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Indianacoin
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January 15, 2016, 07:05:58 PM |
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What can be genuine benefits of double spending the same coin other then being misused like the way its been here?
Double spends aren't having any benefits. Double-spending is the result of successfully spending some money more than once. Bitcoin protects against double spending by verifying each transaction added to the block chain to ensure that the inputs for the transaction had not previously been spent. Other electronic systems prevent double-spending by having a master authoritative source that follows business rules for authorizing each transaction. Bitcoin uses a decentralized system, where a consensus among nodes following the same protocol is substituted for a central authority. Bitcoin has some exposure to fraudulent double-spending when a transaction is first made, with less and less risk as a transaction gains confirmations. Traders and merchants who accept a payment immediately on seeing "0/unconfirmed" are exposed to a double-spend occurring, if there was a fraudulent attempt that successfully communicated one transaction to the merchant yet communicated a different transaction that spends the same coin that was first to eventually make it into the block chain. Merchants can take precautions (e.g., disable incoming connections, only connect to well connected nodes) to lessen the risk of a race attack but the risk cannot be eliminated. Therefore, the cost/benefit of the risk needs to be considered when accepting payment on 0/unconfirmed when there is no recourse against the attacker. Here's an example of how macbook-air (owner of F2pool) had successfully double spent $10000 against OKPAY! |
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shorena
Copper Member
Legendary
 Offline
Activity: 1498
Merit: 1520
No I dont escrow anymore.
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January 15, 2016, 07:20:43 PM |
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What can be genuine benefits of double spending the same coin other then being misused like the way its been here?
Double spends aren't having any benefits. Double-spending is the result of successfully spending some money more than once. Bitcoin protects against double spending by verifying each transaction added to the block chain to ensure that the inputs for the transaction had not previously been spent. For one, its only called a double spend, the value has not actually been spend twice. The first transaction became invalid and thus the same coins have only be confirmed once. Other electronic systems prevent double-spending by having a master authoritative source that follows business rules for authorizing each transaction. Bitcoin uses a decentralized system, where a consensus among nodes following the same protocol is substituted for a central authority.
Bitcoin has some exposure to fraudulent double-spending when a transaction is first made, with less and less risk as a transaction gains confirmations.
After one confirmation you would need to find a competing block for the one that has confirmed the transaction. This is only possible with certainty if you hold over 50% of the networks hashpower. There is no "less and less risk" its a significantly drop from unconfirmed (can be double spend with a few simple steps as long as the conditions are right) to 1 confirmation (you need more hashpower than the rest of the world). Traders and merchants who accept a payment immediately on seeing "0/unconfirmed" are exposed to a double-spend occurring, if there was a fraudulent attempt that successfully communicated one transaction to the merchant yet communicated a different transaction that spends the same coin that was first to eventually make it into the block chain.
Merchants can take precautions (e.g., disable incoming connections, only connect to well connected nodes)
That does not help, what you have in mind is a sybil attack. A sybil attack can be used to make a double spend simple, but its - again - very resource heavy (you need enough full nodes to fill all connections of the merchant) and would be hardly worth the effort for transactions commonly accepted without confirmation. The best way to mitigate a double spend for a merchant is to constantly rebroadcast the TX or as e.g. bitpay does have direct deals with big mining pools. to lessen the risk of a race attack but the risk cannot be eliminated. Therefore, the cost/benefit of the risk needs to be considered when accepting payment on 0/unconfirmed when there is no recourse against the attacker. Here's an example of how macbook-air (owner of F2pool) had successfully double spent $10000 against OKPAY! They used a very specific network state, the 0.8 fork, this is not something you can repeat daily. The window was small and known in advance. -snip-
Was only an issue while there were two chains; ie, for a couple hours last night. The possibility was well-known, which is why it was recommended that merchants, exchanges, etc, stop taking payments/deposits until the issue was resolved, which it now is.
-snip-
What can be genuine benefits of double spending the same coin other then being misused like the way its been here?
Increase the fees on an otherwise stuck transaction. Usually you want double spends to be hard though, because if its too easy you cant accept unconfirmed transactions and bitcoin would slow down even further and be useless for small transfers to e.g. buy a coffee. No one is willing to wait 10 minutes for a coffee. |
Im not really here, its just your imagination.
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Engg.Chaks
Member
Offline
Activity: 70
Merit: 10
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January 16, 2016, 08:02:14 AM |
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Got coins recovered and scammed a guy with 600 euro skrill.
I am.now running nodes and I can somewhat control transactions like triple spending , reverse transaction within 24 hours.
Thanks to bit-trader @hackforu.net
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~PayPal-Trader~
Newbie
Offline
Activity: 33
Merit: 0
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January 16, 2016, 08:06:26 AM |
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Scammed 367 usd with bit-trader method.
Yep! Just triple spent the 0.42btc, none of the transaction will be ever confirmed.. And I am already with high profit. Thanks to bit-trader |
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sardasa (OP)
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January 18, 2016, 06:46:06 PM |
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Scammed 367 usd with bit-trader method.
Yep! Just triple spent the 0.42btc, none of the transaction will be ever confirmed.. And I am already with high profit. Thanks to bit-trader Low life scammer! |
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sardasa (OP)
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January 19, 2016, 05:24:10 PM |
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Scammed 367 usd with bit-trader method.
Yep! Just triple spent the 0.42btc, none of the transaction will be ever confirmed.. And I am already with high profit. Thanks to bit-trader Even after admitting it openly here that you are a scammer, you still have the guts to bump your thread, lock it and then deal with users via PM. You are nothing more than fucking piece of shit! https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1325016.msg13607783#msg13607783 |
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sardasa (OP)
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January 22, 2016, 04:59:43 PM |
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Thank you for this information. He recently pm me engaging myself into a trade and I saw his negative trust referring to this thread.
Thanks a lot for saving me from scamming. I think he is targeting newbies.
Glad this post helped someone from getting scammed  |
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Spoetnik
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1540
Merit: 1011
FUD Philanthropist™
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January 27, 2016, 10:30:48 AM |
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uhhm You were already aware trading BTC with Paypal is against the TOS
so no i don't feel sorry for any you getting burned.
what happens when the guy with the PP account get s locked out ?
Then what ?
Start using your brains guy..
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FUD first & ask questions later™ |
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Timelord2067
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 3668
Merit: 2217
💲🏎️💨🚓
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February 05, 2016, 05:38:06 PM |
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Okay this is refund address: 1CwV6JERyAZpsMAhVqDSpoqYt3eAqs7xFc
I don't feel like blaming you or blocking you , what i felt bad was that you called me scammer , and this i don't like , because i am as legit as you are.
...and the only other time that wallet 1CwV6JERyAZpsMAhVqDSpoqYt3eAqs7xFc is mentioned here at BCT is when it shows up in this message by someone else.... ~PayPal-Trader~ is an Alt of ? ? ?OK, so ~PayPal-Trader~ quoted the wallet address 1CwV6JERyAZpsMAhVqDSpoqYt3eAqs7xFc was quoted above ( http://archive.is/rtnNQ ) and ( http://archive.is/uBmPV )
Over yonder Re: [H] 0.4247 btc FOR SALE | Verified Account | PP,OKpay,Webmoney,Skrill,... https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1352966.0samantlia gives ShakinHandz two positive trust / feedback 's for trades ShakinHandz 0: -0 / +0 2016-01-29 0.02500000 Reference Great guy very fast and pro . BTC/Paypal Reference https://blockchain.info/tx/3b4d6aea7ccb012cb276de6227c57f68f431db023bb862d9b40439b363a2c2bd ShakinHandz 0: -0 / +0 2016-02-04 0.13262944 Reference Very fast, no problem, btc/paypal. Reference https://blockchain.info/fr/tx/b6de63d0a830c2b6749f74521eb620313be7bfd3cb1d63f722915b7c5a8a932b this second transaction is interesting in that the sending wallet is 1CwV6JERyAZpsMAhVqDSpoqYt3eAqs7xFc which means samantlia is an Alt of ~PayPal-Trader~
However... ShakinHandz lists on his profile page the wallet Bitcoin address: 1C8NBJ4cDjpFoe8iMRNgywUs2VqYS1uar8 both wallets 1C8NBJ4cDjpFoe8iMRNgywUs2VqYS1uar8 and 1CwV6JERyAZpsMAhVqDSpoqYt3eAqs7xFc send to the same wallet 16tqsyz3zh6v4PubWDyo5UzMARybDj9A8Tso for samantlia to send ShakinHandz funds from his own wallet means that ShakinHandz is an Alt of samantlia who is an Alt of ~PayPal-Trader~ |
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ShakinHandz
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February 05, 2016, 09:09:39 PM |
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Paypal trader sends him money then what i can do , I deal with many people and i send money to anyone who can send me money , i have all paypal transaction Receipt , if you want you can look into it . |
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xetsr
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1120
Merit: 1000
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February 05, 2016, 09:15:05 PM |
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Paypal trader sends him money then what i can do , I deal with many people and i send money to anyone who can send me money , i have all paypal transaction Receipt , if you want you can look into it . Why did samantlia leave you positive feedback with a reference link ( https://blockchain.info/tx/b6de63d0a830c2b6749f74521eb620313be7bfd3cb1d63f722915b7c5a8a932b) that shows: 1CwV6JERyAZpsMAhVqDSpoqYt3eAqs7xFc (scammer) sent to 16tqsyz3zh6v4PubWDyo5UzMARybDj9A8T (samantlia) |
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ShakinHandz
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February 05, 2016, 09:18:08 PM |
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Paypal trader sends him money then what i can do , I deal with many people and i send money to anyone who can send me money , i have all paypal transaction Receipt , if you want you can look into it . Why did samantlia leave you positive feedback with a reference link ( https://blockchain.info/tx/b6de63d0a830c2b6749f74521eb620313be7bfd3cb1d63f722915b7c5a8a932b) that shows: 1CwV6JERyAZpsMAhVqDSpoqYt3eAqs7xFc (scammer) sent to 16tqsyz3zh6v4PubWDyo5UzMARybDj9A8T (samantlia) i say everyone who ever trade with me to leave a feedback to me , it is my way of getting feedbacks , You want i can give you my account password , you can check all pm and even i can give you my paypal email and password , check it yourself or come to team view and i will refresh pages so that you can see that i am not faking any proof. |
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xetsr
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1120
Merit: 1000
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February 05, 2016, 09:19:21 PM
Last edit: February 05, 2016, 09:34:21 PM by xetsr |
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Paypal trader sends him money then what i can do , I deal with many people and i send money to anyone who can send me money , i have all paypal transaction Receipt , if you want you can look into it . Why did samantlia leave you positive feedback with a reference link ( https://blockchain.info/tx/b6de63d0a830c2b6749f74521eb620313be7bfd3cb1d63f722915b7c5a8a932b) that shows: 1CwV6JERyAZpsMAhVqDSpoqYt3eAqs7xFc (scammer) sent to 16tqsyz3zh6v4PubWDyo5UzMARybDj9A8T (samantlia) i say everyone who ever trade with me to leave a feedback to me , it is my way of getting feedbacks , You want i can give you my account password , you can check all pm and even i can give you my paypal email and password , check it yourself or come to team view and i will refresh pages so that you can see that i am not faking any proof. Let's skip all the BS, if you're legit then samantlia either made a mistake or is a alt of ~PayPal-Trader~. Save everyone the trouble and just post the TXs of the trades you two have done  EDIT: So I'm bored. Weather is terrible, have nothing better to do today for those wondering  Asked ShakinHandz over PM to just list the transactions here. He can't because "How can i get you transaction details from my wallet i havent left any public note on it". Before that he told me the address he uses with all transactions is: 1C8NBJ4cDjpFoe8iMRNgywUs2VqYS1uar8 So here we go: ShakinHandz left samantlia positive feedback today (2016-02-05) with the risked amount as 0.13300000. Going through the above transactions today for 1C8NBJ4cDjpFoe8iMRNgywUs2VqYS1uar8, you will not find that amount. However the reference link left by samantlia shows 1CwV6JERyAZpsMAhVqDSpoqYt3eAqs7xFc (scammer) sent 0.13262944 today, which is pretty damn close to 0.133. I suspect either ShakinHandz = ~PayPal-Trader~ or was involved in a middle man deal that involved ~PayPal-Trader~. Either way, I wouldn't trust him. |
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ShakinHandz
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February 05, 2016, 09:40:41 PM |
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Paypal trader sends him money then what i can do , I deal with many people and i send money to anyone who can send me money , i have all paypal transaction Receipt , if you want you can look into it . Why did samantlia leave you positive feedback with a reference link ( https://blockchain.info/tx/b6de63d0a830c2b6749f74521eb620313be7bfd3cb1d63f722915b7c5a8a932b) that shows: 1CwV6JERyAZpsMAhVqDSpoqYt3eAqs7xFc (scammer) sent to 16tqsyz3zh6v4PubWDyo5UzMARybDj9A8T (samantlia) i say everyone who ever trade with me to leave a feedback to me , it is my way of getting feedbacks , You want i can give you my account password , you can check all pm and even i can give you my paypal email and password , check it yourself or come to team view and i will refresh pages so that you can see that i am not faking any proof. Let's skip all the BS, if you're legit then samantlia either made a mistake or is a alt of ~PayPal-Trader~. Save everyone the trouble and just post the TXs of the trades you two have done EDIT: So I'm bored. Weather is terrible, have nothing better to do today for those wondering Asked ShakinHandz over PM to just list the transactions here. He can't because "How can i get you transaction details from my wallet i havent left any public note on it". Before that he told me the address he uses with all transactions is: 1C8NBJ4cDjpFoe8iMRNgywUs2VqYS1uar8 So here we go: ShakinHandz left samantlia positive feedback today (2016-02-05) with the risked amount as 0.13300000. Going through the above transactions today for 1C8NBJ4cDjpFoe8iMRNgywUs2VqYS1uar8, you will not find that amount. However the reference link left by samantlia shows 1CwV6JERyAZpsMAhVqDSpoqYt3eAqs7xFc (scammer) sent 0.13262944 today, which is pretty damn close to 0.133. I suspect either ShakinHandz = ~PayPal-Trader~ or was involved in a middle man deal that involved ~PayPal-Trader~. Either way, I wouldn't trust him. Hmm..I understood everything , you mean why the man who left me trust with this reference link which points that to scammers address , well i have sent a pm to samantlia for it and he will reply it , because my wallet for all transaction is 1C8NBJ4cDjpFoe8iMRNgywUs2VqYS1uar8 only. |
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xetsr
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1120
Merit: 1000
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February 05, 2016, 09:44:32 PM |
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Paypal trader sends him money then what i can do , I deal with many people and i send money to anyone who can send me money , i have all paypal transaction Receipt , if you want you can look into it . Why did samantlia leave you positive feedback with a reference link ( https://blockchain.info/tx/b6de63d0a830c2b6749f74521eb620313be7bfd3cb1d63f722915b7c5a8a932b) that shows: 1CwV6JERyAZpsMAhVqDSpoqYt3eAqs7xFc (scammer) sent to 16tqsyz3zh6v4PubWDyo5UzMARybDj9A8T (samantlia) i say everyone who ever trade with me to leave a feedback to me , it is my way of getting feedbacks , You want i can give you my account password , you can check all pm and even i can give you my paypal email and password , check it yourself or come to team view and i will refresh pages so that you can see that i am not faking any proof. Let's skip all the BS, if you're legit then samantlia either made a mistake or is a alt of ~PayPal-Trader~. Save everyone the trouble and just post the TXs of the trades you two have done EDIT: So I'm bored. Weather is terrible, have nothing better to do today for those wondering Asked ShakinHandz over PM to just list the transactions here. He can't because "How can i get you transaction details from my wallet i havent left any public note on it". Before that he told me the address he uses with all transactions is: 1C8NBJ4cDjpFoe8iMRNgywUs2VqYS1uar8 So here we go: ShakinHandz left samantlia positive feedback today (2016-02-05) with the risked amount as 0.13300000. Going through the above transactions today for 1C8NBJ4cDjpFoe8iMRNgywUs2VqYS1uar8, you will not find that amount. However the reference link left by samantlia shows 1CwV6JERyAZpsMAhVqDSpoqYt3eAqs7xFc (scammer) sent 0.13262944 today, which is pretty damn close to 0.133. I suspect either ShakinHandz = ~PayPal-Trader~ or was involved in a middle man deal that involved ~PayPal-Trader~. Either way, I wouldn't trust him. Hmm..I understood everything , you mean why the man who left me trust with this reference link which points that to scammers address , well i have sent a pm to samantlia for it and he will reply it , because my wallet for all transaction is 1C8NBJ4cDjpFoe8iMRNgywUs2VqYS1uar8 only. You left positive feedback yourself for samantlia which matches the amount the scammer's address, not your address sent samantlia. So either you left false feedback, you're an alt of the scammer and sent from the wrong wallet or you did a man in the middle deal. Either way, you can't be trusted. It's all above. I don't think I'm missing anything... |
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Indianacoin
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February 05, 2016, 09:48:01 PM |
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Nice that you have shown the screenshots of your faked pms. I want everyone to note the timings of their replies.  I think that tells us all about your true nature. Well you should at least created a thread before starting your massive trading sessions rather than on pms if you are really concerned about transparency. |
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xetsr
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1120
Merit: 1000
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February 05, 2016, 09:52:44 PM |
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Nice that you have shown the screenshots of your faked pms. I want everyone to note the timings of their replies. I think that tells us all about your true nature. Well you should at least created a thread before starting your massive trading sessions rather than on pms if you are really concerned about transparency. Those PMs are probably real. I don't think samantlia is an alt of either, just accepted btc from both. ShakinHandz offered to let me login to your account which is pointless as it doesn't prove anything. The blockchain evidence does though. Appears to come down to funds were sent from the wrong wallet  |
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ShakinHandz
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February 05, 2016, 09:56:23 PM |
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Paypal trader sends him money then what i can do , I deal with many people and i send money to anyone who can send me money , i have all paypal transaction Receipt , if you want you can look into it . Why did samantlia leave you positive feedback with a reference link ( https://blockchain.info/tx/b6de63d0a830c2b6749f74521eb620313be7bfd3cb1d63f722915b7c5a8a932b) that shows: 1CwV6JERyAZpsMAhVqDSpoqYt3eAqs7xFc (scammer) sent to 16tqsyz3zh6v4PubWDyo5UzMARybDj9A8T (samantlia) i say everyone who ever trade with me to leave a feedback to me , it is my way of getting feedbacks , You want i can give you my account password , you can check all pm and even i can give you my paypal email and password , check it yourself or come to team view and i will refresh pages so that you can see that i am not faking any proof. Let's skip all the BS, if you're legit then samantlia either made a mistake or is a alt of ~PayPal-Trader~. Save everyone the trouble and just post the TXs of the trades you two have done EDIT: So I'm bored. Weather is terrible, have nothing better to do today for those wondering Asked ShakinHandz over PM to just list the transactions here. He can't because "How can i get you transaction details from my wallet i havent left any public note on it". Before that he told me the address he uses with all transactions is: 1C8NBJ4cDjpFoe8iMRNgywUs2VqYS1uar8 So here we go: ShakinHandz left samantlia positive feedback today (2016-02-05) with the risked amount as 0.13300000. Going through the above transactions today for 1C8NBJ4cDjpFoe8iMRNgywUs2VqYS1uar8, you will not find that amount. However the reference link left by samantlia shows 1CwV6JERyAZpsMAhVqDSpoqYt3eAqs7xFc (scammer) sent 0.13262944 today, which is pretty damn close to 0.133. I suspect either ShakinHandz = ~PayPal-Trader~ or was involved in a middle man deal that involved ~PayPal-Trader~. Either way, I wouldn't trust him. Hmm..I understood everything , you mean why the man who left me trust with this reference link which points that to scammers address , well i have sent a pm to samantlia for it and he will reply it , because my wallet for all transaction is 1C8NBJ4cDjpFoe8iMRNgywUs2VqYS1uar8 only. You left positive feedback yourself for samantlia which matches the amount the scammer's address, not your address sent samantlia. So either you left false feedback, you're an alt of the scammer and sent from the wrong wallet or you did a man in the middle deal. Either way, you can't be trusted. It's all above. I don't think I'm missing anything... I wrote the feedback because he told me to do so , and i trust him. You can see the date i left him another day when he told me .  |
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