[FACTS] ANON Coins = Illegal

[dinofelis]

PS:
what am i doing here ?
Posting stories from Coidnesk

No, seriously, why are you interested in crypto ?  Or do you want to warn people NOT to use crypto because it's against the law ?

I know why I'm interested in crypto: because I think law and state are evil, and that one has the civil duty to oppose oppression and the crushing of fundamental rights, and I see in crypto a tool to help in that fight.  Crypto can be to the oppressed economic rights, what the internet has been to the lack of freedom of public expression.  But clearly that's not your PoV.  So what brings you here ?

[Spoetnik]

I am not here to spit shine your silly shit coins.
I am not here to polish Febo's bags.
I am not the topic here either.

..your little retort angle here fails Investards.

I criticized Litecoin heavily for the same anon bullshit for the same exact reasons.
And a minute ago i just went and bought some LTC.

Retort Fail kidiots LOL

Carry on with the some other thing is bad routine maybe.
Attacking me accomplishes you and your anon shit coin nothing.

Get in the ring with Spoetnik ? then you better bring your A game profiteers.
..don't waste my time    


EDIT:
What are you silly little Monero shill's going to do now ?
Neg me over this topic now too ? HHAHAHAHHA clowns      

LIEK OMG LIES OMG !!! LIES BBQ !!!111

[dinofelis]

I am not here to spit shine your silly shit coins.
I am not here to polish Febo's bags.
I am not the topic here either.

..your little retort angle here fails Investards.

I criticized Litecoin heavily for the same anon bullshit for the same exact reasons.
And a minute ago i just went and bought some LTC.

Retort Fail kidiots LOL

Carry on with the some other thing is bad routine maybe.
Attacking me accomplishes you and your anon shit coin nothing.

Get in the ring with Spoetnik ? then you better bring your A game profiteers.
..don't waste my time    


EDIT:
What are you silly little Monero shill's going to do now ?
Neg me over this topic now too ? HHAHAHAHHA clowns      

LIEK OMG LIES OMG !!! LIES BBQ !!!111

Ok, you're telling us why you are NOT here.  But why are you here ?  What is your drive to be interested in crypto ?

[TrueAnon]

OP is right.

I chat with wbb dev and he knows anon coins will never work successfully for "real world" applications which is where most crypto is trying to target now in professional manner.  WBB is aiming for real world use.

Anon shit will have pump from dark market news and MAYBE usage, but that is all.  You may laugh given by my Username I say such things but these coin project never be TRUEAnon

[dinofelis]

I chat with wbb dev and he knows anon coins will never work successfully for "real world" applications which is where most crypto is trying to target now in professional manner.  WBB is aiming for real world use.

Why ?  What goal is one trying to accomplish ?
Why would one use crypto and not the existing fiat system if the goal is to be totally privacy-less and transparent ?
I can understand all arguments about legality, the fact that people want to stay away from anything that could attract them the anger of the state and so on. 

But crypto is going through a lot of hassle and difficulties to AVOID central authority.  If you start from the premise that you want to accept a central authority, what is the basis to go through all that hassle in the first place ?  Why not USE the fact that you accept an authority (the state) to make everything MUCH MUCH easier and do away with distributed trustless systems, which have no place where there is a central, accepted authority ?

This is like going through the hassle of making an airplane, but wanting to stay on the ground.  Why not continue with cars then ?

[Spoetnik]

Monero ...



PS:
@Dino
LOL OMG lay it on thick with the playing dumb routine or what ?

Monero ...

[Ayers]

how cna they know if someone did a transaction with monero by surpassing the limit of money if those coins are anonymous? isn't this a nonsense? also what bitcoin have to do with this? what they have done with all that money is applicable tof iat also not only bitcoin

[dinofelis]

Monero ...



PS:
@Dino
LOL OMG lay it on thick with the playing dumn routine or what ?

Monero ...

You still don't say why you're in crypto.  Crypto is not legal tender, hence illegal tender (that's more or less your reasoning).  So why are you in "illegal tender", and then cry out that monero is illegal (bitcoin is then just as illegal) ?
Why don't you stay with fiat, nobody's going to come and handcuff you because you are using your bank account, aren't you ?  You started this thread with someone getting handcuffed because he used bitcoin.  Now, bitcoin is everything but an anon coin: you scream out to the world what you do with your illegal tender.  And clearly, people got into trouble because of that.  so why are you into crypto ?

[Spoetnik]

I am not here to spit shine your silly shit coins.
I am not here to polish Febo's bags.
I am not the topic here either.

..your little retort angle here fails Investards.

I criticized Litecoin heavily for the same anon bullshit for the same exact reasons.
And a minute ago i just went and bought some LTC.

Retort Fail kidiots LOL

Carry on with the some other thing is bad routine maybe.
Attacking me accomplishes you and your anon shit coin nothing.

Get in the ring with Spoetnik ? then you better bring your A game profiteers.
..don't waste my time    


EDIT:
What are you silly little Monero shill's going to do now ?
Neg me over this topic now too ? HHAHAHAHHA clowns      

LIEK OMG LIES OMG !!! LIES BBQ !!!111

Ok, you're telling us why you are NOT here.  But why are you here ?  What is your drive to be interested in crypto ?

I have answered that maybe a 100 hundred times in the last couple years.
Since it's irrelevant here i won't bother doing it again.
In other words find a new retort.. that one is played out heavily.
Think your smart ? Quit copy catting poor quality shitcoin defense tactics.
You bore me Dino.. and i expect better. (i know you are capable of more)

[ArcCsch]

[Spoetnik]

how cna they know if someone did a transaction with monero by surpassing the limit of money if those coins are anonymous? isn't this a nonsense? also what bitcoin have to do with this? what they have done with all that money is applicable tof iat also not only bitcoin

Because when they say bring in your tax records when you are audited you will need to tell them.
What, did you guys forget you need to claim your Poloniex ROI's with the Tax-Man ?  

The INTENTION of ANON coins like Monero is to circumvent Anti Money Laundering Laws.
That is NOT the intention if Bitcoin.

Firms must comply with the Bank Secrecy Act and its implementing regulations ("Anti-Money Laundering rules"). The purpose of the AML rules is to help detect and report suspicious activity including the predicate offenses to money laundering and terrorist financing, such as securities fraud and market manipulation.

Source = www.Google.com

And no i am not trolling, I am trying to point out some very real chronically ignored issues we face.

[dinofelis]

I have answered that maybe a 100 hundred times in the last couple years.
Since it's irrelevant here i won't bother doing it again.

It is absolutely relevant in this thread.  You seem to be warning people that "anon coins may be illegal" and you come with an example to illustrate this where a trade with *bitcoin* got someone into legal trouble.   Hence, what is, according to your demonstration, illegal, is to do things with non-legal tender, all crypto hence.

Now, crypto is a tool to take back freedoms that were stolen from us by state and law.  So in a way the fact that it is illegal shouldn't bother, and be rather a positive point.  But you seem to make it into something that is supposed to have a negative shade on crypto.  So I honestly would like to know what brings you to a club of freedom fighters, if you're afraid of illegal stuff ?   Is it to warn them that those they fight against don't like it ?  Is this to tell Nelson Mandela supporters that he might be in trouble with the law in South Africa ?

But of course, the fight shouldn't be *criminal*.  There's a difference between illegal and criminal, in the sense that illegal (as you think - erroneously - that crypto is) is simply maybe pointing to wrong laws, while "criminal" is usually generally accepted by the people as "to be avoided because bad".    For instance, publicly stating that I'm an atheist is illegal in certain countries, but I don't think that most people consider it criminal.  I think that it is perfectly my right to state that I'm an atheist, and if a law forbids me, then the law is wrong, and not me.   It is by stating NEVERTHELESS that I'm an atheist (and yes, risking to get trouble with law enforcement), that I can hope to put pressure on the law to change it, and the risk I run to do so is what I consider a civil duty.   70 years ago, homosexuality was against the law in the UK.  Nevertheless, courageous homosexuals continued to do what they wanted, some got into prison for that, but in the end, their desire for liberty vindicated and the laws were changed.  

Your rant here is similar to accusing users of condoms for homosexuals, that this is illegal stuff, because homosexuality is illegal.  What are you then interested in discussing, making, trading condoms for homosexuals ?  And what could it bother to true users of those condoms, that they are "illegal" ?

I think that the free and private economic interaction is a freedom that has been taken away from us since the dawn of states.  Crypto can help put those evil laws under pressure.  And yes, there's a risk of course.  But it is our civil duty to run that risk.  So, if ever anon coins are "illegal", then the law is wrong, and that shouldn't stop us from using them, on the contrary.

But that's not your stance.  So again, what are you doing here ?

Now, your argument could be that crypto is NOT about freedom fighters.  My point is then that crypto is meaningless.  It goes to too much trouble to do away with central authority, if you accept, in the end, central authority.  If you accept central authority in monetary matters, that authority can issue currency, and that's WAY WAY WAY easier to use than crypto.

[dinofelis]

The INTENTION of ANON coins like Monero is to circumvent Anti Money Laundering Laws.
That is NOT the intention if Bitcoin.

1) How are you to decide what are the *intentions* of a cryptosystem ?  It is the user that has an intention.  But, when you read Satoshi's paper, it seems to me that the anonymity of the user WAS one of his concerns.  He thought that the pseudonymous system was sufficient.  So Satoshi's *intentions* in as much as he had some on that point, were exactly the same as the intentions of the authors of anon coins, except that Satoshi's mechanism was too weak and ended up failing against chain analysis.  (no blame to Satoshi, if you're the first one, of course not everything works out as intended, it is easy to criticise with hindsight).

2) Don't you want to fight AML ?  They are a denial of a fundamental right, no ?  So the more you can circumvent them, the better.  AML are to economic freedom what the obligation to record all your conversations is to the freedom of speech.

You are claiming here that the intend of "condoms for homosexuals" is to do illegal homosexual acts.  Yes, so ?

In fact, the REAL reason of existence of anon coins is not so much to be "entirely anonymous", but rather to plug a hole in bitcoin, which is a privacy nightmare all together, much worse than fiat.  In doing so, it is also a perfect tool to fight bad laws such as AML laws, and to fight for economic liberty (which was probably one of Satoshi's intentions, but which failed bitterly with the total traceability of coins and hence the danger in using this as a means to fight the oppression).  That on top of that, it is also a useful tool for people wanting to do outright criminal stuff, is normal: every freedom tool is also a tool for the bad guys.  If you can't stand people using their freedom to do bad things, then you're against freedom all together.  But then you have no reason to be here.  Hence, the relevance of my question: why are you here ?

[Mihawk]

It's not because a group of people use the currency the wrong way that the whole system is illegal! And about that report, the aforementioned was the BTC and these people did not follow the rules, really you're a Philanthropist FUD. 

[Spoetnik]

I have answered that maybe a 100 hundred times in the last couple years.
Since it's irrelevant here i won't bother doing it again.

It is absolutely relevant in this thread. ...

Whether you think it is relevant or not does not interest me.
I answered you and you were not satisfied.
I am going to move on.. you are pretty much trolling my topic.
I am trying to discuss a specific issue.. you tried and got shot down
..next you went on & on trying to attack me personally.

The topic here is not "How do you feel about Spoetnik ?"
Need a shrink i can recommend one.. you can flop your bitch tits on his couch and ball your eyes out.

Just be grateful I even addressed your disorganized never ending diversionary rants on my topic.
You have been throwing what ever you can here at the wall in desperation hoping something would stick..
cycling through the list of cliche'd crypto-defense-retorts.

Besides Dino.. what the fuck are YOU doing here ? Let me guess counting your god damn ROI's on Poloniex ?
PS: The price was down almost 13% last i looked  

Have something to say about the topic ? ..be my guest.
I am not *required* to entertain your trolling efforts though.
If i do so it's because i am in the mood and i am throwing you a bone playing along for my own amusement.

Rather than addressing my comments that are utterly diabolical you guys side step them and come after me.
Because you have no viable Monero defense.
AKA: YOUR MOTIVATIONS.

Did you read what the fuck i posted ?
I think just the last comment i made alone sums it up pretty nicely.
You think "one day" mass adoption is coming when you deliberately make an illegal coin ?
When you go out of your way to circumvent AML laws etc ? Really ? Are you guys high or what ?

In your glee for crypto'z and Poloniex profits and stary-eyed dreamer crypto teen angst rabble you thought it was a good idea to be a crypto-rebel and chant free market and "no laws" and make a "Criminal Coin" ?
..yeah simply brilliant Investards  
GROW UP.

All i have heard is "Dark Market" bragging.. what did you guys forget you flogged this forum with that super mega ultra "great" news ?
Seems to me you were all a happy little pig in shit pandering to criminals with that bullshit hype.
Only to play dumb about later when the pump wore off and the price is slumping.

What now ? What next ? Adoption ?
How's that gonna work out when you violate the law ?
Care to answer that ? Any of you ? Even once ?

or ?

Post Spoetnik is ugly and his mother dresses him funny.
Then get off the ground and parade around the ring with your hands in the air proclaiming your the champ.
..when i already won and am in my car driving home from the fight.

[dinofelis]

I answered you and you were not satisfied.

Nope, you didn't.  You gave reasons why you aren't here.  Not why you are here.  I would like to know what motivates you to be interested in crypto, if it is not to defy laws and state.   The very fact that you are screaming about "anon coins are illegal" indicates that you're not here to defy law and state, so again, what ELSE could motivate you to be interested in crypto, if it is NOT "defy law and state" ?

Besides Dino.. what the fuck are YOU doing here ? Let me guess counting your god damn ROI's on Poloniex ?

Nope.  I'm interested in everything that can defy law and state.  And I do like cryptography on the technological side.  I'm not interested in "ROI on Poloniex", I already told you a million times that I think that the huge speculative part of crypto is bad, exactly because it will render crypto less efficient to defy state and law.

Rather than addressing my comments that are utterly diabolical you guys side step them and come after me.
Because you have no viable Monero defense.

Your comments are not diabolical at all.  They are incomprehensible if you have any interest in defying state and law.

All i have heard is "Dark Market" bragging.. what did you guys forget you flogged this forum with that super mega ultra "great" news ?
Seems to me you were all a happy little pig in shit pandering to criminals with that bullshit hype.

Because dark markets are important in the act of defying law and state, no.  Dark markets are not criminal.  They are maybe illegal, but not criminal.  They illustrate a fundamental freedom that has been baffled by the law, that's all.  Dark markets are exactly the kind of battle that crypto helps fighting.  So yes, I'm delighted by that.  And no, it is not criminal.  It is maybe illegal, like homosexuality was 70 years ago in the UK.  And like being an atheist is in Saoudi Arabia.  And like possessing a computer is in North Korea.

Again, if you are NOT interested in that kind of battle, what are you doing in crypto ?  What other reason can there be ?

[Spoetnik]

@Dino
It's my turn.. i have a question for you now after all i was nice enough to answer yours

So, how would you like to tell the users here how many other accounts you have logged into here and what are their names ?

I've been watching for a long time bud and i noticed a conspicuous absence from the biggest Monero shill's here.
Don't forget bud i am the smart one here.
And i dealt with plenty of guys far before you get here in "September 11, 2014"
Such as answering those questions.. "why are you here ?" etc LOL

I recall the entire world of Doge dope heads comin' at me and i put each and every last one of them in their place.
All of them and their little "Community" is dead and long gone now ..as i PREDICTED.

[dinofelis]

@Dino
It's my turn.. i have a question for you now after all i was nice enough to answer yours

So, how would you like to tell the users here how many other accounts you have logged into here and what are their names ?

Sure.  None.  I have only one account here on BCT.
(or did you mean that I hacked other people's accounts ?  No, I haven't)

I have a few points to make, though.  
1) if you get identical questions, that doesn't necessarily mean that the people asking those questions are the same.  It is maybe your behaviour that triggers those questions.  If you didn't change your behaviour, it is maybe logical that you trigger the same questions.

2) I'm not a monero shill, if that's what you intend.  I do like monero, because it tries to solve a big problem with bitcoin: its privacy failure, and it has other properties I like.  Before that, I liked Darkcoin.  But monero is technically simply superior.  But I'm not tied to monero (apart from the fact that because I like it, I studied its system, and I'm still studying it, so my investment in time may colour now somewhat my preferences).  I actually think that ZCASH has even more fascinating crypto than monero, but unfortunately, zcash was extremely badly put into music, so I consider it a failure wrt to privacy, and it also has other technical and monetary problems.

3) I do not trade or speculate.

4) apart from having heard the word bitcoin before without paying attention, I only learned about crypto in spring 2014.

[GoodStrong]

@Dino
It's my turn.. i have a question for you now after all i was nice enough to answer yours

So, how would you like to tell the users here how many other accounts you have logged into here and what are their names ?

I've been watching for a long time bud and i noticed a conspicuous absence from the biggest Monero shill's here.
Don't forget bud i am the smart one here.
And i dealt with plenty of guys far before you get here in "September 11, 2014"
Such as answering those questions.. "why are you here ?" etc LOL

I recall the entire world of Doge dope heads comin' at me and i put each and every last one of them in their place.
All of them and their little "Community" is dead and long gone now ..as i PREDICTED.

Your attitude towards others on here is amazing. You are a true trader sir, you have my attention and definitely the attention of others.

Thank you for a good read and a nice lesson on crypto.

[Spoetnik]

@Dino
You are always coming across with YOUR BEHAVIOR as a contrarian.
You are always stretching things to suit YOUR AGENDA.
You are always positioning yourself to defend YOUR MOTIVATIONS (Monero "Speculating") with verbal gymnastics while simultaneously accusing others of having an "Agenda".
You post exception retorts while claiming others are using the straw-man argument.
..look in the mirror bud LOL  
You then cycle through the list of cliche'd defense retorts.

For example on another topic you posted you *could* do trading somewhere besides Poloniex..
On a topic asking if it's a danger having all the ANON COINS mostly on one Exchange (Polo who tracks you with your Picture ID)
What is that ? Seriously what the fuck is that bloody bullshit ?
Then you have the bloody audacity to try and swarm all over me and my topics pointing the finger at me ?

I'd say this matter is a closed book.
Unless there is something i missed it's pretty damn straight forward.
They made Monero to circumvent Anti-Money-Laundering Laws.
I actually don't need to delve further into it.
And if that sounds like an intelligent thing to do then happy Shilling bag-holders.
Good luck with your future adoption you all love to chant "one day" about.

PS:
@Dino i am a little bit skeptical you have only logged into 1 account here (like me)
Not saying you are a lying but come on.. people do use a lot of dummy accounts to play games here all the time.