An excessive fee is an our future?

[Baudbonny]

Hello, I have some fears about fufure of BTC (sorry if the same thread already exist, I haven't found it).

In future block reward will be equal to zero and it makes uspet the miners who are earning a living by minning. In an effort to continue earnings they will be increace fees of accepted transactions to block and we will have two choices: pay harder fee or wait to confirmation forever. Bitcoin is a dicentralized system but not fully because of minnig pools. Head of pools can decide for accepting the only transactions wiht big amount of fee easily.

For example (just random block):
Block: https://blockchain.info/block/000000000000000004019d60da68382b2bae8526dc57aa083073f1fd1f30e8ac
Reward: 25 BTC
Fees: 0.20759672 BTC

So minners should increase fees more then 100 times to save current earning level.

What do you think about it?

[1714712575]

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[pedrog]

Bigger fees is not the only possibility, the most probable one is the increase in transactions, we can have even smaller fees and the block reward can be higher if transactions on the network increase a lot, also bitcoin value has to be taken into consideration because now the reward is much greater, in dollars, than when it was 50 bitcoins per block.

[Holdaaja]

If bitcoin price is very high in future, there won't be any problem for miners because they still earn same amount of money (in fiat).
Also, ASIC or mining device will be more efficient than now in future & electricity price could be lower if scientist can find better way to produce electricity for lower price.

So, i think there won't be any problem if those condition are fulfilled.

But if 0.0001 would 5$ people wouldn't want to pay that much anymore...
So it would go down and miner wouldn't earn more in fiat.

[Akupuniard]

Unfortunately, you're not the only one who is thinking about that. Recently I've made some transactions - and fees like 500.000 satoshi when you're trying to pay only a few dollars are upsetting me as well. This is not not normal for a payment system to behave so. At least - not for Bitcoin payment system. This is just expensive, nothing personal. If it goes like that - Bitcoin will not be a currency for everyday use, because people do not spend enormous amount of money on everyday life.

[Kprawn]

We are bargaining on adoption growing and transactions increasing to such a level that it would cover the current miners reward. In all probability and

at the rate it is growing, we would surpass the reward currently generated from the protocol. You also have to consider the fact that big companies are

investing millions into projects backed by Bitcoin. These companies will not gamble on their own future, and will jump in and cover the needs, if miners

jump ship, due to low rewards. The more people leaving, will create opportunities for other to join.... Or so we hope.  

[Baudbonny]

If bitcoin price is very high in future, there won't be any problem for miners because they still earn same amount of money (in fiat).
Also, ASIC or mining device will be more efficient than now in future & electricity price could be lower if scientist can find better way to produce electricity for lower price.

So, i think there won't be any problem if those condition are fulfilled.

Do you mean the fees amount in BTC will not change? But if some guy bought 0.01BTC for 100$ ("bitcoin price is very high in future") and he have to pay 0.0001BTC (one $) per each transaction? What if he wants to buy some good that costs 1-2$? 50% fee it is very bad. If the whole world will use Bitcoin miners will do all that I wrote.

[Jet Cash]

Maybe we could use a sidechain to batch transactions. The fee for a block transfer would be an incentive to the miner. It would give users a choice between slower confirmations ( maybe as much as 48 hours), or paying higher fees. This still compares favourably with PayPal's 6 month wait for a confirmation.

[Akupuniard]

We are bargaining on adoption growing and transactions increasing to such a level that it would cover the current miners reward. In all probability and

at the rate it is growing, we would surpass the reward currently generated from the protocol. You also have to consider the fact that big companies are

investing millions into projects backed by Bitcoin. These companies will not gamble on their own future, and will jump in and cover the needs, if miners

jump ship, due to low rewards. The more people leaving, will create opportunities for other to join.... Or so we hope.  

What's the benefit of joining then? How is Bitcoin better than fiat currency, which does not charge me any % when using in a shop for buying food?

[Baudbonny]

Also if ASIC or mining device will be more efficient than now in future then all miners will buy it and situation will not change! Tha same hashrate distribution between pools and only ASIC manufacturers have big earnings.

[SayMeHello]

Maybe we could use a sidechain to batch transactions. The fee for a block transfer would be an incentive to the miner. It would give users a choice between slower confirmations ( maybe as much as 48 hours), or paying higher fees. This still compares favourably with PayPal's 6 month wait for a confirmation.

Sorry but this is not very good future. Comparsion with PayPal is wrong because PayPal is lame.

[Pursuer]

you are not alone in thinking this way.
in the past fees have been configured according to the price and other factors at least a couple of times, and in the future for sure fee amounts are not going to stay this way after a couple of block reward halvings.

but there is this popular belief that bitcoin price is going to be higher than this so the block reward alone is going to be worth the same as now (for example 12.5BTC in future is going to worth the same in fiat as 25BTC now) so the problem will not exist.

[Baudbonny]

If bitcoin price is very high in future, there won't be any problem for miners because they still earn same amount of money (in fiat).
Also, ASIC or mining device will be more efficient than now in future & electricity price could be lower if scientist can find better way to produce electricity for lower price.

So, i think there won't be any problem if those condition are fulfilled.

Do you mean the fees amount in BTC will not change? But if some guy bought 0.01BTC for 100$ ("bitcoin price is very high in future") and he have to pay 0.0001BTC (one $) per each transaction? What if he wants to buy some good that costs 1-2$? 50% fee it is very bad. If the whole world will use Bitcoin miners will do all that I wrote.

I mean if bitcoin price is very high, miners can earn bitcoin which worth a lot in fiat so they don't have to increase bitcoin fee, in fact they can reduce bitcoin fee drastically.
I just forget to write that in previous post, that's all.

I undersood you, don't worry Yes, miners can reduce fee, but even reduced fee will worth a lot in fiat so it will be disadvantageously to buy cheap goods.

[Akupuniard]

This is kinda...not inspiring. As far as I can understand, this is coming along with the problem described by Hirsch. I mean, limit of transactions per second we're encountering right now.

[Baudbonny]

This is kinda...not inspiring. As far as I can understand, this is coming along with the problem described by Hirsch. I mean, limit of transactions per second we're encountering right now.

Can you link to the description you wrote about?

[JosNekoKopa]

you are not alone in thinking this way.
in the past fees have been configured according to the price and other factors at least a couple of times, and in the future for sure fee amounts are not going to stay this way after a couple of block reward halvings.

but there is this popular belief that bitcoin price is going to be higher than this so the block reward alone is going to be worth the same as now (for example 12.5BTC in future is going to worth the same in fiat as 25BTC now) so the problem will not exist.

What will happen if bitcoin dot go double in value?
Fee eventually must go up.. and in some future fee will be crazy high?
why fee must be defined?
Let merchants to choose how much they will give for a fee, and how fast they need transaction..

[kizilsakal]

Well, even with significantly bigger fees, it will still be waaay bellow traditional transaction methods (such as credit cards). I don't see reasons to be concerned about that (specially if the block increase happens).

[HeroCat]

Yes, this is true. Transfer fees can be much higher in the future and BTC transaction times too  Even nowadays BTC transfer time can be several hours. 

[Akupuniard]

This is kinda...not inspiring. As far as I can understand, this is coming along with the problem described by Hirsch. I mean, limit of transactions per second we're encountering right now.

Can you link to the description you wrote about?

Yes, easily. https://medium.com/@octskyward/the-resolution-of-the-bitcoin-experiment-dabb30201f7#.fd2zpqghz
Actually, this post was the reason why Bitcoin price dropped down from 450 to 370 in January.

[madonnino]

Yes, this is true. Transfer fees can be much higher in the future and BTC transaction times too  Even nowadays BTC transfer time can be several hours. 

also if fees goes on 20x actual rate, bitcoin will be the same chepaer than other methods

[SayMeHello]

Yes, this is true. Transfer fees can be much higher in the future and BTC transaction times too   Even nowadays BTC transfer time can be several hours.  

also if fees goes on 20x actual rate, bitcoin will be the same chepaer than other methods

20*0.0001BTC=0.002BTC how will we buy goods that cost 5-10$. 8-16% fee? If BTC will be more than 1000$/BTC situation going to worse. Not cheaper in this case.

[sakinaka]

Don't worry, that's not a problem, because Bitcoin's fiat price, by increasing will make their earnings basically still as good as they used to be.

[Amph]

this is the reason why the halving is there, to force a value increase in view of the fee that will be the only revenue for miners in the future

you don't need to have the reward from the block to zero to have the fee becoming more important to miners, already from 2028 the fee will need to be higher or the value need to be higher to accomodate for the loss of the reward from the block

[Akupuniard]

this is the reason why the halving is there, to force a value increase in view of the fee that will be the only revenue for miners in the future

you don't need to have the reward from the block to zero to have the fee becoming more important to miners, already from 2028 the fee will need to be higher or the value need to be higher to accomodate for the loss of the reward from the block

Please explain me, because I am starting to think that I am really stupid: HOW DO FEES CORRELATE WITH MINING? Mining is the process of mining new coins. Blocks are generated etc. What exactly does the fee share with the process of mining? Who gets these fees?

[SFR10]

I wouldn't mind rewarding miners more for confirming the transactions in which if you compare what were paying, even if you double/triple or even more, it's still way lesser than what other traditional or other payments require as a fee so I really don't see this as a problem to worry about (at all).

[ATguy]

this is the reason why the halving is there, to force a value increase in view of the fee that will be the only revenue for miners in the future

you don't need to have the reward from the block to zero to have the fee becoming more important to miners, already from 2028 the fee will need to be higher or the value need to be higher to accomodate for the loss of the reward from the block

Please explain me, because I am starting to think that I am really stupid: HOW DO FEES CORRELATE WITH MINING? Mining is the process of mining new coins. Blocks are generated etc. What exactly does the fee share with the process of mining? Who gets these fees?

Miners getting the fees as well. Miners can choose which transactions to include in the blocks, if they dont like the size of your transaction fee, they simply dont add your transaction to the block. The only problem is the current 1 MB limit per block is already used up in peak hours thats why people have unnecessary wait more than they could with bit bigger MB limit per block.

[Akupuniard]

I wouldn't mind rewarding miners more for confirming the transactions in which if you compare what were paying, even if you double/triple or even more, it's still way lesser than what other traditional or other payments require as a fee so I really don't see this as a problem to worry about (at all).

Of course you would not mind. Unfortunately, this is only applicable to large amounts. Paying 2 dollars fee when making a purchase of 400 dollars is acceptable. Paying the same 2 dollar fee when buying a coffee or meals is outrageous. You don't see the problem because you're not using BTC for small things. It was intended to be of value for that. By the way, when I am using a plastic card in a supermarket, I am not being charged anything. Do you see what I mean?

[Bitcotalk]

But the future like that is far away, it is true after establishment and when bitcoin take over all the virtual payment system then the fee will come to increase. But it is far away, as currently 10 to 20 years are the years of its adoption. It will take a large period to increase the fee

[blackraven1425]

I don't mind paying higher fees at all! Comparing this to the fess I pay to banks, paypay, of similar services, it's still very cheap even if the fee increases.

[Akupuniard]

I don't mind paying higher fees at all! Comparing this to the fess I pay to banks, paypay, of similar services, it's still very cheap even if the fee increases.

LOL. It's like you do not mind paying 2 dollars fee when the price itself is 2 dollars?

[russian_pete]

I think this is overthinking about a problem that is already in it's way to be solved. Block size increase will make this concerns disappear.

[Preclus]

also if fees goes on 20x actual rate, bitcoin will be the same chepaer than other methods

The cost for me to transfer a $20 bill to someone to buy a cup of coffee is zero. The transaction time is 0ms. There are zero confirmations needed.

The cost for me to transfer $20 to someone in the form of a check is zero. The transaction time is 0ms. The money does not show up immediately, however, and there is counterparty risk if I don't have the money in my account.

The to transfer $20 to someone in the form of a credit card payment is $0 to the buyer. In fact, the buyer can get cash back on their purchases. Credit card costs are incurred by the seller. Small businesses bitch about their merchant fee they pay. Larger merchants pay almost no merchant fee. The fees are negotiated and the customer generally doesn't see them. The advantage to the merchant is that the customer doesn't need to have the money to buy their goods or services because with a credit card, the money is borrowed money. A person can buy a $500 pair of shoes when they have $50 in their bank account and pay back over time. That means the merchant will have more buyers for their products than otherwise. The transaction time is a second or two however, it takes time to clear to the merchants account.

The cost of ACH transfer (eCheck) from bank accounts is generally zero.

The cost for me to transfer $1MM to someone via wire transfer is zero for me. I get free wire transfers because I maintain a high balance. For normal accounts, the cost is $30 or so. Wire transfers are generally irreversible but there is a legal trail so the receiving party can't say "we didn't get your money". They are not immediate, they take a day or so. But they are generally only used for large transaction amounts.

[NorrisK]

Unfortunately, you're not the only one who is thinking about that. Recently I've made some transactions - and fees like 500.000 satoshi when you're trying to pay only a few dollars are upsetting me as well. This is not not normal for a payment system to behave so. At least - not for Bitcoin payment system. This is just expensive, nothing personal. If it goes like that - Bitcoin will not be a currency for everyday use, because people do not spend enormous amount of money on everyday life.

I don't know how you manage to get such high fees for your transactions.. Normally 10.000 should be more than enough, and you can probably get away with less if the size in bytes of your transaction is not too big.

Did you by chance collect a lot of small earnings such as from faucets? A large number of smaller transactions can greatly increase the size of your transaction thus warranting a higher fee.

[Akupuniard]

Unfortunately, you're not the only one who is thinking about that. Recently I've made some transactions - and fees like 500.000 satoshi when you're trying to pay only a few dollars are upsetting me as well. This is not not normal for a payment system to behave so. At least - not for Bitcoin payment system. This is just expensive, nothing personal. If it goes like that - Bitcoin will not be a currency for everyday use, because people do not spend enormous amount of money on everyday life.

I don't know how you manage to get such high fees for your transactions.. Normally 10.000 should be more than enough, and you can probably get away with less if the size in bytes of your transaction is not too big.

Did you by chance collect a lot of small earnings such as from faucets? A large number of smaller transactions can greatly increase the size of your transaction thus warranting a higher fee.

Better to show once than 100 times to tell. Wait a bit plz, syncing the wallet.

[franky1]

bitcoin block rewards will be enough for atleast 20 years. by that time capacity (transactions per block) would have increased, to allow alot more.

for instance.. todays bitcoin price is $400, meaning miners get $10,000 from block reward.
 imagine in 2028 the block reward is 1.5625 and the price of 1 bitcoin was about $6400 (very possible price in 22 years) to ensure miners still get $10,000 per block.

again even then fee's are not an important income stream.. but lets pretend its a bonus

lets say with all the features of LN, segwit, and real blocklimit increases.. that the average block goes from 2500 transactions at 0.0001 (0.25btc fee total)
to 100,000 transactions (equivelent to a 40mb+segwit(again possible in 20 years) and because of bitcoin price deflation.. the fee was 0.00001 instead of 0.0001.. then each person is still paying at most 6cents a tx and miners are getting 1btc per block

remember miners are still getting 1.5btc from block reward and the transaction fee total of 1btc is a bonus. giving them a total of $16,400 income per block.

even if there were zero fee's miners would still get $10,000

so relax there is no mad rush to start making users pay over 10cents a transaction.

[bitlost]

I don't think so, no. There will be a solution to the increase in the fees, or the use of bitcoin will decrease (and hence the fees). It's self regulated, after all.

[virtualdn]

Everything will be solved in time, I trust that the developers will come with great solutions.

[dothebeats]

When all the bitcoins in existence is mined then yes, I can see higher fees in the future being the primary incentive for miners to continue on doing their work. They will rely on fees to further their operation and help secure the network, and that will only be possible if fees are somewhat raised and the price is also high.

[maokoto]

I think that if fees are too high, people will cease to use bitcoin and miners will cease to get fees so none wins. Probably they will adjust to a point of compromise.

[ctlaltdefeat]

Hello, I have some fears about fufure of BTC (sorry if the same thread already exist, I haven't found it).

In future block reward will be equal to zero and it makes uspet the miners who are earning a living by minning. In an effort to continue earnings they will be increace fees of accepted transactions to block and we will have two choices: pay harder fee or wait to confirmation forever. Bitcoin is a dicentralized system but not fully because of minnig pools. Head of pools can decide for accepting the only transactions wiht big amount of fee easily.

For example (just random block):
Block: https://blockchain.info/block/000000000000000004019d60da68382b2bae8526dc57aa083073f1fd1f30e8ac
Reward: 25 BTC
Fees: 0.20759672 BTC

So minners should increase fees more then 100 times to save current earning level.

What do you think about it?

i dont know if fee of transaction can be bigger if the trnsaction so big like that,i never sent as much like that,but i hope sometim i will feel that transaction

[disclaimer201]

Well well, Bitcoin Classic with 2MB blocks has been released and is available for download. I'm willing to give it a try. Even if we will some day need side chains or LN or whatnot, for now a quick doubling of blocks will allow for some scalability right away and will hopefully be backed by a majority and who knows... boost the price.

[Patatas]

I believe in near future there would be no independent miners as mining will be completely over taken by mine farmers (Sorry if this is way off assumption but that's just my idea).Eventually,the block rewards will be next to NULL,no miners will be generating profits (even now starting mining is not a good idea),so majority of the mining jobs will be take over by farmers which will have custom or fixed prices depending on transactions per block.

[countryfree]

What is an excessive fee?
0.002 BTC?
To send a large sum across the planet in less than one hour, I would say it's a good deal for the service.

I'm not worrying at all about this. I'd gladly pay fees a bit higher, and I would happily accept a minimum of 0.01 BTC to make a transaction. This to make BTC more scalable.

Besides regarding fees, I know they are not the main source of income for miners.

[johnyj]

People usually don't care about a fee that equal to a small unit in fiat money, so $0.1 would be acceptable for all the people, and $1 would be acceptable for majority of the people

[bitgolden]

Yes, this is true. Transfer fees can be much higher in the future and BTC transaction times too  Even nowadays BTC transfer time can be several hours. 

But I think it is not true, it will not happen ever in the future. Bitcoin will try to adjust according to the needs and demands of the people, plus it will try its best to compete other available currencies.

[Amph]

People usually don't care about a fee that equal to a small unit in fiat money, so $0.1 would be acceptable for all the people, and $1 would be acceptable for majority of the people

that true, since those same people are using stuff like paypal that charge a fee which is higher in most case and has a minimum of $1

but on the other hands bitcoin was designed in theory to be with low fee, so having the same fee as paypal in the future is not encouraging

[aarons6]

bitcoin block rewards will be enough for atleast 20 years. by that time capacity (transactions per block) would have increased, to allow alot more.

for instance.. todays bitcoin price is $400, meaning miners get $10,000 from block reward.
 imagine in 2028 the block reward is 1.5625 and the price of 1 bitcoin was about $6400 (very possible price in 22 years) to ensure miners still get $10,000 per block.

again even then fee's are not an important income stream.. but lets pretend its a bonus

lets say with all the features of LN, segwit, and real blocklimit increases.. that the average block goes from 2500 transactions at 0.0001 (0.25btc fee total)
to 100,000 transactions (equivelent to a 40mb+segwit(again possible in 20 years) and because of bitcoin price deflation.. the fee was 0.00001 instead of 0.0001.. then each person is still paying at most 6cents a tx and miners are getting 1btc per block

remember miners are still getting 1.5btc from block reward and the transaction fee total of 1btc is a bonus. giving them a total of $16,400 income per block.

even if there were zero fee's miners would still get $10,000

so relax there is no mad rush to start making users pay over 10cents a transaction.

this will never happen.. there is no reason to believe the price of bitcoin will stay proportional to the block reward.
its not how it works.. miners dont just set the price of bitcoin.

[Baudbonny]

I think that if fees are too high, people will cease to use bitcoin and miners will cease to get fees so none wins. Probably they will adjust to a point of compromise.

People will cease to use bitcoin and miners will increace fees to save earnings. It will cause that people will cease to use bitcoin... Bitcoin going to be forgotten (unstable system).

I hope we have another way: People will cease to use bitcoin and miners will increace fees to save earnings. It will cause that people will cease to use bitcoin... Many miners stop mining --> Difficulty decreace ---> Not so many miners go back... Bitcoin not going to be forgotten (stable system).

[Akupuniard]

Unfortunately, you're not the only one who is thinking about that. Recently I've made some transactions - and fees like 500.000 satoshi when you're trying to pay only a few dollars are upsetting me as well. This is not not normal for a payment system to behave so. At least - not for Bitcoin payment system. This is just expensive, nothing personal. If it goes like that - Bitcoin will not be a currency for everyday use, because people do not spend enormous amount of money on everyday life.

I don't know how you manage to get such high fees for your transactions.. Normally 10.000 should be more than enough, and you can probably get away with less if the size in bytes of your transaction is not too big.

Did you by chance collect a lot of small earnings such as from faucets? A large number of smaller transactions can greatly increase the size of your transaction thus warranting a higher fee.

Bro, I am still here. My wallet has totally crashed, reassembling it from yesterday. Damn 70 GB of blocks are very slow. I will show you the fees as soon as I am done with syncing.

[BTCLovingDude]

What is an excessive fee?
0.002 BTC?
To send a large sum across the planet in less than one hour, I would say it's a good deal for the service.

I'm not worrying at all about this. I'd gladly pay fees a bit higher, and I would happily accept a minimum of 0.01 BTC to make a transaction. This to make BTC more scalable.

Besides regarding fees, I know they are not the main source of income for miners.

i agree, fees are so low right now that increasing it would not harm the usage by people.

also it depends on the price of bitcoin, the higher the price the lower fees can stay.

and also if the blocks are bigger, they can contain more transaction with more fees total.

[gregyoung14]

What is an excessive fee?
0.002 BTC?
To send a large sum across the planet in less than one hour, I would say it's a good deal for the service.

I'm not worrying at all about this. I'd gladly pay fees a bit higher, and I would happily accept a minimum of 0.01 BTC to make a transaction. This to make BTC more scalable.

Besides regarding fees, I know they are not the main source of income for miners.

i agree, fees are so low right now that increasing it would not harm the usage by people.

also it depends on the price of bitcoin, the higher the price the lower fees can stay.

and also if the blocks are bigger, they can contain more transaction with more fees total.

People usually don't care about a fee that equal to a small unit in fiat money, so $0.1 would be acceptable for all the people, and $1 would be acceptable for majority of the people

Yep. I think I'm going to go with this $1. That's the safest way to go.

that true, since those same people are using stuff like paypal that charge a fee which is higher in most case and has a minimum of $1

but on the other hands bitcoin was designed in theory to be with low fee, so having the same fee as paypal in the future is not encouraging

[gkv9]

People usually don't care about a fee that equal to a small unit in fiat money, so $0.1 would be acceptable for all the people, and $1 would be acceptable for majority of the people

But what will happen if the price reaches to such speculative levels like $10k or something???
Will miners allow the community to lower the network fee's value in BTC???

[blackraven1425]

There's no such thing as an excessive fee! bitcoin market is self regulated and if fees get woo high, people use it less, and then fees decrese, and so on...

[Gloober]

At some point mining bitcoin will eventually stop. The way miners can still make profit is to keep a certain precentage every time they mine stuff.

[franky1]

this will never happen.. there is no reason to believe the price of bitcoin will stay proportional to the block reward.
its not how it works.. miners dont just set the price of bitcoin.

many people think that $1k is possibly in a year. $2k in 2 years. $4k in 3 years time.. $8k in 4 years time (EG 2000% in 4 years. just like the $20 high average($6-$32) of 2011-2012 became $400 in 4 years)

so i did not state aspeculative rise that could be alot higher(spitballing a speculative price of $100k) in 20 years.. i stayed at a modest and lowball figure of $6400 in 20 years

$6400 is very achievable in 20 years.. no two.. but .. 20

[romero121]

One of the reason for the success of bitcoin is it reduced transaction fee as well as time. If that gets increased by 10 times the value of today, People feel bitcoin to be a failed tech. So at any instance it won't happen as days pass the value will grow which will profit miners. So No need of thinking about increased transaction charges in future.

[lixer]

I wouldn't mind rewarding miners more for confirming the transactions in which if you compare what were paying, even if you double/triple or even more, it's still way lesser than what other traditional or other payments require as a fee so I really don't see this as a problem to worry about (at all).

But the price should not have to be increased to such a value that people start to leave from bitcoin. It will give to people a fear and adoptable fee structure so that no one will be disappointed.

[pinkslink]

But if 0.0001 would 5$ people wouldn't want to pay that much anymore...
So it would go down and miner wouldn't earn more in fiat.

when 0.0001 BTC = $5
(1BTC = $50,000)

miners have already made enough profit and could reduce fees

you may find in future, big miners will just let things roll as there are as long as they tick over
they should really have a longterm plan

[pinkslink]

But the price should not have to be increased to such a value that people start to leave from bitcoin. It will give to people a fear and adoptable fee structure so that no one will be disappointed.

banks constantly increase fees, does not seem to stop them being used.


i live outside my home country,
but most my money goes in my home bank accounts
to use an ATM abroad for $450 maximum withdraw
one bank charges me 2.5% = $11.25
i then also must pay a $5 Atm fee for using a foreign card
i also lose about 0.5% on poor exchange rate = $2.25

so for $450 i must pay $18.50 giving me $431.50
total of 4.1%

if i just used the card to spend, i would still be charged 2.5%
plus $2 each time i used the card

and this is NOT a credit card, but a normal bank debit card.

there are also many other very common methods of transfer that many people use that cost more,
western union is a prime example, ok there are some that may not cost as much but they ALWAYS cost

so until BTC costs more than 2-4% of a $200+ transaction then its not an issue

[barbara44]

I don't think so, no. There will be a solution to the increase in the fees, or the use of bitcoin will decrease (and hence the fees). It's self regulated, after all.

Yes, you are right, it will decrease the users of bitcoin if the fee price is increase much above. There should be a limit to the fee, so that people love to adopt bitcoin because of its low fee of transactions.

[pogress]

One of the reason for the success of bitcoin is it reduced transaction fee as well as time. If that gets increased by 10 times the value of today, People feel bitcoin to be a failed tech. So at any instance it won't happen as days pass the value will grow which will profit miners. So No need of thinking about increased transaction charges in future.

I think the "free or very low fee Bitcoin transactions" slogan which is often used about Bitcoin description in mouth to mouth conversations is very usefull for Bitcoin. It is form of free advertisement for Bitcoin. But with fee market with constantly filled blocks and planned removal of free transactions since Bitcoin Core 0.12, we may limit Bitcoin adoption unnecessary too much in my opinion.