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Author Topic: Apparently Chinese Mining Pools are sticking with Core! :)  (Read 3482 times)
Bitcoinpro
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January 22, 2016, 07:35:01 AM
 #41

Is there any business in communist China that the government doesn't control?  Is there anyone in communist China with money that the government doesn't condone?

The government has little to do with the vast majority of businesses in China (and in fact most small businesses don't even pay tax).

One thing you should learn about Chinese is that they rarely co-operate with each other (which is why they are well known not to work well in teams).

Perhaps you should actually come and visit to "see for yourself" that there aren't troops in jackboots walking around controlling what is going on.  Roll Eyes


yes their is and cctv to go with as well as the most sophistigated sat coverage
 

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January 22, 2016, 07:41:33 AM
 #42

I heard that is a fake news and the fact that someone is spreading fake news indicated that the political campaign has entered china  Grin

Miners might not want to change because a 1MB fixed block forever will make them rich, especially now the hard competition already made their profit very thin

However, I see this as a future problem that miners overtake the control of bitcoin and there is no way to fight against it

Imagine that world government have implemented new rules to regulate all large mining pools so that they only can process non blacklisted transactions (blockchain analysis is the new trend), and all the transactions must be traceable to its owner with name and address, this will make the trace highly practical from AML and KYC point of view. As a bitcoin user, you just can not do anything about it, because all your transactions are processed by government regulated mining nodes

You can change to another algo like skrypt, then again those large mining pools will be regulated if there are just a few, and with a lower hash cost coin, the value of the coin also goes down until it reaches mining cost

So it is very important to decentralize the mining, since controlling the mining nodes is much more effective than control the other part of bitcoin ecosystem, it is equal to control the central bank of a monetary system. We know that central bank is independent from the government, in this case, large mining pools have no way to reach that kind of independence

Tracking name and address through the blockchain would be incredibly dangerous... Would you want to be associated with say 10,000 bitcoins with full details on the blockchain on where to steal them?

Something like that will never work and if nothing is done to prevent something like that from happening, everybody will abandon ship. Maybe litecoin will get some attention than.

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January 22, 2016, 07:52:27 AM
 #43

Ok then, we will just see what happens. I'm getting tired of this blocksize debate.

If China sticks with 1MB block size and BTC lifts off there will be full blocks and transactions will be delayed, eventually not get through. Something is going to change then. Either the BTC price will tank or a solution will be found. Until then, the fees may be higher and the Chinese will earn a bit more, but growth is going to be limited to ...an exclusive circle. All in all, I would say this will make the mid to long-term perspectives for BTC price conservative to bearish.
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January 22, 2016, 08:00:14 AM
 #44

Doesn't seggregated witness fix this problem? I guess it will be ready after few months.

Average confirmation time has not increased, so there is no emergency.

https://blockchain.info/charts/avg-confirmation-time?timespan=2year&showDataPoints=false&daysAverageString=1&show_header=true&scale=0&address=

IMHO we can wait for the seggregated witness.
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January 22, 2016, 08:14:21 AM
 #45

Then the issue s been resolved. Cause mining pools and large miners are the ones who call the shots.

So any other discussion about this is pointless.

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January 22, 2016, 08:51:11 AM
 #46

I heard that is a fake news and the fact that someone is spreading fake news indicated that the political campaign has entered china  Grin

Miners might not want to change because a 1MB fixed block forever will make them rich, especially now the hard competition already made their profit very thin

However, I see this as a future problem that miners overtake the control of bitcoin and there is no way to fight against it

Imagine that world government have implemented new rules to regulate all large mining pools so that they only can process non blacklisted transactions (blockchain analysis is the new trend), and all the transactions must be traceable to its owner with name and address, this will make the trace highly practical from AML and KYC point of view. As a bitcoin user, you just can not do anything about it, because all your transactions are processed by government regulated mining nodes

You can change to another algo like skrypt, then again those large mining pools will be regulated if there are just a few, and with a lower hash cost coin, the value of the coin also goes down until it reaches mining cost

So it is very important to decentralize the mining, since controlling the mining nodes is much more effective than control the other part of bitcoin ecosystem, it is equal to control the central bank of a monetary system. We know that central bank is independent from the government, in this case, large mining pools have no way to reach that kind of independence

Tracking name and address through the blockchain would be incredibly dangerous... Would you want to be associated with say 10,000 bitcoins with full details on the blockchain on where to steal them?

Something like that will never work and if nothing is done to prevent something like that from happening, everybody will abandon ship. Maybe litecoin will get some attention than.

Government will do exactly like they did with exchanges, first define mining pools as a money transmitter service thus require license to run (I think BTCGUID was closed due to this requirement), and when pools get that license they become a financial institution, thus must follow AML and KYC rules, e.g. all the miners connecting to them will have to submit their id-card and el/tele bill to living address....


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January 22, 2016, 09:38:04 AM
 #47

The PRC is the very definition of state capitalism.  No great enterprise is undertaken without the direct consent of the government.  Small business isn't a threat to state capitalism and thus is left to its own devices.  Anything which threatens the monopoly of the state is destroyed.  They only deploy the "jackboots" as a last resort.

Well I seriously doubt that any private company can just say build a freeway without government consent in the US either (i.e. all governments control what can and cannot be done by major companies).

If the Chinese government has been taking over mining operations can you please show the evidence of this (because major players that are owned and controlled by Americans aren't complaining about this)?

The development of public infrastructure is centrally planned in all countries because it is deemed a necessity for the common good.  I am referring to state intervention in regular businesses with the intent to monopolize opportunities for a select few at the expense of the many.  This is perpetrated under the ruse of it being done for the national interest.  The PRC speaks out of both sides of its mouth.  It advocates a policy of international cooperation, but pursues a policy of international monopolization.  Anyone who truly understands the objectives of a communism state realizes that state capitalism is the end goal.

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January 22, 2016, 02:32:10 PM
 #48

Anyone who truly understands the objectives of a communism state realizes that state capitalism is the end goal.

Seriously you are confused.

Until Deng (who had been imprisoned by Mao because of his capitalist ideals) China was not pursuing capitalism at all - so are you saying that the objectives of a communist state only started in 1980?
(and what exactly what do you label that which preceded Deng - "pretend communism"?)

Other well known communist states are still *not capitalist* (compared to China which is perhaps the only really capitalist "supposedly communist" country in the world) so again - what you are saying just is silly.

I can only guess that you don't know much at all about Carl Marx and his theories and what they led to politically.

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January 22, 2016, 02:52:02 PM
 #49

Unconsciously, China has become an important bitcoin
But it is not so important, after all, China's contribution to the core is not much
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January 22, 2016, 02:57:33 PM
 #50

But it is not so important, after all, China's contribution to the core is not much

Indeed - as far as the coding goes there is very little input from Chinese developers (that is a whole other story which is the lack of creativity in China).

What the XT/UB/Classic takeover attempts by the American backers have failed to understand is the Chinese culture - so their efforts to convince groups to co-operate with them will all fail (as they are now finding out).

Core wins not because it is actually preferred but simply because it is what was there first and the Chinese cannot agree amongst themselves to anything else (nor to create any alternative).

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January 22, 2016, 03:13:06 PM
 #51

They already realized that we can solve the blocksize issue without having to increase the size of the Blocks.
The Emercoin project introduced a new tecnique that reducxes the size of the transaction, reducing the need of bigger blocks.
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January 22, 2016, 03:26:29 PM
 #52

Confirmed, bitcoin classic will be another fail try to make bitcoin centralized.

It's great Chinise mining pools don't stick with bitcoin classic, but it means block size is still the main problem.
I hope they'll choose/think something to solve block size problem, but i doubt they'll take any action.

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January 22, 2016, 03:40:41 PM
 #53

Why is it so goddamned hard to get straightforward facts out of China?  It's not another planet.

I'm profoundly uninterested in Chinese opinions on this subject. I think it's very unfortunate that potential innovation is stymied by a bunch of folks who effectively contribute nothing.

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January 22, 2016, 03:43:52 PM
 #54

Why is it so goddamned hard to get straightforward facts out of China?  It's not another planet.

I'm profoundly uninterested in Chinese opinions on this subject. I think it's very unfortunate that potential innovation is stymied by a bunch of folks who effectively contribute nothing.

Clearly then they cannot contribute anything (as you are uninterested in their opinions) - that is basically the same kind of mantra that used to me said of women (by men) in the western world many years ago.

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January 22, 2016, 03:46:37 PM
 #55

Confirmed, bitcoin classic will be another fail try to make bitcoin centralized.

It's great Chinise mining pools don't stick with bitcoin classic, but it means block size is still the main problem.
I hope they'll choose/think something to solve block size problem, but i doubt they'll take any action.

I think they already have chosen to take action. It's not a "real" block size fix but it sort of has the same outcome. It doesn't need a hard fork. It doesn't break any current consensus rules because it manipulates the coinbase transaction's input. They are going to split off witness data to a separate tree instead of mining it in the block. This should allow them to have another couple of years to fuck around and not develop a permanent solution. lol

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January 22, 2016, 05:51:40 PM
 #56



Clearly then they cannot contribute anything (as you are uninterested in their opinions) - that is basically the same kind of mantra that used to me said of women (by men) in the western world many years ago.

Cheesy



Hmm. Maybe that does make me a big old sexist then. Either way at this early stage of the game it would be nice to see a more unified interest in making progress from all sides rather than sitting back and milking. That's fine when things are rather more ossified but it's still in the fragile stages.

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January 22, 2016, 09:49:47 PM
 #57


Looks like Mr.Weirdum got his act together:

https://bitcoinmagazine.com/articles/f-pool-chinese-pools-will-stick-with-bitcoin-core-1453395328

The article has been updated.

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January 22, 2016, 10:25:13 PM
 #58

For the noobs asking if this is a bad or good thing; this is the short of it.

Blockchain technology will not and can not work without something like Bitcoin at its core to insure its security; the big legacy banks were told this but they refused to admit it (at lest not publicly).

so...

The Banks were like "we don't need you, will build our own network" and went and highered armies of tech savvy engineers to build the impossible.  They failed...

and now after many months of secret back door meetings they are back poking around our community and spreading wads of money to anyone willing to turn to the dark side.

Bitcoin developers, luminaries and figure heads are being lobbied by people with very deep pockets; this is the 3rd and 4th failed attempt to hardfork the Bitcoin network into something they see as more accommodating to their needs. This lobbying will not stop, I have a feeling more Bitcoin icons will in the coming months and years turn like so many others have and begin praising the attributes, the benefits of larger blocks.  

Bitcoin was never meant to be free, Freedom is not free and nether is Bitcoin. No decentralized ledger can be secured for free. The Bitcoin network subsidies (block rewards) are running out and we need to begin the hard process of paying for our network. If Bitcoin can not survive on a fee based system then it will fail.

(I am a 1MB block supporter who thinks all users should be using Full-Node clients)
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January 22, 2016, 11:51:10 PM
 #59

For the noobs asking if this is a bad or good thing; this is the short of it.

Blockchain technology will not and can not work without something like Bitcoin at its core to insure its security; the big legacy banks were told this but they refused to admit it (at lest not publicly).

so...

The Banks were like "we don't need you, will build our own network" and went and highered armies of tech savvy engineers to build the impossible.  They failed...

and now after many months of secret back door meetings they are back poking around our community and spreading wads of money to anyone willing to turn to the dark side.

Bitcoin developers, luminaries and figure heads are being lobbied by people with very deep pockets; this is the 3rd and 4th failed attempt to hardfork the Bitcoin network into something they see as more accommodating to their needs.

Can I get paid for this?

Link please.

I wanna buy a boat!


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January 23, 2016, 01:50:29 AM
 #60

this was and one of the reasons that Hearn attack chinese miners. The other reason is that he is a racist.

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