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Author Topic: [Guide] Handling splits: UASFs, BIP148, etc.  (Read 48230 times)
taibas
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July 15, 2017, 02:58:21 PM
 #161

What if i save in bittrex?
Will it be safe?

Bittrex does not differ from other Exchanges/ As it was already said many times it is safe to have coins in the wallet with controllable private keys/ At Bittrex those keys are not in your hands
So the safest step is to store bitcoin in blockchain? is it like that

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ArthurY
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July 15, 2017, 03:49:46 PM
 #162

Ehhh
This is a big scam hahaha
I am sure what rich people now gonna buy BTC
Because who really care about BTU?
We need BTC
Just it
BTCBTCBTC


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July 15, 2017, 04:13:43 PM
 #163

Ehhh
This is a big scam hahaha
I am sure what rich people now gonna buy BTC
Because who really care about BTU?
We need BTC
Just it
BTCBTCBTC

No,I disagree with you, maybe BTU have new and good futures that needs by Cryptocurrency community.

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July 15, 2017, 04:18:50 PM
 #164

I don't understand why are people dumping over BTC while they can have them invested in alts???
Even putting in alts wouldn't settle anything for us??? Putting alts on exchanges will also be dangerous???
What will be the future of BTC after this??? Is it going to die on one side after a majority of another side wins and is it really going to be on two blockchains??? If yes, then on which blockchain will our "present" bitcoins be put???

---
Well, this has happened to other cryptocurrencies alright, for example Ethereum (ETH) and Ethereum Classic (ETC), and they are running in parallel just fine.

Regarding which blockchain, that is one of the GOOD things about a Fork if both get supported as mainstream. If you had 3 BTC, then after the fork you would have 3 BTC and 3 "BTU" (Assuming that is the name of the new fork)... because in that EXACT block that the fork happened you had 3, and now there would be two blockchains running separately. So, yes you just doubled your money... in theory!

Why? Because if the "BTU" currency is not accepted by a significant users, or if the "BTU" is the only one accepted and BTC dies... then you are back to only 3. Second, and as MANY times it has been said in here, and people do not seem to understand... if you have your BTCs with a broker or 3rd party, they might claim that "nothing" happen to you... that means that you just have 3 BTC or 3 BTU, and sweep the other 3 to one of their central accounts (you could still recover the other if you have your private key and you trust your broker/3rd party will not sweep/transfer it to themselves). Another factor is that if the BTC and BTU "merge" or have "consensus" in the future...then there will be double spending...but that is almost impossible once they fork.

In my case, I am moving ALL my money to BTC...... if the hard fork happens, and BTC and "BTU" both get accepted... I just doubled my money Wink ... Again... in theory! This would be the first hard fork for BTC.

Hope this helps to clarify things!
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July 15, 2017, 04:25:52 PM
 #165

Is multibit HD safe to use guys?

They said here that they will support both forks.



Do you guys see any possible issues with their wallet since I am pretty sure they are using a different type of seed wallet words which is not easy to import to lets say electrum?
If you have electrum then your Bitcoin in safe place, because electrum have privet key option. just open your electrum wallet ==> wallet tab ==>privet key ==> Export and save it at your HDD or flash storage .

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July 15, 2017, 05:02:35 PM
 #166

I don't understand why are people dumping over BTC while they can have them invested in alts???
Even putting in alts wouldn't settle anything for us??? Putting alts on exchanges will also be dangerous???
What will be the future of BTC after this??? Is it going to die on one side after a majority of another side wins and is it really going to be on two blockchains??? If yes, then on which blockchain will our "present" bitcoins be put???

That is exactly what  annoys me also. I don't understand why people don't just buy alts, wait for the things to settle and after 1 August just buy BTC again. I think there are lots of btc maximalists  and whales which are using alts just to increase their btc stash. I still wait for the day people will understand the true importance and value of certain alts and stop giving so much importance to btc like retards. Even after they apply this "improvement"  , even if they implement segwit btc will still not be competitive with Visa or MasterCard in terms of TPS, not to mention the only truly scalable crypto that is IOTA. Why don't they just let it go ? Is like some people would still be using candles today instead of light bulbs just because it was the first light source they got in contact with .

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July 15, 2017, 05:21:34 PM
 #167

The private keys are derived from the passphrase of 12 words

My mnemonics on greenaddress contain 24 words !!!!! Is anything wrong?
How can I know my private keys?
If I know my private keys I gain access to my bitcoins outside greenaddress too. Am I right?
Can anyone explain it to me?
Regards.

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July 15, 2017, 05:42:22 PM
 #168

The private keys are derived from the passphrase of 12 words

My mnemonics on greenaddress contain 24 words !!!!! Is anything wrong?
How can I know my private keys?
If I know my private keys I gain access to my bitcoins outside greenaddress too. Am I right?
Can anyone explain it to me?
Regards.

--
Not sure about that feature, but what I do with Blockchain and with GreenAddress is that I add a new BTC Address by importing a private key, and then sweep all the BTC to that address that I have the private key.

So, step 1 is that I go to:
https://bitaddress.org/
And I generate a new BTC pair of public and private address
(You can also do this via Bitcoin Core or Electrum that are my favorites)

Step 2, you add the BTC address to Blockchain or GreenAddress via its private key.
See here:
https://greenaddress.it/en/faq.html
Can I migrate from another wallet like blockchain.info? Can I sweep private keys into my wallet?
Yes. From the Receive Money tab in our wallet applications, enter your private key and the coins will be swept into your wallet.
I could not find a link for Blochain, but you go to Settings->Addresses -> + Import Address
Now this new address is in the Blockchain / Green Address Wallet.
Note that Step 2 is actually optional. You could just send the money to the new address, and since you have the private key, just go to step 3.

Step 3, Sweep all the BTC from all the other Addresses to this new one.

Step 4, and THE MOST IMPORTANT for me: Import the same address to Bitcoin Core or Electrum, and make sure to then send all the money to a NEW BTC ADDRESS! Since you already gave the first Private Key to Blockchain or GreenAddress... for me it is no longer 100% sure in case they "log" something. And in general... I know we want to have this BTC Address that will last "forever"... but it is a very good practice to generate a new BTC address now and then, and sweep all and just forget forever the old ones, just in case they are compromised.

Hope this helps!
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July 15, 2017, 05:53:32 PM
 #169

I don't understand why are people dumping over BTC while they can have them invested in alts???
Even putting in alts wouldn't settle anything for us??? Putting alts on exchanges will also be dangerous???
What will be the future of BTC after this??? Is it going to die on one side after a majority of another side wins and is it really going to be on two blockchains??? If yes, then on which blockchain will our "present" bitcoins be put???

That is exactly what  annoys me also. I don't understand why people don't just buy alts, wait for the things to settle and after 1 August just buy BTC again. I think there are lots of btc maximalists  and whales which are using alts just to increase their btc stash. I still wait for the day people will understand the true importance and value of certain alts and stop giving so much importance to btc like retards. Even after they apply this "improvement"  , even if they implement segwit btc will still not be competitive with Visa or MasterCard in terms of TPS, not to mention the only truly scalable crypto that is IOTA. Why don't they just let it go ? Is like some people would still be using candles today instead of light bulbs just because it was the first light source they got in contact with .

Yes for us who know whats going on and understand the technology behind the altcoins we can make the distinction between bitcoin and altcoins. But many of the newer users to the market who got in because of all the hype and news coverage they really don't take the time to think about the difference. They only see the news about the bitcoin issue and see bitcoin going down and automatically assume this affects the whole market. And then because of this thinking it actually does.

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July 15, 2017, 06:11:53 PM
 #170

Putting alts on exchanges will also be dangerous???
What will be the future of BTC after this??? Is it going to die on one side after a majority of another side wins and is it really going to be on two blockchains??? If yes, then on which blockchain will our "present" bitcoins be put???

Holding to the private keys of the addresses where your BTC is is precisely the way to own coins on ALL the forks.

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July 15, 2017, 06:12:26 PM
 #171

My mnemonics on greenaddress contain 24 words !!!!! Is anything wrong?
How can I know my private keys?
If I know my private keys I gain access to my bitcoins outside greenaddress too. Am I right?
Can anyone explain it to me?
Regards.

That's fine. Many wallets use 12 words, but some use 24. They do basically the same thing internally.

Don't do the bitaddress.org thing; it's too error-prone to deal with private keys individually.

How GreenAddress works normally is that when someone sends you money, they send to a 2-of-2 multisig requiring a signature from both your private keys and GreenAddress's own private keys. This allows GA to apply extra account protections such as 2-factor-authentication, which you normally can't do if you have a software wallet. But it means that you can't spend your money with just your private keys if you don't take additional steps. Therefore, for maximum trustlessness with GreenAddress, you should do one of these things:

 - Create a 2of3 account in settings, and use just that account. Then you will be able to spend your money with EITHER [your original 24-word mnemonic AND GA's cooperation] OR [your original 24-word mnemonic AND your additional 24-word mnemonic given to you when you create the 2of3 account].
 - Enable sending nLockTime transactions to your email in the settings. This will allow you to spend your BTC with just your private keys after an up-to-90-day wait time.

Again, it's better not to use a Web wallet at all, but GA plus one of those two additional measures is OK.

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July 15, 2017, 06:12:53 PM
 #172

I don't understand why are people dumping over BTC while they can have them invested in alts???
Even putting in alts wouldn't settle anything for us??? Putting alts on exchanges will also be dangerous???
What will be the future of BTC after this??? Is it going to die on one side after a majority of another side wins and is it really going to be on two blockchains??? If yes, then on which blockchain will our "present" bitcoins be put???

That is exactly what  annoys me also. I don't understand why people don't just buy alts, wait for the things to settle and after 1 August just buy BTC again. I think there are lots of btc maximalists  and whales which are using alts just to increase their btc stash. I still wait for the day people will understand the true importance and value of certain alts and stop giving so much importance to btc like retards. Even after they apply this "improvement"  , even if they implement segwit btc will still not be competitive with Visa or MasterCard in terms of TPS, not to mention the only truly scalable crypto that is IOTA. Why don't they just let it go ? Is like some people would still be using candles today instead of light bulbs just because it was the first light source they got in contact with .

Yes for us who know whats going on and understand the technology behind the altcoins we can make the distinction between bitcoin and altcoins. But many of the newer users to the market who got in because of all the hype and news coverage they really don't take the time to think about the difference. They only see the news about the bitcoin issue and see bitcoin going down and automatically assume this affects the whole market. And then because of this thinking it actually does.
Dear Lord, I still do not understand, Is it worth it to keep altcoin from stock exchanges or not. Or is it better to bring them out to their purses? The fact is that the situation with Bitcoin is almost clear, But I'm still interested in the dangers that await me with my alternative coins.

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July 15, 2017, 06:16:13 PM
 #173

The private keys are derived from the passphrase of 12 words

My mnemonics on greenaddress contain 24 words !!!!! Is anything wrong?
How can I know my private keys?
If I know my private keys I gain access to my bitcoins outside greenaddress too. Am I right?
Can anyone explain it to me?
Regards.

--
Not sure about that feature, but what I do with Blockchain and with GreenAddress is that I add a new BTC Address by importing a private key, and then sweep all the BTC to that address that I have the private key.

So, step 1 is that I go to:
https://bitaddress.org/
And I generate a new BTC pair of public and private address
(You can also do this via Bitcoin Core or Electrum that are my favorites)

Step 2, you add the BTC address to Blockchain or GreenAddress via its private key.
See here:
https://greenaddress.it/en/faq.html
Can I migrate from another wallet like blockchain.info? Can I sweep private keys into my wallet?
Yes. From the Receive Money tab in our wallet applications, enter your private key and the coins will be swept into your wallet.
I could not find a link for Blochain, but you go to Settings->Addresses -> + Import Address
Now this new address is in the Blockchain / Green Address Wallet.
Note that Step 2 is actually optional. You could just send the money to the new address, and since you have the private key, just go to step 3.

Step 3, Sweep all the BTC from all the other Addresses to this new one.

Step 4, and THE MOST IMPORTANT for me: Import the same address to Bitcoin Core or Electrum, and make sure to then send all the money to a NEW BTC ADDRESS! Since you already gave the first Private Key to Blockchain or GreenAddress... for me it is no longer 100% sure in case they "log" something. And in general... I know we want to have this BTC Address that will last "forever"... but it is a very good practice to generate a new BTC address now and then, and sweep all and just forget forever the old ones, just in case they are compromised.

Hope this helps!


Thank you for your kindly explanation.
I tried it and it helped me very much.
But still there are two issues.
I generated new address on bitaddress.org, then I entered my private key into my wallet. I expected to see that address which was shown on bitaddress, on my greenaddress wallet too. But that not happened. If I give that address to somebody How will I receive bitcoins while that address does not exist in my wallet?
Another issue is that I am afraid that bitaddress store the generated address and private key.

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July 15, 2017, 06:18:17 PM
 #174

There are hundreds of altcoins. Some are already dead, some might die at any moment, prices are fluctuating 10 times worse than BTC. If that doesn't bother you, research each one and put money into them.

I certainly won't.

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July 15, 2017, 06:27:08 PM
 #175

My mnemonics on greenaddress contain 24 words !!!!! Is anything wrong?
How can I know my private keys?
If I know my private keys I gain access to my bitcoins outside greenaddress too. Am I right?
Can anyone explain it to me?
Regards.

That's fine. Many wallets use 12 words, but some use 24. They do basically the same thing internally.

Don't do the bitaddress.org thing; it's too error-prone to deal with private keys individually.

How GreenAddress works normally is that when someone sends you money, they send to a 2-of-2 multisig requiring a signature from both your private keys and GreenAddress's own private keys. This allows GA to apply extra account protections such as 2-factor-authentication, which you normally can't do if you have a software wallet. But it means that you can't spend your money with just your private keys if you don't take additional steps. Therefore, for maximum trustlessness with GreenAddress, you should do one of these things:

 - Create a 2of3 account in settings, and use just that account. Then you will be able to spend your money with EITHER [your original 24-word mnemonic AND GA's cooperation] OR [your original 24-word mnemonic AND your additional 24-word mnemonic given to you when you create the 2of3 account].
 - Enable sending nLockTime transactions to your email in the settings. This will allow you to spend your BTC with just your private keys after an up-to-90-day wait time.

Again, it's better not to use a Web wallet at all, but GA plus one of those two additional measures is OK.

hello sir my money is in mycellium android wallet, is it fine? just leave like that?
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July 15, 2017, 07:41:50 PM
 #176

A private wallet like mycelium is fine and you are not subject to 3rd party risk.  I believe that is summary of the warning.

I don't understand why are people dumping over BTC while they can have them invested in alts???
Even putting in alts wouldn't settle anything for us??? Putting alts on exchanges will also be dangerous???

Alt coin each have a separate blockchain.    So this is news about bitcoin and does not change those other coins
Quote
Dear Lord, I still do not understand, Is it worth it to keep altcoin from stock exchanges or not. Or is it better to bring them out to their purses? The fact is that the situation with Bitcoin is almost clear, But I'm still interested in the dangers that await me with my alternative coins.



Holding the coin with one site relies on them to store it reliably.  Alt coins are not changing at this point so the risk is unchanged for alt coin, this news only gives a heads up about bitcoin blockchain.

The best alt coins for holding I think personally is the Proof of Stake coins and they always encourage personal usage.   Here you do not have miners collected into one place with power over the holders over the coins.  

On proof of stake the blockchain is secured by the operators of each wallet which means value decides direction of the blockchain not a company with separate interests.

Bitcoin is proof of work, this blockchain is secured by workers or miners.  It has become controlled by industry.     Proof of stake is secured by value, you receive the fees if you hold the coins so its like a co-operative instead of a company.  Thats the alt coin I've been using for three years now alongside bitcoin, I find it very easy and simple to operate.  

This POS coin came out in 2014 and is extremely fast, instant I find most of the time and all these coins are very cheap to send with so ideal for the small personal user imo.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BlackCoin
Peercoin came out August 2012 and is also proof of stake
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peercoin
Litecoin was November 2011, use to be the largest alt coin.   Again that blockchain is separate to bitcoin and it not involved in this announced change.  Litecoin is proof of work .
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Litecoin

I prefer proof of stake also because it pays you to hold the coins.  Remember when bank accounts gave you interest on your money ?  The good old days, POS does that for holders and you dont pay fees to large companies in mining fees. To use the network just needs a wallet and all coins are returned back to all the people with just a simple wallet open.


A brief history of POS - https://www.quora.com/What-are-the-most-popular-Proof-of-Stake-cryptocurrencies



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July 15, 2017, 07:51:37 PM
 #177


 - If you want to use both currencies at the same time or sell one of the currencies, then you will probably have to follow a somewhat-complicated series of steps possibly involving running some extra software in order to cleanly split your coins and eliminate the possibility of replay.
 August 1, 2017 at midnight UTC.

What softwares will support this?

Armory? Electorum?

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July 15, 2017, 08:04:59 PM
 #178

--
Not sure about that feature, but what I do with Blockchain and with GreenAddress is that I add a new BTC Address by importing a private key, and then sweep all the BTC to that address that I have the private key.

So, step 1 is that I go to:
https://bitaddress.org/
And I generate a new BTC pair of public and private address
(You can also do this via Bitcoin Core or Electrum that are my favorites)

Step 2, you add the BTC address to Blockchain or GreenAddress via its private key.
See here:
https://greenaddress.it/en/faq.html
Can I migrate from another wallet like blockchain.info? Can I sweep private keys into my wallet?
Yes. From the Receive Money tab in our wallet applications, enter your private key and the coins will be swept into your wallet.
I could not find a link for Blochain, but you go to Settings->Addresses -> + Import Address
Now this new address is in the Blockchain / Green Address Wallet.
Note that Step 2 is actually optional. You could just send the money to the new address, and since you have the private key, just go to step 3.

Step 3, Sweep all the BTC from all the other Addresses to this new one.

Step 4, and THE MOST IMPORTANT for me: Import the same address to Bitcoin Core or Electrum, and make sure to then send all the money to a NEW BTC ADDRESS! Since you already gave the first Private Key to Blockchain or GreenAddress... for me it is no longer 100% sure in case they "log" something. And in general... I know we want to have this BTC Address that will last "forever"... but it is a very good practice to generate a new BTC address now and then, and sweep all and just forget forever the old ones, just in case they are compromised.

Hope this helps!


Thank you for your kindly explanation.
I tried it and it helped me very much.
But still there are two issues.
I generated new address on bitaddress.org, then I entered my private key into my wallet. I expected to see that address which was shown on bitaddress, on my greenaddress wallet too. But that not happened. If I give that address to somebody How will I receive bitcoins while that address does not exist in my wallet?
Another issue is that I am afraid that bitaddress store the generated address and private key.


---
Well bitaddress.org runs in javascript, that means nothing is sent to their web server. The easiest way to "ease" your mind, is that you can download a ZIP with the HTML and the Javascripts and run it DIRECTLY from your Desktop. Since it is NOT sending anything to the server, you do NOT need a webserver, just open the HTML file in your browser and it works "like magic". Also you can get into the JavaScripts and see how it works!
In case you miss it, it is a link in the bottom left side of the screen, and here I copy it for you:
https://github.com/pointbiz/bitaddress.org/archive/v3.3.0.zip

Moving to Greenaddress, I checked, and indeed they only have in the Receive tab, Advance Options the following option:
Private key in WIF or BIP38 format to Sweep... so yes, it will NOT be added to your Account. Sorry about that, there are so many systems and wallets it is impossible to remember them all.

However, if you still want to use a Web based Wallet, then you can use Blockchain:
https://blockchain.info/
I also checked, and they WILL add the Public address so that you can use it any time.

Now, if you have not tried Electrum, I highly recommend that... not trying to do free publicity, but it has all the convenience of a Web Client (e.g. no block chain to download) but almost all the Bitcoin Core functions... mainly that you can add your bitcoin addresses back via their private key. You should try it:
https://electrum.org/

Just to be clear... your wallet DOES NOT have any Bitcoins! You own a Bitcoin address formed by the public and private keys, and a wallet can have 100+ of them. Public (or Bitcoin Address) is what you give anyone to get BTC. However, only if you have the Private Key you can then "reimport" the address back to a wallet to access your BTCs. That is the bottom line in here, that anyone that does not have the private key of their BTC address might not be able to recover any BTC or BTU or whatever the fork will end up using.
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July 15, 2017, 09:17:43 PM
 #179

I don't understand why are people dumping over BTC while they can have them invested in alts???
Even putting in alts wouldn't settle anything for us??? Putting alts on exchanges will also be dangerous???
What will be the future of BTC after this??? Is it going to die on one side after a majority of another side wins and is it really going to be on two blockchains??? If yes, then on which blockchain will our "present" bitcoins be put???

---
Well, this has happened to other cryptocurrencies alright, for example Ethereum (ETH) and Ethereum Classic (ETC), and they are running in parallel just fine.

Regarding which blockchain, that is one of the GOOD things about a Fork if both get supported as mainstream. If you had 3 BTC, then after the fork you would have 3 BTC and 3 "BTU" (Assuming that is the name of the new fork)... because in that EXACT block that the fork happened you had 3, and now there would be two blockchains running separately. So, yes you just doubled your money... in theory!

Why? Because if the "BTU" currency is not accepted by a significant users, or if the "BTU" is the only one accepted and BTC dies... then you are back to only 3. Second, and as MANY times it has been said in here, and people do not seem to understand... if you have your BTCs with a broker or 3rd party, they might claim that "nothing" happen to you... that means that you just have 3 BTC or 3 BTU, and sweep the other 3 to one of their central accounts (you could still recover the other if you have your private key and you trust your broker/3rd party will not sweep/transfer it to themselves). Another factor is that if the BTC and BTU "merge" or have "consensus" in the future...then there will be double spending...but that is almost impossible once they fork.

In my case, I am moving ALL my money to BTC...... if the hard fork happens, and BTC and "BTU" both get accepted... I just doubled my money Wink ... Again... in theory! This would be the first hard fork for BTC.

Hope this helps to clarify things!


So, your theory says: Now all bitcoin are worth 35bill dollars, if all people hold bitcoin and wait BTU then will double his money. So from where do you think that will be founded new 35 bill. for that? Do you really thinking about this?
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July 15, 2017, 10:10:00 PM
 #180

So, your theory says: Now all bitcoin are worth 35bill dollars, if all people hold bitcoin and wait BTU then will double his money. So from where do you think that will be founded new 35 bill. for that? Do you really thinking about this?

Well, just like you cannot "duplicate" a car, but you can duplicate the CAD drawings for the car, the 35 dollar bill fiat example would mean a duplication of the actual bill.

This is the block chain, right? No actual bills. So, as soon as BTU forks, if I had $35 in BTC, then I will also have $35 BTU because now TWO blocks exist in this Universe. And the forking means that transactions will now be in different block chains.

I assume someone already realized this, and there might be a "security" feature, like for example, BTU will inspect BTC transactions? But if you have a new BTU address... will it track all the way to when it was BTC, to check then BTC transactions from the fork day to today? That seems almost impossible even with a ExaHash speed network that we have now for BTC.

By the way... I just had to research... what if I just cut in the middle a $100 bill, take one to one half to one bank and the other half to another bank? Well, it turns out you there is a centralized office that handles this, not the bank directly, and an accountant friend just shared that it seems that you must have at least 51% of the bill serial number, so that only THAT part of the bill will be replaced. If anyone turns with the other 49% it will be denied... interesting, right?
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