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Author Topic: ICO's killing crypto  (Read 3626 times)
joshki
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September 16, 2017, 02:16:40 AM
 #21

Without ICOs, there would be no Ethereum. Without Ethereum, the crypto market wouldn't have grown so fast. It's attracting a lot of capital right now.

That would be a really good thing for the crypto world right now.  ETH is being used almost solely for the purpose of scamming people.  The ICOs being run on it are almost all scams, all it's going to take is for a few of them to come crashing down and then the SEC is going to step in and regulate, and they're going to come down hard.

There are a lot of other things out there that are not scams, the crypto world isn't defined by ETH.  There are also innovations that are coming that probably won't fall afoul of the SEC.
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September 16, 2017, 02:41:36 AM
 #22

Scammers using blockchains like Eth to manipulate markets and launder money by investing-reinvesting, converting-reconverting to ICO tokens and back to

Eth and Bitcoin then from Eth and Bitcoin back to ICO tokens but this time into other tokens with different exchanging services focused markets to confuse all

The government agencies and regulators, and with coin mixers around their job was like a living hell for them so what they did was putting a temporary stop

Into everything until they can come up with some methods to deploy as countermeasure for those nefarious transactions.
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September 16, 2017, 02:48:56 AM
 #23

Yeah, but none of that stuff is "killing crypto".  You've seen the scams perpetrated daily with not only ICOs, but crypto in general, and there's no way governments aren't going to start regulating that.  It's still the wild west, but it's being that less so day by day.

Also, crypto isn't being killed by anything.  The opposite is happening, in fact.  Just look at how wildly bullish bitcoin and the altcoin scene is.  Money is flooding the market, and gov't regulation isn't going to touch that unless they outlaw crypto--and that isn't likely to happen.

That money is ponzi money.
They are here to profit period.
These are not crypto supporters.
Furthermore crypto has done nothing.
Bitcoin is barely used as intended.

Saying there is lots of pyramid scheme participants making profits does not mean the scheme coin in question is being used as intended.. Or that it is a legit scheme coin.
Let's get real.. If it's not used as a currency by non crypto nerds then it isn't one.
In other words adoption..

ETH was morphed into an ICO coin cloning platform.. Should we cheer for its success?

And we needed icos to get where we are?
Dumbest comment ever posted here. Congrats LOL

Merchants are starting to accept bitcoin as a form of payment in a very rapid way so I would have to disagree that it isn't making headway. Look at the massive increase in usage in Japan and tell me that it is not being used as intended. It takes time to overtake the status quo system and especially when it involves governments that are desperate to maintain control.
gidaahmad
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September 16, 2017, 02:53:54 AM
 #24

This year I think a lot of ICOs are popping up. Not a few ICOs that collect tens of millions or even hundreds of millions of dollars. Sometimes I am confused, what is the money for, what for a noble cause, and why investors dare to spend that much money? However, I think again that ICO is indispensable as a creative business step. So, as long as no harm, ICO is still a shortcut for people who want to try to invest without having many requirements.
joshki
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September 16, 2017, 03:00:33 AM
 #25

This year I think a lot of ICOs are popping up. Not a few ICOs that collect tens of millions or even hundreds of millions of dollars. Sometimes I am confused, what is the money for, what for a noble cause, and why investors dare to spend that much money? However, I think again that ICO is indispensable as a creative business step. So, as long as no harm, ICO is still a shortcut for people who want to try to invest without having many requirements.

ICOs, in general and of course with some exceptions, are a way for scammers to rapidly collect money -- that's really the long and short of it.
V1saya
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September 16, 2017, 03:06:21 AM
 #26

Recent news of the imminent closer of many Chinese exchanges is the direct result of them dealing in ICOs, I've been shocked for the longest time other countries have done so, allowing ICO's to fly under regulators radar, however its only just a matter of time.

Because ICOs are really getting dirty. A sort of regulation has to be employed to try sorting out ICOs offered in public. Look at how many ICOs end up as mere scams after millions and millions of dollars worth of investments have been carted away. This has to stop of course, one day soon.
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September 16, 2017, 03:08:13 AM
 #27

Merchants are starting to accept bitcoin as a form of payment in a very rapid way so I would have to disagree that it isn't making headway. Look at the massive increase in usage in Japan and tell me that it is not being used as intended. It takes time to overtake the status quo system and especially when it involves governments that are desperate to maintain control.

You're right about it taking time for people to adopt a new technology. I'd argue that the speculative nature that dominates the bitcoin discussion currently helps draw more attention to crypto currencies in general. This additional awareness is leading to more interest from the general public and will ultimately benefit the market as a whole.

Just like porn drove the adoption of many technologies, bitcoin speculation may help drive it's adoption as intended.

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September 16, 2017, 03:51:46 AM
 #28

Recent news of the imminent closer of many Chinese exchanges is the direct result of them dealing in ICOs, I've been shocked for the longest time other countries have done so, allowing ICO's to fly under regulators radar, however its only just a matter of time.

Because ICOs are really getting dirty. A sort of regulation has to be employed to try sorting out ICOs offered in public. Look at how many ICOs end up as mere scams after millions and millions of dollars worth of investments have been carted away. This has to stop of course, one day soon.

Yes your words are very wise. Ico needs strong rules to avoid fraud like before. The Ico does not kill crypto but it makes them grow quickly. We need strong rules so that scam ico will not exist in the world. But is it possible to create decentralized crypto rules?


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richjohn
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September 16, 2017, 03:58:33 AM
 #29

Recent news of the imminent closer of many Chinese exchanges is the direct result of them dealing in ICOs, I've been shocked for the longest time other countries have done so, allowing ICO's to fly under regulators radar, however its only just a matter of time.

Because ICOs are really getting dirty. A sort of regulation has to be employed to try sorting out ICOs offered in public. Look at how many ICOs end up as mere scams after millions and millions of dollars worth of investments have been carted away. This has to stop of course, one day soon.

Yes your words are very wise. Ico needs strong rules to avoid fraud like before. The Ico does not kill crypto but it makes them grow quickly. We need strong rules so that scam ico will not exist in the world. But is it possible to create decentralized crypto rules?
Indeed! Governments are only responsible for safeguarding citizens. If they fail to do so then they are the one who are questioned. Many ICOs start only with the intention of scamming people. Certain kind of regulations are indeed needed. But banning is also not right according to me. A chance should be given to people to start their own ventures but under strict regulations.
minerja
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September 16, 2017, 10:39:40 AM
 #30

ICO's are not a bad thing themselves, but the way we have all let our greed creep in is the main problem. I as much as the next guy can't resist the next get rich scheme.

The scam ICOs have grown massively over a short period of time, and the crypto community should have come together to try dampen it down, and clean out the bad ones.
We the members of this forum must take some responsibility. Even if we had only established a seperate "ICO only" section, just to keep the dross away from the other sections.
Reading through here now it is so hard to see the wood for the trees.

Unfortunately the crypto communities failure to internally address this, was always going to lead to government intervention, and now we have put crypto on the table in the worst way.
Now we are forcing governments to make public decisions, and we all know how poor they can be at that.

This is definately not the death of crypto, rather the sanitising of it. I know this will bring forward the UKs Bitcoin tax laws into weeks rather than years now.
They were only considering taxing bitcoins, but with all this drama they will use it to encompass all coins. Or, they will only encompass bitcoins and outlaw all other crypto (Knowing the UK, this will be their choice)

My thoughts are simple, give ICOs a seperate section, and monitor them very very closely, perhaps even limit the number of new ICOs published per week, keep a clean house, cos if not history shows it will be cleaned for us, and we will have to live with the results.
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September 16, 2017, 01:41:51 PM
 #31

I think instead (or perhaps even in addition to it if they must) of banning left and right, governments should send more efforts into educating people about money, finance, risks, how to do taxes. It should be started early in schools in my opinion but you don't really see that anywhere in the world. I for one want to spend my money freely, if I think something is worth my money and I do it from a position where I know there are risks, not just rewards and if I fuck it up, it's my fault first and foremost.
So I don't think ICO's are killing crypto, I think people's greed and lack of research and risk control is.
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September 17, 2017, 03:57:10 AM
 #32

Without ICOs, there would be no Ethereum. Without Ethereum, the crypto market wouldn't have grown so fast. It's attracting a lot of capital right now.

and no ETH would be a bad thing  Huh

as Spoetnik rightly put it "ETH was morphed into an ICO coin cloning platform"

Crypto doesn't need alot of capital right now, we shouldn't be judging the success of Bitcoin (or any crypto) on how high its priced in fiat, crypto success is about usability as a p2p currency and acceptance as a currency.

They don't care.
They are here to profit.. and nothing else.
So that has gradually morphed crypto into a sleazy shithole.
They don't get why ICO's are bad no matter how many different ways it is explained to them.
Think about it people.. why wasn't ICO's used years before ?
It was maybe 7 years i am estimating that the scene dropped mined coins and went with ICO's
Why were we mining them ?
You know guys there is a reason  Roll Eyes
And there is a reason why i say *ALL* ICO's are scammy too.

FUD first & ask questions later™
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September 17, 2017, 04:13:42 AM
 #33

Whether or not you want to blame Ethereum for creating an ICO craze, it makes more sense to create a token on top of an existing mined currency. I don't see the need to continually create mined coins. It's hard enough to get people to support a new coin, let alone get them to dedicate computer resources towards it.

Many ICO coins will become worthless. Until they all are worthless, people will continue to participate.

The ICO projects that will be successful will be from companies offering attractive products that gain adoption. As long as there's at least one successful ICO coin, others will continue to try. Don't hate on ICO issuers for trying. Get mad at the people for buying.

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September 17, 2017, 04:28:31 AM
 #34

Building ICO's on top of Ethereum is an awesome opportunity for businesses and consumers - Never before has the internet been able to value projects from the bottom up, anyone anywhere is able to buy a projects token.

In saying that the level of ICO's in China grew to a ridiculous level - Here's a perspective from inside the Chinese ICO community explaining the situation.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gx7qjIpQHgc&t=

Imo the ability for projects to conduct an ICO that allows the world to get involved and early access to their platform is some impressive utility - Though not even project is going to provide real services/utility to their users and those projects won't last long.
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September 17, 2017, 05:06:28 AM
 #35

At the end of this race, only the established coins will survive and the shitcoins will get wiped out. I will tell you an example of what happened recently in India. The government of India demonetized the 1000 rupees and 500 rupees note and banned it from being a legal tender. They took this decision so that they can wipe out all the duplicate notes in the market and to clear out black money and corruption. The plan worked out quite well and the cops caught many in this case. It was just a matter of time and so is this. The ban on ICOs is a good thing which will wipe out the bad from the market and only the established ones will raise their flag at the end.

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September 17, 2017, 09:07:09 PM
 #36

There is a lot of talk of ICO scams.  Has there been a study to show the percentage of ICOs that are scams?  Is it 90% or 10%?

I would think that the majority of projects are bad ideas.  Everyone is trying to put anything and everything onto a blockchain, including the kitchen sink.  Most of them are trying to squeeze square pegs into round holes.

Crypto currencies are excellent for some applications, but not all.

Many of the project teams cannot prove that they can develop.  They have fancy titles like "CTO", but they have no software that you can run.


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September 17, 2017, 09:09:01 PM
 #37

At the end of this race, only the established coins will survive and the shitcoins will get wiped out. I will tell you an example of what happened recently in India. The government of India demonetized the 1000 rupees and 500 rupees note and banned it from being a legal tender. They took this decision so that they can wipe out all the duplicate notes in the market and to clear out black money and corruption. The plan worked out quite well and the cops caught many in this case. It was just a matter of time and so is this. The ban on ICOs is a good thing which will wipe out the bad from the market and only the established ones will raise their flag at the end.
I agree with you , all these uncapped ico's are fucking the market up.
Most coins don't need that much but It is pure greed from both sides.

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September 17, 2017, 09:12:19 PM
 #38

There is a lot of talk of ICO scams.  Has there been a study to show the percentage of ICOs that are scams?  Is it 90% or 10%?

I would think that the majority of projects are bad ideas.  Everyone is trying to put anything and everything onto a blockchain, including the kitchen sink.  Most of them are trying to squeeze square pegs into round holes.

Crypto currencies are excellent for some applications, but not all.

Many of the project teams cannot prove that they can develop.  They have fancy titles like "CTO", but they have no software that you can run.



It boils down to who cares as long as I make money. This would separate the idiots from their money and the lesson would be a hard one for them.
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September 17, 2017, 09:55:54 PM
 #39


I can believe that many ICOs in China (and other countries) are scams.  Even the Chinese government is saying so.

Check out this ranking of countries based on corruption:

https://www.transparency.org/news/feature/corruption_perceptions_index_2016

China is corrupt.  Russia and eastern Europe is even more corrupt.

If a country is corrupt, it means that their people are more prone to exaggerate or even lie.

That's why I see so many ICO teams stacked with people with nice titles like "Blockchain Developer"  or "Blockchain Expert" who have no skills nor experience related to technology, programming or blockchain.



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September 17, 2017, 10:13:31 PM
 #40

I think that cryptocurrency and ico should simply be regulated but within reasonable limits

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