France(ism): ban the burkinis

[mOgliE]

You know that's ridiculous.  You are directly comparing "cold weather (cold water) gear" to what might be worn on the beach in the middle of summer.

If you don't believe me, try swimming in really cold water.  Please do report back.  And by the way, the burkini doesn't prevent the cold like the wetsuit does.

Still less ridiculous than thinking you have the right to tell anyone what they can or can't wear when it causes zero harm to anyone else.  For a forum that's supposedly full of libertarians, there's quite a few authoritarian traditionalists about who clearly don't believe in any form of personal freedom whatsoever.  Who gives a shit if it doesn't prevent the cold?  It's their choice.  Not yours.

And so I refuted one argument, and an entirely unrelated one is presented.

It's so laughable....one argues for requiring bikinis, and he's now an "authoritarian traditionalist."

Let them find their own secluded fucking burkini beach.

You know that's ridiculous.  You are directly comparing "cold weather (cold water) gear" to what might be worn on the beach in the middle of summer.

If you don't believe me, try swimming in really cold water.  Please do report back.  And by the way, the burkini doesn't prevent the cold like the wetsuit does.

Still less ridiculous than thinking you have the right to tell anyone what they can or can't wear when it causes zero harm to anyone else.  For a forum that's supposedly full of libertarians, there's quite a few authoritarian traditionalists about who clearly don't believe in any form of personal freedom whatsoever.  Who gives a shit if it doesn't prevent the cold?  It's their choice.  Not yours.

When i go to the beach i want to relax?..
Now when a Muslim walks on the beach with a burkini on i think as she got a bomb under that outfit
then i think will some more Muslims pop up and blow us up..
THEN YOU JUST SPOILED MY DAY OUT  ..I CANNOT RELAX....

I think that's a totally reasonable point of view.

Given the simple fact that they DO HIDE THINGS under their clothes.  Things that go boom.

Yeah very reasonable point of view! Let's ban everyone and everything that doesn't suit you. So start with burkini,  then maybe young people because they make noise, then any people with dogs, and why not couples?

See, freedom stops where the freedom of others starts. It doesn't harm you in any way to see other people with burkini, so why should it be forbiden ?

[European Central Bank]

I find this whole thing really freaking bizarre. it's an item of clothing that fits the way they want to live their life. they are citizens of a supposedly free country who should be free to do what they want.

it's one thing to ban religious symbols from schools and public buildings, but I don't get that either, it's another level of weirdness to get heavy about this.

they do have track record about this though. I don't of any other country that forces you to wear speedos so it's evidently some glitch in the French psyche.

[Masha Sha]

You know that's ridiculous.  You are directly comparing "cold weather (cold water) gear" to what might be worn on the beach in the middle of summer.

If you don't believe me, try swimming in really cold water.  Please do report back.  And by the way, the burkini doesn't prevent the cold like the wetsuit does.

Still less ridiculous than thinking you have the right to tell anyone what they can or can't wear when it causes zero harm to anyone else.  For a forum that's supposedly full of libertarians, there's quite a few authoritarian traditionalists about who clearly don't believe in any form of personal freedom whatsoever.  Who gives a shit if it doesn't prevent the cold?  It's their choice.  Not yours.

The more I read you the more I like you!
Crazy to see those "btc is freedom" people asking for laws that forbid people to wear certain clothes...

Correct, except that it's the muslims who want to ban women from wearing certain clothes. Muslims don't want women to wear bikinis, and that burkini thing is only the beginning. Soon, they will also ban women from wearing skirts, and that's already happening in several countries, just like in some neighborhoods of France.

If someone wants to know what freedom looks like, a travel to a muslim country provides a quick lesson.

No there is no place in france where you get hurt for not wearing a burka. That's just shit propaganda it doesn't happen.

LoL a francist refuse to see reality... Pathological denial of reality detected.

[Gronthaing]

Now sarkozy is trying to score political points saying he will change the constitution to allow the ban if he gets reelected.

it's one thing to ban religious symbols from schools and public buildings, but I don't get that either, it's another level of weirdness to get heavy about this.

Different things. Banning religious symbols from schools and public buildings has to do with separation of church and state. The state not imposing a religion on people. Everyone is still able to choose what they want to believe in. This law is just stupid and unconstitutional.

[European Central Bank]

This law is just stupid and unconstitutional.

I've spent a lot of time in france. there's a lot of stuff I couldn't put up with. it's about as close to communism as you're gonna get in Europe these days.

[xhomerx10]

This law is just stupid and unconstitutional.

I've spent a lot of time in france. there's a lot of stuff I couldn't put up with. it's about as close to communism as you're gonna get in Europe these days.

 So aside from the radical islamists randomly attacking and killing people, please tell us what stuff was unbearable for you.  What freedoms did you feel you didn't have while you were freely coming and going to this communist paradise?  List those things that you couldn't put up with.  Were you unable to find the new heavily guarded Charlie Hebdo office?  Did you miss an event at the Bataclan?  Was your sunbathing interrupted during the police investigation in Nice after Bastille Day?

 The law was made by regional governments as a reactionary measure to give the percpetion to the public that something was being done to protect them. This is what leaders do!  They come up with solutions to problems.  Elected representatives are not necessarily the brightest individuals but the beauty of living in a free society is that you have recourse and those laws can be appealed.  There is however, no coming back from having your life premaurely snuffed out by a misguided radical freely expressing himself with a rifle, knife, truck or bomb.

 Do you have answers to this problem?
 ...I doubt it.

 How about you Masha Sah?  You're great a posting the political issues... how about your solution?


 

[countryfree]

We should invite a saudi woman to tell what she thinks.
I remember dining in Cannes a few years ago, when a group of 20 saudis arrived around midnight. They were all loud and flashing their money, with some women showing serious cleavage (as most women do in Cannes). It was obvious the women were having a good time, and enjoying the freedom they had in France.
More recently, in Geneva, I saw an arab walking with his woman fully veiled behind him, I can't say if she was having fun, but I don't think so.

[Spendulus]

You know that's ridiculous.  You are directly comparing "cold weather (cold water) gear" to what might be worn on the beach in the middle of summer.

If you don't believe me, try swimming in really cold water.  Please do report back.  And by the way, the burkini doesn't prevent the cold like the wetsuit does.

Still less ridiculous than thinking you have the right to tell anyone what they can or can't wear when it causes zero harm to anyone else.  For a forum that's supposedly full of libertarians, there's quite a few authoritarian traditionalists about who clearly don't believe in any form of personal freedom whatsoever.  Who gives a shit if it doesn't prevent the cold?  It's their choice.  Not yours.

And so I refuted one argument, and an entirely unrelated one is presented.

It's so laughable....one argues for requiring bikinis, and he's now an "authoritarian traditionalist."

Let them find their own secluded fucking burkini beach.

You know that's ridiculous.  You are directly comparing "cold weather (cold water) gear" to what might be worn on the beach in the middle of summer.

If you don't believe me, try swimming in really cold water.  Please do report back.  And by the way, the burkini doesn't prevent the cold like the wetsuit does.

Still less ridiculous than thinking you have the right to tell anyone what they can or can't wear when it causes zero harm to anyone else.  For a forum that's supposedly full of libertarians, there's quite a few authoritarian traditionalists about who clearly don't believe in any form of personal freedom whatsoever.  Who gives a shit if it doesn't prevent the cold?  It's their choice.  Not yours.

When i go to the beach i want to relax?..
Now when a Muslim walks on the beach with a burkini on i think as she got a bomb under that outfit
then i think will some more Muslims pop up and blow us up..
THEN YOU JUST SPOILED MY DAY OUT  ..I CANNOT RELAX....

I think that's a totally reasonable point of view.

Given the simple fact that they DO HIDE THINGS under their clothes.  Things that go boom.

Yeah very reasonable point of view! Let's ban everyone and everything that doesn't suit you. So start with burkini,  then maybe young people because they make noise, then any people with dogs, and why not couples?

See, freedom stops where the freedom of others starts. It doesn't harm you in any way to see other people with burkini, so why should it be forbiden ?

As usual you have no logic.

Dogs ARE regulated because they can bite and can have rabies.

[popcorn1]

You know that's ridiculous.  You are directly comparing "cold weather (cold water) gear" to what might be worn on the beach in the middle of summer.

If you don't believe me, try swimming in really cold water.  Please do report back.  And by the way, the burkini doesn't prevent the cold like the wetsuit does.

Still less ridiculous than thinking you have the right to tell anyone what they can or can't wear when it causes zero harm to anyone else.  For a forum that's supposedly full of libertarians, there's quite a few authoritarian traditionalists about who clearly don't believe in any form of personal freedom whatsoever.  Who gives a shit if it doesn't prevent the cold?  It's their choice.  Not yours.

And so I refuted one argument, and an entirely unrelated one is presented.

It's so laughable....one argues for requiring bikinis, and he's now an "authoritarian traditionalist."

Let them find their own secluded fucking burkini beach.

You know that's ridiculous.  You are directly comparing "cold weather (cold water) gear" to what might be worn on the beach in the middle of summer.

If you don't believe me, try swimming in really cold water.  Please do report back.  And by the way, the burkini doesn't prevent the cold like the wetsuit does.

Still less ridiculous than thinking you have the right to tell anyone what they can or can't wear when it causes zero harm to anyone else.  For a forum that's supposedly full of libertarians, there's quite a few authoritarian traditionalists about who clearly don't believe in any form of personal freedom whatsoever.  Who gives a shit if it doesn't prevent the cold?  It's their choice.  Not yours.

When i go to the beach i want to relax?..
Now when a Muslim walks on the beach with a burkini on i think as she got a bomb under that outfit
then i think will some more Muslims pop up and blow us up..
THEN YOU JUST SPOILED MY DAY OUT  ..I CANNOT RELAX....

I think that's a totally reasonable point of view.

Given the simple fact that they DO HIDE THINGS under their clothes.  Things that go boom.

Yeah very reasonable point of view! Let's ban everyone and everything that doesn't suit you. So start with burkini,  then maybe young people because they make noise, then any people with dogs, and why not couples?

See, freedom stops where the freedom of others starts. It doesn't harm you in any way to see other people with burkini, so why should it be forbiden ?

It's not forbidden if you go back to Muslim lands ..We are at war with Islam state..

Sentencing Of The Birmingham Jihadi Terror Cell - YouTube
Video for terrorists arrested in birmingham youtube▶ 3:41
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZrTabhcXdTQ
21 Feb 2013 - Uploaded by Wrath0fKhan
CNN's Dan Rivers recounts the evidence against a British terror ring ... Irfan Naseer, Irfan Khalid and ..

3 YEARS GONE BY AND STILL WE GET THIS?

Arrest Of Terror Suspect At U.K. Airport - YouTube
Video for terrorists arrested in birmingham youtube▶ 0:43
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TKlFowMA4to
15 Apr 2016 - Uploaded by wochit News
... officials said five terror suspects were arrested in the U.K. The U... ... city of Birmingham on Thursday night ..

Bomb squad puts city street in lockdown after five men arrested in anti ...
Video for 4 terrorists arrested in birmingham▶ 0:32
www.mirror.co.uk › News › UK News › Terrorism
3 days ago
Heavy police presence in Birmingham after terror alert and arrests made ... and was warned by police that

Burkini symbol of ISLAM     ISLAM =BOMBS=DEATH=SADNESS..
And like i said i went the beach to relax  STRESS=CANCER

So it could harm me by getting blew up..
Then i could get cancer with the stress knowing we have a Muslim fanatic on the beach..
Now she must be a fanatic because why she gone that far to wear the Burkini in the first place?..

Now if a women come on the beach showing her body then said she was a muslim i would think oh she must be a moderate Muslim..My thinking not to serious about fairy tales hmm happy days..
Then that be ok with me..NOT THE BURKINI.. FANATIC MUSLIM.. BOMBS=DEATH=SADNESS..

I say give ISLAM UP and we can have peace ..

Watch the priceless reaction of a Muslim when he came to ... - YouTube
Video for watch the priceless reaction of a muslim▶ 3:16
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0f280g60G8

[Masha Sha]

This law is just stupid and unconstitutional.

I've spent a lot of time in france. there's a lot of stuff I couldn't put up with. it's about as close to communism as you're gonna get in Europe these days.

 So aside from the radical islamists randomly attacking and killing people, please tell us what stuff was unbearable for you.  What freedoms did you feel you didn't have while you were freely coming and going to this communist paradise?  List those things that you couldn't put up with.  Were you unable to find the new heavily guarded Charlie Hebdo office?  Did you miss an event at the Bataclan?  Was your sunbathing interrupted during the police investigation in Nice after Bastille Day?

 The law was made by regional governments as a reactionary measure to give the percpetion to the public that something was being done to protect them. This is what leaders do!  They come up with solutions to problems.  Elected representatives are not necessarily the brightest individuals but the beauty of living in a free society is that you have recourse and those laws can be appealed.  There is however, no coming back from having your life premaurely snuffed out by a misguided radical freely expressing himself with a rifle, knife, truck or bomb.

 Do you have answers to this problem?
 ...I doubt it.

 How about you Masha Sah?  You're great a posting the political issues... how about your solution?


 

Ahaha... Be ready to be blown away!

So first France should tackle the young men... Why!?! Hehehe, this one you will have to figure it yourself. Btw where is price money? (You can always pm me for btc address).

So legalize cannabis, and kick start the weed economy, chateau cannabis, organic, highest quality to compete with the west coast. This would bring back sanity, justice, equality and fraternity.

Then as this is not a French issue, it must be seen in a global context. Ready?!? Isreal should take over the mount of the temple military. As soon as the fake French start to manifest violently, the purge begins. But be aware it's gonna be massive, revolt, cities burning and co.

But there is no other path. The goal isn't to jail the violent up risers in France but send them back in the Sahara.

Or with birth rate and demographic shitft (French baby boomers + crazy breeders = A Muslim will soon win the presidential election)... And as its clear supremacists always win as they see martyrdom in imposing the Quran as the only path to martyrdom.

This is the gift that those that wanted cheap labor from North Africa have let you... And it will never stop giving.

So do you like it?

[xhomerx10]

This law is just stupid and unconstitutional.

I've spent a lot of time in france. there's a lot of stuff I couldn't put up with. it's about as close to communism as you're gonna get in Europe these days.

 So aside from the radical islamists randomly attacking and killing people, please tell us what stuff was unbearable for you.  What freedoms did you feel you didn't have while you were freely coming and going to this communist paradise?  List those things that you couldn't put up with.  Were you unable to find the new heavily guarded Charlie Hebdo office?  Did you miss an event at the Bataclan?  Was your sunbathing interrupted during the police investigation in Nice after Bastille Day?

 The law was made by regional governments as a reactionary measure to give the percpetion to the public that something was being done to protect them. This is what leaders do!  They come up with solutions to problems.  Elected representatives are not necessarily the brightest individuals but the beauty of living in a free society is that you have recourse and those laws can be appealed.  There is however, no coming back from having your life premaurely snuffed out by a misguided radical freely expressing himself with a rifle, knife, truck or bomb.

 Do you have answers to this problem?
 ...I doubt it.

 How about you Masha Sah?  You're great a posting the political issues... how about your solution?


 

Ahaha... Be ready to be blown away!

So first France should tackle the young men... Why!?! Hehehe, this one you will have to figure it yourself. Btw where is price money? (You can always pm me for btc address).

So legalize cannabis, and kick start the weed economy, chateau cannabis, organic, highest quality to compete with the west coast. This would bring back sanity, justice, equality and fraternity.

Then as this is not a French issue, it must be seen in a global context. Ready?!? Isreal should take over the mount of the temple military. As soon as the fake French start to manifest violently, the purge begins. But be aware it's gonna be massive, revolt, cities burning and co.

But there is no other path. The goal isn't to jail the violent up risers in France but send them back in the Sahara.

Or with birth rate and demographic shitft (French baby boomers + crazy breeders = A Muslim will soon win the presidential election)... And as its clear supremacists always win as they see martyrdom in imposing the Quran as the only path to martyrdom.

This is the gift that those that wanted cheap labor from North Africa have let you... And it will never stop giving.

So do you like it?

 Yes, I appreciate the fact that you have considered some solutions.  I like your deportation option. 
Sure, France showed short-sightedness in employing cheap labour but it allowed their economy to become one of the strongest in europe.  Les Banlieues continues to be a problem for France with nearly 50% unemployment and seriously impoverished conditions.  No doubt these areas will become more problematic with continued immigration from low-skilled asylum seekers.  France needs to deal with this before anything else.   That costs money though, whereas banning the burkini cost virtually nothing.

[Masha Sha]

The biggest problem I see with those ghettos is:

- weed illegal, making the drug trade prosper... And all the illegal victim full activities too (gun trade, human trafficking etc).

- if you don't wear a hijab your a slut and can be gang raped in a cave.

- as you said a lot of illegal unregistered people there.

- 0 support for the republic like you said, visible soon at the soccer World Cup where all the flags are on display but the French one. Of course if the cops are always harassing for plants... How to like the republic

- these buildings are from Soviet Union... Even worst. Proximity is unbearable.

- very few success stories but pushing a ball...

Then the goal isn't to deport peaceful protest against the return of the mount of the temple... But the violent ones.

[Losvienleg]

One of the main principles of the French Republic is the laïcité. It is the total disconnection, even the hate between State and religion. In that way, wearing religious clothes is prohibited.

[Spoetnik]

LOL

..what a slut (the guy)

[Masha Sha]

What really shocks me is when someone says that there could be a bomb under the burkini... Bagpack anyone? It's hopeless 

[Spendulus]

LOL

..what a slut (the guy)

There is no problem here.  Just let them wear wetsuits.   

[Masha Sha]

LOL

..what a slut (the guy)

There is no problem here.  Just let them wear wetsuits.   

Wet suits are slim, stick to the skin... While burkinis are ampler... Too much and they would sink

[bryant.coleman]

..what a slut (the guy)

There is no problem here.  Just let them wear wetsuits.   

Right on the point there. France is a secular country (although the overwhelming majority are Catholics) and outward display of religiosity is not welcome. If the Muslims simply want to cover up, then why can't they wear the wetsuit, which is perfectly legal? They don't want to wear them, because they want to display their religiosity.

[Gimpeline]

Its just a few fat old guys that is angry that a few boobs will be cowered up.

[DooMAD]

There is no problem here.  Just let them wear wetsuits.   

If the Muslims simply want to cover up, then why can't they wear the wetsuit, which is perfectly legal? They don't want to wear them, because they want to display their religiosity.

And also because they know that the types of people pushing for this ban would simply use this as a stepping stone to more wide-ranging bans including all religious head-wear in all places, not just the beach.  Why would anyone openly play along with that agenda and willingly give up the right to wear whatever they please?  It's clear to anyone this is nothing more than a nationalist ploy to attempt to legitimise discrimination against minorities.  

Speaking of legal, it's now the mayors that are in the wrong by continuing to enforce the ban when the courts have deemed the ban itself illegal.  It's still demonising one particular religion out of many.  I don't see anyone in the thread calling for bans on tznius scarves or habits, because you aren't afraid of Jews and Catholics.  And that's what this entire debate is about.  Your fears.  Your weaknesses.  Your inability to cope with those different to you.

If you actually read the interview by the person who designed the first Burkini, you'd see it was intended to allow more integration, as it wasn't practical to wear hijabs in the water, so Muslim women simply weren't able to go in the water.  You claim you want integration, but you're trying to ban something that encourages it:

While French officials argued the burkini represents Islam’s inability to assimilate to France’s values, the burkini was actually invented to allow Muslim women to participate more in Western culture.

"I created [burkinis] to stop Muslim children from missing out on swimming lessons and sports activities," she said. "I hope the French prime minister and the mayors see that they should find out how to combine communities, how to work around issues, instead of harming the community, taking the beach away from some people and punishing them. That’s just hatred."

And again, authoritarian bans on styles of clothing are identical to the ones in those hardline Islamic countries you claim you don't approve of.  If your plan is to fight fire with fire and become just as totalitarian as those countries, you can't claim to be any more enlightened than they are.  The authoritarian approach is not the right one and will only serve to further raise tensions.  Forced conformity is a disgusting notion and you should all be ashamed of yourselves for allowing your fears to overcome reason.