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Author Topic: [Group Buy] Avalon ASIC Batch 3 [CLOSED- Seven 4 module Avalons ordered]  (Read 48963 times)
CoinHoarder
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March 30, 2013, 10:11:22 PM
 #581

Hi all, hope you're having a nice holiday weekend!

I am seriously entertaining the idea of adding our group as an asset on Litecoinglobal.com. This would solve several problems for me and the group immediately.

First of all, this would allow everyone in the group to buy and sell shares at any time without me having to do all the work. I can tell you guys right now, my fees are very small and soon difficulty will be very high. I do not want to spend all my free time transferring shares all the time for everyone for pennies. I need to have a life too.

Secondly, this would be a way for me to streamline dividend payments. This is one of the only remaining things to figure out before our Avalons come. I could write a shell script for bitcoind to do this, but then I will not be allowing the buying/selling of ahares because it would again, require too much upkeep for little incentive.

Honestly, I'm not too familiar with litecoinglobal or what kind of fees, etc. would be involved, but I know it is a possible solution to the problems we face ahead of us. I am interested in everyone's opinions on this and how we should proceed. Please speak up!

Thanks,

Ch

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cryptojournal
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March 30, 2013, 10:12:48 PM
 #582

Ok, so spread risks... i mean it has advantages this way too.

At least that's what I'd like to see. Can't speak for anyone else. We should propably do a google group or something so we could spread documents and do polls very easily.

I'm for sharing the risk. I think it's more fair and much more simple this way.
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March 30, 2013, 10:15:17 PM
 #583

Hi all, hope you're having a nice holiday weekend!

I am seriously entertaining the idea of adding our group as an asset on Litecoinglobal.com. This would solve several problems for me and the group immediately.

First of all, this would allow everyone in the group to buy and sell shares at any time without me having to do all the work. I can tell you guys right now, my fees are very small and soon difficulty will be very high. I do not want to spend all my free time transferring shares all the time for everyone for pennies. I need to have a life too.

Secondly, this would be a way for me to streamline dividend payments. This is one of the only remaining things to figure out before our Avalons come. I could write a shell script for bitcoind to do this, but then I will not be allowing the buying/selling of ahares because it would again, require too much upkeep for little incentive.

Honestly, I'm not too familiar with litecoinglobal or what kind of fees, etc. would be involved, but I know it is a possible solution to the problems we face ahead of us. I am interested in everyone's opinions on this and how we should proceed. Please speak up!

Thanks,

Ch

Hi CH,

I'm not a big fan of this option [edit: mainly because it introduces a layer of counterparty risk (exchange trust/hack), which I consider is very low when dealing directly with you], but I must confess I haven't had the time to think it out. But if you really want to list this on an exchange, please list it on btct, not LTC Global. This is a BTC group buy for a product generating BTCs, and not LTC, so I think it has no place on ltc global, which would force a conversion everytime a dividend is paid, and I'm not even talking about the fees...
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March 30, 2013, 10:24:42 PM
 #584

I am seriously entertaining the idea of adding our group as an asset on Litecoinglobal.com. This would solve several problems for me and the group immediately.

I would be a possible option if the amount of trades remains high, but maybe it's best (since they haven't arrived yet and won't for a while) to see if the volume keeps up after an initial rearranging of shares?
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March 30, 2013, 10:58:21 PM
 #585

That will not do.... when all is up and running, and the dust has settled... I want at least one picture of "My Precious" working his butt off... So I move we have CH put a large sticker on every machine
with a number... don't care on what order of color.... as long as there is a "My Precious" with a large #1 on it....

Also, we need a jazzy name for our group  Grin
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March 30, 2013, 11:00:09 PM
 #586

What I'm hoping, is that there is enough buying interest within our own group to purchase anybody who wants out, for exactly the price they came in (I'll probably be a buyer).  If we give ourselves two weeks to set up the guidelines and such, and have CH's approval ahead of that time, then the first "bulk transfer" of those who want to sell could happen on April 14th.

I am wondering why some want out so quickly - after just a few days, other than making a quick profit by selling their share at two or three times their investment. I think somewhere in the topic a listing on Litecoinglobal was mentioned. That's probably a good option, but until then, since almost everybody wants to either buy more or sell everything, the fairest way (at least for this first redistribution of shares) is probably dividing up all shares to be sold amongst all those looking to buy more, by % already invested, by % willing to additional invest or just divided up by number of buyers.

I agree with this approach, because it would be the most fair for the buyers of the unwanted shares. However, the problem lies with the sellers possibly wanting to be compensated differently for their shares. How do we deal with that if we are to group all of the unwanted shares from multiple sellers into 1 pool?
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March 30, 2013, 11:11:20 PM
 #587

What I'm hoping, is that there is enough buying interest within our own group to purchase anybody who wants out, for exactly the price they came in (I'll probably be a buyer).  If we give ourselves two weeks to set up the guidelines and such, and have CH's approval ahead of that time, then the first "bulk transfer" of those who want to sell could happen on April 14th.

I am wondering why some want out so quickly - after just a few days, other than making a quick profit by selling their share at two or three times their investment. I think somewhere in the topic a listing on Litecoinglobal was mentioned. That's probably a good option, but until then, since almost everybody wants to either buy more or sell everything, the fairest way (at least for this first redistribution of shares) is probably dividing up all shares to be sold amongst all those looking to buy more, by % already invested, by % willing to additional invest or just divided up by number of buyers.

I agree with this approach, because it would be the most fair for the buyers of the unwanted shares. However, the problem lies with the sellers possibly wanting to be compensated differently for their shares. How do we deal with that if we are to group all of the unwanted shares from multiple sellers into 1 pool?

I also agree with what mrbrt and koquillion said. But this is a difficult matter. I have no idea why some people want to get out already, but I guess that certain circumstances can always change things. I would be willing to buy some shares as well, if some of the other people who invested one or two bitcoins are dropping out. I don't have that much money myself, but I do think that this is a great opportunity.

But indeed, people wanting different amounts of money for their shares might be troublesome. We could maybe decide on some fixed price, but then again I don't know if everyone would agree to that.

That will not do.... when all is up and running, and the dust has settled... I want at least one picture of "My Precious" working his butt off... So I move we have CH put a large sticker on every machine
with a number... don't care on what order of color.... as long as there is a "My Precious" with a large #1 on it....

Also, we need a jazzy name for our group  Grin
What about something like... the Bebop Batch Miners. Jazzy enough? Tongue



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March 30, 2013, 11:12:30 PM
 #588

How do we deal with that if we are to group all of the unwanted shares from multiple sellers into 1 pool?

We could decide on a collective offer per share? We probably wouldn't be able to match every offer to buy/sell (since apparently 3 times the investment amount has already been offered) but if we can include most of them, trading would at least be less effort in administration and still make most people happy. Having a smaller number of investors in total probably makes things easier overall.

I would not be against offering a somewhat larger amount (though not double) than the actual amount invested as a compensation.
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March 30, 2013, 11:23:23 PM
 #589

Hi all, hope you're having a nice holiday weekend!

I am seriously entertaining the idea of adding our group as an asset on Litecoinglobal.com. This would solve several problems for me and the group immediately.

First of all, this would allow everyone in the group to buy and sell shares at any time without me having to do all the work. I can tell you guys right now, my fees are very small and soon difficulty will be very high. I do not want to spend all my free time transferring shares all the time for everyone for pennies. I need to have a life too.

Secondly, this would be a way for me to streamline dividend payments. This is one of the only remaining things to figure out before our Avalons come. I could write a shell script for bitcoind to do this, but then I will not be allowing the buying/selling of ahares because it would again, require too much upkeep for little incentive.

Honestly, I'm not too familiar with litecoinglobal or what kind of fees, etc. would be involved, but I know it is a possible solution to the problems we face ahead of us. I am interested in everyone's opinions on this and how we should proceed. Please speak up!

Thanks,

Ch

As Cryptojournal said, if you want to use an exchange, use BTCT. But I also would prefer receiving BTC directly from you.

I see that there are 100 investors that put on the table less than 10 BTC and 32 that put 10 BTC or more.
For those who want to sell there shares, they should be allowed only for a short period of time and only with those who already have shares. That way, you will have less investors and less transactions to do each month.
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March 30, 2013, 11:30:11 PM
 #590

I think all trading should remain internal (between existing shareholders) unless there is no demand for shares amongst us (doubtful). I agree this lessens the work load for CH/admin.

sc
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March 30, 2013, 11:32:25 PM
 #591

Hi CH,

I'm not a big fan of this option [edit: mainly because it introduces a layer of counterparty risk (exchange trust/hack), which I consider is very low when dealing directly with you], but I must confess I haven't had the time to think it out. But if you really want to list this on an exchange, please list it on btct, not LTC Global. This is a BTC group buy for a product generating BTCs, and not LTC, so I think it has no place on ltc global, which would force a conversion everytime a dividend is paid, and I'm not even talking about the fees...


As Cryptojournal said, if you want to use an exchange, use BTCT. But I also would prefer receiving BTC directly from you.

I see that there are 100 investors that put on the table less than 10 BTC and 32 that put 10 BTC or more.
For those who want to sell there shares, they should be allowed only for a short period of time and only with those who already have shares. That way, you will have less investors and less transactions to do each month.

I agree, I dunno why I suggested LTCglobal first... I guess it was the first exchange that popped into my head.

BTCT would definitely be the best route to go IF we are to get listed on an exchange.

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March 30, 2013, 11:40:30 PM
 #592

I would be hesitant to have this venture use an exchange. While it would make buying and selling shares easier, along with dividends, we've all seen what happened to GLBSE... if an exchange goes belly up it tends to make life really hard dealing with the administrative work and for share owners.

Also, I checked out your spreadsheet earlier CoinHoarder. Looks good for me! Grin

BTC: 1MeTeorfxZNsY6gJDBtrF8JA8KEv6SKGUmLTC: Lejxgou6hUkjupF6RoruxJGG9AQ7t3ovYt
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March 30, 2013, 11:41:00 PM
 #593

My 1 BTC deposit and the address are both correct.

Great work CH Smiley
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March 30, 2013, 11:54:11 PM
 #594

How do we deal with that if we are to group all of the unwanted shares from multiple sellers into 1 pool?

We could decide on a collective offer per share? We probably wouldn't be able to match every offer to buy/sell (since apparently 3 times the investment amount has already been offered) but if we can include most of them, trading would at least be less effort in administration and still make most people happy. Having a smaller number of investors in total probably makes things easier overall.

I would not be against offering a somewhat larger amount (though not double) than the actual amount invested as a compensation.


I think this is worth a shot, especially if several investors are interested in dumping their shares, per CH's earlier post.

As far as admin goes I would be willing to help in whatever role is needed. Perhaps someone with the expertise can set up a site to automate the btc mined minus fees, electric, etc, and then divy up btc payout per share %?
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March 30, 2013, 11:56:36 PM
 #595

I would rather not use an exchange, it's probably the easiest option but we could run into potential issues if they got hacked, suffer from downtime, etc.

Buying and selling shares seems like a maintenance nightmare, though, I guess it wouldn't be too bad if purchases are limited to those within the group already. Someone else said it (and I agree with them) that any share selling should be locked once the Avalons arrive to minimize the workload for CH.
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March 30, 2013, 11:59:55 PM
 #596

I would rather not use an exchange, it's probably the easiest option but we could run into potential issues if they got hacked, suffer from downtime, etc.

Buying and selling shares seems like a maintenance nightmare, though, I guess it wouldn't be too bad if purchases are limited to those within the group already. Someone else said it (and I agree with them) that any share selling should be locked once the Avalons arrive to minimize the workload for CH.

Newer exchanges address the problems that happened with glbse.com. I wouldnt store money on an exchange for longer anyway and users and issuers can get a csv-list with all the shares connected to the members so that the death of such exchange wouldnt mean a big problem.
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March 31, 2013, 12:25:40 AM
 #597

I like the idea of btct and I will donate .25 btc towards the listing fee if that is the route taken by CoinHoarder.
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March 31, 2013, 12:25:52 AM
 #598

i also approve btct IF we MUST go there,otherwise i would prefer not involve into that. As for shares selling i think it should be easy. Just internal transactions, the buyer send the btc to the owner of shares, show proof of transacvtion and CH modify the percentage. To helpwiththis and don't usemuch free timewe should establish 2 days a month where we can sell/buy shares.. for example.

- i buy 1btc to a guy that has 2, i show transaction proof, my shares is increased to 2 and the other guy will have 1.

to make things smoother we should try to coordinate with others, example

-me and another buyer buy the 2 btc to nthe other guy, then CH will erase the seller address leaving less investors to deal with.
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March 31, 2013, 12:28:37 AM
 #599

How do we deal with that if we are to group all of the unwanted shares from multiple sellers into 1 pool?

We could decide on a collective offer per share? We probably wouldn't be able to match every offer to buy/sell (since apparently 3 times the investment amount has already been offered) but if we can include most of them, trading would at least be less effort in administration and still make most people happy. Having a smaller number of investors in total probably makes things easier overall.

I would not be against offering a somewhat larger amount (though not double) than the actual amount invested as a compensation.


I think this is worth a shot, especially if several investors are interested in dumping their shares, per CH's earlier post.

As far as admin goes I would be willing to help in whatever role is needed. Perhaps someone with the expertise can set up a site to automate the btc mined minus fees, electric, etc, and then divy up btc payout per share %?

Shall we give it a try and start with a list of who wants to sell/buy/hold?

Based on the posts on the previous pages of the thread, willing to buy are:
- bitrocket
- cryptojournal
- dchou
- ibminer
- khamark
- koquillion
- silvercoins
- skyhigh2004

Selling are:
- Rampion (2BTC)
- TheJuice (partial)

My suggestion would be to add something to the price of the share (opening offer: shall we say 20%?) to compensate for things like the trouble of investing and to provide some profit.

I'm not against either allowing new investors into the group or a listing on an exchange, but I think the most important thing for us (besides a jazzy name) is to get organized as a group and making sure everyone is happy with their share.
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March 31, 2013, 12:29:26 AM
 #600

Hi all, hope you're having a nice holiday weekend!

I am seriously entertaining the idea of adding our group as an asset on Litecoinglobal.com. This would solve several problems for me and the group immediately.

First of all, this would allow everyone in the group to buy and sell shares at any time without me having to do all the work. I can tell you guys right now, my fees are very small and soon difficulty will be very high. I do not want to spend all my free time transferring shares all the time for everyone for pennies. I need to have a life too.

Secondly, this would be a way for me to streamline dividend payments. This is one of the only remaining things to figure out before our Avalons come. I could write a shell script for bitcoind to do this, but then I will not be allowing the buying/selling of ahares because it would again, require too much upkeep for little incentive.

Honestly, I'm not too familiar with litecoinglobal or what kind of fees, etc. would be involved, but I know it is a possible solution to the problems we face ahead of us. I am interested in everyone's opinions on this and how we should proceed. Please speak up!

Thanks,

Ch

You should only have to do the work you have signed on for, and others have agreed to up front,

[1] that is Only give people back in proportion to what they invested minus fees.
[2] No share scheme or other fees should be added unless 100% agreed which is likely impossible, why should any ones terms be varied because of a majority vote, unless you can some how leave the non voting group on original terms
[3]If people want to sell of shares, let them make their own shares and sought that out themselves
[4]If people want to band together and all move to some aggregated share model, let them pay that from their fees

IF your fee model kept the same for reduced workload then you would be ok with out any vote because you are still keeping to the whole terms of the agreement,


Edit
even if you go for the internal model, this means more work for you, and thus dilutes your attention from tending the farm...rest..etc....and you have to do all sorts of things like decide compensation level for current sellers, anyone on the list can contact any one else and make an offer, or anyone selling on the list can say the want to sell and at what rate, I would want you compensated however for any redirection of  BTC's (except maybe from original holders), otherwise you will be doing this as a full time job


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