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Author Topic: 💰(LIR)💰 LetItRide💰 Dice Tournament LIVE💰 3+BTC in LIR PRIZES💰 Join For FREE  (Read 255910 times)
AcoinL.L.C
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June 17, 2016, 07:38:12 PM
 #201

Another ICO targeted towards gambling... That doesn't have a user base or any traction.

Everyone needs to start somewhere.

You are right, everyone does need to start somewhere. Until you get somewhere, you shouldn't be raising a ton of money from the public.

No one on their team has any experience in the crypto-gaming industry. None. I don't believe "Frank" has any experience in the gaming industry either, just stating you have experience doesn't make it so. Where did he previously work in the gaming industry?

Their mission statement has spelling errors (sloppy), very vague references to trending subjects ("we will look to utilize Smart Contracts and DApps in the future") that frankly have nothing to do with a gambling site, nor would even be feasible. the only reason you mentioned that is so that people associate your site with other hyped up stuff so they are more likely to invest in your site.

Here is why decentralization/trustless casino is not possible. The only way to operate a business is when you have complete control over the money, even more so in the casino industry.

One example that I have heard people discuss before:
Say you want to use a variation of multi-sig wallets, so that way users don't need to worry about the casino running off. What happens if a player loses their bet and refuses to accept the transaction (to send the Bitcoin out of their wallet)? You could say you could do a 2/3 with a third party... Well now you are relying on a third party to operate your business, where it is possible they could conspire with the player to steal from your business.

As to the decentralized part... Lol. You can't run a decentralized business. It doesn't work. In business decisions need to be quick, you can't be held hostage by having to have a majority of a vote where its possible a large portion of people eligible to vote do not vote, so it's extremely difficult to reach a consensus (meaning if you are using smart contracts, nothing would ever be executed).

This 35% of valuation is also ridiculous. What is stopping you from pretending to sell the site 3-4 months down the line for say 100 BTC, which means only 35 BTC would go towards stakeholders. You would pocket everything raised minus 35 BTC and investors would be out big time.


Even assuming you know what you are doing (I don't believe you do), what are you bringing new to the table that gives you a competitive advantage? Tournaments? That can be replicated in a day by a competitor if a tournament draws big volume (not to mention most sites hold competitions of some sorts). Provably fair has been around for years. Dice, hundreds of sites like that. You will also have a much smaller bankroll than most sites. The management team provides no added value (since you have no experience in this industry). To sum it up, you are trying to join a crowded market with no competitive edge.

Here is where it really shows you have no idea what you are doing. You say Jigar estimates that 10% of raised funds will be needed for development. How do you have a % of an unknown quantity down as your development cost? What if you raise 1000 BTC? 500 BTC? 150 BTC? Your development costs shouldn't be tied to that whatsoever, dev costs are pretty much fixed rate, or at the very least within a ballpark range. You also shouldn't be paying a developer that much capital if they also have an equity stake in the business. You could hire a developer to build a quality casino for $10-20k without paying them any equity.

What will you be spending the marketing budget on?

"As you know, there are potential unseen costs so we need to be prepared for those and have a buffer ready"
No, I do not know. What potential costs are there outside of development and having a bankroll (marketing budget is nice to have, not a necessity)? The only thing is legal costs, and you have legal issues based on where you are located (or because of the fiat gateways you intend on adding) 10% of what you raise will not be nearly enough to cover that.

Why are you offering cashback on an investment? Why not just try and raise 10% less cash.

Finally, for investors:
Why are you investing for 15% piece of the pie. You could simply invest your money on other sites (such as Bet King, SatoshiDice, BitVest.io, and so on) where you get a larger portion of the EV while also still having control over your money (being able to liquidate at any time without incurring loss from having to dump).


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June 17, 2016, 07:39:07 PM
 #202

I have great hope in this project and am glad to be a part of it. Tomorrow will set up a facebook page, had some stuff to finish off at home today.


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June 17, 2016, 09:36:06 PM
 #203

I have great hope in this project and am glad to be a part of it. Tomorrow will set up a facebook page, had some stuff to finish off at home today.

Will there be a facebook bounty as well? Or only Twitter?
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June 17, 2016, 09:42:14 PM
 #204

just wondering guys what will happens to this users that have red bet ?
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June 17, 2016, 09:53:55 PM
 #205

A ton of money? To me that is not a ton of money they're asking even if it was money and not btc. People are going to hate and them same people get but hurt and try put others off. When I invested in ETH or LSK or a few others do you think they had got somewhere? No they had not that is why I risked it and the return paid me because I put faith in something  before the ball was rolling. All the time people like you telling me how retarded I was oooooooweeee was it good taking profits all the way.

That separates those who take risk and win and those who waste time mumbling on. Everything you say after that is not worth reading as you clearly do not understand how to take risks for big rewards. I donated to the biggest ico oh hum bug the word the wording haha

We will carry this on 1 year from now because right now it's pointless.

True I remember with ETH first came out that everyone doubted them. Even now, people are doubting them again because of what's happened causing the price to crash. I will be investing in ETH once again with the full confidence that they will resurge in value and those who didn't get in now will cry later, just like this project.
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June 17, 2016, 10:05:56 PM
 #206

A ton of money? To me that is not a ton of money they're asking even if it was money and not btc. People are going to hate and them same people get but hurt and try put others off. When I invested in ETH or LSK or a few others do you think they had got somewhere? No they had not that is why I risked it and the return paid me because I put faith in something  before the ball was rolling. All the time people like you telling me how retarded I was oooooooweeee was it good taking profits all the way.

That separates those who take risk and win and those who waste time mumbling on. Everything you say after that is not worth reading as you clearly do not understand how to take risks for big rewards. I donated to the biggest ico oh hum bug the word the wording haha

We will carry this on 1 year from now because right now it's pointless.

They are asking for a ton of money for something that quite frankly is very cheap to upstart. They have already raised 100k for a product worth a fraction of that, so relatively speaking it is a ton of money for what it is. There is no advantage to an investor buying into this, literally non.

You buy into this and you get 15% cut correct? Say you invest 100 BTC, you technically only "own" 15 BTC worth. You are also relying on the site taking off in terms of traction (very high chance it gets low volume).  
Example of outcome:
- You invest 100 BTC
- Total raised is 1000 BTC
- House does 100k volume (no chance in hell it gets anywhere close to this), at 1% HE that would be an expected 1000 BTC revenue. The investors, who chipped in 1000 BTC, only get 150 BTC from this. Your 100 BTC investment generated a whopping 15 BTC, which is a pitiful return for how low the floor on an investment like this is.

Now, lets do an example for if you did the smart thing and spread your investments out across a few bankrolls of well known sites that already have users (meaning you will for sure get volume, unlike option A):
- You invest 100 BTC
- Total bankroll across all sites is 10,000 BTC (combined BR of multiple sites)
- Total volume across all sites is 300k (combined volume of multiple sites)
- Assume BR gets 50% of EV. 1% house edge
- The bankroll would make an expected 1500 BTC (3000 from the edge, 1500 goes to BR investors)
- In this scenario you would also make 15 BTC. The difference? The floor is MUCH higher AND you still have your original 100 BTC that you can withdraw at any time.

This is such a terrible investment its not even funny.
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June 17, 2016, 10:26:47 PM
 #207

I'd like a facebook bounty as well, I am more active on facebook than I am twitter so I think it would be a good idea  Grin
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June 17, 2016, 11:02:44 PM
 #208

A ton of money? To me that is not a ton of money they're asking even if it was money and not btc. People are going to hate and them same people get but hurt and try put others off. When I invested in ETH or LSK or a few others do you think they had got somewhere? No they had not that is why I risked it and the return paid me because I put faith in something  before the ball was rolling. All the time people like you telling me how retarded I was oooooooweeee was it good taking profits all the way.

That separates those who take risk and win and those who waste time mumbling on. Everything you say after that is not worth reading as you clearly do not understand how to take risks for big rewards. I donated to the biggest ico oh hum bug the word the wording haha

We will carry this on 1 year from now because right now it's pointless.

They are asking for a ton of money for something that quite frankly is very cheap to upstart. They have already raised 100k for a product worth a fraction of that, so relatively speaking it is a ton of money for what it is. There is no advantage to an investor buying into this, literally non.

You buy into this and you get 15% cut correct? Say you invest 100 BTC, you technically only "own" 15 BTC worth. You are also relying on the site taking off in terms of traction (very high chance it gets low volume).  
Example of outcome:
- You invest 100 BTC
- Total raised is 1000 BTC
- House does 100k volume (no chance in hell it gets anywhere close to this), at 1% HE that would be an expected 1000 BTC revenue. The investors, who chipped in 1000 BTC, only get 150 BTC from this. Your 100 BTC investment generated a whopping 15 BTC, which is a pitiful return for how low the floor on an investment like this is.

Now, lets do an example for if you did the smart thing and spread your investments out across a few bankrolls of well known sites that already have users (meaning you will for sure get volume, unlike option A):
- You invest 100 BTC
- Total bankroll across all sites is 10,000 BTC (combined BR of multiple sites)
- Total volume across all sites is 300k (combined volume of multiple sites)
- Assume BR gets 50% of EV. 1% house edge
- The bankroll would make an expected 1500 BTC (3000 from the edge, 1500 goes to BR investors)
- In this scenario you would also make 15 BTC. The difference? The floor is MUCH higher AND you still have your original 100 BTC that you can withdraw at any time.

This is such a terrible investment its not even funny.

Getting in early at the start means I'm not strongly being diluted by a ton of other people more so then other well established sites. The way it sounds to me is that once the initial sale is done as long as I don't sell my coins I'm not going to get diluted so it seems like a good opportunity to me to be a part of a profitable organization.

Edit: I see you're a money pot supporter, explains a lot.
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June 17, 2016, 11:32:06 PM
 #209

A ton of money? To me that is not a ton of money they're asking even if it was money and not btc. People are going to hate and them same people get but hurt and try put others off. When I invested in ETH or LSK or a few others do you think they had got somewhere? No they had not that is why I risked it and the return paid me because I put faith in something  before the ball was rolling. All the time people like you telling me how retarded I was oooooooweeee was it good taking profits all the way.

That separates those who take risk and win and those who waste time mumbling on. Everything you say after that is not worth reading as you clearly do not understand how to take risks for big rewards. I donated to the biggest ico oh hum bug the word the wording haha

We will carry this on 1 year from now because right now it's pointless.

I truly understand the view points from both side of the spectrum. There will always be people who are careful and want to make sure everything is safe and proven before they are willing to try it out or do it. Usually, the best moment to make money is when everyone has yet to make any money from it so these people will tend to loss out a lot. They will settle with safer options and less rewards like 10% or even less ROI.

Whereas you belongs to those who believe in your judgement and is a risk taker. You choose what you believe in and go all in with no fear. The potential is huge as the 'egg' that you invested in can turned out to be a phoenix or it is actually just a spoiled rotten egg.

But no matter what, it is still advisable to spread out your investments. Good luck and hope we can success together with this amazing project.
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June 18, 2016, 12:20:00 AM
 #210

A ton of money? To me that is not a ton of money they're asking even if it was money and not btc. People are going to hate and them same people get but hurt and try put others off. When I invested in ETH or LSK or a few others do you think they had got somewhere? No they had not that is why I risked it and the return paid me because I put faith in something  before the ball was rolling. All the time people like you telling me how retarded I was oooooooweeee was it good taking profits all the way.

That separates those who take risk and win and those who waste time mumbling on. Everything you say after that is not worth reading as you clearly do not understand how to take risks for big rewards. I donated to the biggest ico oh hum bug the word the wording haha

We will carry this on 1 year from now because right now it's pointless.

I truly understand the view points from both side of the spectrum. There will always be people who are careful and want to make sure everything is safe and proven before they are willing to try it out or do it. Usually, the best moment to make money is when everyone has yet to make any money from it so these people will tend to loss out a lot. They will settle with safer options and less rewards like 10% or even less ROI.

Whereas you belongs to those who believe in your judgement and is a risk taker. You choose what you believe in and go all in with no fear. The potential is huge as the 'egg' that you invested in can turned out to be a phoenix or it is actually just a spoiled rotten egg.

But no matter what, it is still advisable to spread out your investments. Good luck and hope we can success together with this amazing project.

amen, i couldn't have put it better myself
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June 18, 2016, 12:59:48 AM
 #211

Nice guys! We are half way to 250!! We should get a betting thread going on what the end number will be  Grin

id be down for that, i think we can get upto 500 maybe 1000 BTC there is still like 13 days before the sale ends should I make it?
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June 18, 2016, 02:59:06 AM
 #212

will all the 33.5 million coins be sold on ICO? and what happend to lower bids who will not be sold coins?

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June 18, 2016, 04:28:08 AM
 #213

I have great hope in this project and am glad to be a part of it. Tomorrow will set up a facebook page, had some stuff to finish off at home today.

Will there be a facebook bounty as well? Or only Twitter?

I am setting up a facebook fan page, today, not sure if there will be a facebook bounty though, that is up to the DEV Team here to decide and let us know. Smiley


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June 18, 2016, 05:01:31 AM
 #214

will all the 33.5 million coins be sold on ICO? and what happend to lower bids who will not be sold coins?
I recall in one of the dev post they said 30 million, since some are kept for bounties and stuff I think

I have great hope in this project and am glad to be a part of it. Tomorrow will set up a facebook page, had some stuff to finish off at home today.

Will there be a facebook bounty as well? Or only Twitter?

I am setting up a facebook fan page, today, not sure if there will be a facebook bounty though, that is up to the DEV Team here to decide and let us know. Smiley

Awesome, hopefully there will be!
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June 18, 2016, 07:32:45 AM
 #215

Nice guys! We are half way to 250!! We should get a betting thread going on what the end number will be  Grin

id be down for that, i think we can get upto 500 maybe 1000 BTC there is still like 13 days before the sale ends should I make it?

Maybe make it with 10 days or 7days remaining. We will need a trusted escrow for it if there are many bets.

will all the 33.5 million coins be sold on ICO? and what happend to lower bids who will not be sold coins?
I recall in one of the dev post they said 30 million, since some are kept for bounties and stuff I think

Yeah it is 30 million but what about the bids that are lower when the sale finishes?

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June 18, 2016, 09:10:53 AM
 #216

will all the 33.5 million coins be sold on ICO? and what happend to lower bids who will not be sold coins?

I think .5 million coins are the dev fund so it must be either 33.5 million coins + the devs fund or just 33.5 million coins including the .5 million.
Maybe shogdite or phoenix can clear that up.
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June 18, 2016, 09:14:49 AM
 #217

will all the 33.5 million coins be sold on ICO? and what happend to lower bids who will not be sold coins?

I think .5 million coins are the dev fund so it must be either 33.5 million coins + the devs fund or just 33.5 million coins including the .5 million.
Maybe shogdite or phoenix can clear that up.

It could have been any clearer. 33mil are for sale and 0.5mil are the dev fund and not for sale during the ICO. What is not clear is what happens to my bid at the end of the sale when it finishes and it's in red. OP please can you answer?

I think a good thing would be those who are in the red in order all get moved to the highest bid and pay more for not staying on the ball. Guess you will let us know soon enough.
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June 18, 2016, 09:18:49 AM
 #218

will all the 33.5 million coins be sold on ICO? and what happend to lower bids who will not be sold coins?

I think .5 million coins are the dev fund so it must be either 33.5 million coins + the devs fund or just 33.5 million coins including the .5 million.
Maybe shogdite or phoenix can clear that up.

It could have been any clearer. 33mil are for sale and 0.5mil are the dev fund and not for sale during the ICO. What is not clear is what happens to my bid at the end of the sale when it finishes and it's in red. OP please can you answer?

I think a good thing would be those who are in the red in order all get moved to the highest bid and pay more for not staying on the ball. Guess you will let us know soon enough.

I don't think that would be good though because someone already has a bid (albeit super a super small one) on 0.1. Which means people who are not on the ball will be paying over $75 a coin. Which give a total market cap of 2.5125e9 yes, that's correct. My calculator cant even do 33 500 000 x 75$

I hope the dev will say today the plan for the red orders.
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June 18, 2016, 09:35:21 AM
 #219

will all the 33.5 million coins be sold on ICO? and what happend to lower bids who will not be sold coins?

I think .5 million coins are the dev fund so it must be either 33.5 million coins + the devs fund or just 33.5 million coins including the .5 million.
Maybe shogdite or phoenix can clear that up.

It could have been any clearer. 33mil are for sale and 0.5mil are the dev fund and not for sale during the ICO. What is not clear is what happens to my bid at the end of the sale when it finishes and it's in red. OP please can you answer?

I think a good thing would be those who are in the red in order all get moved to the highest bid and pay more for not staying on the ball. Guess you will let us know soon enough.

I don't think that would be good though because someone already has a bid (albeit super a super small one) on 0.1. Which means people who are not on the ball will be paying over $75 a coin. Which give a total market cap of 2.5125e9 yes, that's correct. My calculator cant even do 33 500 000 x 75$

I hope the dev will say today the plan for the red orders.

Can that 0.1 be removed no?  Yes I do to as it is a little confusing until dev gives update. It is coming along nicely so far though isn't it? Just a few days and it has raised 126btc! Bonuses still available so I'm sure we will see some more big investments.
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June 18, 2016, 09:37:15 AM
 #220

will all the 33.5 million coins be sold on ICO? and what happend to lower bids who will not be sold coins?

I think .5 million coins are the dev fund so it must be either 33.5 million coins + the devs fund or just 33.5 million coins including the .5 million.
Maybe shogdite or phoenix can clear that up.

It could have been any clearer. 33mil are for sale and 0.5mil are the dev fund and not for sale during the ICO. What is not clear is what happens to my bid at the end of the sale when it finishes and it's in red. OP please can you answer?

I think a good thing would be those who are in the red in order all get moved to the highest bid and pay more for not staying on the ball. Guess you will let us know soon enough.

I don't think that would be good though because someone already has a bid (albeit super a super small one) on 0.1. Which means people who are not on the ball will be paying over $75 a coin. Which give a total market cap of 2.5125e9 yes, that's correct. My calculator cant even do 33 500 000 x 75$

I hope the dev will say today the plan for the red orders.

Can that 0.1 be removed no?  Yes I do to as it is a little confusing until dev gives update. It is coming along nicely so far though isn't it? Just a few days and it has raised 126btc! Bonuses still available so I'm sure we will see some more big investments.

No it cant be. Once an order is placeed it can only be moved to a higher satoshi value so it can stay on 0.1 or move higher.
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