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Author Topic: Open Letter to GMaxwell and Sincere Rational Core Devs  (Read 33114 times)
AgentofCoin
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March 04, 2017, 02:57:52 AM
 #261



No, the blocksize debate exists because some think we can scale now and others think we need to scale later.
Then you come along and say we can never scale and we should try to market directly to world banks.

You are advocating we solicit the very institutions that Satoshi create Bitcoin to counteract.
You are an extremist with possible mania, who can not argue without personally attacking people.

At least you understand my argument.  You are just sad Satoshi lied.  You never would have participated if he told you the truth.  Bitcoin is a finger trap for nations and banks:
...
The more they struggle the tighter things will get. Thx for bumping my thread lots!

What did Satoshi lie about?

I support a decentralized & unregulatable ledger first, with safe scaling over time.
Request a signed message if you are associating with anyone claiming to be me.
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March 04, 2017, 03:00:38 AM
 #262

Then you come along and say we can never scale and we should try to market directly to world banks.

You are advocating we solicit the very institutions that Satoshi created Bitcoin to counteract.
You are an extremist with possible mania, who can not argue without personally attacking people.
I do not read any of that in his posts or writings.

What I read is that Bitcoin as a worldwide store of value is the key to getting the world banks to do our bidding, meaning asymptotically approach a more ideal money for us to use.

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traincarswreck
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March 04, 2017, 03:02:03 AM
 #263


What did Satoshi lie about?
He made you believe bitcoin is for the peoples.  Its not.  Its for the metaplayers, the big banks. 
traincarswreck
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March 04, 2017, 03:04:31 AM
 #264


I do not read any of that in his posts or writings.

What I read is that Bitcoin as a worldwide store of value is the key to getting the world banks to do our bidding, meaning asymptotically approach a more ideal money for us to use.
Nash's argument that I support couldn't be anymore for the people:
Quote

    There perhaps will always be “politics”, like also “death and taxes”. But it is sometimes remarkable how political contexts can evolve. And in relation to that I think that it is possible that ‘the Keynesians’ are like a political faction that will become less influential as a result of a political evolution….(All over the world varieties of states make claims to have governments very properly or even ideally devoted to the interests of the citizens or nationals of those states and always an externally located critic can argue that the government is actually a sort of despotism.)

    The Keynesian implicitly always have the argument that some good managers can do things of beneficial value, operating with the treasury and the central bank, and that it is not needed or appropriate for the citizenry or the “customers” of the currency supplied by the state to actually understand what the managers are managing, what exactly they are doing and how it will affect the “pocket book” circumstances of these “customers.”

    I see this as analogous to how the “bolshevik communists” were claiming to provide something much better than the “bourgeois democracy” that they could not deny existed in some other counties. But in the end the “dictatorship of the proletariat” seemed to become rather exposed as simply the dictatorship of the regime. So there may be an analogy to this as regards those called “the Keynesians” in that while they have claimed to be operating for high and noble objectives of general welfare what is clearly true is that they have made it easier for governments to “print Money”.

    So I see the Keynesians as in a weak sense comparable to the “Bolsheviks” because of the support of both parties for a certain “lack of transparency” relating to the function of government as seen by the citizenry. And for both of them it can be said that they tend to think in terms of government agencies operating in a benevolent fashion that is, however, beyond the comprehension of the citizens of the state.

    And this parallel makes it seem not implausible that a process of political evolution might lead to the expectation on the part of citizens in the “great democracies” that they should be better situated to be able to understand whatever will be the monetary policies which, indeed, are typically of great importance to citizens who may have alternative options for where to place their “savings”.

These two clowns are just clowns and their agenda is exposed.  My proof they are wrong, and I am moral, and right.
AgentofCoin
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March 04, 2017, 03:04:58 AM
 #265

Then you come along and say we can never scale and we should try to market directly to world banks.

You are advocating we solicit the very institutions that Satoshi created Bitcoin to counteract.
You are an extremist with possible mania, who can not argue without personally attacking people.
I do not read any of that in his posts or writings.

What I read is that Bitcoin as a worldwide store of value is the key to getting the world banks to do our bidding, meaning asymptotically approach a more ideal money for us to use.

That is not what i read.
The final conclusions of this argument type is that we can never scale because it will destroy its inherent value.

The whole argument is that we can not have a blockchain that banks use as settlement and for users to transact.
It must be one or the other and if we change anything NOW, it will transform into that one or other forever.

Meaning we stay and work with banks with high value, or we expand and lose value through time.

I support a decentralized & unregulatable ledger first, with safe scaling over time.
Request a signed message if you are associating with anyone claiming to be me.
AgentofCoin
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March 04, 2017, 03:08:22 AM
 #266

What did Satoshi lie about?
He made you believe bitcoin is for the peoples.  Its not.  Its for the metaplayers, the big banks.  

If it was for the banks, why didn't he patent the whole system or certain parts of it and
market or sell directly to the banks. Instead Satoshi attempted to release it in a manner
that would be the most fair and free. He outlined and released it within communities that
believed in the opposite of what you are now saying.

It may be true that in the future only banks would be using this system, but that will only
be due to technological limitations and expenses and not because that was Satoshi's original
intention.
 

...
These two clowns are just clowns and their agenda is exposed.  My proof they are wrong, and I am moral, and right.

I have no agenda, unlike you. I only want Bitcoin to balance through time since that is the
most secure future. You would enslave humanity if it benefit you and your ego.

I support a decentralized & unregulatable ledger first, with safe scaling over time.
Request a signed message if you are associating with anyone claiming to be me.
traincarswreck
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March 04, 2017, 03:11:53 AM
 #267



If it was for the banks, why didn't he patent the whole system or certain parts of it and
market or sell directly to the banks. Instead Satoshi attempted to release it in a manner
that would be the most fair and free. He outlined and released it within communities that
believed in the opposite of what you are now saying.

It may be true that in the future only banks would be using this system, but that will only
be due to technological limitations and expenses and not because that was Satoshi's original
intention.

Do you know what sentiments are?  They mean feelings.  Like opinion.  Other people here go to school and stuff, and they are taught science and what it means to put together a well founded argument.  This includes research and dialogue with other experts.  These are things you don't understand.  Also macro economics, you don't understand, which includes "banks". You don't know how to read a source document or why its important.

How many people do you think you will convince not to listen to a well reasoned argument?
danda
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March 04, 2017, 03:20:21 AM
 #268

I do not disagree with you at all on this point.  I have thought the same since the first day I read about and began to understand bitcoin, though of course I did not make a connection with Nash.   In private conversation I have usually called it a straight-jacket or trojan horse for banks and govs, but I like finger trap too!

note:  I don't post about it, because I figure the less they are warned the better.   :-)

At least you understand my argument.  You are just sad Satoshi lied.  You never would have participated if he told you the truth.  Bitcoin is a finger trap for nations and banks:



The more they struggle the tighter things will get. Thx for bumping my thread lots!

mybitprices.info - wallet auditing tools
franky1
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March 04, 2017, 03:25:22 AM
 #269

you have spend 14 pages trying to tell people that bitcoin is not ideal money..

ok bitcoin is not nashes "ideal money".. no disaster..
best rebuttal.. bitcoin is not a banana either.. (widen your scope and think outside of the box to know what i am getting at)

bitcoin is not meant to be for the banks to adopt. bitcoin is a new paradigm AWAY from the greed of bankers.

bitcoin doesnt need to be government controlled ideal money. it works as an open and natural digital asset currency

bitcoins value(price) stability is not related to bitcoins value(utility) needing to be halted.
even if we halted all value(utility).. the value(price) will still be unstable due to it being new. and so far used by less than 1%, which makes it volatile by a small number of users

by developing bitcoin adding value(utility) you will see value(desire) increase and adoption increase and then with more people the value(price) will stabilise

there is a stability S curve and at the moment bitcoin is still at the beginning. and has a long way to go mainstream to reach the peak where things get stable.

halting development does not = stability

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traincarswreck
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March 04, 2017, 03:32:25 AM
 #270

This entire scenario came to Nash in an flash of insight when he was in his late 20's.  He was basically still a kid.  He wasn't crazy, it just took him time to realize he can't just tell people and they would understand.

Quote
I spent times of the order of five to eight months in hospitals in New Jersey, always on an involuntary basis and always attempting a legal argument for release. And it did happen that when I had been long enough hospitalized that I would finally renounce my delusional hypotheses and revert to thinking of myself as a human of more conventional circumstances and return to mathematical research. In these interludes of, as it were, enforced rationality, I did succeed in doing some respectable mathematical research. Thus there came about the research for "Le problème de Cauchy pour les équations différentielles d'un fluide général"; the idea that Prof. Hironaka called "the Nash blowing-up transformation"; and those of "Arc Structure of Singularities" and "Analyticity of Solutions of Implicit Function Problems with Analytic Data".

But after my return to the dream-like delusional hypotheses in the later 60s I became a person of delusionally influenced thinking but of relatively moderate behavior and thus tended to avoid hospitalization and the direct attention of psychiatrists.

By 1995, however, even though he was "thinking rationally again in the style that is characteristic of scientists," he said he felt more limited.[9][35]

'95 was the first lecture I could find of his on ideal money.  (if i remember correct that's when szabo and chaum were doing digicash, not sure if i just made that up or not).
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March 04, 2017, 06:42:39 AM
 #271


What did Satoshi lie about?
He made you believe bitcoin is for the peoples.  Its not.  Its for the metaplayers, the big banks. 


How can ideal money be not for all ?

What is 'ideal' if it is rather ideal for ( central) banks ?  (ideal for a very special group)


Ideal money is money for the poor, here we have biggest gaps to fill.

Carpe diem  -  cut the down side  -  be anti-fragile
A feature that needs more than one convincing argument is no and Satoshi owes me no proof.
My coding style is legendary but limited to 1MB, sorry but cannot come much over my C64, Bill Gates and Tom Bombadil
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March 04, 2017, 06:50:48 AM
 #272


What did Satoshi lie about?
He made you believe bitcoin is for the peoples.  Its not.  Its for the metaplayers, the big banks.  

Boom and their it is !!!

You hit the Nail Right on the Head.
 Wink


 Cool

FYI:
traincarswreck
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March 04, 2017, 06:55:07 AM
 #273



How can ideal money be not for all ?

What is 'ideal' if it is rather ideal for ( central) banks ?  (ideal for a very special group)


Ideal money is money for the poor, here we have biggest gaps to fill.
because the definition for deal we are using is 'stable in value of long periods of time'. Your definition sucks and doesn't do anything.  Our definition stops governments and banks from screwing over the people. Didn't you read the paper?

bitcoin is not for the peoples daily use, its a finger trap for the meta-players.
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March 04, 2017, 07:57:47 AM
 #274

@traincarswreck ,

Just Curious,
In your understanding of Future Events,
Where the Meta-players use BTC Onchain Exclusively ,

In your opinion, do you see the world's people only allowed to use Offchain Representations of BTC Shenanigans controlled by the Meta-players?


 Cool
traincarswreck
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March 04, 2017, 08:02:59 AM
 #275

@traincarswreck ,

Just Curious,
In your understanding of Future Events,
Where the Meta-players use BTC Onchain Exclusively ,

In your opinion, do you see the world's people only allowed to use Offchain Representations of BTC Shenanigans controlled by the Meta-players?


 Cool
No.  Don't think conspiracy or bad.  Think Nash is smart and good:

Quote from: Ideal Money
…this standard, as a basis for the standardization of the value of the international money unit, would remove the political roles of the “grand pardoners,”…

Remember the genesis block:

Quote
The Times 03/Jan/2009 Chancellor on brink of second bailout for banks[1]

Nash is saying this will never happen again.  No more bailouts.  Nash wins.



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March 04, 2017, 08:05:50 AM
 #276



How can ideal money be not for all ?

What is 'ideal' if it is rather ideal for ( central) banks ?  (ideal for a very special group)


Ideal money is money for the poor, here we have biggest gaps to fill.
because the definition for deal we are using is 'stable in value of long periods of time'. Your definition sucks and doesn't do anything.  Our definition stops governments and banks from screwing over the people. Didn't you read the paper?

bitcoin is not for the peoples daily use, its a finger trap for the meta-players.

I see. I can help you out.

Go look up R3CEV or hyperledger or intra blockchain. This is your friend. They can just copy bitcoin and run it inside thier meta world, as idially as you wish. bingo

Carpe diem  -  cut the down side  -  be anti-fragile
A feature that needs more than one convincing argument is no and Satoshi owes me no proof.
My coding style is legendary but limited to 1MB, sorry but cannot come much over my C64, Bill Gates and Tom Bombadil
traincarswreck
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March 04, 2017, 08:05:57 AM
 #277

traincarswreck
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March 04, 2017, 08:06:59 AM
 #278




I see. I can help you out.

Go look up R3CEV or hyperledger or intra blockchain. This is your friend. They can just copy bitcoin and run it inside thier meta world, so idially as you wish. bingo
Only central banks meta players and ignorant people don't like nash's proposal.  Which are you?  Cause Nash saved the people.
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March 04, 2017, 08:08:17 AM
 #279

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March 04, 2017, 08:08:54 AM
 #280

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