I am about to do something massivley stupid

[XxionxX]

Ok, I slept on it and I have made a decision.

• The student loan is out, there are just too many reasons not to use a student loan despite the advantages. My loan will either be from a credit card or some kind of p2p loan.
• My loan size will be an easily manageable level, I will be taking out $6k. I can comfortably pay this amount back in under a year and I could probably hock all my stuff at a pawn shop if I really needed to get rid of it asap. This limits my stupidity/insanity to a reasonable level.

I would really like to be bolder, but I believe that Melbustus is right when he said:

I know you're not planning on defaulting, but your financial position suggests a volatile situation where even *you* may not be aware of how you'll react to various developments.

I have the resolve, I just don't want market forces making decisions for me. I am not so stupid as to assume that the market will go up enough for me to pay this off in the next several months. I know my job will still be here in a year barring the collapse of the USD. And I know I have the assets to settle my debt quickly if I needed to. All of this money would be savings or expendable money anyway. I just want it now.

I plan on selling 50 of my coins to break even when the time comes. I will keep the rest.

Now I just need to figure out how to buy.... Leveraged or all in :/ Anybody know if we are going to crash soon? I would really like to get coins at a discount! 

[c0ikws]

Hello fellow bitcoin users.

I have been watching bitcoin over the past 2 years, I 'bought in' about 6 months ago. Over the months I have watched bitcoin developments and feel strongly about bitcoins future. Barring some massive hole found in the code, or something disastrous happening worldwide which might make people feel that bitcoin is terribly insecure, I feel that bitcoin's rise is inevitable.

Now comes the stupid part. I am thinking about taking on a $10k-$15k student loan to purchase bitcoins.

No, I don't need you to tell me why this is a retarded idea or why this is massively risky. I understand the risks quite well and I think I have lost my marbles. I have determined that I would rather pay off this loan than miss this investment opportunity. I know that if this fails I will kick myself forever, but I am young (26) and I can recover.

I was wondering if anyone knew of any loan services which might be good for this purpose, or things I should know about making such a large purchase. Please keep the doom and gloom to yourself, I know this is stupid but I have made my decision. I need ideas and help.

I plan to be holding for at least 5-10 years, and I would be willing to part with about 50 of my coins for $15k to pay off my loan and break even (a.k.a. a price of ~$300 a coin). I will be holding my breath until then. I plan on doing this in such a way that I do no incur Forex taxes on my 'cash out'. And I would probably end up having someone pay off my loan for the trade of coins below market rate. I would probably end up paying for everything I need in bitcoins as I see no reason to exchange my money back out and let 'the man' take a cut of my profit. This is my super scary gamble and I want to keep my reward if I get it.

Thank you very much for any positive input. And I hope you have a great day.

Edit:

Ok, I slept on it and I have made a decision.

• The student loan is out, there are just too many reasons not to use a student loan despite the advantages. My loan will either be from a credit card or some kind of p2p loan.
• My loan size will be an easily manageable level, I will be taking out $6k. I can comfortably pay this amount back in under a year and I could probably hock all my stuff at a pawn shop if I really needed to get rid of it asap. This limits my stupidity/insanity to a reasonable level.

I would really like to be bolder, but I believe that Melbustus is right when he said:

I know you're not planning on defaulting, but your financial position suggests a volatile situation where even *you* may not be aware of how you'll react to various developments.

I have the resolve, I just don't want market forces making decisions for me. I am not so stupid as to assume that the market will go up enough for me to pay this off in the next several months. I know my job will still be here in a year barring the collapse of the USD. And I know I have the assets to settle my debt quickly if I needed to. All of this money would be savings or expendable money anyway. I just want it now.

I plan on selling 50 of my coins to break even when the time comes. I will keep the rest.

Now I just need to figure out how to buy.... Leveraged or all in :/ Anybody know if we are going to crash soon? I would really like to get coins at a discount! 

dooooo it!

[XxionxX]

OP: Noooo!!

If you must, then sell your car for bitcoins -- unless it's a collectible, or extremely old, a car loses value rapidly. If you truly believe in Bitcoin, you will make sacrifices and use public transport . Even hiring a rental for the occasional weekend out of town works out cheaper than registration + insurance and all that other nonsense.

Sell your TV on ebay or whatever. There's nothing good on anyway, and they're so ubiquitous that you can always visit your parents and stuff for movie nights.

Quit smoking and buy a couple of bitcoins each week with the spare change.

--Try testing yourself in those or similar ways for e.g.: a week, and if the "pain" is not worth it, then I would hold off. Because if the risk of a loan doesn't pay off (e.g.: Bitcoin crashes to $15) you'll have to do those things anyway.

I would already be rid of my car if it weren't for my job, it is my biggest expense and I can't get rid of it

I don't smoke and I wouldn't get much for my tv. I have been purchasing coins in the manner you just set forth and I have done quite well for myself, I am just unhappy with the rate at which I am acquiring coins.

Thank you for all of the suggestions though!

[cedivad]

The biggest problem you have here is that if you need to go all in, you need to do it right now, not next week.
You will be forced to invest during the time, that is not necessarily a bad thing.

Good luck!

[grondilu]

No, I don't need you to tell me why this is a retarded idea or why this is massively risky.

It's not just risky and retarded, it's irresponsible.  You will borrow some money for you to gamble with.  So in a nutshell, in case your plan fails, you intend to tell you creditor:  «  Sorry I lost everything, I can't pay you back. »   At some point in history some people would have broken your legs for that.



Just look at the 2011 crash and think again.

[XxionxX]

No, I don't need you to tell me why this is a retarded idea or why this is massively risky.

It's not just risky and retarded, it's irresponsible.  You will borrow some money for you to gamble with.  So in a nutshell, in case your plan fails, you intend to tell you creditor:  «  Sorry I lost everything, I can't pay you back. »   At some point in history some people would have broken your legs for that.



Just look at the 2011 crash and think again.

?? Did you even read this thread? I just posted how I have the ability to pay everything back. Why would I default and wreck my credit score? I don't want to do that.

[XxionxX]

The biggest problem you have here is that if you need to go all in, you need to do it right now, not next week.
You will be forced to invest during the time, that is not necessarily a bad thing.

Good luck!

I know! This is the real dilemma/gamble! 

[grondilu]

No, I don't need you to tell me why this is a retarded idea or why this is massively risky.

It's not just risky and retarded, it's irresponsible.  You will borrow some money for you to gamble with.  So in a nutshell, in case your plan fails, you intend to tell you creditor:  «  Sorry I lost everything, I can't pay you back. »   At some point in history some people would have broken your legs for that.



Just look at the 2011 crash and think again.

?? Did you even read this thread?

No, I confess I did not.    I just read the part when you said you would use your student loan to buy some bitcoins.

[shawshankinmate37927]

...but I am the kind of person who decides something and sticks with it like a mule. This has gotten me in trouble quite a few times...

Stop being a mule or it's going to get you in trouble again.  What if your parents lose their house?  What if you lose your job?  I'm bullish on bitcoin, but this is a very volatile market.  Trust me, you won't be able to stomach it.  You need to listen to your own advice.  You're too smart to be doing this.  Going all in at an all time record high is not a wise move.  You're allowing the price action of the last two months to go to your head.  Just relax, think logically, and remember Murphy's Law.

I only pocket like $300-$500 a month.

This is the money you should be using to buy BTC with.  That will allow you to dollar cost average and take advantage of the dips.

I can already weld and I can program.

So use your programming skills to earn BTC on the side.

[XxionxX]

I almost forgot! Thank you everyone for putting up with my hairbrained scheme. I am super happy to have received advice from so many prolific forum members and helpful investors. You have all given me exactly what I needed to go forward with my plan. I will only lose a year of my life if I fall flat on my face now

[bitdragon]

Your subconscious mind, your gut, your intuition, your soul, whatever you want to call it managed to slip itself in the title of the thread.
I am about to do something massivley stupid

You will save years of hard lessons the more you listen to that intuition. Learn from the mistakes of others and buy on a regular basis a set amount of $ in bitcoins per day/per month. As price drops, you will buy more coins and price rise they will all be worth more.
You will be much better emotionally. Do it for the rest of us

[Elwar]

OP, I did something similar to what you are planning.


In early July 2011 I took $10,000 out of my 401k to buy bitcoins at a mere $14.5/BTC. I had confidence in the whole Bitcoin technology and everything that it stood for.

I watched as my investment dropped. I was able to make a few more bitcoin buying and selling on MtGox getting my total Bitcoin stash over 750. Then I learned about Bitcoinica which allowed you to trade on a 10:1 margin as well as allowing shorting. So I moved about 600 of my BTC over to Bitcoinica and started trading at a 10:1 margin. Almost every time I dumped a large trade in the market went the opposite direction and I lost my leveraged funds. After becoming suspicious with only about 150 BTC remaining I moved it back to MtGox and then into a private address for safe keeping. At this point the price was around $4/BTC, basically a value of around $1,000 remaining.

I had a reason for jumping in with my 401k. I had a $30,000 balloon payment on the lot of land next to my house due that next April. I figured that BTC would triple by then at least. Instead I was short, I had to cash out more from my 401k while I had to pay $3k in penalties and taxes on the original withdrawal.

Along with other factors, I took out so much from my 401k that I owe the IRS a lot of money this year. And the only way I could do that is to work in Afghanistan where I get paid very well. Now my life is hell.

Bitcoin was not the only reason, my wife and I made some poor financial choices including a failed business. But just tread carefully. You are young and you should be ok with just $6k.

But you have been warned enough so I will address your original question:

If you have a credit card with a decent limit, a good way to get BTC for credit is to sell something in demand at cost on BitMit and have it shipped to the buyer while paying for it with your card. There are some wholesale companies out there that allow drop shipping, if you find a decent one you could even make a few bitcents.

[Lethn]

And I thought I was crazy for gambling 0.02 Bitcoins on Satoshi.

[Rassah]

Oh, another tip. Instead of student loans, see if you can get a car loan instead. Good rates, and way fewer risks (though you may be restricted to actually having to buy a car, new or used). Back before the '08 crash it was fairly common for people to arbitrage, taking out low interest car loans and putting the money into high interest savings. They would only make 1% to 2% a year on this, but it was still something.

[acoindr]

I almost forgot! Thank you everyone for putting up with my hairbrained scheme. I am super happy to have received advice from so many prolific forum members and helpful investors. You have all given me exactly what I needed to go forward with my plan. I will only lose a year of my life if I fall flat on my face now

That is the correct way to take trade risk, to be fine with the worst case outcome.

[Timo Y]

Bitcoin's rise is NOT 'inevitable'.  There is still a 30% chance of Bitcoin failing in my opinion. There are a lot of things that can still feasibly go wrong, and probably whole lot of other things that nobody has even thought of.   Note of them would kill Bitcoin completely, but they would condemn Bitcoin as a niche currency trading at single figures.

  

[Jutarul]

Bitcoin's rise is NOT 'inevitable'.  There is still a 30% chance of Bitcoin failing in my opinion. There are a lot of things that can still feasibly go wrong, and probably whole lot of other things that nobody has even thought of.   Note of them would kill Bitcoin completely, but they would condemn Bitcoin as a niche currency trading at single figures.

I'd say the number is 42.

[SaltySpitoon]

I would suggest taking out as much of a loan in all categories as you can get, selling all of your possessions, assets, etc. Then buying BTC and filing for bankruptcy. They can't take your Bitcoins, and they will have nothing else to take. Then restart your life with your billions in Bitcoins.

[justusranvier]

I would suggest taking out as much of a loan in all categories as you can get, selling all of your possessions, assets, etc. Then buying BTC and filing for bankruptcy. They can't take your Bitcoins, and they will have nothing else to take. Then restart your life with your billions in Bitcoins.

Bankruptcy doesn't clear all categories of loans. You'd have to restart your life in another country, and at that point there's no point mucking around with bankruptcy.

[Timo Y]

I would suggest taking out as much of a loan in all categories as you can get, selling all of your possessions, assets, etc. Then buying BTC and filing for bankruptcy. They can't take your Bitcoins, and they will have nothing else to take. Then restart your life with your billions in Bitcoins.

Taking out a loan with the intent to file bankruptcy is fraud. Not to mention that it is unethical even from a libertarian viewpoint.