Bitcoin Foundation receives cease and desist order from California

[Severian]

Reposting this for emphasis:

With all the respect to your technical skills I really doubt your political ones.
This from a non US European Balkan guy with centuries of Byzantine politics f@ckin up the continent.
You people there are so naive...sorry for my tone, I really like most of you but it has begun and you still negotiate!

Klee is 200% correct. The C&D letter to Tangible Cryptography from the Commonwealth of Virginia and now this letter from the State of California to The Bitcoin Foundation are aggressive actions from entities that won't negotiate.

And yes, Americans are politically naive. Those of my fellow Americans that think they'll be ok if they follow the law appear to be completely ignorant of the larger fact that we now  live in an age of arbitrary authority. It doesn't matter what the law actually is. All that matters is the intention of the person or the agency wielding the law in your direction at that particular moment. The law won't save Bitcoin because the law is trying quash Bitcoin.

If you want to know what their endgame for Bitcoin is, look at the history of the Liberty Dollar:

'Liberty Dollar' Creator Awaits His Fate Behind Bars - NYTimes.com

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/25/us/liberty-dollar-creator-awaits-his-fate-behind-bars.html?pagewanted=all

[600watt]

watchin..

[franky1]

If you want to know what their endgame for Bitcoin is, look at the history of the Liberty Dollar:

'Liberty Dollar' Creator Awaits His Fate Behind Bars - NYTimes.com

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/25/us/liberty-dollar-creator-awaits-his-fate-behind-bars.html?pagewanted=all

DO NOT compare bitcoin with liberty dollar.
the issue with liberty dollar was the fact that the metal coins were made to replicate a actual FIAT dollar coin. which comes under counterfeiting laws.

bitcoin is not a counterfeit of FIAT. its a totally unrelated and new currency. (well the thailand authorities could take BTC symbol a bit personal. but its still not as bad as the liberty dollar)

[CurbsideProphet]

Is Peter Vessenes still the head of TBF?

He's the Executive Director, Chairman of the Board, and Treasurer.

[Rampion]

I don't think yours is a "conspiracy theory", but like conspiracy theories, this approach presumes that there is some powerful group, or at least a loose association of people at the helm of the regulation, who are steering the course of BTC in a way that favors their stakeholders - banks, paypal, Western Union, etc.  I think that the truth is actually more terrifying: the regulation is rudderless.  There is nobody and no particular group of people at the helm.

Centralized money-printing sets the course of the economy, and of the government that depends upon it.  The direction is towards centralization and control.  It isn't a "conspiracy theory".  Ben Bernanke gives regular press conferences.  It's the entire reason Bitcoin even exists.

This +1,000

US Government is acting beyond stupid, as usual. Let's them shut down the Bitcoin Foundation. Then they can declare "war" to a p2p protocol. That's gonna be funny, I'm waiting.

[Gabi]

If you want to know what their endgame for Bitcoin is, look at the history of the Liberty Dollar:

'Liberty Dollar' Creator Awaits His Fate Behind Bars - NYTimes.com

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/25/us/liberty-dollar-creator-awaits-his-fate-behind-bars.html?pagewanted=all

DO NOT compare bitcoin with liberty dollar.
the issue with liberty dollar was the fact that the metal coins were made to replicate a actual FIAT dollar coin. which comes under counterfeiting laws.

bitcoin is not a counterfeit of FIAT. its a totally unrelated and new currency. (well the thailand authorities could take BTC symbol a bit personal. but its still not as bad as the liberty dollar)

I disagree, it seems government always have an excuse. Why the "laws" didn't apply for hsbc or similar cases?

You are right, comparing bitcoin with libery dollar is nonsense: bitcoin can't be shut down like liberty dollar

[QuestionAuthority]

Is Peter Vessenes still the head of TBF?

He's the Executive Director, Chairman of the Board, and Treasurer.

Thanks, I never know how frequently these websites are updated. So, he's the one you want to google for info about what's happening.

[Severian]

This... It's perversely comforting to imagine there's a cabal of power players running the world from the shadows with uncanny ingenuity.

Ingenuity no, power yes. Power rests on cunning, a low level of intelligence shared by snakes, spiders, wolves, foxes, birds of prey, etc.

It's a well known fact forgotten by most that whoever controls the volume of currency and credit in a country also controls pricing and all commerce in that country. It's also a well known fact that there actually is a small cabal that has a monopoly on the issuing of currency and credit in the US.

They're very cunning and some of them are even smart.

[Severian]

bitcoin can't be shut down like liberty dollar

They don't need to shutdown Bitcoin. They can threaten prison for developers and businessmen.

"BITCOIN MOGUL BUSTED IN SUSPECTED TERRORIST DRUG PORN SCAM"

It's within the realm of possibility at this point. With CA in the mix now, they're not messing around.

[justusranvier]

Ingenuity no, power yes. Power rests on cunning, a low level of intelligence shared by snakes, spiders, wolves, foxes, birds of prey, etc.

People who have political power have it because first they are the type of person who desires this power, and second because they are the kind of person willing and able to do what is necessary to achieve and maintain it.

Because the act of achieving power over other people automatically puts the power-seeker in an adversarial relationship with every human being on the planet, it's an unstable condition which requires active effort to maintain.

Natural selection removes from the political sphere those individuals who are not successful at identify and countering threats to their power, so the people who remain are the ones who can do this, consciously or (more likely) unconsciously.

They don't need to collaborate or conspire in order to attack threats to their power - doing so comes naturally to them. They respond in predictable ways to certain stimuli because they all share a common set of motivations centred around their common desire to hold on to their power.

[Rampion]

bitcoin can't be shut down like liberty dollar

They don't need to shutdown Bitcoin. They can threaten prison for developers and businessmen.

"BITCOIN MOGUL BUSTED IN SUSPECTED TERRORIST DRUG PORN SCAM"

It's within the realm of possibility at this point. With CA in the mix now, they're not messing around.

Well, that scenario it's been likely from the very beginning. That's why Satoshi is a pseudonym and he/them used Tor, right?

Sooner or later, Bitcoin may face that kind of hostility. But it was designed to be resilient to that type of attack. The sheeps will say "oh, it's the coin of the pedophiles, stay away from it, just use the USD, the land of the freedom bill that it's used only by honest people and that cannot be used by pedo-bears".

But IMO Bitcoin will survive to that and raise stronger. There are a lot of sheeps, especially in the US, but there is also a lot of people who are not sheep and want to use REAL money like Bitcoin.

In my opinion Bitcoin needs to be stress-tested. This experiment need to resist a ban to be really successful.

[Severian]

They don't need to collaborate or conspire in order to attack threats to their power - doing so comes naturally to them.

Exactly. It's how the pack mentality operates. No one needs to teach pack animals or gang members. They either become the alpha, fall into line or they're out of the pack.

[Severian]

But IMO Bitcoin will survive to that and raise stronger. There are a lot of sheeps, especially in the US, but there is also a lot of people who are not sheep and want to use REAL money like Bitcoin.

Yes, the tech will survive. It might even become better. I have far more faith in human ingenuity and spirits like those that created Bitcoin and those of us that use it than I do in the unthinking brutality of those that feel a need to "regulate" everyone else.

[franky1]

the US government only has control over US dollars.. end of

they do not have control over the euro:
and everyone knows about the number of red light districts, cafe's selling drugs and also how oil tycoons may be thinking of dealing in euros as oppose to dollars. yet the US government cant do anything about that.

they do not have control over the Yen:
and everyone knows that most of their electrical products come from japan and having the ability to control yen would make supplier costs even cheaper.  yet the US government cant do anything about that.

they do not have control over the thai baht:
and everyone knows that most of the counterfeit goods originating from thailand. and to add to this counterfeit goods in Beijing, cambodia at some point passes through thailand. making thailand a fashion threat. yet the US government cant do anything about that.

i can give many examples of other currencies being related to illegal activities.. mexico=drugs, iraq, wars/weapons etc..

the point is when the currency is involved the government cannot do anything about a currency they do not own.

[telemaco]

the US government only has control over US dollars.. end of

they do not have control over the euro:
and everyone knows about the number of red light districts, cafe's selling drugs and also how oil tycoons may be thinking of dealing in euros as oppose to dollars. yet the US government cant do anything about that.

they do not have control over the Yen:
and everyone knows that most of their electrical products come from japan and having the ability to control yen would make supplier costs even cheaper.  yet the US government cant do anything about that.

they do not have control over the thai baht:
and everyone knows that most of the counterfeit goods originating thailand. and to add to this counterfeit goods in Beijing, cambodia at some point passes through thailand. making thailand a fashion threat. yet the US government cant do anything about that.

i can give many examples of other currencies being related to illegal actuvities.. mexico=drugs, iraq, wars/weapons etc..

the point is when the currency is involved the government cannot do anything about a currency they do not own.

well they are doing pretty well against iran's currency

[BitcoinBarrel]

You are Free... to do as we tell you.

[leopard2]

Overpaid government demons in action. Best thing is, ignore it and move on. Let them issue an arrest warrant for S. Nakamoto  

[johnyj]

I believe that's someone who want to buy coins cheap

[HappyScamp]

The Bitcoin Foundation needs to move elsewhere.

☐ California
☑ Texas

New Hampshire, actually.

[aigeezer]

Interesting thread (one of several on the topic here), but the comments to the Forbes article itself are also worth a read.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/jonmatonis/2013/06/23/bitcoin-foundation-receives-cease-and-desist-order-from-california/

On balance, there is a lot of support for BTC from the Forbes readership, Matonis' readership at least.

I don't think I've seen anyone comment anywhere to the effect that California has done something good with this move. I wonder how it will play with the public at large.

And of course, as always, who is doing what to whom? No "aha" light goes on for me yet.

Maybe it really is as tawdry as this Forbes commenter speculates:

"Californicatin 1 hour ago

You know, as a former employee of the State of California, I have to say all I see when I look at this is a pleading for money by way of the sentence: “For more details on applying for a money transmission business license in California….”. This most definitely feels like a form letter, as well.

I mean, it was sent almost exactly one month prior to the end of the fiscal year in CA. If I remember correctly – that’s also about the time they send around the memo regarding the final day to intake any monies that will be able to apply to the closing fiscal year.

Or at least – here’s to hoping……"