Andreas M. Antonopoulos is "bullish on Ethereum"

[iamnotback]

Since the start of this thread, my stance remains that Ethereum has its market and if their market wants forks, then so it is.

And that we who disagree with that, and disagree with the hype marketing, then we should compete, not complain.

I wrote that "Crypto is Not Politics" post not to tell them what to do, but to tell people what I would do and to give others the opportunity to consider my logic.

It should not be construed as an attempt to try to force Ethereum and its supporters to change their minds.

My point about Vitalk and Wood is not that I expect the Ethereum community to demote them (and I expect possibly the opposite post-DAO with them being lifted on even higher pedestals), rather to say that we should want to create a competitor which doesn't have personalities that serve as idols and CEOs of the ecosystem.

And of course we hopefully also want to create a competitor with technology that isn't FAIL.

[btcxyzzz]

Lol! He is one of the small dicked IDIOTS who bought Ethereum, and now he hopes people will buy his CRAP 

ETHEREUM IS FINISHED

Lost all of its credibility

Only valuable among IDIOTS

Someday... you will realize how pathetic you are. Please don't kill yourself then, everybody's got the right to second chance.

[funkenstein]

Incorrect. The point is that no matter what proof-of-work algorithm an altcoin employs, those who are protecting Bitcoin will rent enough mining hash rate to fuck your coin forever. They only have to rent it for a short period of time, and your difficulty will be so high that it will never produce a block again. And all the money in the chain will be unspendable for a very, very, very long time.

The "attacker" has the resources to do that to any proof-of-work altcoin which doesn't have the level of hashrate of Bitcoin.

Of course the altcoin can then manually reset the difficulty lower using a fork, but then the attacker can repeat again. It will quickly become clear that the altcoin is fucked.

If Monero starts to approach $1 billion market cap (or perhaps much less if the liquidity is very high, which it is for Monero), this attacker will destroy Monero and profit by shorting.

Dude you need to read tardlema a little longer before reposting the derpage here.  (I've been reading for years as you can tell by my fluent orcish). 

Otherwise, go ahead and rent some SHA256 asics and attack litecoin and monero with them.  I'll wait. 

[iamnotback]

Readers please note that I don't have anything against Monero as an open source experiment in crypto-currency. I support their experimentation. I don't like (bordering on hate although I don't allow myself be consumed by hate) the community of Monero. And I don't support when someone writes that Monero is the only altcoin that is serious or worthy. They have not yet earned that, and if ever they do earn that, they won't need to state it because such truths are self-evident.

There is something foul smell in the community of Monero. I'd rather not try to explain what that smell is, as others have already explored that. Ethereum has its idolizing fanboiz and Monero has its delusion-of-superiority, pack-dog-attacking bagboiz. Something like that.

...

Incorrect. The point is that no matter what proof-of-work algorithm an altcoin employs, those who are protecting Bitcoin will rent enough mining hash rate to fuck your coin forever. They only have to rent it for a short period of time, and your difficulty will be so high that it will never produce a block again. And all the money in the chain will be unspendable for a very, very, very long time.

The "attacker" has the resources to do that to any proof-of-work altcoin which doesn't have the level of hashrate of Bitcoin.

Of course the altcoin can then manually reset the difficulty lower using a fork, but then the attacker can repeat again. It will quickly become clear that the altcoin is fucked.

If Monero starts to approach $1 billion market cap (or perhaps much less if the liquidity is very high, which it is for Monero), this attacker will destroy Monero and profit by shorting.

Dude you need to read tardlema a little longer before reposting the derpage here.  (I've been reading for years as you can tell by my fluent orcish).  

Otherwise, go ahead and rent some SHA256 asics and attack litecoin and monero with them.  I'll wait.  

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1520691.msg15316487#msg15316487
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1520691.msg15316642#msg15316642
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1520691.msg15314867#msg15314867
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1520691.msg15313262#msg15313262
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1520691.msg15313922#msg15313922
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1520691.msg15313993#msg15313993

Four pages of shred, just to come to the conclusion that yes indeed altcoins with $million mcaps and declining block rewards, are probably insecure against an adversary with the resources of a billionaire, or more so when their hashrate has so declined already.

It shouldn't require 4 pages of bagging, to be intellectually honest and cordial and arrive at an amicable understanding that yes indeed altcoins need to be able to gain millions of users as Bitcoin has, so they become secure against all hashrate attacks. Then again Bitcoin has the subsequent problem which is then how do you stop the mining from becoming centralized control as the adoption scales up.

No non-vaporware block chain has yet solved this conundrum.

So again instead of attacking me (which is not an accomplishment), how about you just get in touch with reality, roll up your sleeves, get to work, and stop pumping your shitcoin down everyone's throat.

I realize you Munderotards are jealous with Ethereum and others making 100X gains, and you need to find some bagholders to dump your bags on, but taking your frustration out on me is not an accomplishment. Really, slaying AnonyMint is not worth even a single fuck. Find a more productive vocation.

(in short, STFU Munderotard*)

*Munderotard
noun
Often confused with a decentralized crypto-currency, it rather refers to a constituent in the community of bagholders and bagboiz whose sole vocation in life is to convince force down the throats of everyone else that bagging users is an adoption marketing plan for a future-shock coin with regularly scheduled "community" forks leading the way away from centralization to that Holy Banal Grail (HBG).

[iamnotback]

Readers please note that I don't have anything against Monero as an open source experiment in crypto-currency. I support their experimentation. I don't like (bordering on hate although I don't allow myself be consumed by hate) the community of Monero. And I don't support when someone writes that Monero is the only altcoin that is serious or worthy. They have not yet earned that, and if ever they do earn that, they won't need to state it because such truths are self-evident.

There is something foul smell in the community of Monero. I'd rather not try to explain what that smell is, as others have already explored that. Ethereum has its idolizing fanboiz and Monero has its delusion-of-superiority, pack-dog-attacking bagboiz. Something like that.

I am dreaming of a community that are idealistic and imaginative as are the supporters of Ethereum.

I'm wishing for a community that is well grounded in realism and does their due diligence and asks challenging questions. Yet who are not rude, disrespectful, flippant, nor wasting their time fighting back those who attack our project in other threads.

I am dreaming of a community that does not idolize any of its developers.

I am dreaming of a community that is all about production and helping to get things done. And not talking about (nor even looking at!) the price or the market cap.

I am dreaming of solving the problems of Bitcoin and Ethereum.

I am dreaming of doing this without hype, and instead methodical development.

I am dreaming of a meritocracy and an enjoyable work environment.

I am dreaming of success.

I think you guys are lurking out there. I hope I will not be wrong in my assumption.

Some munderotard will quote me:

I am dreaming...

I am dreaming...

I am dreaming...

I am dreaming...

Edit: this post was not intended to pretend there might not already be communities in the altcoin ecosystem that have the above qualities. They may already exist. Some would probably "offer" (I accidentally wrote "throw up" but caught my Freudian slip) the names, DASH, VCASH, NEM, SHADOWCASH, etc.. Maybe so, although I might have a quibble on a few points for each of those. Any way, I am writing above about the community I would want.


I also want to offer my realization that it is highly discombobulating to ponder the level of conspiracy, fraud, hate, manipulation, etc.. in our CC ecosystems. I can't even wrap my mind around what the reality really is. There are so many competing interests and there is no way to discern what/which people are hiding and what they pretending. I've decided to stop even trying to comprehend it. I think all we can do is create something and enjoy our work. The rest will work itself out.

Some here have the vocation of speculator and all they typically care about is a good pump or dump. That is not my vocation. I can't relate to them. Some of them apparently earn a lot of $, but that isn't a sufficient motivation for me to change my vocation. I am creator. A programmer. A technologist. Etc.. I am not an arbitrage seeker. I'll leave that vocation to others and not dilute my capabilities by trying to understand them.

OP may actually be onto something: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-06-22#1486943

I found some interesting musing on Ethereum vulnerabilities at that link but no mention of Monero or XMR.  What did I miss?

Nothing, ETH is garbage. I can't say Monero doesn't have vulnerabilities but they are not in the same fashion as ETH obscurity-by-complexity model.

Do you believe in conspiracies? I'll tell what I think about Ethereum since I watched it from the beginning, its a plot from part of the Bitcoin elite, the same that funded and nurtured with their owned outlets, that dominates the mainstream and directs the narrative naming the "villains" and whom the sheep should listen to and that promotes that bootleg of fungible currency named Zcash. Ethereum was created to slaughter as many idiot sheeps as they can, it may look like it has a purpose and utility but if you take enough time to examine it you'll find its all smoke and mirrors, some day a bitcoin aristocrat will look at the pile of smoking ruins that was ethereum and at the hundreds of thousands of USD lost and say: "oh well it was a fun experiment", turn away and laugh, while hundreds of sheep will be look at their empty pockets and wondering what happened, because thats what they like to do and thats why true innovative currencies like Monero is being ignored by the same part of the Bitcoin elite.

http://btcbase.org/log/2016-06-22#1486939

That has always been my assumption as well.

I figured that is why some geekcool, technobabbling, spacedout WoW teenager running it was a perfect fit.

And remember Peter Thiel awarded $100,000 scholarship to Vitalik, at the early juncture.

Note the ideas from Ethereum may not be entirely garbage. I originally thought they were, but I'm leaning otherwise now.

[iamnotback]

Yes the attacker is on the move again right now. He donated some ether into the DAO and joined both whitehat splits. We drained the ETH he donated as fast as we could but he got what he wanted.

An attacker in now part of split 78 and he can now do the split attack again in that white hat DAOs.

Analogous to the unbounded recursion of Turing-complete scripting, the splitting can be recursed. Are we surprised.

Until it's fixed. Surprised this has to be repeated.

Looks like the only fix is going to be a fork.

If you fork it, some of us will no longer be willing to support Ethereum and we will actively develop a competing project.

I don't want to get into a debate about first mover, size of market, etc.. I understand already the points you would make. I am just making you aware that forking, will also fork your supporters. Please be aware of the cost.

Re: Why does no one use the BitShares Exchange DEX?

MP nixes DEX for real-time trading:

http://trilema.com/2013/why-i-nixed-p2p-colored-coins-and-all-that-jazz/


He implies that if we prove him wrong, then he can just take the value for himself.

But if the system is truly decentralized, he can't take the value and no one can.

Who is correct? MP or the future of DEX?

I'll say something about this with code.

[funkenstein]

...

Incorrect. The point is that no matter what proof-of-work algorithm an altcoin employs, those who are protecting Bitcoin will rent enough mining hash rate to fuck your coin forever. They only have to rent it for a short period of time, and your difficulty will be so high that it will never produce a block again. And all the money in the chain will be unspendable for a very, very, very long time.

The "attacker" has the resources to do that to any proof-of-work altcoin which doesn't have the level of hashrate of Bitcoin.

Of course the altcoin can then manually reset the difficulty lower using a fork, but then the attacker can repeat again. It will quickly become clear that the altcoin is fucked.

If Monero starts to approach $1 billion market cap (or perhaps much less if the liquidity is very high, which it is for Monero), this attacker will destroy Monero and profit by shorting.

Dude you need to read tardlema a little longer before reposting the derpage here.  (I've been reading for years as you can tell by my fluent orcish).  

Otherwise, go ahead and rent some SHA256 asics and attack litecoin and monero with them.  I'll wait.  

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1520691.msg15316487#msg15316487
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1520691.msg15316642#msg15316642
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1520691.msg15314867#msg15314867
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1520691.msg15313262#msg15313262
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1520691.msg15313922#msg15313922
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1520691.msg15313993#msg15313993

Hmm, i guess I didn't make my point clear, sorry.  My point was that your previously linked article (why there are no such thing as cryptocurrenciies)  assumed that hashpower is fungible across altcoin networks when in fact it isn't.  I only listed the coins as examples of coins secured with different hash functions, which are not mineable with SHA256 hardware. 

[iamnotback]

Hmm, i guess I didn't make my point clear, sorry.  My point was that your previously linked article (why there are no such thing as cryptocurrenciies)  assumed that hashpower is fungible across altcoin networks when in fact it isn't.  I only listed the coins as examples of coins secured with different hash functions, which are not mineable with SHA256 hardware.  

I wasn't aware that the original source was making that presumption (well I vaguely remember an allusion to Bitcoin copy coins). It makes sense though, as it is a lot more practical to attack with ASICs you already have.

But the reason I don't think the original source means what you think it means, is because the author linked to that article again in the recent discussion of his DAO hack. So it seems he thinks it is still applicable to relevant altcoins (i.e. worth even attacking), of which none that I know of use SHA256.

Any way, it is sometimes difficult to know what that author thinks because he is cryptic.

[iamnotback]

How is Andreas fornicating with his "overtaking the world" memes the past few hours?

If they had only taken the -33% haircut instead of doubling-down on self-belief. But the class action lawsuits were likely perceived to be on the horizon.

Or if they had never launched this delusional smart contakes in the first place.

Aha, Ethereum core BCT promoter confirms the irrefutable power of unstoppable organization:

Read an article today that said at the time of the MtGox BTC heist had the attackers been known or the address the millions in Bitcoin disappeared to a fork would have been considered. Apparently over 6 propel committed suicide over MtGox. Now imagine the blood on your BTC Spoetniktard goon shill hands if the ETH community doesn't do what it votes for.

[iamnotback]

Seems there is a lot of confusion about why Ethereum's price doesn't go down when in a free market it should:

To be honest here, I have no idea how ETH isn't collapsing as people move their ETH to BTC or fiat or gold or whatever. I mean, how come people has still thousands of BTC on the ETH market? I have no idea beyond thinking marketing is a very powerful thing to raise the price of an asset.

I mean fuck, who believes in ETH long term after Vitalik Buterin told exchanges to stop trading to stop panic selling? I think this fact alone makes ETH something you can't trust.

Im waiting for Rootstock to see if it can replace ETH, but for now I would stay cautious with smart contracts stuff.

Even the DAO attacker explains ETH is not dropping because buying demand is printed out-of-thin-air by the insiders employing margin trading with the ETH they probably deceptively obtained by buying the ICO from themselves. Review the following linked posts for the details:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1413819.msg15343686#msg15343686
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1413819.msg15363783#msg15363783
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1526067.msg15362605#msg15362605
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1413819.msg15364284#msg15364284
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1526614.msg15365639#msg15365639
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1526990.msg15364629#msg15364629

Im waiting for Rootstock to see if it can replace ETH, but for now I would stay cautious with smart contracts stuff.

RootStock is technologically flawed, because Sidechains can't be secure. Review the following linked posts for the details:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1518508.msg15284907#msg15284907
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1518508.msg15286570#msg15286570

CounterParty is technologically flawed, because Bitcoin's block chain can't secure what it doesn't validate. Review the following linked post for the details:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1518508.msg15283868#msg15283868

Someone please ask Andreas if he wants to continue promoting scams:

apparently this isn't something to argue. for if one of these token get to be on the market with high value. it wouldn't be scam anymore.

You think ETH is not a scam any more as the insiders allegedly continue to pump it using margin traded creation of demand out-of-thin-air so that at the end bag holders will be holding empty bags worth 0 and the insiders will have siphoned off all the BTC you all invested.

With sufficient ignorance of you speculators, our crypto ecosystem will become nothing but a criminal enterprise. Thank you.

Edit: another confirmation of my stance on CounterParty and RootStock:

Counterparty and RootStock are two smart-contract projects building on top of bitcoin this way. But, Counterparty bundles its state (how much the guest owes you, etc) into bitcoin transactions, which weren’t designed for this purpose.

This also limits Counterparty transactions to bitcoin’s 10-minute block time, rather than ethereum’s 15-second one. Meanwhile, RootStock is far behind ethereum in development, arguably falling further behind every day, and involves some technical challenges (how to reliably transfer coins between the bitcoin blockchain and RootStock blockchain) that don’t appear to be fully worked out yet.

In both cases, you’re now dependent on two separate networks and technologies: bitcoin, and Counterparty or RootStock.

XCP is not the only smart contract for bitcoin
rootstock and i think maidsafe

I explained a few posts above that XCP is a flawed.

RootStock doesn't have that same flaw, because it is its own side-chain and can verify every transaction. But side-chains have other problems and I expect them to be a clusterfuck.

[funkenstein]

Any way, it is sometimes difficult to know what that author thinks because he is cryptic.

The word you are looking for is "senile". 

[Fasunathan]

iamnotback, do you mean all the smart contract platforms are flawed? Is there a way to rectify the problems?

[BTCwriter]

Ethereum is done.

[iamnotback]

iamnotback, do you mean all the smart contract platforms are flawed? Is there a way to rectify the problems?

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1505886.msg15306066#msg15306066
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1505886.msg15273183#msg15273183

So I think some good can come out of doing more with block chains, but the exact form is going to require more careful work and research.

[Bokelka]

iamnotback, do you mean all the smart contract platforms are flawed? Is there a way to rectify the problems?

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1505886.msg15306066#msg15306066
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1505886.msg15273183#msg15273183

So I think some good can come out of doing more with block chains, but the exact form is going to require more careful work and research.

I hope the Ethereum developers will notice your thoughts and give them a careful consideration to improve it.

[iamnotback]

Written just before The DAO attack:

So the new normal is write 2080 lines of code (less code than I write in a week) and raise $168 million or don't write any code and use someone else's code and raise $15 million:

Just stay away if you're not invested or slowly sell them without upsetting the price if you're holding them. You are missing the opportunity to invest in other more profitable prospects. Looking at github they have been working on these projects but without any solid results yet. So it might better to wait until they have something to show for and check of their assets are worth to invest in.

Such as Waves which apparently raised $15 million for vaporware and selling a crowdsale pitching IOHK's open source code (and which jl777 was said to be advisor):

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1504381.msg15138357#msg15138357

And Lisk which raised $10 million apparently still has problems in the functioning of the wallet:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1504381.msg15139560#msg15139560

Or The DAO which raised $168 million with only 2080 lines of sol code:

https://github.com/slockit/DAO

Seems these days it is better to be good at marketing and selling ideas than actual code that is stable and ready for the launch.

And another on this topic:

Copy-cat ICO Schemes Unleashed:
You call stayed silent on that and we seen an explosion of copy cat ICO schemes unleashed..
And we seen the greedy profiteer dregs go along with it all so they could profit off them all.

When i asked the dev of BlockNET why he needed a million dollars in Bitcoin
He told me word for word, "to ensure it's a success"

Crypto-Minimum Wage Increase ?
When i started this coin devs would work on projects for FREE.. mostly.
Satoshi did not put his hand out and say i want a MILLION DOLLARS first before i release anything..

It is true that the ICOs aren't really providing any funding for development that matters. It is just the insiders cashing out.

That being said, no top notch s/w developer will work on a risky project that might net him $0, if he can't at least generate $250,000 per year of effort. And that is really on the low end since most of them can make that much (and more with stock options) in a job in silicon valley.

For example, I have been doing research and basically "working" in crypto since 2013. If I launched a project, I would expect to recover those years of investment.

But I also wouldn't waste all the funds on nonsense development of pie-in-the-sky fantasies.

But any way, I am not going to ask anyone to give me an ICO money. Mined distribution is clearly the fair way to launch a coin.

But just keep in mind if the developer is receivng a $million for years of effort, it is really just about break even, if he is a top developer. Please be respectful of the opportunity cost of top developers.

Also even the developers have a right to seek higher ROI. Speculators invest and risk to get a big payoff. When developers invest their time/effort and risk to get a big payoff, this is capitalism.

Having said that, afaik most of the developers of altcoins are not top developers. Afaics, most of them have nearly no experience as employed software developers before their work in crypto. This is excluding the Bitcoin core devs of course. There are experienced developers in the Bitcoin ecosystem.

The DAO is only 2080 lines of source code. And it can never be "fixed" or "finished" any more than it already is, because it is a flawed concept and I have difficulty believing Tual doesn't realize it.. It probably wasn't intended to grow into something great. It was probably a quickie rush to latch on to the euphoria about ETH and so those looking to cash out of ETH at the double-top at $15, had another option The DAO. It was probably a timing and marketing product decision and not an engineering or long-range focus. I could understand your criticism of something like that. But it is a free market and you can't stop them.

[iamnotback]

Lol, the Ethereum soft fork has a DoS attack vulnerability:

https://blog.ethereum.org/2016/06/28/security-alert-dos-vulnerability-in-the-soft-fork/

http://hackingdistributed.com/2016/06/28/ethereum-soft-fork-dos-vector/

This all-star programming team is proving to be not so worthy.

[parmatiya]

Lol, the Ethereum soft fork has a DoS attack vulnerability:

https://blog.ethereum.org/2016/06/28/security-alert-dos-vulnerability-in-the-soft-fork/

http://hackingdistributed.com/2016/06/28/ethereum-soft-fork-dos-vector/

This all-star programming team is proving to be not so worthy.

Are you interested in joining their team? Maybe you can make the team work better and produce better programs.

[a fool and his money ...]

Antonopulous has become a shitcoin pumper who abuses his reputation to pump various shitcoins. I have no idea why he would be relevant.

"Guineapigs will be millionaires" smh

[iamnotback]

Antonopulous has become a shitcoin pumper who abuses his reputation to pump various shitcoins. I have no idea why he would be relevant.

"Guineapigs will be millionaires" smh

Interesting perspective. Thanks.