Bitmain announces plan to create altcoin if BIP148 succeeds

[pokapeski]

After thinking about it for not too long (and after cuddling in foetal position for some good 10 minutes realizing how consensus-less fanatics have provocked this abrupt awaken of a beutiful dream) by now I am cashing my BTC immediately.

This is actually great news for Bitcoin holders (seriously). People are dumping for dumb reasons (is it news to anyone that there is a contentious scaling debate)? Meanwhile, the major obstacle to scaling is declaring that they are going off and creating their own altcoin, and in doing so signaling that BIP148 must have greater strength than generally realized, which means it is likely to succeed now.

In short: Bitcoin price is down at precisely the time when we can see some light at the end of the tunnel.

I beg to differ here, mate. features appart, bitcoin is a currency and as such it has to protect value. All this frenzy TV-soap with unilateral UASF is the kind of idiocy that bitcoin could have helped to prevent a long track of idiotic monetary policies in different countries where people had been exposed until now. Stronk Bitcoin is a clear message to authorities declaring that if you screw your monies I flee to bitcoin and screw you. This last chapter is a pathetic show on how we as a community are not able to represent a decent alternative to any fiat currency. as sad as it makes me writing this.

[gentlemand]

I beg to differ here, mate. features appart, bitcoin is a currency and as such it has to protect value. All this frenzy TV-soap with unilateral UASF is the kind of idiocy that bitcoin could have helped to prevent a long track of idiotic monetary policies in different countries where people had been exposed until now. Stronk Bitcoin is a clear message to authorities declaring that if you screw your monies I flee to bitcoin and screw you. This last chapter is a pathetic show on how we as a community are not able to represent a decent alternative to any fiat currency. as sad as it makes me writing this.

This has been ongoing since 2010 pretty much and you shouldn't be surprised that it's still an issue. There will always be power struggles and user dissatisfaction. Everyone wants it to be all things to them while other groups want it to be all things to them.

[Paashaas]

What happend with those BU supporters these days? For months i've seen walls of text with anti-Core anti-Segwit anti-Lightning content. Look what there overlord Jihand Wu is doing now, he dropped BU and focusing on Core's disign called Segwit. 

Jihan is swapping camps by supporting BIP48 ore BIP49 in the end. Saving face is very important in Asia.

[pokapeski]

I beg to differ here, mate. features appart, bitcoin is a currency and as such it has to protect value. All this frenzy TV-soap with unilateral UASF is the kind of idiocy that bitcoin could have helped to prevent a long track of idiotic monetary policies in different countries where people had been exposed until now. Stronk Bitcoin is a clear message to authorities declaring that if you screw your monies I flee to bitcoin and screw you. This last chapter is a pathetic show on how we as a community are not able to represent a decent alternative to any fiat currency. as sad as it makes me writing this.

This has been ongoing since 2010 pretty much and you shouldn't be surprised that it's still an issue. There will always be power struggles and user dissatisfaction. Everyone wants it to be all things to them while other groups want it to be all things to them.

true say but I find it´s normal that tensions arise and agreements may take a long time to be reached but a split-up it's breaking the game, IMO.

[deisik]

There is no such thing as an "economic majority". 95% of Bitcoin users don't care or are uneducated when it comes to the scaling debate. A handful of CEO's saying they support this or they support that, is nothing more than political gerrymandering that literally means nothing, unless they personally own large chunks of hashpower, That is

I can definitely say that you talk too much

You can discard the economic majority as non-existent in the same way as you can throw away the law of gravity. You may think that it doesn't exist and whatnot, but it is what gravity itself thinks which is what finally matters. In other words, your ignoring of the economic majority doesn't make it less effective. More specifically, while 95% of Bitcoin users may in fact be uneducated or even ignorant (just like you) but since their coins are mostly traded, exchanges would act as their proxies and on their behalf. So you may very well consider the major exchanges as the economic majority. And they certainly do care, and you can easily picture what they think about Jihan Wu and his efforts

[OROBTC]

There is no such thing as an "economic majority". 95% of Bitcoin users don't care or are uneducated when it comes to the scaling debate. A handful of CEO's saying they support this or they support that, is nothing more than political gerrymandering that literally means nothing, unless they personally own large chunks of hashpower, That is

I can definitely say that you talk too much

You can discard the economic majority as non-existent in the same way as you can throw away the law of gravity. You may think that it doesn't exist and whatnot, but it is what gravity itself thinks which is what finally matters. In other words, your ignoring of the economic majority doesn't make it less effective. More specifically, while 95% of Bitcoin users may in fact be uneducated or even ignorant (just like you) but since their coins are mostly traded, exchanges would act as their proxies and on their behalf. So you may very well consider the major exchanges as the economic majority. And they certainly do care, and you can easily picture what they think about Jihan Wu and his efforts

I am more ignorant than the average "Legendary" here but let me tell you my opinion FWIW.  First, I love the whole idea of a good crypto, that's what brought me here to Bitcoinistan...

But, if this whole thing ends badly, I am OUT!  I'll wait patiently for an Alt that might be better, less contention and drama.  Maybe some more forward thinking too.  Include better anonymity, and I would take a good look.

BTC turning into one or more shitcoins will not work for non-tekkies like me...

[Lauda]

The likely outcome of this is three chains (unless BIP148 gathers enough support so that it remains the same with status quo):
1) BIP148 Segwit.
2) Status Quo (the one that we are using today).
3) Bitmain coin.

Can you guess which one I'll be dumping?

[DooMAD]

While it generally looked like the split was inevitable, even I wasn't expecting quite this level of brinkmanship from both sides, heh.  My only suggestion to everyone would be not to let the big personalities set the narrative and tell you how to react.  Don't take anything at face value, regardless of who said it, because everyone has their own agenda.  Consider all the pros and cons, do your own research and make up your own damn minds.  And most important of all, don't do anything rash or hasty without thinking it through.  It might all seem like a massive drama, but calm heads usually prevail. 

After thinking about it for not too long (and after cuddling in foetal position for some good 10 minutes realizing how consensus-less fanatics have provocked this abrupt awaken of a beutiful dream) by now I am cashing my BTC immediately.

I can see why it might seem like a good idea, but there if a potential to lose out doing it that way.  Hodling in the event of a split means you get coins on both chains.  Selling before the split means you have to buy back after the split and choose very carefully which chain you think has the best chance of survival.  And if you take too long deciding, the fiat price may well recover to a level above the point that you panic sold.  

[deisik]

After thinking about it for not too long (and after cuddling in foetal position for some good 10 minutes realizing how consensus-less fanatics have provocked this abrupt awaken of a beutiful dream) by now I am cashing my BTC immediately.

This is actually great news for Bitcoin holders (seriously). People are dumping for dumb reasons (is it news to anyone that there is a contentious scaling debate)? Meanwhile, the major obstacle to scaling is declaring that they are going off and creating their own altcoin, and in doing so signaling that BIP148 must have greater strength than generally realized, which means it is likely to succeed now

There are some issues with this logic

First, you (most likely) erroneously assume that miners (represented by Jihan and his henchmen) are actually going to fork Bitcoin. So far the consensus has it that he is just bluffing and he is not going to shoot himself in the foot (or right in the head). That may well be true, and if so, things might be and likely are a lot more complicated than that (i.e. just forking Bitcoin as announced). Second, Jihan may have actually sold his soul already (to fiat demons), and he is following some really nasty plan or scheme in respect to Bitcoin and its future, so it is not just about forking Bitcoin either, and things are not just complicated, they are in fact really dangerous in what concerns the very Bitcoin existence as such

[BillyBobZorton]

oh i knew this would happen, what is this new coin that they would mine a fork of the original chian or an enterely new one, or maybe a coin already on the market?

It'll be a new fork of Bitcoin sort of in the vein of how XT/BU/Classic would've worked, but apparently he plans a little extra premine of 5400 "BTC" for himself.

What? That is ludicrous. Who the hell is going to stick with that nonsense? What will be the token for that one? I suggest JHC (JihadCoin). Or just call it ChinaCoin.

It looks like Jihan is losing his mind. Well, idiots and their money eventually part ways. His chance to continue being a good player in the bitcoin system are over. It would be as easy as signal for BIP141 and avoid this mess, but looks like his ego is too big to accept he is wrong. What an idiot.

[The_Dark_Knight]

If the chain splits, it will be bad from an image perspective for BTC. Pride destroyed whats supposed to be a brilliant master piece.

I do not know if I would call it that way, Bitmain is basically saying do as I say or I leave, and a large part of the community is like, leave already and leave bitcoin alone, if we get segwit activated and get rid of Bitmain at the same time then that would be great.

[25hashcoin]

Bitmain is basically saying do as I say or I leave, and a large part of the community is like, leave already and leave bitcoin alone, if we get segwit activated and get rid of Bitmain at the same time then that would be great.

UASF supporters are basically saying do as we say, and a large part of the community is like, leave already and leave bitcoin alone, if we get big blocks and get rid of Blockstream/Core at the same time then that would be great.

[rambeazle]

Only centralized shitcoin will be Cores UASF who has a very minority support.

And how would a UASF chain mined by ACTUAL bitcoin users be centralized?

You're saying Jihan and the many big blockers aren't actual bitcoiners? Sounds like an emotional thing to say. And to answer your question, maybe it won't be centralized, but it definitely won't be bitcoin with minority hash power. Don't fall for the lies. We will soon have a superior bitcoin with large blocks and we may also have a Core/Segwit altcoin. Ignore false narratives that try and flip this.

Good luck with your altcoin goals, you fucking idiot.

[thejaytiesto]

So this is the reason for the dump. I'm getting sick of this shit to be honest, Jihan needs to burn in the fires of hell. This guy is becoming a real pain in the ass.

No, he should be thanked and honored for having the courage and integrity to do the right thing and to lead the mining community with on chain scaling, to the benefit of everyone.

The only ones benefiting from Buggy Unlimited or any other Forkcoin are:

1) Miners (for they will control bitcoin 100%)
2) Enemies of bitcoin (for people not being able to run nodes make the network an easier target)
3) Bitmain shills (for their revenue will get increased)
4) Idiots that don't have 5 bucks to spend on fees to make an onchain transaction and think the tradeoffs are worth it when they could reach the same goal with Litecoin

[pokapeski]

While it generally looked like the split was inevitable, even I wasn't expecting quite this level of brinkmanship from both sides, heh.  My only suggestion to everyone would be not to let the big personalities set the narrative and tell you how to react.  Don't take anything at face value, regardless of who said it, because everyone has their own agenda.  Consider all the pros and cons, do your own research and make up your own damn minds.  And most important of all, don't do anything rash or hasty without thinking it through.  It might all seem like a massive drama, but calm heads usually prevail. 

After thinking about it for not too long (and after cuddling in foetal position for some good 10 minutes realizing how consensus-less fanatics have provocked this abrupt awaken of a beutiful dream) by now I am cashing my BTC immediately.

I can see why it might seem like a good idea, but there if a potential to lose out doing it that way.  Hodling in the event of a split means you get coins on both chains.  Selling before the split means you have to buy back after the split and choose very carefully which chain you think has the best chance of survival.  And if you take too long deciding, the fiat price may well recover to a level above the point that you panic sold.  

Yeah, but I do not see how this is not going to sunk the prices of both chains. BTW, it wasn´t that bad, I just happen to be very graphic in my expression

[25hashcoin]

Only centralized shitcoin will be Cores UASF who has a very minority support.

And how would a UASF chain mined by ACTUAL bitcoin users be centralized?

You're saying Jihan and the many big blockers aren't actual bitcoiners? Sounds like an emotional thing to say. And to answer your question, maybe it won't be centralized, but it definitely won't be bitcoin with minority hash power. Don't fall for the lies. We will soon have a superior bitcoin with large blocks and we may also have a Core/Segwit altcoin. Ignore false narratives that try and flip this.

Good luck with your altcoin goals, you fucking idiot.

Real nice buddy.

Even Theymos has always said that anything that changes consensus rules without overwhelming majority or any client that isn't Bitcoin Core is an altcoin. UASF fails both of these. He is a hypocrite and you will be the one on an altcoin as UASF support is seemingly nonexistent outside of censored echochambers. 

[mmortal03]

IMO August forkers are defintely offering something better than what Bitmain announced. Yeah, BIP 148 is an aggresive way to signal Segwit, but the point is Segwit gets activated. Bitmain is just fooling around, after Segwit2x, another gig at stalling the progress.

Yep, there are many more people who are willing to just go with SegWit over all the nonsense Bitmain is trying to tack on with this UAHF proposal.

[25hashcoin]

IMO August forkers are defintely offering something better than what Bitmain announced. Yeah, BIP 148 is an aggresive way to signal Segwit, but the point is Segwit gets activated. Bitmain is just fooling around, after Segwit2x, another gig at stalling the progress.

Yep, there are many more people who are willing to just go with SegWit over all the nonsense Bitmain is trying to tack on with this UAHF proposal.

Source? I see the opposite as true.

[mmortal03]

If i wanted to split a chain and mine it for myself... i wouldn't announced it in advance. I would simply announce it on the day the split happens and leave it to the other miners to catch up. Obviously i won't get 72 hours worth of blocks for myself. The idea that Bitmain will solo mine for 72 hours is laughable. Miners now can prepare in case a split does happen thus Bitmain has no advantage now.

Jihan can't even show us the code yet: "Currently, there are at least 3 client development teams working on the code of the spec. All of them want to stay quiet and away from the propaganda and troll army of certain companies. They will announce themselves when they feel ready for it. Users will be able to install the software and decide whether to join the UAHF. The softwares are expected to be ready before July 1st, and it will be live on testnet by then."

I wonder if any other miners will look to premine along with him, given that the code will only have, at best, a month of review.

[mmortal03]

So this is the reason for the dump. I'm getting sick of this shit to be honest, Jihan needs to burn in the fires of hell. This guy is becoming a real pain in the ass.

No, he should be thanked and honored for having the courage and integrity to do the right thing and to lead the mining community with on chain scaling, to the benefit of everyone.

I think we should commend his actions, this is not something that is done for personal gain, it is for the benefit of all. We should feel grateful to him, but you are too exasperated to say that he should feel honored.

Yes let's commend him trying to get a premine on a fork of Bitcoin. Oh such a generous gracious man because he is so fearful of UASF

Not only a premine, but also a more than 51% mining share.