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Author Topic: Which altcoins are most attractive to people not in crypto before?  (Read 1397 times)
spassbold (OP)
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March 20, 2016, 12:30:36 AM
 #1

I think it is Gridcoin, the idea of mining by doing research is easy to understand and it is at once obvious why it makes sense.

See for example this thread on reddit right now: https://www.reddit.com/r/Futurology/comments/4b4drk/a_currency_minted_by_doing_science/
traderman
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March 20, 2016, 01:06:45 AM
 #2

Damn, almost 1000 upvotes! That was one kick-ass post Spassbold!
spassbold (OP)
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March 20, 2016, 01:34:57 AM
 #3

Already much more upvotes Smiley

 The good thing is that the idea behind Gridcoin is actually that good and that easy to understand, that you do not really have to sell it, just explain the idea behind it.
TPTB_need_war
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March 20, 2016, 01:40:48 AM
 #4

But it relies on centralization of the proof of BOINC and proof-of-stake, which thus guarantees it won't scale to anything significant, as vested interests will strangle it.

...

Btw, proof-of-stake will never scale out user adoption, because it is a vested interest paradigm, and thus will be destroyed by its stake holders. No stake holder (in any context or business model) allows a competitor to profit. Only permissionless, decentralized systems scale.

It will perhaps be good for a P&D, because so many fools believe technological nonsense because they don't understand.


spassbold (OP)
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March 20, 2016, 01:45:55 AM
 #5

I do not see a problem with proof-of-stake really, could you explain further?

I also do not believe that it will be P&D, the good thing is that the miners do it mostly because of science anyway and have no background in the traditional crypto pump&dump.
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March 20, 2016, 02:07:06 AM
 #6

I do not see a problem with proof-of-stake really, could you explain further?

...

...rely on the centralization of proof-of-stake which destroys the Nash equilibrium security in a power vacuum winner-take-all political economics...

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March 20, 2016, 03:57:37 AM
 #7

Grid coin just copied cure coin really. Cure coin was okay but they were just very slow to improve upon the way it worked. However lately it has started developing again.

Any alt coin that becomes very profitable in a BIG way will attract people not in crypto. If people hear they can make $ they will be attracted.

Some just love the idea like you say.


kiklo
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March 20, 2016, 03:59:07 AM
Last edit: March 20, 2016, 04:42:28 AM by kiklo
 #8

But it relies on centralization of the proof of BOINC and proof-of-stake, which thus guarantees it won't scale to anything significant, as vested interests will strangle it.

...

Btw, proof-of-stake will never scale out user adoption, because it is a vested interest paradigm, and thus will be destroyed by its stake holders. No stake holder (in any context or business model) allows a competitor to profit. Only permissionless, decentralized systems scale.

It will perhaps be good for a P&D, because so many fools believe technological nonsense because they don't understand.



Really, and yet investing money into a PoW coin that relies completing on ASICS that are already centralized and will be even more so at the next halfing is ok?  Huh

Quote
fools believe technological nonsense
By this conclusion, 99% should Not be investing in BTC either.   Wink

 Cool


FYI:
Quote
Nash equilibrium security
Game theorists use the Nash equilibrium concept to analyze the outcome of the strategic interaction of several decision makers. In other words, it provides a way of predicting what will happen if several people or several institutions are making decisions at the same time, and if the outcome depends on the decisions of the others. The simple insight underlying John Nash's idea is that one cannot predict the result of the choices of multiple decision makers if one analyzes those decisions in isolation. Instead, one must ask what each player would do, taking into account the decision-making of the others.

IMO, Nash equilibrium theory is not that accurate .

I would say the larger the group of people or institutions , the easier it is to predict the outcome.
Kind of what the whole field of Sociology is about.
Sociology is the study of social behavior or society, including its origins, development, organization, networks, and institutions. It is a social science that uses various methods of empirical investigation and critical analysis to develop a body of knowledge about social order, disorder, and change.
Knowing that the majority always choose what is in their individual best interests , would help accurately predict the outcome.

(Individuals are always the wild card and unpredictable , because of their individual & background motivations, so they may not always choose what would be in their best interest.)  

Isaac Asimov Foundation series basically showed how a whole Universe could be controlled using Sociology.

Plus I will tell you Nash's Original Idea , is not Original , it is very Old,
because it is really nothing more than Simple Collusion.
traderman
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March 20, 2016, 04:02:41 AM
 #9

Gridcoin launched before curecoin!

Grid coin just copied cure coin really. Cure coin was okay but they were just very slow to improve upon the way it worked. However lately it has started developing again.

Any alt coin that becomes very profitable in a BIG way will attract people not in crypto. If people hear they can make $ they will be attracted.

Some just love the idea like you say.


kiklo
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March 20, 2016, 04:09:04 AM
Last edit: March 20, 2016, 04:19:24 AM by kiklo
 #10

People who are new to Crypto would be better served with Proof of Stake to make profit.

One reason, you can hold the Proof of Stake coins in a local wallet and gain interest, althrough I perfer to call it a Harvest instead of interest.
even if the price of the coin stays exactly the same, you can cash out with more than you started and make a profit.

PoW coins, price stays the same and you gained nothing.
Price has to rise, which why should it except on speculation, as a function of ASICS is to always create more, which will always decrease the price per coin.
Simple Supply & Demand economics.  Smiley

Where as Proof of Stake coins have intrinsic Value and are their own mining equipment.

 Cool
traderman
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March 20, 2016, 04:17:19 AM
 #11

Wow, up to 2200 upvotes, that subreddit has like 5 mil subscribers.
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March 20, 2016, 04:26:20 AM
 #12

Gridcoin launched before curecoin!

Grid coin just copied cure coin really. Cure coin was okay but they were just very slow to improve upon the way it worked. However lately it has started developing again.

Any alt coin that becomes very profitable in a BIG way will attract people not in crypto. If people hear they can make $ they will be attracted.

Some just love the idea like you say.



Is this true ??

I'm certain curecoin came first?

Let me check it out.

I heard about curecoin first maybe they announced first but took time to get it off the ground.

Interesting though since I though cure coin came way before.

Both are good.

spassbold (OP)
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March 20, 2016, 06:34:02 AM
 #13

Almost 3k upvotes and still going strong, many new users in irc and on the forum :0
Scalextrix
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March 20, 2016, 09:10:55 AM
 #14

I do not see a problem with proof-of-stake really, could you explain further?

...

...rely on the centralization of proof-of-stake which destroys the Nash equilibrium security in a power vacuum winner-take-all political economics...
Yeah but Gridcoin isnt Proof of Stake, its Proof of Research.  The PoS is combined with the BOINC work which changes the way it works, staking a block isnt purely based on the coin age.

I get much more reward from my BOINC contribution in each block than from the PoS interest, so there is no barrier to me overtaking a larger coin holder if I exceed their BOINC contribution.  The last block I got 3-1 BOINC versus PoS.

SolarCoin Address: 8cESoZyjFvx2Deq6VjQLqPfAwu8UXjcBkK    Gridcoin Address: SAuPu8zarzQykWLGwxc6JRvW3imM8YU9wc
Pinkcoin Address: 2GTnp7oRn2i6KnuwfGaFh1Ps7RZFyDe6nH    MannaCurrency Address: GXDwi6W888jbQZ7a79GTaStxiQsYehisfi
Grctest
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March 20, 2016, 11:45:42 AM
 #15

But it relies on centralization of the proof of BOINC and proof-of-stake, which thus guarantees it won't scale to anything significant, as vested interests will strangle it.

...

Btw, proof-of-stake will never scale out user adoption, because it is a vested interest paradigm, and thus will be destroyed by its stake holders. No stake holder (in any context or business model) allows a competitor to profit. Only permissionless, decentralized systems scale.

It will perhaps be good for a P&D, because so many fools believe technological nonsense because they don't understand.
Proof of BOINC is not centralized. Gridcoin used to use netsoft for credit checking, now every node participates in securing the neural network with verified BOINC statistics gathered directly from the BOINC project sites - so there is no centralization in the POB system.

DPOR generates 50k GRC per day, which is far more than interest rewarded for POS, so really it's perfect to scale out user adoption since there is no market cap. If investors hold and never crunch, they'll experience deflation of their holdings (almost demurrage).

Gridcoin is a permissionless & decentralized system.

Quote
POS centralizes control according to stake, which is a finite resource
Gridcoin is not a finite resource - there is no cap on coin supply, and DPOR rewards more than POS. Better to have BOINC users in control rather than having pool owners or ASIC manufacturers in control of the network (POW is extremely centralized & wasteful).
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March 20, 2016, 11:55:06 AM
 #16

Gridcoin launched before curecoin!

Grid coin just copied cure coin really. Cure coin was okay but they were just very slow to improve upon the way it worked. However lately it has started developing again.

Any alt coin that becomes very profitable in a BIG way will attract people not in crypto. If people hear they can make $ they will be attracted.

Some just love the idea like you say.



Is this true ??

I'm certain curecoin came first?

Let me check it out.

I heard about curecoin first maybe they announced first but took time to get it off the ground.

Interesting though since I though cure coin came way before.

Both are good.
Doesn't curecoin use SHA256? That's massively wasteful compared to Proof of Stake. It'd be cool if folding@home was ported to BOINC, then we could reward folding@home computation - not out of the realm of possibilities.
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March 20, 2016, 01:09:01 PM
 #17

Doesn't curecoin use SHA256? That's massively wasteful compared to Proof of Stake. It'd be cool if folding@home was ported to BOINC, then we could reward folding@home computation - not out of the realm of possibilities.

GRC had these evolution steps which CURE still would have to undergo. Remembering the old GRC "classic" and it's immense stock of old coins which basically declassified GRC as beeing POW stock up for sale.

The massively wasteful part that will always remain is double BOINC research for recalculating any experiments by some second researcher, comparing results for validity. Each task has to be done twice at least, and more times if these numbers tend to differ way to much.
Some BOINC tasks are providing sensor data like weather related stuff, so "mining GRC on a remote-distant-reading thermometer" is fact and quite extraordinary in comparison to any other coin in existance.

I'm willing to give it a second go again, been abandoning GRC when it has been above 0.00002000 BTC end of 2015. For some time things have been looking to much GPU mining centric which ain't be my cup of tea. More looking for CPU background tasks, idle cycles beeing reused for a purpose.

Science is indeed good advertising! Crypto somewhat missed the advertisement opportunity of combining the DOGE phenomenon with BOINC research, things would have been gone trought the roof straigtways.
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March 20, 2016, 01:25:43 PM
 #18

i think none of them
because people not in crypto ever before will most probably never hear about any of the altcoins. and if they want to choose they are going to choose the biggest, and oldest technology not just anything with small market that was created new.

Holding Bitcoin More Every Day
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March 20, 2016, 02:46:07 PM
 #19

May be Doge, because many sites are using it and Doge have fast transaction times too - only some minutes.  Wink
J1mb0
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March 20, 2016, 02:56:58 PM
 #20

I think it is Gridcoin, the idea of mining by doing research is easy to understand and it is at once obvious why it makes sense.

See for example this thread on reddit right now: https://www.reddit.com/r/Futurology/comments/4b4drk/a_currency_minted_by_doing_science/

PIGGY

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