Mining fees will eventually kill bitcoin

[deisik]

I think that main line you see already that cap BTC have. Without any changes i don't see major BTC rise against inflation.
BTC today stay at limit that alone without community Segwit/LN or BU it won't pass.
Once you stop evolving you will slide down because ctypo won't wait for BTC.
This is like EU all see its dying bu noone can pass changes and only fall can bring revolution.
Same time countries in Asia don't wait for EU and evolve and have +5 GDP.

Alts will improve because of high competition in market share, BTC will fall slowly off even from mainstream radars.
I want BU miners make HF and move on their own chain, let other create segwit/LN and we will see what market will chose.
Enchanted BTC core or forked alt BU if this is only solution let it be, best chain will win

The market price of a coin reveals everything you may need to know

Indeed, no one says there is nothing to know just beyond that but in respect to falling off slowly, the price will be the first hallmark if it ever comes to that. Regarding the BU folks (miners and developers alike), they seem to be the ones who are actually muddying the waters here. And the sooner they leave with their Bitcoin altcoin the better. But mark my words, they won't leave, they will continue to stay with Bitcoin. Otherwise, everyone and his dog will quickly find out that there is no substance behind them. All major exchanges have made it pretty clear recently

[Pettuh4]

The fact that fee will eventually grow as the reward for mining a block gets lower has always been part of the plan on the development of bitcoin, the issue here is there is not a solution backed by everyone to make bitcoin scale.

Well I'm not disputing that fact the mining fees were a part of the original plan but when there is discrimination in the determination of the fees then I have a problem because we need to be treated equally. Why should my transaction delay because I couldn't pay more fees? This is my bane and if we don't get it solved it can kill Bitcoin eventually.

[deisik]

The fact that fee will eventually grow as the reward for mining a block gets lower has always been part of the plan on the development of bitcoin, the issue here is there is not a solution backed by everyone to make bitcoin scale.

Well I'm not disputing that fact the mining fees were a part of the original plan but when there is discrimination in the determination of the fees then I have a problem because we need to be treated equally. Why should my transaction delay because I couldn't pay more fees? This is my bane and if we don't get it solved it can kill Bitcoin eventually

There is no need to be treated equally

To force equal treatment in the way you want it would kill Bitcoin even faster. Socialism is not sustainable in a closed system. You basically want that someone else should pay the fee for you if you want to be treated equally and at the same time pay less. In fact, you don't need to be treated equally at all since if there were a true free market in the mining department, all transactions would be included even if higher paying ones (i.e. with more fees) would still be prioritized. The reason is pretty simple, in a free market miners would be interested to include all transactions with however small fees just because that would be a rational choice to increase profits. Right now they can increase profits by raising the fees themselves by excluding low-fee transactions. This is possible because there is a mining oligopoly in Bitcoin and users have no other choice but to pay higher fees

[jaysabi]

The fact that fee will eventually grow as the reward for mining a block gets lower has always been part of the plan on the development of bitcoin, the issue here is there is not a solution backed by everyone to make bitcoin scale.

Well I'm not disputing that fact the mining fees were a part of the original plan but when there is discrimination in the determination of the fees then I have a problem because we need to be treated equally. Why should my transaction delay because I couldn't pay more fees? This is my bane and if we don't get it solved it can kill Bitcoin eventually

There is no need to be treated equally

To force equal treatment in the way you want it would kill Bitcoin even faster. Socialism is not sustainable in a closed system. You basically want that someone else should pay the fee for you if you want to be treated equally and at the same time pay less. In fact, you don't need to be treated equally at all since if there were a true free market in the mining department, all transactions would be included even if higher paying ones (i.e. with more fees) would still be prioritized. The reason is pretty simple, in a free market miners would be interested to include all transactions with however small fees just because that would be a rational choice to increase profits. Right now they can increase profits by raising the fees themselves by excluding low-fee transactions. This is possible because there is a mining oligopoly in Bitcoin and users have no other choice but to pay higher fees

You can't include all transaction when there isn't space though. The limited block size means wait time for the lowest price/byte transactions. Increasing transactions to increase profits isn't possible when the blocks are maxed out on size. And you can look at the blockchain itself to see that blocks are just about maxed out, so there just isn't capacity to increase profits by accepting more transactions.

[rajasumi3]

No i dont think it will totally kill bitcoins .with the advancement of the price tx fees will increase and i think it is the minimum when comparison to the taxes u pay through the governement .

[Meowth05]

No i dont think it will totally kill bitcoins .with the advancement of the price tx fees will increase and i think it is the minimum when comparison to the taxes u pay through the governement .

Eventually, if we are about to compare the tax between the fiat money transactions and bitcoin transactions, bitcoin transaction's fee is still cheaper than fiat money transactions since it only pays miners, not the governments. However, if the governments charge or require every bitcoin's transaction, it would eventually keeps its users to prefer other means of transactions. This is quite possible, yet there's no assurance if it would eventually happen.

[DoublerHunter]

No i dont think it will totally kill bitcoins .with the advancement of the price tx fees will increase and i think it is the minimum when comparison to the taxes u pay through the governement .

Eventually, if we are about to compare the tax between the fiat money transactions and bitcoin transactions, bitcoin transaction's fee is still cheaper than fiat money transactions since it only pays miners, not the governments. However, if the governments charge or require every bitcoin's transaction, it would eventually keeps its users to prefer other means of transactions. This is quite possible, yet there's no assurance if it would eventually happen.

That is correct. The fees in bitcoin is still cheaper than the fiat or any other kind of payment method. Even though it is continue rising, i think the fee is still fair for the users that are usually doing transactions because even though they send a lot of money, the fee is not that high and you can still have much left in your wallet. Also, the transactions are still average in time frame and i can received bitcoin within an hour which is still great with a cheaper fee in it.

[deisik]

No i dont think it will totally kill bitcoins .with the advancement of the price tx fees will increase and i think it is the minimum when comparison to the taxes u pay through the governement .

Eventually, if we are about to compare the tax between the fiat money transactions and bitcoin transactions, bitcoin transaction's fee is still cheaper than fiat money transactions since it only pays miners, not the governments. However, if the governments charge or require every bitcoin's transaction, it would eventually keeps its users to prefer other means of transactions. This is quite possible, yet there's no assurance if it would eventually happen.

That is correct. The fees in bitcoin is still cheaper than the fiat or any other kind of payment method. Even though it is continue rising, i think the fee is still fair for the users that are usually doing transactions because even though they send a lot of money, the fee is not that high and you can still have much left in your wallet. Also, the transactions are still average in time frame and i can received bitcoin within an hour which is still great with a cheaper fee in it

How long and how often have you actually been using "fiat or any other kind of payment method"?

In most cases, you don't have to pay anything as a transaction fee if you buy things both online and offline using a payment card like Visa or MasterCard. In fact, the bank which issued the card can even give you a certain percentage of cashback on a specific category of purchases (or just on all purchases) if you use their card. Needless to say that all these transactions are virtually instant (typically, it takes only a few seconds to confirm the transaction). Some banks even offer free of charge wire transfers up to a certain limit of amount transferred. You could hypothetically transact in bitcoins with no fees at all, provided you first completely exclude confirmation times (up to a few days) from consideration altogether

[ekoice]

Now that the SEC has rejected the Winklevoss bitcoin ETF, I decided to actually glance through their S-1 (registration statement) that they filed with the SEC just for the heck of it. The S-1 requires a statement and discussion of possible risks associated with a security that is seeking SEC registration. In the Winklevoss S-1, I found this section particularly noteworthy (emphasis is original):

As the number of Bitcoins awarded for solving a block in the Blockchain decreases, the incentive for miners to continue to contribute processing power to the Bitcoin Network will transition from a set reward to transaction fees. The requirement from miners of higher transaction fees in exchange for recording transactions in the Blockchain may decrease demand for Bitcoins and prevent the expansion of the Bitcoin Network to retail merchants and commercial businesses, resulting in a reduction in the Blended Bitcoin Price.

If transaction fees paid for the recording of transactions in the Blockchain become too high, the marketplace may be reluctant to accept Bitcoins as a means of payment and existing users may be motivated to switch from Bitcoins to another Digital Math-Based Asset or back to fiat currency. Decreased use and demand for Bitcoins may adversely affect their value and result in a reduction in the Blended Bitcoin Price.

Not only is this a risk that they highlighted, my view is this is inevitable, and that mining fees will eventually become prohibitive not only to bitcoin expansion, but everyday bitcoin function. This is the flaw that will eventually render bitcoin unusable for everyday commerce, and the price will decline accordingly as demand for coins falls off as a result.

Mining fees will eventually kill bitcoin, the question is if this is avoidable with some type of change, or a predetermined fate that cannot be altered due to the nature of the ecosystem?

Its the biggest issue which the bitcoin environment is facing today.I had to pay my friend some amount and so i sent btc with a fee of 0.0009 manually set hoping that it would be confirmed quickly.But what happened is i had to wait for 24 hours to receive the payment.In this digital world,every thing happens fast and digital gold taking more time seems very much contrast.

[wxa7115]

The fees are getting more and more expensive everyday!

Just today, i sent 3.77 usd and the bitcoin core client wanted 0.50 cents, that's ridiculous for 3.77

i created my own fee and the fee turned out to be 0.07, it's been 7 hours and no confirmations yet,

im not worried, i think eventually it will go through, and i wanted to test it to see how long it would take,

but yes, bitcoin would not work for small transactions for stores and between strangers, its too slow

i know the 0.50 cent fee would of been super fast, but it's way to expensive,

i remember when there was free fees and it was fast,

i have no problem if there is no free fees, i don't mind paying fees, to support the bitcoin technology because the transactions fees help the miners, but it is getting way out of control

i don't think bitcoin will go down that easy, it's still very convenient to transfer lots of money, millions,
 
i'm not ready to give up on bitcoin yet, but i hope they fix things, or yes it could kill bitcoin

You must understand that the price of miners fee is dictated by the size of the transaction in bytes and not by the amount you send, you could have send a million dollars and the fee will still be 50 cents which is very cheap what this means is that bitcoin is no longer a good way to send microtransactions.