[BitFunder] Graet.Loan - Paying 0.05% interest daily

[Bananery]

So seems like the dividends are no longer being sent to Bitfunder... and they don't seem to be being forwarded to Weexchange.

Graet: We could all use an update here. Doesn't have to be much but a provisional plan would be nice.

Thanks

He paid 7 BTC on the last day of November, so it means we're covered until December 8th. I hope Graeme can give an update tomorrow, but looking at how slow his communication has been so far, I'm not expecting anything for several weeks.

Next time he pays dividends, it will probably cover at least a week or maybe even a month. Paying every day isn't for best, because the transation fees will take a lot from the dividends. I'm quite alright with weekly or monthly dividends.

[lunarboy]

Next time he pays dividends, it will probably cover at least a week or maybe even a month. Paying every day isn't for best, because the translation fees will take a lot from the dividends. I'm quite alright with weekly or monthly dividends.

Weekly makes a lot of sense now the tx fee is so high, i'd be reluctant to switch to monthly unless there was an official method to trade shares and a new published business plan.

[digit]

Graet what about GPT.ESecBTC and GPT.YABMC assets?  

In case you were not aware ESECURITYSABTC on BTC-TC has already been migrated to Crypto-trade nearly a month ago and dividends have already been paid for October. If you not planning to continue the pass through, could you transfer the shares to the individual holders who have accounts there?

November dividends about to paid out soon.  Can you give some answers please?

[julz]

I don't understand why dividends are (were?) being paid via a system which Graet would know (as a director of weexchange) has lost coins.

If those of us with funds trapped at weexchange don't end up receiving the full amount - it seems unreasonable for him to have paid into a system which will not return 100%.

I applaud the efforts to resolve the situation via a deal with Neo & Bee, but if there is any doubt that the full dividends paid into bitfunder/weexchange will reach the shareholders, then such dividends should have been with-held until direct payment was practical.

There is no circumstance under which it is reasonable to put yet more user funds into a system which is not going to pay out 100%.  
Adding such funds after the event, means that the average haircut would be less - but it is not legitimate to add more *users* funds to some loss-sharing pool.

I can only hope that this means Graet has complete confidence in the upcoming arrangements and has good reason to believe everyone will ultimately be paid.

[Bananery]

I don't understand why dividends are (were?) being paid via a system which Graet would know (as a director of weexchange) has lost coins.

Because he himself had funds in the broken system that he can't withdraw. By paying them inside of the broken system he makes them available to him, because he can say he paid them, it's not his fault the system broke.

So if WeExchange doesn't pay out, he effectively converted his frozen funds into real one.

[gangplank]

I think it's just to cover his ass so that when this ship sinks and people chase him, he'll be able to say he continued to pay divs via bitfunder as per the agreement and that if you have any problems, you need to take it up with them, not him.

[julz]

I think it's just to cover his ass so that when this ship sinks and people chase him, he'll be able to say he continued to pay divs via bitfunder as per the agreement and that if you have any problems, you need to take it up with them, not him.

*If* it comes to lawyering up - there are people in the same legal jurisdiction as Graet (Australia) with enough at stake and deep enough pockets to take this on.
Graeme Tee described it as a 'personal loan' - and said in effect that failure to pay would only happen as a result of bankruptcy.
Considering Graet is a director of Weexchange - there is a good case to be made that 'payment' via a system he should reasonably know is compromised/insolvent does not represent a valid resolution of those portions of the debt.
It would be sad to see lawyers involved, and I wouldn't wish bankruptcy on him - but when there are individuals owed hundreds of thousands of AUD equivalent value - I expect a failure to ultimately pay out will result in just that.

Of course - the question is whether bankruptcy has already been reached and whether there are any personal assets to even chase. Given that Bitcoin provides a pretty good way to hide assets, and the legal situation around Bitcoin and 'personal loans' via an unregulated exchange system is unclear at best - it would be a risky case.. but I know of at least one Bitcoiner who is tempted to risk 'throwing good money after bad'  - simply to help establish some legal precedence here in Australia regarding this - and send a message that BTC debts will be chased up whether due to negligence, mismanagement or fraud.

If it turns out that that negligence/mismanagement/fraud don't directly apply to Graeme Tee's actions - I still think it's a plausible outcome to have the judgement made against Graeme Tee's assets - leaving his recourse to chase his losses against the other parties involved.

[tolan77]

Is there an IRC channel Graet frequents? He historically hasn't replied or checked on threads/pms here much. Was considering hopping in an irc channel and priv chatting him. Haven't received a reply since his last email in October.

[Djingis]

Is there an IRC channel Graet frequents? He historically hasn't replied or checked on threads/pms here much. Was considering hopping in an irc channel and priv chatting him. Haven't received a reply since his last email in October.

Seen him and Ukyo in the IRC channel #bitfunder , but u must be very very lucky if they answer any question ! -.-
So , they arent any official news about the Graet.Loan? He's running around / away like ukyo with our BTC ?
I'am really angry like all others in the same situation 

[SOSLOVE868]

Is there an IRC channel Graet frequents? He historically hasn't replied or checked on threads/pms here much. Was considering hopping in an irc channel and priv chatting him. Haven't received a reply since his last email in October.

Seen him and Ukyo in the IRC channel #bitfunder , but u must be very very lucky if they answer any question ! -.-
So , they arent any official news about the Graet.Loan? He's running around / away like ukyo with our BTC ?
I'am really angry like all others in the same situation 

Go for a lawyer ,I think for UKYO and Great at their ages,running isn't a proper things to do....because both of them have families, and I guess they should have other personal assets apart from BTC itself, house or car?

[TurdHurdur]

...
Until bitfunder closes and I get all of the information I cannot pay direct to peoples private addresses.

Looking at options to manage graet.loan after bitfunder closes

I have stated earlier in this thread that the goal was to have most of graet.loan repaid by mid 2014 this is still my goal - the changes at bitfunder hurt me too and i'm waiting to be repaid btc from several sources too - not a nice time.

I plan to stick around and honor my commitments
thanks for patience and understanding in these trying times
Graet

Now that bitfunder is closed, can you start sending the dividends to the private addresses?

[ru0chen]

where is my dividends now?

[thy]

So what's the latest updates on this loan from Graet now ?

[Bananery]

So what's the latest updates on this loan from Graet now ?

No updates. Looking at past and how rarely he gives updates, it will probably take another month for him to start paying dividends directly and give us an update.

[thecoinjournal]

Any updates?

[gangplank]

He has not logged in for almost a month. It's obvious your money is of little concern to him (now that he has it).

[Evolyn]

Honestly, i'm getting very bored about this kind of communication. Even fucking BFL is doing a better job, at least they tell every two weaks they'll ship in two weeks. Just disappearing is the most annoying thing someone can do. Usually i'm very patient but even my patience has a deadline.

[Keven]

Honestly, i'm getting very bored about this kind of communication. Even fucking BFL is doing a better job, at least they tell every two weaks they'll ship in two weeks. Just disappearing is the most annoying thing someone can do. Usually i'm very patient but even my patience has a deadline.

+1

[ru0chen]

any updates?

[BitHub]

i'm talking to him in #bitcoin-aus room. Asking/pleading with him to give an update. Hope he does. I'm worried for him.