Butterfly Labs Jalapeno Unboxing

[creativex]

So who lied in oct? Nov? Dec? Jan? Feb? Mar?

Months of lying from you mouth has been much more epic. You have more to account for than puerto. Stop deflecting lol

If I had a penny for every delivery date and scheduled release in the tech world that has been moved/scrapped I would have, well I guess a lot of pennies. Doesn't make all those companies liars. BFL's biggest mistake was sharing their timelines and estimates before they had a solid information, their lack of experience in the field surely didn't help either.

Indeed, you can be sure it won't be happening again if I have anything to say about it.  The ship dates were announced before I came on board with BFL and going forward, unless I am explicitly overridden, we will not be making any shipping date commitments.  It will be Valve time from here on out if I have my way.

Nice.

In your face FTC! JZ says NO to your silly rules about delivering stuff people paid for.

http://business.ftc.gov/documents/alt051-selling-internet-prompt-delivery-rules

You da man JZ. Hey send those FCC trolls a get lost memo too while you're at it since you didn't comply there either. We know how Sonny feels about the man though, so nobody expects BFL officers to follow the same rules as everyone else. It's just the silly FCC though, Sonny is unlikely to go back to jail for it.

[nathanrees19]

Haha, do you expect anything less from Puerto Libre?  He's lied repeatedly for months, why not throw some fraud into the mix?  He's right up his alley, given his lifestyle.

Can you feel the epic wave of back peddling by the likes of Yajaira D Guevara and the rest of the clown crew as they try to claim they never said BFL was a scam or that BFL would never ship or that BFL never had ASICs etc... but they ACTUALLY meant something entirely different.

I expected that those who were emotionally invested in the whole "omg BFL is a scam" thing would have trouble accepting otherwise and would probably look for other reasons for BFL to be in the wrong, but honestly I'm slightly surprised that PL outright advocated fraud.

[nathanrees19]

So who lied in oct? Nov? Dec? Jan? Feb? Mar?

broken promise != lie

[Epicblood]

So who lied in oct? Nov? Dec? Jan? Feb? Mar?

broken promise != lie

Sure it does, they said they would ship at a certain date, they did not.
that is a lie

[Bogart]

That red triple-headed power cable looks familiar.

[PuertoLibre]

It is pretty sneaky. Though they would probably not want anyone to know that their customers might be able to "double tap" them for a refund.

Consider that a customer using Paypal would want an actual refund of a transaction. So they use that workaround to "send" the customer money as a ?"gift"? for what they are owed. The original transaction still remains with that valid refund button. So if that customer still demands the transaction be refunded and open a dispute....they may very well get to "double tap" the refund.

So you you have spent months calling BFL a scam and now you are encouraging people to commit fraud? Really taking the moral high ground here I see!

A small tip, when you are trying throw shit at others make sure to not stand in your own shit pile, your shoes tend to get messy that way.

Haha, do you expect anything less from Puerto Libre?  He's lied repeatedly for months, why not throw some fraud into the mix?  He's right up his alley, given his lifestyle.

Can you feel the epic wave of back peddling by the likes of Yajaira D Guevara and the rest of the clown crew as they try to claim they never said BFL was a scam or that BFL would never ship or that BFL never had ASICs etc... but they ACTUALLY meant something entirely different.

Want to play?

Josh[ua] Ryan Zerlan?

I expected that those who were emotionally invested in the whole "omg BFL is a scam" thing would have trouble accepting otherwise and would probably look for other reasons for BFL to be in the wrong, but honestly I'm slightly surprised that PL outright advocated fraud.

I didn't advocate fraud. If people end up doing it, it is because BFL is misapplying refunds. (IMO) There is no loophole until it is then created.

There is an incentive now to close this loophole. I am surprised no one ever realized it.

----------------

I guess no one seems to wonder how a company can issue refunds of thousands of dollars of pre-order merchandise and Paypal never balks at it?

Circumvent the way refunds are done and you open up a backdoor to new problems. As long as no one is the wiser the abuse may continue. If you want to say sly crap, go right ahead. Pointing it out is not advocating.

Unless you are one of those types that thinks security through obscurity is...security?

Let Paypal deal with that issue when they come to it.

[Inaba]

I guess no one seems to wonder how a company can issue refunds of thousands of dollars of pre-order merchandise and Paypal never balks at it?

See, Yajaira D Guevara, this is why you're so pathetic.  You make statements like this.  Who says we issue refunds of thousands of dollars?  Your warped little mind?  We get very little refund requests in the grand scheme of things.  I know you desperately want it to be true that people are asking for refunds in droves, but it's simply not the case.  This is why I know a large majority of the whiny brats that cry about BFL still maintain their pre-orders.  Frankly, it wouldn't surprise me in the least if you had a stealth order yourself, just like Frizz, but until there's evidence of that, I'll give you props for being one of the few trolls who actually doesn't have a pre-order.

You just go on advocating fraud there, Yajaira.  You are a real stand up guy!  Not only a liar, but a thief and fraudster as well, GG!

[nathanrees19]

So who lied in oct? Nov? Dec? Jan? Feb? Mar?

broken promise != lie

Sure it does, they said they would ship at a certain date, they did not.
that is a lie

Wrong.

Edit so that this doesn't go back and forth forever:

A lie would be saying "We shipped in October" in November when they haven't shipped in October. If they say "We intend to ship in October" but something happens and they can't, that statement doesn't retroactively become a lie. A statement is true or false at the time that it is made; to knowingly make a false statement is to lie, by definition. Anything else is not a lie.

You see this kind of thing in politics all the time. A politician says "I will not do X".  They are later forced to do X due to external factors, and their opponent then (incorrectly) calls them a liar, even if they honestly intended to not do X. Or worse, they are forced to do Y which is kinda like X yet not X, their opponent then misrepresents Y as X and then calls them a liar. The general public is often too stupid to see that Y is not X and that even doing X would not have made it a lie...

[PuertoLibre]

I guess no one seems to wonder how a company can issue refunds of thousands of dollars of pre-order merchandise and Paypal never balks at it?

See, Yajaira D Guevara, this is why you're so pathetic.  You make statements like this.  Who says we issue refunds of thousands of dollars?  Your warped little mind?  We get very little refund requests in the grand scheme of things.  I know you desperately want it to be true that people are asking for refunds in droves, but it's simply not the case.  This is why I know a large majority of the whiny brats that cry about BFL still maintain their pre-orders.  Frankly, it wouldn't surprise me in the least if you had a stealth order yourself, just like Frizz, but until there's evidence of that, I'll give you props for being one of the few trolls who actually doesn't have a pre-order.

You just go on advocating fraud there, Yajaira.  You are a real stand up guy!  Not only a liar, but a thief and fraudster as well, GG!

Joshua Ryan Zerlan,

That is definitely trollbait. I don't really have much to say since I am sure everybody will pile on at some point.

"This is why I know a large majority of the whiny brats that cry about BFL still maintain their pre-orders." --Joshua Ryan Zerlan

[PuertoLibre]

You just go on advocating fraud there, Yajaira.  You are a real stand up guy!  Not only a liar, but a thief and fraudster as well, GG!

By the way, my dear genius, keep in mind...when you refund. You refund, that is pretty much it. There is "no more" to "fraud" the "process". It was designed a specific way for a specific means. If you alter that to avoid account closure that is your business. So far you don't even seem to be denying it.

Now if you abuse the system to keep from being "flagged", then yes, you open yourself to claims and "double taps". Try explaining to Paypal why the next customer is asking for a refund on their transaction after you claim you have already given them their money.

Do you actually think the 9 to 5 people at Paypal will actually give a damn that you used some exterior method to compensate your customer? I don't think they will. They will look at their screen like a robot plugged in and say something akin to "Sir, I see on my screen that this transaction has not yet been refunded. I am therefore going to close the claim and issue their refund. Thank you."

Don't expect Paypal to go the extra mile. It won't happen. Reasoning with them is futile. (I hope someone posts that Star Trek Borg cube after this)

[PuertoLibre]

Pro Tip:

Don't ever mention that you offer to give your customers refunds via BitCoin. Especially if they made a USD purchase through PayPal services. Instant closure of your account is an almost 99% certainty to occur.

[nathanrees19]

Do you actually think the 9 to 5 people at Paypal will actually give a damn that you used some exterior method to compensate your customer? I don't think they will.

I don't think you have any fucking idea what you're talking about.

[Inaba]

You do realize that real businesses that do a large amount of transactions with Paypal have account reps assigned to them specifically... sort of like a concierge service, right?  Oh, no, that's right.. you live in a shack in San Antonio and have a failed Computer Repair business and you buy women's handbags on the side... I guess you wouldn't know anything about doing business on a scale beyond a few dollars here and there, would you?  

Do you honestly think Paypal is unaware that our business involves hardware that is related to Bitcoin?  Seriously?

[PuertoLibre]

You do realize that real businesses that do a large amount of transactions with Paypal have account reps assigned to them specifically... sort of like a concierge service, right?  

You mean the account manager or a senior manager? You seem to think you are strangely unique in that regard. Crazy...

If hundreds of members here have thousands of dollars to spend...I am pretty sure if they have ever been in business (like many have) they know that. I had dozens to handle different accounts in the past. So what of it?

Oh, no, that's right.. you live in a shack in San Antonio and have a failed Computer Repair business and you buy women's handbags on the side... I guess you wouldn't know anything about doing business on a scale beyond a few dollars here and there, would you?  

Do you honestly think Paypal is unaware that our business involves hardware that is related to Bitcoin?  Seriously?

It could be worse, I could be you.  

Edit: By the way, in all seriousness. You should be applauded for getting this far. Your dedication to the miner and ability to take multiple hits for Team BFL is really admirable. You definitely know how to walk through a marsh full of shit and still walk to the other end.

No one should ever say that you didn't have a sense of dedication to see things through to the end. I'll give you credit when it is due.

(I am also thankful that the new Jalapeno didn't burn the reviewers hands upon touching it. It seems like it lost it's coffee warming abilities.)

[nathanrees19]

Serious question for BFL: are you getting some hardware to ck? The cgminer team needs some love.

[Inaba]

Yes, Conman and Kano should be getting their units next week as well as Bitminter, among a number of others.

[Nancarrow]

This video is great news. BFL finally got their shit together, even if power needs were wildly underestimated. This is infinitely better than that slimy shit Luke and Josh pulled three weeks ago.

[nathanrees19]

Yes, Conman and Kano should be getting their units next week as well as Bitminter, among a number of others.

Cheers.

[Epicblood]

So who lied in oct? Nov? Dec? Jan? Feb? Mar?

broken promise != lie

Sure it does, they said they would ship at a certain date, they did not.
that is a lie

Wrong.

Edit so that this doesn't go back and forth forever:

A lie would be saying "We shipped in October" in November when they haven't shipped in October. If they say "We intend to ship in October" but something happens and they can't, that statement doesn't retroactively become a lie. A statement is true or false at the time that it is made; to knowingly make a false statement is to lie, by definition. Anything else is not a lie.

You see this kind of thing in politics all the time. A politician says "I will not do X".  They are later forced to do X due to external factors, and their opponent then (incorrectly) calls them a liar, even if they honestly intended to not do X. Or worse, they are forced to do Y which is kinda like X yet not X, their opponent then misrepresents Y as X and then calls them a liar. The general public is often too stupid to see that Y is not X and that even doing X would not have made it a lie...

Alright, I see where you're coming from.

[Syke]

A lie would be saying "We shipped in October" in November when they haven't shipped in October. If they say "We intend to ship in October" but something happens and they can't, that statement doesn't retroactively become a lie. A statement is true or false at the time that it is made; to knowingly make a false statement is to lie, by definition. Anything else is not a lie.

There are lots of different kinds of lies. Putting forth ship dates that have no chance to be met, is a "misleading" lie. Being in "final stages of development" for 7 months is a "puffery" lie. Promising "1 watt consumed per gigahash" when they haven't even built a prototype is a "fabrication" lie.