjust cgminer settings/strategy...
I will order Monday the 280mh miner, will take about 10 days to arrive from Hongkong.  ;D

I still have my Zeus 28mh up for solo-mining low diff coins like Hobo/Gen/Lot/Titty etc. as round robing is fine with that.

If it is just an MCU reflash I have the tools to do that already, I like to tinker a lot I did try the .a4 cgminer on and A2 and it detected the boards , surprisingly they have not changed any of the nomenclature since the A1. Still lists everything as an A1 but has the voltage mod parameter. Would be interesting to put a logic analyzer and see how different the protocol is, or if much at all, to bad the driver code is not floating around like the A2, I really never used the web interface and ran everything command line remotely .

@mjgraham , can you help me run my miner through command line via ssh? Pls. let me know. It making me crazy that i cant adjust the parameters and strategy's. It would be beautyful to have it run on awesome miner :D

I was able to manage it with zeusminer zoomhash but my last slip with the A4 scared me to fiddle more. Just to confirm, on multipool/H2C the miner runs flawless since 3 days with no mh drops or blackouts. It also works well with power reset and autostart on my end. So no worries on the current software v2.0.2.

@usao, maybe a programmable timer with auto power recycle once every 3 hrs. help...i worked for me for my zeusminers.

You can login and setup a job to issue a reboot 3-hours after last boot, if that's what you want.
I don't find I need it that often, and a bit more random also, not every X hours, but sometimes works for days, then sometimes several in just a few hours.

Well you can run a cron job to do a reboot but what I did was write a perl script for my A2s that read the number of cores on each board via the API and when it detected one that was at 0 for more then 20 seconds it restarted the miner, first problem it required connecting a reset to the hash boards that they had almost ran all the circuits for but didn't hook up the last bit for some reason that made them more reliable.

I just got my A4s today so I havent gotten them going yet to start the debug, I do know they are batch 2 and the only fix for batch 1 and 2 is a MCU replace or reflash which I have contacted Innosilicon about and they did confirm that and we'll see how they want to precede, I took one apart to see how it is laid out and will be doing some analysis on it , some things I didnt like , like in the controller the raspberry pi has so much rust on all the metallic parts made me sad, has a revamped controller board that is nice. The reflash should be easy I have the tools just have to map out the connections, they didnt put an easy to access header on it just test pads to it will require some kind of jig to do it but it can be done, although for most it will require shipping somewhere. I hope to get at least one going tomorrow , I was a dummy and didnt calculate my PCIe power connector stash correctly. On my A2s I just soldered right to the header with screw terminals but these are new and I have to void all the warranties although unless they just catch on fire should be fixable.

I dont like a non command line interface I run all my stuff that way, actually net boot the units from a server so the CF cards dont die and have scripts that monitor everything , pools/ rates all that crap ran trhough proxies and switch stuff for best rates, it is a hobbled up mess that has grown crazy really.

I was lucky enought the be able to fix some issues with the driver for the A2 and compile it with curses support so it has the fimilar interface .


if you wanted to you could do a
crontab -e

then on a line do
 
0 3 * * * /sbin/reboot

then save it Ctrl-X if it is nano editor

What do they need done? I pretty much did the same work for Alcheminer for their board issues. Pretty sure I can fix anything wrong with these boards.

My issue is that a reboot doesn't fix the problem. It requires a power cycle to get the board(s) back...

I figured that would be the case, on the A2 boards they had the MCU reset line brought right out to the connector but didnt fit a jumper so like you said you needed a power cycle, with the reset you didnt just toggle a  GPIO pin and you were set. I'll look into the A4 board today and see what options there are, although most will require soldering stuff unless they ran this and just dont use it.

How do these guys compare against a reliable Titan set up? Would you recommend buying?

B1/B2 rigs suffer from flakey firmware. B3 and flashed B1/B2 rigs are reported to be working properly.
Im waiting for my turn at the Jig to flash mine...
Power approx 1059W, hashrates closer to 265 than 280...

Would definitely buy a B3 or a flashed B1/B2 > B3 A4  -- being a B2 owner that finally got mine flashed to B3, I can say it was hell dealing with it before it was reflashed.

After reflashing to B3 though, over 3 days without an issue now which is a near impossible feat for B1/B2.

I think the A4 machines are about to get beat out in w/mh by the new antminer l3

Both machines at a $1900 say usd the price with shipping say ...

From what I can tell with the ltc diff rise and Roi more then a year, it's likely
A unicorn chase. Lots of fun, but unlikely to succeed.

At least at 10c kWh winter and 14c kWh summer. For me and those with same

Also note I'm only still a home miner on 7 new KNC units from 2
 Companies bankruptcy. One of which KNC.

I've otherwised passed on new stuff and used scrypt is too high last year too boot

Word of caution

Agreed, it's fun chasing coins, but ive been through this before when Zeus came out... ROI on any of these is not likely unless you have excellent power costs.
Best bet is to mine for a while then try to recoup via resale before something better hits the street which will drive the costs down...

If you MUST mine something (its an addiction I know), then at least wait till the end of the year when the 'land rush' of difficulty has passed by...it does not
take a lot of thought to understand with all the scrypt miners out there...and doing the math...if there is going to be a 'big data' hall asic mining surge..then
scrypt asic it the way to go. I am clueless and I made that bet in 2015 when the home difficulty on BTC miners killed home miners..

What I'm saying is wait to the end of the year..take the equip off your taxes for the year then..use the puppies for heat...maybe some used stuff will be better

me....I just see everyone piling on and at 10c kwh in the winter and 14c kwh in the summer...my only shot with new stuff or the stuff I had is the heat benifit

*$1,200 buck savings* (assuming elec for heat trade off draw) in 2017-2018....

be prudent...but me ...I see everyone piling on and his brother into scrypt miners big/medium/small home folk etc just like what killed home mining for btc asic's
in 2015...just do the calcs for big money with 2-3c kwh electric ...it is obvious imho.....NOW that they can get asic scrypt miners in VOLUME and not just
btc miners

gonna be a blood bath imho ...(be warned thou I know zip at one time I drank the BFL kool aid) :)

diff has nearly doubled since december, looks like this miner is dead in the water as far as ROI goes.

IF you planning to mine only LTC, then yes this is bad buy. Probably L3 isn't that great either.

Yeah, because its a low power unit and the manufacturers can build them for probably $400 each they will overwhelm the network soon. Its still profitable for them even with 4x the hashrate right now..

Depends on how much production and sales Bitmain manages on the L3 - if the L3 doesn't sell a ton or they can't MAKE a ton of them, the A4 still has a window of ROI available - especially for folks with very low electric rates.

 I believe Innosilicon needs to get serious about dropping the price if they plan to sell a significant number of additional A4 units though.

 The L3 should be fine reguardless - I don't see any probability of a significantly more efficient Scrypt miner showing up in the next 2 years or so, which is plenty of time to ROI a L3 (it it doesn't die anyway).

This image illustrates why ROI calculators are inaccurate and redundant.
Yesterday, Prohashing paid out (after pool fees) 160% of the returns I would have got if I'd mined LTC, and you can't calculate this profit using an ROI calculator because there are too many scrypt coins and variables to consider. You can see that it's been increasing steadily for the past week, largely due to the rise in Gamecredit over that period, but it's still well below the pre A4/L3 rate of return which was about .00008 BTC/MHs/Day.

You can use LTC diff as a proxy for the overall scrypt hashrate but that really tells you nothing about ROI without knowing where price will go, and LTC really isn't the major indicator of price movements it was anymore. The Chinese like it for commerce because it's stable. As miners cashing out coins for profit, LTC is the last coin you want to mine, you want to be focusing on the most profitable per MHs at any given point in time and this is precisely what Prohashing and Clevermining do for the 5% they charge, and as you can see they do it well.

If you really need to calculate ROI I suggest you use .0000225 BTC per Mhs per day, that's a fairly conservative figure given the rates below, but it's still a guess. Gulden may be nationalised and spike 1000%, who knows? :-X

Part of the attraction of this pursuit for me is operating in a space where there's lots of unknowns.

https://i.imgur.com/I9kryCV.png

After the A4 Dominator comes out, we will offer a A2 Terminator miner replacement program


 Any news on this yet?
 Optimally, a replacement board that has voltage control so we can set it to be competative with the L3?

Holy crap! Totally missed this...

I wonder if this promise will be fulfilled like the A4 open source software promise...

Has anyone set their miners up for outside remote access other than through RDP type connection to another computer on the network? How did you set up password protection? Newbie Linux user here. Thanks, G

Yea I had forgotten this as well, I hope they open source something, this new cgminer on the A4s makes me sad, still dont have mine all upgraded to batch 3 yet.
shesh


Well just taking a stab your a long way off from an easy answer, unless there directly connected to the internet which would be pretty bad since everyone knows the default passwords and such, they will be behind a firewall of some kind which you will need forward ports, or setup and use VPNs . I use a VPN to connect back to my network where I can get to whatever I need to.

At this point I think Bitmain L3 is by far a better option, even though I wanted to buy A4...

If you wanna mine smaller crapcoins A4 is better, for large block mono-coins L3 will be better.

Thanks mjgraham. I'll probably just end up doing that.

G

Is it possible to replace the fans with more silent ones? What are the specs for those fans?
Thank you!

Basic 12V fan, CFM: 200 or greater. Currently it uses the 2-wire, so runs at 100%. You can use the speed control if you have one of those boards which measures temps.

Anyone know how to login/password protect the miner interface?
I moved my A4's to datacenter and need to find a way to secure access to the GUI.
Is there a way to "route" the miner ethernet through a small server to provide access control but still allow the miners to hit the internet for pool access?
Also, it would be nice if the "small server" could be something like a Raspberry pi, rather than a brick type server.
What about putting a "router" inbetween the external ethernet and A4's, could that restrict access but still allow me to "login" somewhere to get to the GUI?

Looking for options.

lots of ways to do this, I just put the A4 on a range other than the standard range is one way to mask it from being found from standard ip scans.

You could put a router in between to separate the networks you would have to establish a VPN connection to that router to get to your miner which requires additional settings in your primary router to be configured to allow that vpn connection.

The a2's had this same issue, wish someone would have made up something to secure their settings from tampering in the web GUI

I was hoping there was a way to put a login page in front of the existing GUI.
Friend of mine suggested sending a home-router to the datacenter along with a PI. That would put the PI and A4's on a private network behind the router.
Then configure VPN tunnels to access the PI with  port forwarding. I don't really understand this part of how this works though.

Correct, this will work but requires the front end router to forward the ports to the 2nd router so you would have to use custom ports for a pptp server would be easiest.

This is all considered to be advanced networking though and if you don't have access to the front end router or have someone who could forward the ports for you, it eliminates this option.

Honestly you arent going to find a datacenter that will let you put your own router on their network. That is just a big no no. If it is secured in the datacenter why are you so worried about it? IF you are that paranoid just talk to whoever you signed your hosting contract with and get them to put in writing they will pay for lost revenue if somehow the account information gets changed.

Im worried about it because if they expose my A4 on the internet, anyone anywhere can change the config.
If they don't expose it, then I have no way to monitor the boards to see if anything died, or to change the pool.

I see two plans here depending on what you have access to.

If you can get an static IP at the data center you would need another PC or router and switch to bridge between you can the miners. You could set up and VPN on the router you could connect to and have access to the network behind them.

If your miners just get a private IP and you don't get the ability to set up anything else , if you had a static IP or at least something you could use a dynamic DNS on the outside you could set the miners to use say OpenVPN and have it start, each miner open a VPN to the outside world where you could connect to it as well.

And you could combined them if you could add a switch and router but don't get a outside IP then you can have the router build a VPN to an outside device and go from there.

Maybe this helps some, kind done a little of both.

The datacenter ended up allowing a separate router with private VPN, so I can VPN into the router and reach the rigs.

Cool that is nice, I just wish I could get mine updated to Batch 3.. these units are driving me nuts!

Hopefully we see some updates soon. The Chinese holiday ended on February 4th so they have been back in office at least 4 full days now.

I hope so to, they did reply said whoever had the jig now was having to make repairs to it and it would be a while,  already a month later than expected, the batch 3 boards I do have work better but still not happy , made some hardware mods and some software mods as well to make it a little better but still no where like they claimed.

They said they still are not sure on letting the driver code out, so I guess we will chug along with what we got.

I don't understand the thought to make the machines reboot in a stratum disconnect.

From my observation they have a script that reboots the Pi any time it see's 1 Get Failure.

I haven't had time to chase/find it yet though but I can confirm it does it consistently.

I've got a 3rd A4 cube coming that is supposed to be batch 3. Hopefully that gamble pays off when they fix the stability issues.

Well batch 3 is better however I have made some modifications, I replaced /sbin/shutdown with another a file that does a hardware MCU reset , had to wire that in along with a sudo pkill cgminer to kill cgminer off, all of the stuff in ran in a do loop do it instantly restarts, well nearly for some reason the cgminer binary takes 10 seconds to start now for some reason.

I have been unable to flash my own boards from batch 3 firmware that I pulled to my batch 2 cards just get a quick sharp LED flash, dont know the error of my ways, the jig is a month late or so , needless to say I am a bit sad

Please contact us if you have B1 or B2 A4 miners. We can help you to update directly to B3.
Email to: luojm@innosilicon.com.cn

They guy that Innosillicon decided to go with improving the source code is called Nowayz on this forum btw

I have never received any word back from Innosillicon regarding my proposal to them, not even after a reminder email with a modified proposal :-\

jump  to baikal mmmmmmmm yummy

just got my first A4, thing is loud, something i wont be running at nite glad for me it's just hobby right  now..

my question now has anyone come up with a quieter fan ?. All ready like it but the nosie gonna have to either find quieter fans or build something around it...

Not that I know of. The specs on the fan are 200CFM, so as long as you can vent 200CFM through the rig you should be able to replace with ducting or other forced air.

Man talk about cheap or cutting corners i had to open the controller mine came with the RPI b not b plus or 2b but mine was rusting and old the pins on the SD slot were bent to the point the only SD it worked with was the one  it came with and that was hard to get it to boot or the only one that would boot the miner with any image i found so far that works on the A4 ... .. good fpr me thu i had a b i don't use any more with no bent pins on the SD slot, and no rust ... I put it on the addon board it booted up no waiting sad thu i'm  gonna figure out or try to plug a RPI 3 or any PI into the board , the add on board on the RPI b is all you really need.


my other question is there any open Source Software for that version of CGMINer ?  and i wish BFG worked with it , i know it doesn't ...



so im guessing it can be watered cooled if you want to go that route and have some heat sinks made, the boards from what i saw are your normal type hash boards not like the miners bitmian put out after the S5 ... I didn't open the miner and have no plans to till the warranty is up . only went by pictures i saw ...

Drop it in a tub of mineral oil...

No, there is no opensource version of CGminer.

No they still use the old Pis, they have to be the version 2 of the B . one of mine only has the BCM chip and ethernet controller, they left off everything else, no usb jack , power , etc, and yes all of mine are rusty. As as for making it work on a newer version, well it wont work out of the box, it will have to be recompiled due to the bcm2708 libraries needing to be different , not to say it cant be . I have been allowed to get the source code and were working on making them work a lot better myself and another person have made some good progress.

AS far as the fans , yes they are loud but I put some dc-dc converters on them dropped them to about 8volts and they are a lot more tolerable , it only changed the CFM about 30% and they run only about +5c higher.

I guess I can ask what would people like to see in this, things we have done so far is make them a lot more stable and done the xnsub addition.

While it would be neat to water cool them I'd say be more hassle than good, although I have though about it.

The fans are approx 65dbA, so pretty loud. It's possible (if you have multiple rigs), ti use ducting to a larger/quieter fan used in AC units or squirrel cage fans.
If you want truely silent, then you need to drop the miner boards and the ATX PSU into a mineral oil bath.
Then, use tubing to circulate the mineral oil through a radiator, perhaps something like a car radiator from an old car. That way, the noise is outside, but the miners are inside.

There might be something wrong with my A4 it keeps dropping one board then the other one maybe  two mins later it is a B3 i was told and it is running 202 beta it was running ok till last nite then it started doping one board first now it's both, I  left the voltage @ 815 like the seller said do and hadn't really done any OC, i swiped out the PSU hoping that was it,  both boards are stating to act up ...I really hate to ship it back to china.


I hate this shit of being force to use a old out dated OS on a old out dated rusting PI they sell that is inside the controller that takes for ever to install something that may not install .. man i hope INNOSILICON see the light of this wisdom and let us use our own  controller's with Ubuntu 16 in my case the dropping boards may have something to do with the OS and how bad it is  and also either give us the cables to run it off any PI hell im even pay for them if that's a problem just make them reason able ...and not some stupid greedy price , I'll make my own once they let us if they let us use any RPI or PI type ......if the price is stupid !!!!

 wheezy is old, i don't think even https://www.raspberrypi.org/downloads/ supports it any more sigh ....I remember reading some place a year ago that support was being drop for wheezy.... upgrade to Raspbian.. i would rather use my own RPI 3 if I have to be forced or limited to a RPI and Ubuntu 16 .... so I may not buy another A4 till they fix the limited controller issue to me that is a big issue  and may be another issue causing the boards to drop .....I was giving it some thought of buying another half till the boards started acting up if they are ..EastShore Mining Devices has them back in stack for 899 a 100 bucks more then i paid for this one ...

Don't get me wrong l love the miner the power it uses and small form factor but my Alchemist with 5 working boards and jstefanop firmware with BFG support runs better then this does on most pools, ...IF  jstefanop was to write one for this if he hasn't yet i would gladly pay him 60 bucks for a copy .... even 60 bucks a miner if he requested it that's fair to me ...

The sound is no longer a problem for me let it run at full spin i have in a room in my basement that is sound proofed, i may turn into a miner room soon with one window so venting won't be a problem, if i do ...

Last thought for those who don't know the SD card has to be a 8 GIB or less the slot size has to be Class 10 SDHC Card or the big one  in this case 8 gib or the OS wont fit it .. and using a big slot adapter with the little standard card won't do it  or using a 16 GIB card with SDHC support didn't work for me, i forget that pI only takes one size card slot wise i think and never allowed  use any thing over 8 GIB...with that OS ...

I know no one cares but that's how i feel and gonna say it any way ......  

Sorry for the delay of our reply. There must be some misunderstanding here.
We will check internally then feedback to you soon.

Thanks for your understanding.

Innosilicon A4 Support Team

Hi, you can contact us by sending email to luojm@innosilicon.com.cn
We will help you to solve the issues.

Innosilicon A4 Support Team

They need someone?

well everything is running ok now sense i went to this PSU http://www.ebay.com/itm/232259820738?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT i got it for that price just the PSU and mine was brand new not used ....I was using a Corsair 850 i had back in my S5 mining days i guess it was done ... but plan to buy this one later this month

http://www.ebay.com/itm/HP-1200W-Platinum-Power-Supply-for-ProLiant-Servers-438203-001-PSU-/191640171414?hash=item2c9ea4f396:g:k9QAAOSwu4BVr~FF

it seems it might better, i used one my old used ones i had laying around and it held up better, hash wise then my new 750 does but everything is stable now ..



MY only beef is the controller it's lame we can't use any anything but the OLD RPI it comes with for some or one you sell for those who were unlucky and had to buy one . which is fine, if there was better support which there all most is none to that degree ...I see you all sell one full A4 now on your site if that's all we want for a really nice price ..I'm sure emailing is useless by other complaints here , so i won't brother ...

With pools like ProHashing currently paying out as much as 0.07c per Mh/s per day ($17.50 USD per day), I wonder how many ROI nay-sayers are now kicking themselves they didn't buy an A4 back in August 2016?

I'd imagine there's a bunch of A2 and Titan owners who have made ROI that are feeling pretty happy too.

The BTC scaling debacle and the SEC have been great for Alts, I just hope Bitmain don't mess it up too soon.

That's the part i don't understand why does bitmain want to f everyone they should be happy how they are setting, wealth only goes so far before you get to much and getting greedily er  will in time kill them.

I'm hoping those L3 take backs were to fix them or check them out and test them more , then put them back on the  Market, i know it's a dream, but hoping ..

No, they'll be mining with them, and to be honest that was really the right thing to do if you were in their shoes and can make more money mining with them than selling them.
And I quietly suspect this is what happened with the L1. It existed, but never saw the outside of a Bitmain data hall.

Is there some kind of latest firmware updates or recommendations for Mining on Nicehash?

Not sure what you are looking for.
My A4's work fine on nicehash (v2.0.2)
Is there some specific issue you are having with nicehash?

2.0.3 is current and works much better than 2.0.2 plus it supports Nicehash.

Before 2.0.3 I would have never been able to show you a screen capture like this that illustrates more than 10 days run time with anything other than 0 Get Failures because prior to 2.0.3, 1 get failure would make the miner reboot itself.

2.0.3 Can be found here https://www.dropbox.com/s/sis8eoeo6wxoqdv/G5-20-V2.0.3.zip?dl=0,
Note if you're running 2.0.2 you're already capable of running 2.0.3. If you're running a version that begins with 1.0.x or 0.0.x your miner must have a hardware reflash before 2.0.x will be supported.

https://s5.postimg.org/9yjpzwyzr/A4_2.0.3_15_Days.jpg

Thank you, I only had the 2.0.2

What does 2.0.3 offer over 2.0.2?
My A4's have been working great on nicehash. Not aware of any issues...

Specifically for NH, 2.0.3 has Xnonce among other improvements such as the GF Reboot issue being fixed.

Is it too late now to jump on the A4 LTC train ???

hell no:

BITTAWMS A4 DEALZ

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1885976.msg18734858#msg18734858

COME AND GET SCRYPT MINERS HERE AND NOW A4 280MHS NO BULLSHIT

firmware 204 yet ? .... nm my bad to soon to ask , btw 203 works great , I hope to buy a second tube by the end August ..

 My A2 farm was paid for late last year - the past month has been a happy time though, as they were getting close to break-even shutdown time instead they're pulling in GOOD money again - for now.

 Still waiting on "upgrade plan" news though.

My A4's are still earning over $10 per day while electric is $2+ per day, so still well on the profitable side.
However, I haven't yet run the deposits to see if I have hit break-even, although I suspect that I have.

Hello

A4 asic chips 1000 pieces price pleace

I just picked one of these up from Amazon. I haven't had much of a chance to run it yet, but it does work.

My question is, since I didn't receive any manuals with it, what is the proper shutdown procedure? I currently stop mining from the web interface, and once it cools down, I unplug the power supply. I'm mainly wondering if the added step of manually stopping hashing first is necessary.

Thanks.

Proper? Yank the power...

You're probably close.  I just hit break even this month which was far better than the track we were on in December and January!

Works for me. Thanks.

Yes, I went back through my wallet and found that I am almost 2x my purchase price, so very happy.

Back in Nov/Dec I had these in my garage, and I have a time-of-use plan, so I had a switched-PDU and automatically shut-down the power between 3 and 6pm to avoid the high rate.
Never did anything formal to shutdown, just shut-off the outlet at the PDU, and back-on when it hit 6pm.
Miners restarted fine from this "yank" for 2 months, and although I have since moved them to a datacenter, have had no side-effects of the daily power bounce.
Still runnnig smoothly, but now 24/7 instead of 21/7 at home.

Better to contact Innosilicon through email (luojm@innosilicon.com.cn <- taken from website of innosilicon http://www.innosilicon.com/html/a4-miner/)

Or use skype, the address is on the website as well

Anyone from Australia who knows the limits of how many A4s can be powered per room circuits in Aus? what is the limit?

koalana

If you should need 2.0.3 this might help you:
https://www.nicehash.com/index.jsp?p=news&id=152

I just set up my first A4 Miners.

Initially I had a lot of trouble understanding exactly where to change IP addresses but thanks to Innosillocon skype, finally sorted it.
Ea mining setup consists of 2 barrels. These generate about 60-65 db of noise.

So I have decided the only way to go is to set up my mini farm in the garage.  My small office was not enough space to get rid of the heat with the door closed.

Best results yet occurred at night with a peak of 1Ghash between two miners. (4 barrels) but not for long. Mostly runs between 500 and 600 MH for two sets combine score.

We have decided to build a noise box around them, and to rid exhaust by a powered exhaust fan connected to a whirlybird or such the like.
During summer I think we will apply a small thermoelectric aircon.

Whilst it is economical now, i wonder how much room there is to remain profitable enough to at least pay for the electricity if there is a lull in price.

howzit for u al out there? :)

Miss type ? . ....just noticed that !!!! if it's not why doesn't my tube get results like that ... any way I'm gonna buy i hope buy two more tubes soon ;;;;don;t care much for bit mains junk it cost 3k or wait till July .

Unless there has been some shadow upgrade, the A4 get's around 250-260MHs at about 1KW.
The current webpage shows pretty much similar numbers...
http://www.innosilicon.com/html/a4-miner/ (http://www.innosilicon.com/html/a4-miner/)

Those numbers are from the initial announcements of the A4.  Original test video of the A4 showed the chip by itself is capable of some impressive numbers, but apparently those hash rates were not able to be maintained, or there is something in current packaging etc that prevents these chips from running at rates that it looks like they should be able to run.

Now if Inno were somehow able to correct that and release a miner with those stats right now they would be back in the game and would be competitive.  If they were to make that kind of announcement I would be more than glad to setup another group buy here for the community with Inno's help to get these miners in the hands of the community.

Inno please keep us posted or PM me if you find a way to get these kinds of numbers from the A4.  I would be glad to help you here in the community.  I would love to see some competition for Bitmain.  We have seen Inno will stand behind their product so we know it will/would be a good miner. 

2.10 still doesn't do much on sites like Zpool , litecoin pool or Prohashing.com .. it works  great on nice hash but I don't care much for nice hash ..
and it is the same issue, it show it mining at 137 to 138 MH miner side and on the POOL side on some pools it some times only goes as high as 120 to 128 never a good sable 138 or close, on Zpools it sets at 80 to 84 MH pool side but in the miner on the UI it shows every thing working fine and Ming at 137 to 138 MH steady but sense i can mine Zcash on Zpool and get paid in Zcash, without using GPUs but can't,  i hope it stays that way but from time to time it's nice to get paid in that coin even if your  not really mining it with a script miner i know that..  or get paid in any coin they support with any miner type which lets me use old miners if i want to like my A6 ...which lets me also justify using my A6 and that A6 has a second wind use for a while longer.


Just asking ? ...... any big fixes coming any time soon for the Poolside hash rate issue on some pools or does that need to be another more up to date re flash of the boards like jstefanop did here https://archive.litecointalk.org/index.php?topic=27370.0 for the AlcheMiner/MAT Miner that was having the same issue till he fixed it, will the A4 see a even newer updated to make it more stable and if so when will that happen ....

I know i still own and use one of the AlcheMiners .... and the fix for the A4 now doesn't seem to work for all pools like his did for the A256.

Again if I use my A4 on Nice hash with 2.10  no issue so far , it's on other pools, i have the low hash rate issues  with any version....of the miner software....

In the middle of May I bought an A4 Dominator ASIC, arriving on June 2, but with problems:

lil@innosilicon.com.cn <lil@innosilicon.com.cn>
May 25

to me
Hi Marian Danut,

Your goods have been shipped today. DHL tracking number is 3503713684.
Feel free to let me know if any question.

Marian Danut Corduneanu <corduneanumariandanut@gmail.com>
Jun 2

to lil
Hi, today I receive the miners, but is a problem. At the web interface are 4 miners, one of them work at half of normal (33-34 mhz) and I have a maxim 210 mhz on nicehash and under 200 on digibyte. Tomorow I will make a printscreen to tell me how so solve the problem. Thank you.


Marian Danut Corduneanu <corduneanumariandanut@gmail.com>
Jun 2

to lil
And another problem is that the miners restart several time in one day!


lil@innosilicon.com.cn <lil@innosilicon.com.cn>
Jun 5

to me
Hi,

Could you pls tell me what is the IP of your router? Can you change the IP to 192.168.1.2 ?
Then change the Gateway IP in LTC LIMITED to 192.168.1.1

Do you use Skype?
You can add my skype: lil@innosilicon.com.cn

Marian Danut Corduneanu <corduneanumariandanut@gmail.com>
Jun 5

to lil
The board is faulty. The computer does not see it anymore in Real-time monitoring


lil@innosilicon.com.cn <lil@innosilicon.com.cn>
AttachmentsJun 5

to me
Hi,

Pls find some user guide in attachment.


then SKYPE:

[05.06.2017 9:42:42] Dan Corduneanu: Hi
[05.06.2017 9:43:02] Sherly Li: hi
[05.06.2017 9:43:22] Dan Corduneanu: from innosilicon?
[05.06.2017 9:45:36] Sherly Li: yes
[05.06.2017 9:46:28] Dan Corduneanu: ok, I email from corduneanumariandanut@gmail.com, problems with one board at A4 dominator
[05.06.2017 9:47:37] Sherly Li: yes, I have got your email. my email  is lil@innosilicon
[05.06.2017 9:47:46] Dan Corduneanu: the asic working with 3 boards
[05.06.2017 9:50:34] Dan Corduneanu: When I receive the order and I power on the asic, was a problem with one board
[05.06.2017 9:50:57] Dan Corduneanu: I make a print screen and I email you
[05.06.2017 9:51:58] Sherly Li: wait some minutes. i have a meeting now. i will answer you later
[05.06.2017 10:22:20] Sherly Li: Hi I'm back
[05.06.2017 10:22:33] Sherly Li: Could you pls check to see if the connection has been inserted?
[05.06.2017 10:23:12] Dan Corduneanu: one moment, pls, I change the conection from a board to another
[05.06.2017 10:34:37] Dan Corduneanu: I go and swich port to onother in raspberry pi, maybe is the controler port and not the board
[05.06.2017 10:45:02] Dan Corduneanu: I disconnected from the controller the working device and connected in his ports the problem device
[05.06.2017 10:45:54] Dan Corduneanu: Controler is ok, I think the board is faulty
[05.06.2017 10:51:10] Dan Corduneanu: I realy hope we can restart the board from controler, or something
[05.06.2017 10:51:33] Dan Corduneanu: Because if is broken, there is a big problem
[05.06.2017 10:53:29] Dan Corduneanu: Are you still here?
[05.06.2017 10:54:24] Sherly Li: Yes i'm here.
[05.06.2017 10:54:58] Sherly Li: I will check with our engineer and answer you
[05.06.2017 10:56:39] Dan Corduneanu:
How fast do you get an answer?
[05.06.2017 10:58:39] Dan Corduneanu:
Because I do not know how to do it. I still leave the board with power on?
[05.06.2017 10:59:29] Sherly Li: I'll get back to you asap
[05.06.2017 11:20:42] Sherly Li: I get the answer
[05.06.2017 11:23:02] Sherly Li: Unplug the fan line of which board is not working, do not dissipate heat, run for three minutes, heat the barrel by the normal plate heat, run for three minutes, turn off the power, plug into the fan line and turn on the machine
[05.06.2017 11:28:58] Sherly Li: Hi are you still here?
[05.06.2017 11:29:08] Dan Corduneanu: Yes
[05.06.2017 11:30:35] Dan Corduneanu: unplug the fan for three minute, run the machine for three minute without the fan, turn of the power then plug the fan and run the machine
[05.06.2017 11:34:01] Sherly Li: Yes
[05.06.2017 11:43:38] Dan Corduneanu: not working
[05.06.2017 11:49:59] Dan Corduneanu:
The LED on the non-functional plate does not flash
[05.06.2017 11:50:25] Sherly Li: OK, get it.
[05.06.2017 11:57:57] Dan Corduneanu: I wait your answer?
[05.06.2017 12:10:40] Sherly Li: You need send the broken board to us and we will give a new normal board to you.
[05.06.2017 12:13:39] Dan Corduneanu:
That's what I did not want to get to! Additional high costs, high processing time,I do not produce anything with that board!
[05.06.2017 12:14:42 | Înlăturat 12:14:44] Sherly Li: Acest mesaj a fost şters
[05.06.2017 12:15:32] Dan Corduneanu: I return it, please check carefully the functionality of the board you send me
[05.06.2017 12:16:54] Sherly Li: OK. Thanks for your understand. we will give you a discount last time
[05.06.2017 12:16:56] Sherly Li: To : Innosilicon
Name: Tao Zhou
Address: F1409, Mingyue Huadu Buidling, Gonghe Gongye Road, Xi Xiang street, Bao'an District 
ZIP code: 518102 SHENZHEN
Country: China, People's Republic
Phone number: 177 2256 3214
[05.06.2017 12:17:35] Sherly Li: This is the information of address.
[05.06.2017 12:19:57] Dan Corduneanu:
I will have to unpack the device and remove the nonfunctional board to send it
[05.06.2017 12:21:03] Sherly Li: yes, ok
[05.06.2017 12:24:28] Sherly Li: When you send that board, pls send fedex tracking number to me. Thx
[05.06.2017 12:32:14] Dan Corduneanu: DHL from Romania
[05.06.2017 12:32:22] Dan Corduneanu: :)
[05.06.2017 12:33:08] Dan Corduneanu: Tomorow I will send the board.
[05.06.2017 12:36:33] Sherly Li: OK
[05.06.2017 12:36:46] Sherly Li: OK, DHL
[05.06.2017 12:37:00] Sherly Li: Thank you so much
[07.06.2017 13:05:07] Dan Corduneanu: Hi
[07.06.2017 13:05:12] Dan Corduneanu: AWB 1312388221
[07.06.2017 13:11:18] Sherly Li: HI, get it.

Then mail:


Marian Danut Corduneanu <corduneanumariandanut@gmail.com>
Jun 12 (9 days ago)

to lil
Hi, can you tell me which is the stage of board that I returned?


lil@innosilicon.com.cn <lil@innosilicon.com.cn>
Jun 12 (9 days ago)

to me
Hi,

Our technical have received the board. And we can send a new one tomorrow. Thank you.


Marian Danut Corduneanu <corduneanumariandanut@gmail.com>
Jun 13 (8 days ago)

to lil
Ok, pls send me the awb when you send the board


lil@innosilicon.com.cn <lil@innosilicon.com.cn>
Jun 14 (7 days ago)

to me
Hi Marian Danut Corduneanu,

Our technical support feedback says that the incorrect operation caused the board to burn out from board you sent to us.

Pls pay attention, electrical equipment can not plug connection line when it is running. The damage caused by it is not covered by the warranty.

So you should pay for it and shipping fee. I apply it to our manager, we can give you a twenty percent off discount.

One board is 320 USD.
Shipping fee for one board to Romania is 132 USD.
Total price: (320 +132)*80%= 361.6 USD.

Feel free to let me know if any question. Thank you.


Marian Danut Corduneanu <corduneanumariandanut@gmail.com>
Jun 14 (7 days ago)

to lil
The board arive from you broken, check when I received it because I immediately announced that. Do not try to blame me, I would have broken the whole asic, not a single board. You come with the proof that the plate has worked for one minute at me and I broke it, and I support the expenses. If not, you replace because is your fault, you shipp a faulty board!


lil@innosilicon.com.cn <lil@innosilicon.com.cn>
Jun 14 (7 days ago)

to 罗洁明, me
Hi Marian Danut Corduneanu,

Don't worry. We can solve it.
Confirmed with our technical surport, the damage caused by misoperation normally burn the whole chips, some times burn one board.
Considering the inconvenience caused to you, we can repair the board and replace the 10 chips. And send back to you.
And it will cost 150 USD. shipping fee is 132 USD.
I apply it to our manager and our A4 sales team, we'll give you 20 percent off. And you only need to pay 220 USD to us.

In reality, our machines are all tested before we send to you. We guarantee that there is no problem like burn one board.
There is statement in invoice i sent to you: that the circuit boards or the chip is burnt is not covered by the warranty. You can check it.
Considering your side feedback problems, we can repair it.
Pls understand. Thank you.


Marian Danut Corduneanu <corduneanumariandanut@gmail.com>
Jun 14 (7 days ago)

to lil
No, you don't understand! I received the order with a faulty board. I announced you right away, not after a month, the same day! The ASIC came with the non-functional board! I want a proof, now, that the plaque worked for one minute at me and that you did not send it I will fail!


Marian Danut Corduneanu <corduneanumariandanut@gmail.com>
Jun 14 (7 days ago)

to lil
You sent me a defect that you took my money! Now you ask me for money to fix your mistake!


Marian Danut Corduneanu <corduneanumariandanut@gmail.com>
Jun 14 (7 days ago)

to lil
Right now, get in touch with your technicians and send me a report with the minutes of running the board from the moment I got the order!


lil@innosilicon.com.cn <lil@innosilicon.com.cn>
Jun 14 (7 days ago)

to me, 罗洁明
Hi Marian Danut Corduneanu,

We don't have a good solution right now. So I'll report to our team first and get back to you later. Thank you.



Marian Danut Corduneanu <corduneanumariandanut@gmail.com>
Jun 14 (7 days ago)

to lil
Ok, if you don't have a solution, please put me in contact or give me the contact of company director or any person who can take decisions within the company

Then another one:


luojm <luojm@innosilicon.com.cn>
Jun 15 (6 days ago)

to me, lil, shupp, 张巧, 耿舵
Dear Marian,

Thanks for your purchase of Innosilicon A4 Miner.
This is Dominique from Innosilicon, Business Manager of A4 miners.

There must be misunderstanding between you and us for the board replacement within warranty.

First we feel very sorry that you get the miner with only minutes running then a board is broken. We don't know what happened on your side but could imagine how sad you were.

Then we ask you to send the board back to us to investigate if the board can be repaired. If the board is broken slightly we will send a new one to you soon to make you get the full machine asap. But unfortunately we found that 10 chips on the board is burnt which cannot be repaired. We are very sorry to tell you in this case the board cannot enjoy the after-sale service within warranty as written in the invoice.

So we have found a better way to lower the expense on your side by providing 20%  of the total price($150 for the chip replacement, $132 for the shipping). Normally we would ask customer to just send the board to us without the heavy heat sink(the metal) to save the shipping fee. It's our fault that we didn't remind you in advance. We are very sorry about that.

Innosilicon is a big company which has served thousands of customers, aiming to help customer solve the problems.
Your case is really sad but we are trying to help at any time.

We don't want to let you feel bad to us due to such a board, so we will only charge 50% of the total price, which is $141. You can pay us in LTC or BTC.
What do you think? Your understanding will be appreciated.

Best Regards,
Dominique
Innosilicon A4 Sales

Email:   luojm@innosilicon.com.cn
Web:   www.innosilicon.com
Skype:   luojm@innosilicon.com.cn

Marian Danut Corduneanu <corduneanumariandanut@gmail.com>
Jun 15 (6 days ago)

to luojm
No, unfortunately you do not understand and refuse to provide me the required report. The board did not work for me for even a second, that's why I asked the technicians report with the minutes of operation from the date I picked up the parcel. I'm not interested in the payment, the board was broken, it did not work at all (not even a single bit!). The other three boards have been functioning properly since we put them into operation. Please beg your respect for not coming up with price offers, because I have to resort to the court and then come with the required report!


Marian Danut Corduneanu <corduneanumariandanut@gmail.com>
Jun 15 (6 days ago)

to luojm
I kindly ask you to check when the parcel was lifted, when I wrote about the issue (I attached you pictures every time) and give me the required report!


luojm <luojm@innosilicon.com.cn>
AttachmentsJun 18 (3 days ago)

to me, lil
Dear Marian,

Thanks for your feedback.
What we are doing now is trying to help you to get the issue solved. So please calm down then we can reach an agreement soon.

We have attached the pictures that you have sent to us.

1. From the minitoring page of boards, there is a label "none" which shows only around 33Mhs for the board - > in this case that means half of the chips(10) on the board is broken.

2. From the chat history we found that you have switched the plugs from one groove on the controller to another when the maching is working - > this is misoperation( operation of hardware connection of a working machine is prohibited )

3. Attached is the screenshot of the multimeter when detecting the chip voltage - > normal chip voltage should be more than 1.75mv while your 10 chips shows less than 1.7mv(this means the chip is burnt which cannot be used any more)

All in all, the chips on the board is half burnt when we received the pacel. And as written in our invoice, if chip is burnt then the part cannot enjoy replacement free of charge.

We have offered our suggestion to help you repair the boards asap and get the board shipped to you with a lower repair fee. And we have already mentioned that we will cover the shipping to you.

Innosilicon is a big company which has served a lot of customers with the A4 miner. We have tried our best to help you solve the issue. If you still want to go to the court, then we can also face it.

We are ready to ship a new board to you once we received your payment. Please feel free to let us know if you need the board shipped asap.


Marian Danut Corduneanu <corduneanumariandanut@gmail.com>
Jun 18 (3 days ago)

to luojm
What you gave me is not the required report. I asked you a report of the minutes since I got the asic! You do not understand one thing, you sent a plaque with half of the burned chips! The pictures you have attached to me are pictures of the conversation and prove that the board did not work, no matter what it was (the first pictures and the last pictures)! From the first e-mail, after I put the device in operation, there was dpvada that the board came with the burned chips!
I asked you to extract a report with the minutes of running (how many bits did that board use to mine), from the date I received the asic!


Marian Danut Corduneanu <corduneanumariandanut@gmail.com>
Jun 18 (3 days ago)

to luojm
That conversation I wore when you got in touch with the technicians. The asic was disconnected from the power source, and the ports interchanged. At that time the board did not work, if it happened as if it was under tension, the other three boards were burning.


Marian Danut Corduneanu <corduneanumariandanut@gmail.com>
Jun 18 (3 days ago)

to luojm
This is my first mail, in the day when I receive the order:

"Hi, today I receive the miners, but is a problem. At the web interface are 4 miners, one of them work at half of normal (33-34 mhz) and I have a maxim 210 mhz on nicehash and under 200 on digibyte. Tomorow I will make a printscreen to tell me how so solve the problem. Thank you."

If you teling me that half of the cip from board are burn out, prove the board arive with that problem. Never work in mine and at the web interface show half of the power, because the cip was burn.


Marian Danut Corduneanu <corduneanumariandanut@gmail.com>
9:50 PM (13 hours ago)

to luojm
It's been more than a week since the board is at your side and I do not see any results! So you treat your clients? Is this the serious business with you?


NOW, MY QUESTION -
Is there anyone else ho buy from them with malfunctions? If someone has broken ASIC into a warranty, how did you do, how did they behave?

I received a couple of the later miners (which have individual heat-sinks) where the heat-sinks were loose in the case (they'd fallen off in shipping, one of the boxes had clearly been dropped), and Inno sorted the problem out straight away once I'd sent them back, sending me new hashboards. Time Zone and language barriers aside, they are always very helpful when I've dealt with them.

There's a critical piece of information missing from your post, what kind of power supply are you using? These Inno boards are well engineered and extremely robust, so if they're burnt out it suggests there may be a problem with either the boards circuitry or the power supply, and Inno are very honest in my experience so I personally think they'd say if they had found a problem with the boards voltage regulation.

Might be an idea to check your PSU before connecting it up again.

 You have unrealistic expectations.

 You NEVER will have a long-term match on "miner side" reported hashrate and "pool side", as you will always lose a little on stale shares and such.
 Doesn't matter what miner you use or what algo, this is the norm on EVERYTHING in crypto.


 Pools report your hashrate poolside based on the VALID SHARES you have found.

 Variation is ALSO normal, due to that fact.

Hello
Have a problem yesterday had a power failure and since that connects my a4 miner is no longer with the internet can help me someone thanks.

We have come to a result after many negotiations, complaints and discussions with a lawyer. The point is that they do not really care how the order arrives. I received an asic with a nonfunctional board, to which I was asked to pay the repairs! Finally they sent me a new card (today I received the courier information) together with a controller. From my own experience, they are very bad at communication.

When will the next Batch of Miners be shipped ?

sigh then how come my Alchemist miner runs at a steady 137 to 146 on five boards some times higher pool side like it should, this one barely hits 128 most of the time stays around 121 to 124 and shows at the miners UI 137 to 138 MH, you want Screen shots, i can give them ."as you will always lose a little on stale shares and such".< I'm very a ware of that but not like this .Id be happy with  130 to 132 pool side, best it hits pool side is 128 unless it's nice hash.
 and Innosilicon even told me in a email they are aware of some pools under hashing which it seems now might never be fixed like the Alchemist was. if i mine Lite coins on Antpool id be lucky if it hits 110 mh while my Alchemist miner runs @ 134 or higher it all depends what pool it is for the A4 . I'll bet the L3 + runs around what it suppose to any place . which i hope to have A L3+ soon i may post Screen shots once i do . I guess what i should watch more then anything is pay out which i don't ... . i was able to improve the speed and shares some the other day by giving the miner full api Access by editing some files in the controller with SSH .

I loved the upgraded alchemist miner , drew alot of power but was awesome
wish i had kept the three i had

According to this link http://www.innosilicon.com/html/a4-miner/ from www.innosilicon.com October to November batch.

Fraud Alert:

Dear customers, Please be aware that all sale inquiries need to go through Innosilicon direct email contact (**@innosilicon.com.cn).
Lately some customers reported to us that someone used “live:inno.miner” fake Skype account to ask for customer payment. That is a fraud! Please be aware that “live:inno.miner” is not our Skype account and do NOT pay anyone through Skype request. Without correct Innosilicon email address (**@innosilicon.com.cn), you may risk being cheated.
(1)   Please be careful to check our website and confirm with our official sources before you pay. For payment process, please check: http://www.innosilicon.com/html/orderguide/index.html
(2)   We sell directly through our website. We don’t have any so-called reseller globally. Please visit http://www.innosilicon.com.
(3)   Don’t send money other than Innosilicon account.
We hope every customer has a great user experience with our miner. Should there be any question, feel free to contact us via: http://www.innosilicon.com/html/message/index.html.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DHUbU0VUIAASKpm.jpg:large

Should there be any question, feel free to contact us via: http://www.innosilicon.com/html/message/index.html.
We will not ask you to pay via Skype.
Only official email (XX@innosilicon.com.cn) with order number and detail can be deemed as real order.
However, we still strongly suggest you check the source before payment.

Those accounts are fraud account, and you may risk your money by contacting them:

https://mmbiz.qlogo.cn/mmbiz_png/O9FpOCg8ATU1JYU0XxTXqIF35xucbElMKStb94ZBWlpiaibqcXxolfOC2TibLngzCk1Rz3yFYls2qdZq9rp2Io8OQ/0?wx_fmt=png
https://mmbiz.qlogo.cn/mmbiz_png/O9FpOCg8ATU1JYU0XxTXqIF35xucbElM8SePyW0dFvlcIEU22gXIRe5HSs1zjK4V1XqhYwReZ85H8TYic0iba6JA/0?wx_fmt=png
https://mmbiz.qlogo.cn/mmbiz_png/O9FpOCg8ATU1JYU0XxTXqIF35xucbElMFhl2eTxhO8gncheEr6OT6hCfxzcDKNPyGic79NnI3WmUBv02tdpmklg/0?wx_fmt=png

There is a new miner coming..  :)
Innosilicon A4+
Hash rate 520 Mh/s, power consumption ~700W.

This seems good, I would like to know more info.

See this video:
"【INNOSILICON A4+】The Most Powerful Miner in the World"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9z-haTm7nY

This is closer to what the A4 was supposed to be.  Video says customers who placed A4 pre order will get a deal, nice!

Depends on price. As long as they don't want 9k for it.

Good find.  I am reaching out to them now to see what we can find out about access to the pre-orders for those who participated in the A4 pre-orders.  I will post what I find out.

Hook me up with this if you get any info, very interested as I was also an early A4 adopter.
Kinda disappointed with the original A4's numbers as they keep degrading over time, hope they get it right this time.
It's pretty comparable with the L3+, but the ordering process over at Bitmain is really bad. Just luck is all that matters over there, small batches which flood their web server. Wish they would adopt a queue mechanism.

BTW, I don't think their website is up to date. Looking at the A4 page:


That places the value of BTC at $2635...

Inno on other hand heavily overcharges all orders below 5 miners and even if they accept cryptos then usually at very bad rates

 Yeah, I'm currently in discussion with that issue with them about a pre-order I placed earlier this week.

 Their initial suggestion was "wire transfer" but I don't have ACCESS to wire transfers (one down side of credit unions, sometimes they don't offer some of the "fancy services" the big banks do - but on the other hand they also don't usually have the "fancy fees" either).


 Their published specs for the CHIPS in the A4 suggested they could put together a higher-performance miner - at a significantly higher cost due to the need to use a lot more chips to be able to run them at a lower voltage.

 I also suspect the Futurebit Moonlander v2 is using the chip out of the A4, but that's not been confirmed or denied yet....

Im sure if people were interested a solid group buy could be arranged.  I believe inno worked with guys here for the initial a4 group buy

I dotn see where it says that an A4 preorder will magically be upgraded to an A4+

Innosilicon needs to state that on this thread

You need to listen through that video that was linked in this thread earlier.

I see all that but they still have to confirm on thier thread

and honestly with the jacked up prices for BTC and LTC they use , its no surprise that no one is buying

Not so much "jacked up" but "month or more outdated" and they apparently aren't going to change them "at this time" per my email exchanges with them about my current pre-order.

Guess it's back to playing "L3+ website lottery" if they don't get the exchange rates FIXED before they actually start selling the A4+.

They do fix the BTC ratio when you make the order for real.
It's not a realtime Bitstamp price, but much better still.

I know because they did it when I ordered one A5 preorder after a long thought.
Let's see how that turns out.  :D
Delivery in November.

so how many did you order and what was the BTC price you have a recipt ?

 Be nice if they would actually DO that on my A4 order - so far it hasn't happened.

 On the other hand, I'm quite willing to wait to get A4+ units instead.

I ordered one unit and the btc price was valued approx. 4200 USD .

what im asking sorry is what did you actually PAY in btc , i.e they are pricing it at 1500 so did you pay .25 BTC or the outrageous .28 they want right now for a preorder

witch brings the price to 1950 or so vs the 1500 if you paid in full via wire

Confused about pricing
A4+ is priced at $4500 ($1500 each), however when I tried to place an order, it came back at $5809 ($1963 each)

The price on the Inno site is for the A4 NOT the A4+.  Priced in USD it is 1500 each+shipping and MOQ is 3.
The initial payment for the preorder is 70% down with the remainder due when they are ready to ship the miners.

If you price it in LTC or BTC it is WAAAAAAY OFF.  Your not going to get an A4 for $1500 USD if you try to pay in crypto.

So your best bet is to wire transfer USD if you want the best price.  Inno has been told their conversion rate is way off.  If they don't correct it then it is intentional.  At this point I don't know if they are going to make it closer to the real exchange rate or not.  So I would assume your best bet is a USD wire transfer.

And remember your going to pay by the hash rate so when they offer the A4+ the price is per megahash.  So if it is 520mh x $5.36 per megahash = $2787.20

So your balance due PER UNIT would be $1737.20 or for the MOQ of 3 units you would owe an additional $8371.60 PLUS shipping, customs, VAT etc.

I tried again with wire transfer and they said : Price $1620/ea
The video said if ypu pre order a A4 ($1500 per web page) you eill get A4+.

[/quote]
I tried again with wire transfer and they said : Price $1620/ea
The video said if ypu pre order a A4 ($1500 per web page) you eill get A4+.
[/quote]

You will get A4+ at price per megahash that could be around 2600$ to 2800$ depending upon the hash rate and you have to pay the difference and I think that  A4+ will not be delivered before 3 months could take 4 to5 months
I will not  pre-order a miner whose specs are not clearly mentioned, price is not confirmed and on top of all that the delivery date is not specified.

You will not get the A4+ for $1500.  It is priced per MHS of an A4 at $1500.  If you want to upgrade your order you will get the opportunity to do that as Inno has stated they will let all pre-order holders know they have the option to upgrade to the A4+.  We have already been told that once this preorder round is over the price will be going up.

BUT to get the A4+ you have to pay by the MHS of the A4+ upgrade.  The price is $5.36 per megahash if my math is correct at 280mhs A4 / $1500 = $5.35xxxxxxx Rounded up to $5.36

If the A4+ is delivered at say 550mhs(high end of the estimates we have seen so far) then the cost PER UNIT could be as high as $2948 + shipping.

So be aware that the preorder price on the site is for the 70% deposit, the remainder due when they are ready to ship. 

You may want to get a confirmation in writing from Inno that they are going to give you the option to upgrade to the A4+ just so you have that to refer to later should there be some sort of mix up. 

WTF with Silicons? ??? >:(  

I ordered the A4, for August-September delivery, now I am offered to pay extra for A+ and wait for December. its SCAM? How can this be? they risk the honest name of Charlie Lee, who praised them on his Twitter account.

I paid the money and waited two months to hear it?

That sounds like they are offering you a possibility to upgrade to the A4+ model?

they do not offer, but they say that this is the only way out and without a refund. is this normal for you? suppose you made a pre-order for A4 for the September, and they decided that you'd better buy an A4+ and wait another half a year. I myself want to decide what and when to buy for my money. there is an obvious fraud

I don't know about the A4 or A4+, but I made a preorder for the A5 Dashmaster, and so far so good.

We were told a week ago by phone that your order will be shipped in mid-September. but now they say that we no longer produce them. I hope that everything will be OK with your order. but not sure.

@HagssFIN I also bought an A5, what date did they give delivery? To me the 10-20 of October

November XX.

They didn't give me more specific date than that.

If anyone interested in buying A4+, PM me.

Does this mean that everyone who ordered A4 "Aug - Sept" batch now has to forcefully upgrade to A4+, pay more money and wait till November ? OMG
What if I dont want this A4+ miner. Do I get my money back that I used to preorder the original A4.  What is happening to Innosilicon ?
We need answers.

How about emailing them or Skyping?

Is there anyone here with contacts to innosilioc. I have tried emailing them using their contact form on their website but getting no answer! All Skype contacts are scam am told.   Do they still participate on bitcointalk forum ? I really need to speak to a human from innosilicon to verify this thing about A4 -> A4+ for pple who preordered Aug - Sep batch and don't want to upgrade. Has anyone received their machine from these guys for Aug - Sep  batch ?? :( :(

live:luojm_2 is one of their skype's

no  :'(

I've been messaging them since September 1st for information regarding my pre-order... Received one response saying they will look into it on the 4th and it's been dead silent ever since.

I've tried email and skype. Is there another option?

try calling them on this number:

Tel: +86 27-87531668  ext  304

They have some pple who speak english. Though i think something bad is going on at innosilicon. this silence has never hapenned with these guys.

Thank you! If I get any decent info I will reply with it.

Anyone know anyone in China trustworty to forward miners?

[/quote]
[/quote]
Anyone know anyone in China trustworty to forward miners?
[/quote]

Yes I know and I have forwarded my miners to him also for Nov delivery

Any news yet ?

No.. I've called multiple times but didn't get anywhere.

Going to try again in about 9 hours.

I bought a miner a4 a month and a half ago and it worked perfectly but yesterday one of the 4 cores crashed. simply disappeared as if it did not exist. I can not find anyone with this problem. Someone can help me ?

Atleast you received yo miner. Most of us have not goten any miners we preordered from innosilicon. They stopped answering emails or picking calls ??!!

Has anyone ordered A4s November batch? How long did it take for Innosilicon to confirm your payment? How did you pay? Have you received any emails for the upgrade?

If they are delaying the September batch till November, how long will it than take for the November batch to arrive :-[

I have preordered 5 a4's.
I waited 3 weeks for confirmation about payment via bank transfer.
I got the email that the waiting time is gonna be longer but no official time now on shipping.

As far as i know so far with the limited info:

Old A4 was 1500usd.
New A4+ is gonna be around 2950usd.

I'm attempting to raise funding to procure hardware.

Innosilicon........aren't they bankrupt ?? Got some rumors doing the rounds !

Any update on this? Have you heard anything about paying outstanding balances yet on the preorders?

Guys.
 I got a mail today from shupp@innosiiicon.com.cn telling me to pay the outstanding pre-order balance to the account below

Bank:China Merchants Bank
Bank Address:HeadOffice
adress:China Merchants Bank Tower No.7088, Shennan Boulevard,Shenzhen,China
Beneficiary: SONGMIN
Beneficiary's a/c no.:6214 8376-766-0078
SWIFT: CMBCCNBSXXX

Am wondering if innosilicon changed their bank account or this was a scam attempt. ?!
I have written to innosilicon through their website and hoping on a response to clarify this.
So if you get a similar mail, I suggest you contact innosilicon directly through their site first before transferring any money to the above account.

There are three i-letters in a row in the e-mail address you mentioned if you look at it closely (innosiiicon).

Smells like a scam.

This is 100% scam!!!
This has nothing to do with innosilicon bank.
Their bank is account is:
2. Payment:
Company name: INNOSILICON TECHNOLOGY LTD
Account Number: 8011 8168 6838
Bank : HSBCHK (HSBC Hongkong)
Swift Code : HSBCHKHHHKH
Bank Address: 1 Queen’s Road Central, Hong Kong

Anything different than this is scam.
Open your eyes good before you pay.


What really bothers me is how do the scammers know you have ordered?
Do they have an insider in innosilicon?
Where did you made the order? Was it on their site or somewhere else?

He told it earlier. And he couldn't get a hold of Inno about his preorder.

I have only been communicating to innosilicon through their website and i was also wondering how this guy got to know all my preorder details.
I still have not goten any response from innosilicon about this issue. I will keep you posted if i get any response from them.

Any news?
Did any1 got some response from innosilicon?

confirm, their bank account should be:

2. Payment:
Company name: INNOSILICON TECHNOLOGY LTD
Company Address: 10F-A2, Optical Valley Financial Harbor, Wuhan, Hubei, China 430000
Account Number: 8011 8168 6838
Bank : HSBCHK (HSBC Hongkong)
Swift Code : HSBCHKHHHKH
Bank Address: 1 Queen’s Road Central, Hong Kong

Has anyone got request to pay outstanding orders or are they shipping yet??

I finally got my outstanding balance information. They didn't send it on their own though... I had to bother them about it.

They said shipping will start late this month / early December.

Ok good. Thanks for sharing.
What about the price?
Whats the total of the A4+?
Having in mind you preordered and paid 1050USD.

Any new information for A4+??
thank you

Total price for each A4+ was around $3000 due to the discount given to those who were forced to upgrade....

I've yet to hear back on any payment confirmation or better shipping time frame. Innosilicon is starting to worry me. Have a strong feeling I'm going to have to write all this money off as a loss...

Even if these show up, I will never do business with them again. In the same time frame I've received multiple S9s and L3+ orders from Bitmain without any issues.

this is comforting to know that they are at least replying to you guys. I've ordered and paid for miners on June.

I've received a few emails but none included final payment options.  The first one seemed to be an offer to preorder more A4+'s.  No mention of the balance I owe for the preorder I already paid for.  But they did want payment quickly.  I sent back an email that asked the question "how much do I owe for order # etc"

The email I got back had no running total but just asked if I wanted to pay by wire or LTC.  I asked to list both amounts since the exchange rate is a bit high.

So far it seems that when they do communicate with me it's information that could be called "boilerplate".  No specifics of my order.  

I have no idea on the specific amount I owe and am certainly not going to guess and get one of those "your payment is 0.00001 too low and we cancelled your order" replies.

ordered in July, promised to have the miner in Sept... by then, no miner but an email said A4+ balala, so I wait...
for another month, bugged them, and they asked me to pay the additional amount for A4+ ...
paid additional payment again in late Oct, and then nothing... then, wait... until now

Don't worry, they are just testing them.  Once they ROI for them they will ship them to you!!  ;)

Same as any other ASIC manufacturer.

Same story with me, it is very disappointing that a company like Innosilicon is doing this to their customers. I am not sure whether I' ll get the miners in december even.

Where's the A5 thread?  I can't find it anymore.

I believe people who bought the A5 were supposed to get an A4?

Same here.
Even if i get the A4+ that i ordered i will never do business with them again. EVER!
Their communication with customers is retarded and idiotic.
I am just praying atm this is not some sort of a scam.

  :-\ same here too.
7 September ordered 8 units with a deposit of 70% for preorder of A4+. Confirmation email was not more then a "confirmed".. they dont answer to any email. No response!
3 days ago i received a email like this.. wtf..

-------------------------------------------------

Dear Innosilicon LTC miner pre-order customer,

 

We are grateful for your continuous support and trust of Innosilicon. We are devoted to creating the best miner products that provide wonderful user experience with their superb performance.

 

To maximize your benefits, and adapt to the difficulty of LTC mining, Innosilicon has updated A4 into introduce the next generation inspiring LTC miner, A4+, in the pursuit of the higher hash rate and EER (energy efficient ratio). Its hash rate and EER are leading in the industry with the typical hash rate of 620MHs and power consumption lower than 750W. For more details and video of A4+ miner, please refer to our website: http://www.innosilicon.com/html/a4+-miner/index.html

 

In consideration of your pre-order, we now offer a special discount for your support and understanding:

1)         You can obtain the LTC miner with highest hash rate in the market with only a total of 3200USD per unit;

2)         You can enjoy the priority delivery, which means your shipment takes the lead;

As known to all, when the hash rate is rising, obtaining the miner in advance means gaining your profits in advance.

 

We can understand your desire to get your miner immediately, and we have been sparing no efforts to realize it.

 

In order to receive the latest A4+ LTC miner as soon as possible, please complete the payment immediately.

 

To ensure the efficiency and accuracy of the shipment and to avoid unnecessary delay, please check and confirm your delivery address:

Order ID:

Customer Name:

Company:

Country:

State/Province:

City:

Street and House NO.:

Zip Code:

Phone Number:

Power Supply Voltage, (110V or 220V):        

 

We offer the official standard power supply (110V or 220V), it is only 120USD.

 

Please inform us about the quantity of the miner and PSU you wish to reserve and make the payment in a timely fashion. The miners and PSU will be delivered to the confirmed address faster, thus increasing the operation time of your equipment.

 

Finally, please reply to this email if you have any questions.

Looking forward to your reply and have a good day!

-------------------------------------------------

Special discount?!
Hahaha. What do they mean by special discount when the original price is 3200 anyway?

Can you post the email address that sent you this mail please?

Nop...   Email :  miner_a4@innosilicon.com.cn

Can anybody confirm if they have actually started the shipping process? I received two emails asking to confirm my details.I hope i will receive the miners on December at least.

No idea. I wired them my remaining balance and have been unable to get a response since.

Thanks. Please update once you get a response from them.

Its out now. I get the final payment and i have to pay for each unit 3320$ with psu . First and last time buying stuff from innosilicon. In the offer from sept there wss only explained that if you order A4 you getting automatically an update for A4+ units.. there was fucking nothing explained about the price announcement or the price politics frum this "company".

On twitter they get a shitstorm for the A5 and now also for A4plus too.
Im thinking @ 2018 innosilicon will getting out of miner business
Now we have to pay wit EU fee and transport all together something around 12500$ for fucking 3 Innosilocon units 👍and roi maybe with good luck mid 2019.
Next orders only @ bitmain and rly fu Innosilocon and thx for waiting 4 months..

Greetings

Yeah, it is just ridiculous business by these people...but, given that they had a genuine reason (A4+ Upgrade), I have no choice but to be content with what they are doing - just because a good amount of money I ve already invested in this. I just don't worry about the ROI, it is pointless at this time, it wil only make me more anxious, seeing LTC/BTC price go up calms me down..I consider myself lucky if i get my hands on them miners on december atleast.

Thanks for the update man.

Yes any scrypt coin there is.

what about this company?
I have read some posts and I see that people is not satisfied

I was told on 23 November shipment would be arranged "instantly". Heard absolutely nothing since.

Did you made full payment?
Can you please post the bank account of Innosilicon that you made your payment to.

This company is absolutely ridiculous.

DO NOT BUY anything from INNOSILICON.  They are really bad company, no contact information, to get email from them is even more rare then to win on a lotery.

I believe they are a company, but people inthere just do not know how to have a relationship with customers.
They earned a tons of money.

But to stay stick with Proforma Invoice and with promise - that is far away from honesty.

This is from their web page:




So: A company with NO responsibility, no care for customers, no honesty.

Wondering, what kind of answer will write back guys from Innosilicon Sales: @Inno_ASIC https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=318062 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=318062)

Can you guys read post #382 in this thread and do a quick reply, please?

I think they are not scammers, but they definitely bite much much more than they can chew.
They make tons of money but they don't employ more people in their marketing department to improve communication with customers etc.
Waiting for email answer for 2,3,4 weeks is embarrassing and stupid.
They will definitely loose customers for this.

I agree with that. Not nice what they are doing.

Plus: They mixed the orders on their web page: There was a HUGE misunderstanding with A4 and A4+ orders.
It is a shame that they increase the price to more then double ($1620 for A4+ with PSU - first order in September  => then suddenly price increased to $3200 without PSU)  ???

I agree to increase the price for new uyers, but you cannot do that with customers who payed 70% in advance and waiting for months, before you should pay additional 30%. I hope all those who order A4+ and got "new proforma invoice with 400% money to pay, that they have good heart!!  :o

5 days after making full payment and still no replay from Innosilicon.
Amazing.

Same here, i Paid the balance payment on 12th dec... still no confirmation or any kind of update... this is just terrible

Hi guys,

we are all together in this knee-deep-waiting-game sh***, I wired the rest last week of November and I am still waiting for confirmation.

I heard some folks got their miners without a shipping notification email - Inno just send the miners via DHL.

Hope to get mines this year, but the days are kind of running out..

Anyone know where to get the data cable which goes from the cube to the controller?

Did anyone of you got an email like this:


This was 3 days ago.

I've finally received my A4+

I'm out of town and can't test them at the moment though. Bleh

Did they provide you with a tracking number before they shipped the miners?

Bump

No, I sent an email asking when shipping will occur. They had already shipped them and provided a tracking number.

This was a day after they shipped them.

Hello

What are news on the A4R model ?

I have an offer for this, 620Mh/s, powerful than L3+, and price is less...

It's good deal ?


I mean about quality than Bitmain, and fiability ?

Save your time and nerves and everything.
Do not order anything from Innosilicon.

Ok thanks.

L3++ is more expensiver, but after overclock it's same performance.
And i think quality is better.

What email are you getting replies from? I have had zero luck with all the emails I have tried. Dec 28th batch payment made in full on Dec 14th. Would be nice to know if they are coming so I can arrange someone to accept them.

People that made full payments in August are still waiting their miners.
God help you and god help us all with these people from Innosilicon.

They said they will ship last week.And ofc nothing happened.
At this point i am really scared for my money.

well same here, every email received from them is "ship by this week" and it's always pending payment confirmation. Have you received your miners?

When do you make your order ? What batch was the expected delivery date for yours? What method of communication are you receiving these messages?

Great news! We now have very limited number of brand new A5 32.5Gh/s 750W (in normal mode) DashMaster in stock for clearance. The A5 DashMasters are the world most powerful, power efficient and reliable miners that were previously sold out and now just became available. 

For interested volume buyers who desire 50 miners or more, please email us at miner_a5@innosilicon.com.cn and take advantage of this clearance week with good deal plus free PSU.

Happy new year and have a nice holiday!

https://mmbiz.qpic.cn/mmbiz_jpg/O9FpOCg8ATXBBUakhBFibC7fXfWl0icDRBCrKsooJ6cEUKVfvjZVNJKbM8klmggNQ2f9KvEQvibVaClqYOD1tSryA/0?wx_fmt=jpeg

My offer is 500$ per miner for 50 miners purchased in bulk

So whats the price?