BW.com L21 - Litecoin (scrypt) ASIC miner - unofficial speculation thread

[wheelz1200]

Would just rather buy some second hand L3+s which are real at this point and have shown to be a good design.  $2800 and a min order of 100 is a no go.  Sorry but will stick with the L3s i have and ride em out.  If these do come out might have some worries about my titans though...  

[Longsnowsm]

I don't see a performance advantage with the L21, it would just come down to availability and maybe some competition for Bitmain.  Bitmain has started the game of selling stuff way into the future, well if another company comes along and offers real miners in hand now then maybe some of those "pre-sales" start to dry up. 

I welcome the competition.  I hope it turns into a horse race so we have choices.  So far the 2800 and 100 unit minimum isn't going to do that.  They clearly are focused on the "big boys" who are filling data centers. 

[QuintLeo]

At least it looks like they might actually sell some of these units, as opposed to their Bitcoin mining units that never did end up going on sale to the public.
Specs are inferior to the L3+, but quite close for a 28nm unit vs the L3+ apparently being 14/16nm.

Price though - they better be ready to drop it FAST once Bitmain gets close to shipping their next batch.

 Given what I've seen dealers selling the L3+ for right now though, they MIGHT get some sales.

 Hopefully it will also pressure Innosilicon to drop their INFLATED pricing on the A4.

[Searing]

At least it looks like they might actually sell some of these units, as opposed to their Bitcoin mining units that never did end up going on sale to the public.
Specs are inferior to the L3+, but quite close for a 28nm unit vs the L3+ apparently being 14/16nm.

Price though - they better be ready to drop it FAST once Bitmain gets close to shipping their next batch.

 Given what I've seen dealers selling the L3+ for right now though, they MIGHT get some sales.

 Hopefully it will also pressure Innosilicon to drop their INFLATED pricing on the A4.

They probably will lower the 100 unit bulk rate to something more manageable to move them in China to big data halls. I doubt they have the
chops to compete against bitmain in retail price per unit ...etc

ie bulk 100 sales NOW is still like 2weeks or more before bitmain stuff ships..thus the extra they are charging if they are going out the door now
may be moot to a large buying in china vs getting bitmain stuff on an order now in sept or oct

i probably don't know what I'm talking about...but used to see what I thought was high priced 100 priced lots of btc equip in china more at those prices
back in the day in bulk..but the stuff was usually dumped when the more/bigger/competitive bigger player manufacturer was not shipping for a month or so.

makes a diff in my view if you are a big player putting stuff up NOW vs 2 months later at less price

anyway ..just a guess on their 100 unit price being high..its on hand .thus a big player or more in china at 2-5c elec will grab it up imho

want to be wrong and have someone slap around bitmain on price and delivery....don't see it happening yet thou

[slovakia]

SEARING: Must quote up above comment? damn it are you first time in internet?

[Searing]

SEARING: Must quote up above comment? damn it are you first time in internet?

my oddness is legendary How it was done BEFORE the internet (yeah I'm that old)

[slovakia]

Searing   highest time to start using your brain  

[HagssFIN]

Searing   highest time to start using your brain  

Stay on topic, please.
That's just useless crap talk.

[GMPoison]

At least it looks like they might actually sell some of these units, as opposed to their Bitcoin mining units that never did end up going on sale to the public.
Specs are inferior to the L3+, but quite close for a 28nm unit vs the L3+ apparently being 14/16nm.

Price though - they better be ready to drop it FAST once Bitmain gets close to shipping their next batch.

 Given what I've seen dealers selling the L3+ for right now though, they MIGHT get some sales.

 Hopefully it will also pressure Innosilicon to drop their INFLATED pricing on the A4.

They probably will lower the 100 unit bulk rate to something more manageable to move them in China to big data halls. I doubt they have the
chops to compete against bitmain in retail price per unit ...etc

ie bulk 100 sales NOW is still like 2weeks or more before bitmain stuff ships..thus the extra they are charging if they are going out the door now
may be moot to a large buying in china vs getting bitmain stuff on an order now in sept or oct

i probably don't know what I'm talking about...but used to see what I thought was high priced 100 priced lots of btc equip in china more at those prices
back in the day in bulk..but the stuff was usually dumped when the more/bigger/competitive bigger player manufacturer was not shipping for a month or so.

makes a diff in my view if you are a big player putting stuff up NOW vs 2 months later at less price

anyway ..just a guess on their 100 unit price being high..its on hand .thus a big player or more in china at 2-5c elec will grab it up imho

want to be wrong and have someone slap around bitmain on price and delivery....don't see it happening yet thou

Well Bitmain just released another batch of L3+ but now the price is around $2000. Still fair for the potential profits that these things will make though. I wish BW would sell less than 100 at a time so there would be some more competition out there.

[QuintLeo]

Well Bitmain just released another batch of L3+ but now the price is around $2000. Still fair for the potential profits that these things will make though. I wish BW would sell less than 100 at a time so there would be some more competition out there.

 Delivery mid-to-late September - and priced in Litecoin, which is a change for them but does make SOME sense.
 They had that batch up yesterday, but it was priced originally in $ - unfortunately I didn't pay close attention to how much $, so I dunno if they jacked the price when they changed to the Litecoin pricing or not.

[MachineZero]

Well Bitmain just released another batch of L3+ but now the price is around $2000. Still fair for the potential profits that these things will make though. I wish BW would sell less than 100 at a time so there would be some more competition out there.

They must have high hopes for LTC price. Now the preferred way of receiving payment for L3+.
Glad I got my order in last week.

[GMPoison]

Well Bitmain just released another batch of L3+ but now the price is around $2000. Still fair for the potential profits that these things will make though. I wish BW would sell less than 100 at a time so there would be some more competition out there.

They must have high hopes for LTC price. Now the preferred way of receiving payment for L3+.
Glad I got my order in last week.

I have high hopes for the future of LTC. Altcoins are making big moves, and LTC is no exception with all of the positive things that are going on with it.

[kurbeks]

Would be interested in few units if someone would do group buy.

[GMPoison]

Would be interested in few units if someone would do group buy.

Group buy of 100 wouldn't be a bad idea, we would just need at least 100 units ordered or none of them would go through. That's also a lot of money to handle.

[Longsnowsm]

Well I would suggest that the first step would be to reach out to manufacturer and see if they are open to a group buy if we could get a large enough order.  They may be willing to help the community with such a purchase.

Secondly I would only suggest doing this if the manufacturer was the one accepting the orders and the money for the orders, or some sort of escrow which is pretty unlikely to happen given the size of the order.  Most of the escrows are not going to want to handle that much cash.

The logistics of such an order could be a nightmare.  If the manufacturer will drop ship to individual addresses then it might work.  Otherwise you have to send the miners to a single receiving point and have them forwarded which means even more shipping costs added on, and the possibility that the order ends up getting hung up in customs and a large customs fee is tacked on due to the size of the shipment.  And of course you would need to trust the receiver with you equipment to send it onto you.

You would need to trust the manufacturer with your funds and hope that they will deliver the product.  It is less risk with a company with a track history like Innosilicon, so I don't know how much trust you can place in BW.

If I were more interested in buying some of these I would offer to try and get a group buy going for these, but I am going to beg off on this one.  I have the feeling Bitmain has already taken enough orders to flood the market with miners so I think I am going to wait and see what happens next.  I will be monitoring this thread with interest in how this turns out.

 

[GMPoison]

Well I would suggest that the first step would be to reach out to manufacturer and see if they are open to a group buy if we could get a large enough order.  They may be willing to help the community with such a purchase.

Secondly I would only suggest doing this if the manufacturer was the one accepting the orders and the money for the orders, or some sort of escrow which is pretty unlikely to happen given the size of the order.  Most of the escrows are not going to want to handle that much cash.

The logistics of such an order could be a nightmare.  If the manufacturer will drop ship to individual addresses then it might work.  Otherwise you have to send the miners to a single receiving point and have them forwarded which means even more shipping costs added on, and the possibility that the order ends up getting hung up in customs and a large customs fee is tacked on due to the size of the shipment.  And of course you would need to trust the receiver with you equipment to send it onto you.

You would need to trust the manufacturer with your funds and hope that they will deliver the product.  It is less risk with a company with a track history like Innosilicon, so I don't know how much trust you can place in BW.

If I were more interested in buying some of these I would offer to try and get a group buy going for these, but I am going to beg off on this one.  I have the feeling Bitmain has already taken enough orders to flood the market with miners so I think I am going to wait and see what happens next.  I will be monitoring this thread with interest in how this turns out.

Yeah, you bring up a lot of problems which are all logistical that make sense. I don't know how group buys have been done in the past but I'm assuming someone (or multiple people) that have proven themselves to be extremely trustworthy would hold the coins until the bulk order is to be made, then receive all of the miners and reship them to their respective owners. I wouldn't think that the manufacturer would have anything to do with it (nor would they be willing to) and it's all done by the leader of the group buy.

[Longsnowsm]

I coordinated a group buy in the past with Innosilicon and they helped me to facilitate the purchase for the community.  We were able to get them to reduce the minimum order and they were willing to direct ship to us as long as we ordered at least 3-5 miners.  So that worked out pretty well.  So the manufacturer may be willing to help.  Don't rule it out until they tell you they can't do it. 

Also you have to think about what it would be like to get an order of 100 miners and then have to keep track of who ordered what and juggle shipments and assume the risk of possible damage.  It would be a pretty large undertaking and not something that many people will take on unless they are going to charge you something for doing all that work.

Small orders not as big a problem, but 100 units?  That is a lot. 

[kilo17]

I have emailed them but not gotten a reply from them yet.

[Searing]

Well the odds got better. Bitmain raised the price of their L3+ to 41 LTC (only crypto listed..I assume you can still wire xfer)..that currently is about $2,100 usd.

Great evil planning on their part. IF LTC goes to 75 bucks, bitmain will point to them and say buy now..if LTC Price dumps to 40 bucks they will say

buy now great deals.

A way to maximize the most amount of miners out the door with the least amount of hassle on their part..self-regulating to get max units (er toasters) out the door...L3's that is

So

2,800 bucks now for an L21 miner from bw.com is looking a LOT better if they

1) have them on hand to ship now vs waiting till end of Sept or beginning of Oct to get the above-mentioned batches of L3+'s

2) if you can find a legit guy doing a group buy like (longsnowsm) to do it, assuming they will take pity on hobby thread here and do a batch of 25 say at that price


The main reason for them to do so ..is to get the word out to the big boys on this thread that COULD with like 4 whale buddies get 100 piece lots

Group buys can really take off under the right circumstances

but anyway, those are the two levers you'd have to move to get this big a*ss rock moving and get some of these out into the world imho

edit:

should and one more point

3) They have to answer their emails to either a) consider this group buy or b) tell us to bugger off

[HagssFIN]

I just contacted BW and proposed a buy and review for one BW L21 Litecoin miner (like I have done previously with Hotmine company).
I know it is way below the MOQ of 100 units, but let's see what is their answer