Is CHINA CONTROLLING Bitcoin?

[SvenBomvolen]

People here have claimed that Bitcoin is in fact controlled and ruled by China, as mining is centralized by Chinese mining institutions.

Do you think that China is controlling/ruling bitcoin yes or no?

i think yes , my opinion average of user bitcoin is chinese so their controller

Lol I want to ask you, if they can control the bitcoin, how they control the bitcoin?
and you know there are other countries that also have very large users, what do you think?

   That is where we should start for, how can anyone control bitcoin? If there is answer on that question then it would be easy to answer on question who control it.
   I didn't find enough reasons in this topic that can convince me that some country like China is controlling bitcoin network.

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[kiklo]

  That is where we should start for, how can anyone control bitcoin? If there is answer on that question then it would be easy to answer on question who control it.
   I didn't find enough reasons in this topic that can convince me that some country like China is controlling bitcoin network.

Hmm, really ?  
It is funny , how people ignore what is basically thrust in their face.
Numerous articles and You tube videos discussing the issue, and you don't know.  
1st way using Technology
http://www.btcpedia.com/bitcoin-51-attack/

 
If a miner gains 51% or more power, he is capable to:
    Reverse transactions that he sends while he’s in control. This has the potential to double-spend transactions that previously had already been seen in the block chain.
    Prevent some or all transactions from gaining any confirmations.
    Prevent some or all other miners from mining any valid blocks.

2nd Way , This example is how it is done Economically using Goldman as an example , and China does it with BTC
http://www.usnews.com/opinion/blogs/economic-intelligence/2013/07/24/how-goldman-sachs-and-wall-street-manipulate-alumnimum-and-other-commodities

Some of the richest opportunities for such manipulation lie in combining control of physical commodities with dominance of commodity derivatives and futures markets. The major banks are, of course, key dealers in these derivatives markets. Control of physical commodities allows them to both forecast and influence the spot commodity prices that can determine derivatives pricing. Indeed, some observers have pointed out that bank involvement in warehousing has allowed them to conceal information from the markets on the true supply of physical commodities, creating market squeezes and artificially fueling investor appetite for commodity futures.

Get some popcorn and Go to http://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/bitcoin/#markets
and watch the Chinese exchanges move the BTC market up or down thru fake trading, which manipulates the price in whichever direction they like.  
(Why is it Fake Trading, because most of the Chinese Exchanges don't charge a trading fee, so it costs them nothing to fake the price.)

 

FYI:
BTC wallets should have inscribed on it,
In China We Trust .
Warning : Value Void if China does not like you.  

[acroman08]

china has less hash power then you think

haobtc.. are in tibet aswell as other locations
BW..  are in mongolia aswell as other locations
BTCC..   are around the world
bitfury.. are in Finland, Iceland, and the Republic of Georgia.

put down your racist hats and put on some research glasses

Doesn't really matter WHERE they are located. So long as it is owned and controlled by Chinese , then China will still have control over it.
Why? Because these owners will likely have interests/properties/businesses IN China. Heck, if it is for the country, and the pressure is high enough, well.

Have you ever been to China?

When I worked as an interpreter with big Chinese companies (thousands of workers, just in case), the groups that we were negotiating with always had some guy sticking around them, who didn't participate in discussions and business negotiations, but nevertheless was always present at these meetings. When we asked in private who was that guy and what he was doing there, we were told that he is "representing the government". Between ourselves we concluded that he was actually an agent of some government security service supervising the company deals and contacts. I guess you strongly underestimate the level of government participation in businesses across China

I agree that all "Big"(big enough) business deals will likely be overseen by "representatives" of the government.

[Liang_Kubur]

I'm come from china, but I'm not sure that China can controlling Bitcoin. When I was in a public area, I never found the discussion about bitcoin. even now I still have not found the Bitcoin ATM, it seems this assumption is wrong.

[carlerha]

More mining power is'nt equal to control bitcoin.. in my humble opinion.. who control code and community and early adopter? I think no one

Yeah agree no one can control bitcoin even they are have lots of bitcoin farm they are just mine on bitcoin not control it but they can control the price just to dump and pump. but i think they don't do that because they are expecting more price increase with bitcoin. and bitcoin is decentralize so that no one can control bitcoin..

No one really controls bitcoin but we do have big allotment and contribution for bitcoins economy. Because us, people who uses bitcoin and consumes it for real are the ones to make the fluctuation of bitcoins price to move. And of course those people who are holding and have mining power are also contributing such as China.

in fact bitcoin is anonymous and no one know about the actual number of bitcoin users and their identity, so if the number of bitcoin users in china are more than the rest of the world, and they all at the same time decide to sell or buy more bitcoins then they can manipulate the price of bitcoin. but i think it is just impossible.

[kiklo]

in fact bitcoin is anonymous and no one know about the actual number of bitcoin users and their identity, so if the number of bitcoin users in china are more than the rest of the world, and they all at the same time decide to sell or buy more bitcoins then they can manipulate the price of bitcoin. but i think it is just impossible.

Blockchain is a Shared General Ledger , Hello
it is not anonymous, once your real name is tied to one address, they can track you from there.

Buy or sell any BTC on an exchange, then they got you.
Anyone that has ever does business with you, they got you.
Cross Referencing is some serious stuff, and 99.9% of the populace can't hide from it.

All Markets can be manipulated, if you have the leverage.
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-04-14/markets-are-manipulated

https://www.corbettreport.com/how-the-markets-are-manipulated/

http://www.gold-eagle.com/article/markets-are-manipulated-so-get-out-now

http://www.businessinsider.com/criminals-are-manipulating-the-stock-market-and-regulators-cant-seem-to-stop-it-2015-8

Google  markets are manipulated

After your read over 10 Million articles on it , you might realize not only is it possible , but happening every day.

 

[mirakal]

in fact bitcoin is anonymous and no one know about the actual number of bitcoin users and their identity, so if the number of bitcoin users in china are more than the rest of the world, and they all at the same time decide to sell or buy more bitcoins then they can manipulate the price of bitcoin. but i think it is just impossible.

Blockchain is a Shared General Ledger , Hello
it is not anonymous, once your real name is tied to one address, they can track you from there.

Buy or sell any BTC on an exchange, then they got you.
Anyone that has ever does business with you, they got you.
Cross Referencing is some serious stuff, and 99.9% of the populace can't hide from it.

All Markets can be manipulated, if you have the leverage.
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-04-14/markets-are-manipulated

https://www.corbettreport.com/how-the-markets-are-manipulated/

http://www.gold-eagle.com/article/markets-are-manipulated-so-get-out-now

http://www.businessinsider.com/criminals-are-manipulating-the-stock-market-and-regulators-cant-seem-to-stop-it-2015-8

Google  markets are manipulated

After your read over 10 Million articles on it , you might realize not only is it possible , but happening every day.

 

Not really, we can still be anonymous because not all people are using static IP address. In some countries, they shared connections in prepaid Internet and with that kind of services, it's hard to trace who are using such.

[kiklo]

in fact bitcoin is anonymous and no one know about the actual number of bitcoin users and their identity, so if the number of bitcoin users in china are more than the rest of the world, and they all at the same time decide to sell or buy more bitcoins then they can manipulate the price of bitcoin. but i think it is just impossible.

Blockchain is a Shared General Ledger , Hello
it is not anonymous, once your real name is tied to one address, they can track you from there.

Buy or sell any BTC on an exchange, then they got you.
Anyone that has ever does business with you, they got you.
Cross Referencing is some serious stuff, and 99.9% of the populace can't hide from it.

All Markets can be manipulated, if you have the leverage.
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-04-14/markets-are-manipulated

https://www.corbettreport.com/how-the-markets-are-manipulated/

http://www.gold-eagle.com/article/markets-are-manipulated-so-get-out-now

http://www.businessinsider.com/criminals-are-manipulating-the-stock-market-and-regulators-cant-seem-to-stop-it-2015-8

Google  markets are manipulated

After your read over 10 Million articles on it , you might realize not only is it possible , but happening every day.

 

Not really, we can still be anonymous because not all people are using static IP address. In some countries, they shared connections in prepaid Internet and with that kind of services, it's hard to trace who are using such.

Yes Really,
IP Address don't matter if they track your Bank Account you linked to buy or sell BTC on an exchange or a vendor you purchased something from gives them your home address.  


 

FYI:
Since you clueless to fact dynamic IP are also kept track of , here is a fun fact for you ,
every ethernet & wireless adapter have a unique identifying physical address, that is tracked.
They know the machine you are using , every time you pop it on the internet, unless you spoof the physical address.
That is common knowledge , there are other things you have no idea about, use a computer there is no anon.
You want anon, don't use a computer.

[marcus_of_augustus]

cheap, chinese-made bitcoins don't last as long and break if you use them too much 

[_Legendary_]

China is the biggest bitcoin mining in the world for right now, and the largest factors to infect about the price is China. If the exchanger market from China down, the price is also down. So I believe that China can controlling bitcoin price and stock.

[arcanaaerobics]

I'm come from china, but I'm not sure that China can controlling Bitcoin. When I was in a public area, I never found the discussion about bitcoin. even now I still have not found the Bitcoin ATM, it seems this assumption is wrong.

I don't think that have a lot of ATMs in the world so it don't mean much.

Probably most bitcoins are with few people(big miners) and that's why you don't see too much people talking about however for sure China have a better adoption then others countries.

[Harry Callahan]

China is the biggest bitcoin mining in the world for right now, and the largest factors to infect about the price is China. If the exchanger market from China down, the price is also down. So I believe that China can controlling bitcoin price and stock.

i didnt know that china could infect the price of bitcoin . but the Chinese could influence the price of the coin since majority of the hashing power originates from china which means they have the biggest miners and so they could influence the price a bit but it all depends upon people purchasing the coins

[sportis]

So far the largest part of the bitcoins has been mined (15,998,175).  So, I cannot understand why anyone should be worry if China has most mining pools. Maybe a reason to concern is the next or after the next halving where the cost to mine a bitcoin will be raised if at some point miners cooperate to raise the transaction fees too, so the usage of bitcoins to  be prohibitive for most users especially if they use it for micropayments.

[kiklo]

So far the largest part of the bitcoins has been mined (15,998,175).  So, I cannot understand why anyone should be worry if China has most mining pools. Maybe a reason to concern is the next or after the next halving where the cost to mine a bitcoin will be raised if at some point miners cooperate to raise the transaction fees too, so the usage of bitcoins to  be prohibitive for most users especially if they use it for micropayments.

You should study what a 51% attack is, then you will understand why anyone or any country having over 51% is a problem.

http://www.btcpedia.com/bitcoin-51-attack/

If a miner gains 51% or more power, he is capable to:
    Reverse transactions that he sends while he’s in control.
    This has the potential to double-spend transactions that previously had already been seen in the block chain.
    Prevent some or all transactions from gaining any confirmations.
    Prevent some or all other miners from mining any valid blocks.

 


FYI:
BTC is already too expensive for the micropayments industry.

[deisik]

So far the largest part of the bitcoins has been mined (15,998,175).  So, I cannot understand why anyone should be worry if China has most mining pools. Maybe a reason to concern is the next or after the next halving where the cost to mine a bitcoin will be raised if at some point miners cooperate to raise the transaction fees too, so the usage of bitcoins to  be prohibitive for most users especially if they use it for micropayments.

This is an interesting topic as such, even outside the question whether the Chinese control Bitcoin. Obviously, when all bitcoins are already mined, miners could only earn through the transaction fees (I hope this won't become a matter of dispute). Raising the fees above some optimal level will be counterproductive, just like raising taxes above a certain percentage in an economy would only lead to a decline of the amount of taxes collected (since producers start suffering losses and cut down production). In the same way, people will simply transact less with larger amounts per transaction, and miners profits instead of growing will be shrinking...

In this way, miners will be pretty much shooting themselves in the foot if they become too greedy

[funkenstein]

So far the largest part of the bitcoins has been mined (15,998,175).  So, I cannot understand why anyone should be worry if China has most mining pools. Maybe a reason to concern is the next or after the next halving where the cost to mine a bitcoin will be raised if at some point miners cooperate to raise the transaction fees too, so the usage of bitcoins to  be prohibitive for most users especially if they use it for micropayments.

This is an interesting topic as such, even outside the question whether the Chinese control Bitcoin. Obviously, when all bitcoins are already mined, miners could only earn through the transaction fees (I hope this won't become a matter of dispute). Raising the fees above some optimal level will be counterproductive, just like raising taxes above a certain percentage in an economy would only lead to a decline of the amount of taxes collected (since producers start suffering losses and cut down production). In the same way, people will simply transact less with larger amounts per transaction, and miners profits instead of growing will be shrinking...

In this way, miners will be pretty much shooting themselves in the foot if they become too greedy

The issue becomes one of whether liquidity will flee to other coins, for which the transaction fees are lower.  If you are interested in this problem, consider: 

A logarithmic release currency avoids this problem by always having some coinbase reward (coinbase rewards drop far slower than the geometric series / halving of bitcoin) - and yet maintaining a hard cap on the total money supply. 

[babo]

More mining power is'nt equal to control bitcoin.. in my humble opinion.. who control code and community and early adopter? I think no one

Yeah agree no one can control bitcoin even they are have lots of bitcoin farm they are just mine on bitcoin not control it but they can control the price just to dump and pump. but i think they don't do that because they are expecting more price increase with bitcoin. and bitcoin is decentralize so that no one can control bitcoin..

No one really controls bitcoin but we do have big allotment and contribution for bitcoins economy. Because us, people who uses bitcoin and consumes it for real are the ones to make the fluctuation of bitcoins price to move. And of course those people who are holding and have mining power are also contributing such as China.

in fact bitcoin is anonymous and no one know about the actual number of bitcoin users and their identity, so if the number of bitcoin users in china are more than the rest of the world, and they all at the same time decide to sell or buy more bitcoins then they can manipulate the price of bitcoin. but i think it is just impossible.

1) bitcoin isnt anonymous
2) bitcoin isnt only a cryptocurrencies, bitcoin is a BIG community, bitcoin is a phylosophy, bitcoin is a faith and future hope without bankers

this is the bitcoin revolution

[deisik]

This is an interesting topic as such, even outside the question whether the Chinese control Bitcoin. Obviously, when all bitcoins are already mined, miners could only earn through the transaction fees (I hope this won't become a matter of dispute). Raising the fees above some optimal level will be counterproductive, just like raising taxes above a certain percentage in an economy would only lead to a decline of the amount of taxes collected (since producers start suffering losses and cut down production). In the same way, people will simply transact less with larger amounts per transaction, and miners profits instead of growing will be shrinking...

In this way, miners will be pretty much shooting themselves in the foot if they become too greedy

The issue becomes one of whether liquidity will flee to other coins, for which the transaction fees are lower.  If you are interested in this problem, consider: 

A logarithmic release currency avoids this problem by always having some coinbase reward (coinbase rewards drop far slower than the geometric series / halving of bitcoin) - and yet maintaining a hard cap on the total money supply

Why not than just leave the mining reward where it is, i.e. make it constant until a preset amount of coins has been mined? I understand that it is sort of simplistic and doesn't look very enticing overall, but how is it essentially different from a logarithmic release currency? My point is that these tricks (e.g. logarithmic vs geometric series vs something else even more arcane) don't actually contribute anything really beneficial to the currency itself...

As to me, Bitcoin reward halving is the golden mean and a satisfactory compromise between sweeping simplicity and unrestrained complexity

BTC is already too expensive for the micropayments industry

Could you please expand more on micropayments industry in general and their payment rates in particular?

[Tyrantt]

BTC is already too expensive for the micropayments industry.

How come? the decimals go to 8 places, why do you think that it's too expensive for micropayments? fees or...?

[dontryjustdoit]

If China does not have "control" they will soon. There is too many of them and they are smarter than lazy people form the USA. Just callin it like I see it.