[Pre ANN] Vulcanalia Mint Physical BTC and more

[SaltySpitoon]

*I will be updating the topic quite a bit while I think of better ways to word things, and as questions come in that help me address concerns, questions, and criticism. Think of this as a rough draft at the moment, but the topic will become more and more polished with time. I tend to write walls of text, so formatting changes will help overcome that.



Hi everyone, this is a pre announcement to something that has been quite a while in the making. I will soon be starting production on quite a few planned projects under the name Vulcanalia Mint. I wanted to first describe what Vulcanalia is all about, and then open it up to questions. As of the date of this post, I expect prototypes of my first projects to be done within a month or so, with sneak previews coming soon.

What this is:

Vulcanalia is its own mint through and through. The entire design and creation process is done in house, no third parties. Because of this, there will be some unique advantages and disadvantages to my work which I'll discuss below.

I'll first start by explaining the process for having Physical Bitcoins made. The creator designs what they would like, fronts the cash for materials and the order quantity, the mint has that design made into dies, the dies press blanks into coins, they are shipped back to the creator, and there you have it. The advantages to this, are that the coins can be mass produced quickly. The disadvantages however come in the terms of under utilizing creativity and material freedom. What happens if you want your coins produced as 1/8th oz parallelepipeds in blue gold? The mint will tell you get lost. What if you want your coins to be something other than coins? Again, they will tell you to get lost.

Vulcanalia will be able to produce non standard sized pieces with a greater range of creative freedom and material choice. If you have wondered why there aren't Platinum, Palladium, Rhodium, Blue Gold, Argentium, or Indium coins floating around, its because mints will not produce them. They are set up to punch out standard size rounds in mainly three materials, copper, silver, and gold.

Of course, there comes disadvantages. There are certain levels of two dimensional detail that I will not be able to achieve due to machinery restraints, and craftsman level consistency problems. Machines with perfectly set parameters will be able to infinitely reproduce the same exact work. introducing the human element invites error. But, with error comes charm, being completely uniform is boring. I intend to make up for the negative aspects of human error by overcompensating in favor of my customers.

What sort of products will you produce?

My setup is sort of a cross between a jeweler's setup and a forge. I can produce cast coins, as well as higher detailed pieces such as statues, or make rings, pendants, etc. I can produce just about anything in any type of non ferrous metal. If my firing kiln was a bigger, I could cast airplane parts.

Custom orders?

I will accept custom orders after I've established the mint a while. I'm going to need to fail a couple times before I'm confident that I can do anything, and I'd like to fail on my own terms before making promises and not being able to deliver.

What sizes and of what material will your products be made of?

You tell me, anything that I can melt, alloy, and cast will be done. Want a peg leg made of hepatizon? I'll let you know!


Why bother making a mint?

There have been a couple of things that have bothered me about the physical coin market for a long time. My introduction to numismatics was with collectors coins in precious metals and old world currencies. When the premium on a 1 ounce silver coin with a Bitcoin logo on it is the same as a 2000 year old silver coin in pretty good condition, it kind of bothers me. I want to reform the idea of Physical Bitcoins. A coin that is worth 1.03 BTC metal included selling for 2 BTC is not something that is exchangeable. Its a collectors piece I suppose, but its not going to change hands in the form of a gift, or to make semi Bitcoin payments to someone. I fully intend to have a line of exchangeable and affordable physical Bitcoins in addition to fancier pieces.

Keep in mind, anything that is made to be collectible usually is not.

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[SaltySpitoon]

Hey everyone, just wanted to post in here to show I'm helping out too

I'll be helping with the 3d printing/design. I've been a 3d artist for years, designing for places like microsoft and cartoon network recently. (I'm also the artist on a videogame - www.burritogalaxy.com )  So if you're looking to work with Vulcanalia I'd be the one designing the thing for you :~)

I've been 3d printing for a while as well (we will be releasing some of my designs as action figures as well... )


First off, we are going planning on releasing some in house designs before doing commissions so I thought I would post here to lay out our plans.

--JEWELRY
Designing and selling a small pendant based on a character from some of my comic books, mainly meant as a test and for ppl who are already fans of my work. We will be casting these in copper and a few in silver as well. A handful will be sold here if you are interested


--STATUES
silver statues based around bitcoin events, our first design based around the "Genesis Block" will feature a sort of suspended cube cast in 5-10 ounces of silver. One of our first planned releases.

--COINS
we also plan on selling some funded metal bitcoin, our first will be a "Pizza Coin"

kind of a wacky idea, but I think you guys will like it. The coin itself will be sculpted like a pizza, with little pepperonis, the coin will be funded with the USD VALUE of 41$ in bitcoin at the time of mint (to commemorate the first bitcoin pizza sale - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=137.0 )

I will keep you guys updated here, along with salty, as we continue making cool stuff for you guys

[miffman]

This is actually exactly what I've been looking for, and I already know many mints won't be be happy with my request  Looking forward to it!

[SaltySpitoon]

This is actually exactly what I've been looking for, and I already know many mints won't be be happy with my request  Looking forward to it!

I certainly plan to offer custom things made for individuals, groups, alt coin communities, who ever.

[Hhampuz]

Awesome Salty! Looking forward to trying out some stuff with you . Actually just talked to some people about doing something, and this proves to be perfect timing!

Watching closely

[SaltySpitoon]

Awesome Salty! Looking forward to trying out some stuff with you . Actually just talked to some people about doing something, and this proves to be perfect timing!

Watching closely

I'm just waiting on a bit of hardware right now, and finalization of some designs, then I'll have some prototypes out.

I suppose I can at least say this, something pretty high on my list of things to make is an ~5 Oz Argentium Silver Genesis block statue. Debating on whether or not to have an engraved wood base, or to just have the entire thing be silver. I might end up making them in other materials, size might be bigger/larger, but thats on the agenda. As well as a few other things that I will keep quiet for now.

I'm also producing some promo material for a friend's video game. Though that probably wont be of much interest to Bitcoiners.

[Hhampuz]

Awesome Salty! Looking forward to trying out some stuff with you . Actually just talked to some people about doing something, and this proves to be perfect timing!

Watching closely

I'm just waiting on a bit of hardware right now, and finalization of some designs, then I'll have some prototypes out.

I suppose I can at least say this, something pretty high on my list of things to make is an ~5 Oz Argentium Silver Genesis block statue. Debating on whether or not to have an engraved wood base, or to just have the entire thing be silver. I might end up making them in other materials, size might be bigger/larger, but thats on the agenda. As well as a few other things that I will keep quiet for now.

I'm also producing some promo material for a friend's video game. Though that probably wont be of much interest to Bitcoiners.

Sounds like good stuff! This sure sounds awesome. Looking forward to it

[OgNasty]

I suppose I can at least say this, something pretty high on my list of things to make is an ~5 Oz Argentium Silver Genesis block statue. Debating on whether or not to have an engraved wood base, or to just have the entire thing be silver.

I say keep it 100% .999 fine silver.  I've wanted a solid silver statue since I saw the Mount Rushmore statue on Pawn Stars.

[SaltySpitoon]

I say keep it 100% .999 fine silver.  I've wanted a solid silver statue since I saw the Mount Rushmore statue on Pawn Stars.

I have no problem making fine silver statues (actually its cheaper for me to do so) but fine silver in particular tarnishes pretty badly. I suppose I can do multiple types for those who want fine silver, but for things that don't go in airtites or get handled, I'm a really big fan of Argentium.

I really want to do some nice sized ones too, so I'll probably do 10, 5, 3, 2.5 oz something like that. Whatever ends up looking right anyway.

[digicoinuser]

Salty, this sounds great!  Really looking forward to how this progresses and I can't wait to see a prototype/test item.   

[SaltySpitoon]

Just a few odds and ends to tie up before the mint becomes at least semi operational. Here is a short list of what has been done or put in progress in the last two days.

• I picked up a new 3D Printer to help with prototyping, it should arrive tomorrow.
• Vacuum casting table + pump should be arriving early next week.
• Purchased Mig Welder, and learned to weld so I'm now assembling various what have yous and a better work table
• I'm nearly finished with construction of my larger furnace, just need to finish building the burner and line with refractory
• New firing kiln should arrive early next week
• One production design is finished, the ones that would interest bitcoiners are still in early stages, but its not an overly long process to complete.
• Vulcanalia brand stamp hasn't begun, but the concept is created. Production may take a while, but its not 100% completely necessary
• Research on laser engraving systems has begun, also not completely necessary for early works
• Various tools should arrive throughout next week
• Alloy research is more or less finished. I still have a couple of things I want to play with, but everything necessary for now is done.
• Website development has begun, not very far along right now, but again not 100% necessary at the moment

The earliest I'd possibly have anything interesting to show would be by next weekend. I'll consider taking a lot of photos and documenting the entire process for those who are at all interested. I was honestly expecting a lot more criticism and questions. I suppose I have things a bit more squared away than I figured I would, that or you coin hungry monsters don't care as long as you get your fix  . (joking)

[Liad.Services]

Just a few odds and ends to tie up before the mint becomes at least semi operational. Here is a short list of what has been done or put in progress in the last two days.

• I picked up a new 3D Printer to help with prototyping, it should arrive tomorrow.
• Vacuum casting table + pump should be arriving early next week.
• Purchased Mig Welder, and learned to weld so I'm now assembling various what have yous and a better work table
• I'm nearly finished with construction of my larger furnace, just need to finish building the burner and line with refractory
• New firing kiln should arrive early next week
• One production design is finished, the ones that would interest bitcoiners are still in early stages, but its not an overly long process to complete.
• Vulcanalia brand stamp hasn't begun, but the concept is created. Production may take a while, but its not 100% completely necessary
• Research on laser engraving systems has begun, also not completely necessary for early works
• Various tools should arrive throughout next week
• Alloy research is more or less finished. I still have a couple of things I want to play with, but everything necessary for now is done.
• Website development has begun, not very far along right now, but again not 100% necessary at the moment

The earliest I'd possibly have anything interesting to show would be by next weekend. I'll consider taking a lot of photos and documenting the entire process for those who are at all interested. I was honestly expecting a lot more criticism and questions. I suppose I have things a bit more squared away than I figured I would, that or you coin hungry monsters don't care as long as you get your fix  . (joking)

Thanks for your update!
it looks way beyond cool

Looking forward to see some items go out from this mint,You can count me in for a silver bitcoin statue.


Also do you think you are going to be able to mint some .999 gold coins?
or maybe a set of coins of all the metals could be cool too.
There are many things you can do when you own a mint

[SaltySpitoon]

Thanks for your update!
it looks way beyond cool

Looking forward to see some items go out from this mint,You can count me in for a silver bitcoin statue.


Also do you think you are going to be able to mint some .999 gold coins?
or maybe a set of coins of all the metals could be cool too.
There are many things you can do when you own a mint

Yep, I'll be able to do gold and even exotic metals no problem. One benefit to having your own mint, is I could make just a handful of gold coins in any size I desire rather than having to order a minimum quantity from a 3rd party mint in pre determined shapes and sizes.

I'm starting with silver for each of my designs as its not a huge problem if I make a mistake. If I overheat my furnace and vaporize a couple grams of silver, its not a big deal. If I vaporize a couple grams of gold, I probably wouldn't be too happy with myself. I'll make sure to keep everyone up to date.

I also got a hold of some precious and semi precious stones. Mostly to practice doing settings, but if I end up any good at it, thats also something I could add to things I produce.

[Liad.Services]

Thanks for your update!
it looks way beyond cool

Looking forward to see some items go out from this mint,You can count me in for a silver bitcoin statue.


Also do you think you are going to be able to mint some .999 gold coins?
or maybe a set of coins of all the metals could be cool too.
There are many things you can do when you own a mint

Yep, I'll be able to do gold and even exotic metals no problem. One benefit to having your own mint, is I could make just a handful of gold coins in any size I desire rather than having to order a minimum quantity from a 3rd party mint in pre determined shapes and sizes.

I'm starting with silver for each of my designs as its not a huge problem if I make a mistake. If I overheat my furnace and vaporize a couple grams of silver, its not a big deal. If I vaporize a couple grams of gold, I probably wouldn't be too happy with myself. I'll make sure to keep everyone up to date.

I also got a hold of some precious and semi precious stones. Mostly to practice doing settings, but if I end up any good at it, thats also something I could add to things I produce.

Sounds really cool.
Do you already have an idea on the premium price?(or it all depends on the product)

I am going to keep my eye on this thread,and I would be happy to be the 1st customer
please provide us some pictures when available.

Good luck with your mint.

[SaltySpitoon]

Sounds really cool.
Do you already have an idea on the premium price?(or it all depends on the product)

I am going to keep my eye on this thread,and I would be happy to be the 1st customer
please provide us some pictures when available.

Good luck with your mint.

So I want to go in both directions. I want to offer low premium pieces, as well as higher premium pieces. The pieces that are cast one by one with great amounts of detail actually require quite a bit of work and time to produce. I also want to offer pieces that are relatively quickly cast, finished, and then good to go at premiums lower than anything else on the market. The things that require a lot of time and effort that sell for a higher premium are what is going to fund my mint so that I can get bigger and better machinery to more efficiently produce. The low premium pieces that I envision will just be paying for the material and my time. I'd really like to be able to create essentially Bitcoin pocket change. I want to be able to make BTC pieces that are worth $5 or $10 USD at time of issue, with a premium low enough that you could use it to pay your friend back for a sandwhich they bought you, or use one to pay for a regular common daily thing. Things like Cas coins are cool, but you aren't going to hand someone a coin worth 2+ BTC for a 1 BTC debt.

I've got a lot of things to consider Physical Bitcoin wise. Will I do private keys on coins, or offer them to people to self fund. Will I do the kind of overdone holograms, or will I figure out another way to secure private keys. I have quite a few ideas, but they all require a bit more thought.

For example, I have a friend who likes Clam (an alt coin) so I wanted to cast a palm sized clam shell, etch a QR code inside, and then seal it with a layer of molten silver, so that you would have to "shuck" the clam to get at the keys. There would be a few more safety mechanisms than just that, but I'm not super satisfied with the standard tamperproof sticker thing, so I'd like to do something a little outside the box.

[Liad.Services]

Sounds really cool.
Do you already have an idea on the premium price?(or it all depends on the product)

I am going to keep my eye on this thread,and I would be happy to be the 1st customer
please provide us some pictures when available.

Good luck with your mint.

So I want to go in both directions. I want to offer low premium pieces, as well as higher premium pieces. The pieces that are cast one by one with great amounts of detail actually require quite a bit of work and time to produce. I also want to offer pieces that are relatively quickly cast, finished, and then good to go at premiums lower than anything else on the market. The things that require a lot of time and effort that sell for a higher premium are what is going to fund my mint so that I can get bigger and better machinery to more efficiently produce. The low premium pieces that I envision will just be paying for the material and my time. I'd really like to be able to create essentially Bitcoin pocket change. I want to be able to make BTC pieces that are worth $5 or $10 USD at time of issue, with a premium low enough that you could use it to pay your friend back for a sandwhich they bought you, or use one to pay for a regular common daily thing. Things like Cas coins are cool, but you aren't going to hand someone a coin worth 2+ BTC for a 1 BTC debt.

I've got a lot of things to consider Physical Bitcoin wise. Will I do private keys on coins, or offer them to people to self fund. Will I do the kind of overdone holograms, or will I figure out another way to secure private keys. I have quite a few ideas, but they all require a bit more thought.

For example, I have a friend who likes Clam (an alt coin) so I wanted to cast a palm sized clam shell, etch a QR code inside, and then seal it with a layer of molten silver, so that you would have to "shuck" the clam to get at the keys. There would be a few more safety mechanisms than just that, but I'm not super satisfied with the standard tamperproof sticker thing, so I'd like to do something a little outside the box.

I think you should open up a vote thread so you can share some ideas and designs, and people would tell you whats better, so you will know what people likes and more likely to buy and whats not.

Also my suggestion is creating a limited amount of sets that cointains the same design of coin in 5-6 different metals I think people here are going to buy them instantly.
You should also consider minting coins that has private key minted on them (not an hologram,the coin it self has a design of a private key) which can be really cool but I assume that creating those can cost a lot of money.

[SaltySpitoon]

I think you should open up a vote thread so you can share some ideas and designs, and people would tell you whats better, so you will know what people likes and more likely to buy and whats not.

Also my suggestion is creating a limited amount of sets that cointains the same design of coin in 5-6 different metals I think people here are going to buy them instantly.
You should also consider minting coins that has private key minted on them (not an hologram,the coin it self has a design of a private key) which can be really cool but I assume that creating those can cost a lot of money.

I will likely take your advice on that. Though, I'll probably just produce a few things even without a poll just because at the very least I'd want one. With the exception of my idea for the Bitcoin pocket change concept, each piece I make will be hand numbered, I'll decide ahead of time on total mintage based on popularity. Typically what mints like Perth do, is they decide a maximum mintage of a certain coin + a deadline, and they will not exceed that mintage. Lack or orders or interest could cause the total produced to be under the maximum mintage, so if you look at the Lunar series silver/gold coins for example, of a maximum of 100,000 some years only 30,000 were minted. More difficult and exotic metals will probably have fewer produced than the universally popular copper, silver, and occasionally gold, but if there is enough demand, maybe not.

Pretty much the decisions that I make will decide if they will be individual pieces worth their value as art pieces, or if they will be funded before shipping and have a secondary market. I'm all for having a secondary market, but I'm not a huge fan of handling other people's private keys.

Should I find a solution that allows it, I would indeed like to have private keys directly on the coins. There are a few reasons not to do that, but I may be able to come up with a solution. I had a 2013 1 BTC Silver/Gold Cas coin go through the washing machine, and that sucked pretty bad. I'm curious to what kind of resolution I could get a cast QR code onto a coin. Thats something I'll have to try to find out.

[smoothie]

This is a seriously huge undertaking.

Good luck to you brother! 

[Hhampuz]

One quick Q.

Will you accept orders from customers for custom coins? Or will you try and finetune everything until you are happy with the process before opening up to that?

[SaltySpitoon]

This is a seriously huge undertaking.

Good luck to you brother!  

Thanks Smoothie, I have a huge amount of respect for you and Lealana. When I was thinking of a name for my mint, I was thinking about the successful coin producers, Cas, and Lealana. I then decided that in order to be successful, my name must be difficult to spell. Casascius is the most successful physical coins, and no one can spell it, so thats proof enough! Lealana isn't too bad, but that might just be because I've seen the name spelled as many times as I've seen the word, the.

One quick Q.

Will you accept orders from customers for custom coins? Or will you try and finetune everything until you are happy with the process before opening up to that?

I will take custom orders for custom coins, but I am going to hold off doing so until I've figured out the limits of my new machinery and I have some prior work to show.