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Author Topic: Bitcoin plus - is it owned by a member of this forum? - RANT ALERT!  (Read 12066 times)
Seaco
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July 01, 2011, 04:54:37 PM
 #1


If you dont know about bitcoin plus its a javascript cpu mining "pool", which obviously pays out small small amounts of BTC. So ive had it running at the office for a few weeks and amassed a fortune of 0.02 btc. Not much, but hey, i like free bitcoins.

Anyhow here comes my rant:

IMHO this is a complete scam, as the owner claims that he needs to discount 0.01 btc for transaction fees. This is absolutely ridiculous given that it takes a solid week to generate 0.01 btc with his software. So basically he just rips everyone off and prolly keeps most if not all bitcoins to himself. Might seem like small amounts, but added up its probably a NICE bounty.

Id like to give the owner a chance to defend his policies and site, so bitcoin plus dude if  youre a member of the community, speak up!
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BitcoinPorn
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July 01, 2011, 04:59:18 PM
 #2

"a few weeks and amassed a fortune of 0.02 btc" lol

Donny or someone representing that site really really needs to come through.

shakaru
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July 01, 2011, 05:08:36 PM
 #3

Just do some simple math and compare. a quad core gives about 14 mhs or so and will destroy it quickly at that rate. So that is 1/20th of a Hd5830 which will atm produce .24btc a day. By use of a simple ratio, thats about 0.012 a day. But wait. Your not using a 5830 and this dosent work in ratio at all. So in reality, due to your small shares, your are probably getting half that at 0.006btc a day. Also, im willing to bet your not using a quadcore cpu because most offices dont have one. And if you are using it, the computer would be unusable at that speed, so lets just say at the best case scenario that you are mining for 16 hours a day. You would be getting now 0.004btc a day. If you are only using half the cores, you would be getting 0.003btc a day if your mining nonstop.

So by my calculations, you are using a mid range intel, probably a P4HT or a Core2Duo. Sound right? If so, then your "mass fortune" is all you earned. Get a gpu

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July 01, 2011, 05:12:52 PM
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Just do some simple math and compare. a quad core gives about 14 mhs or so and will destroy it quickly at that rate. So that is 1/20th of a Hd5830 which will atm produce .24btc a day. By use of a simple ratio, thats about 0.012 a day. But wait. Your not using a 5830 and this dosent work in ratio at all. So in reality, due to your small shares, your are probably getting half that at 0.006btc a day. Also, im willing to bet your not using a quadcore cpu because most offices dont have one. And if you are using it, the computer would be unusable at that speed, so lets just say at the best case scenario that you are mining for 16 hours a day. You would be getting now 0.004btc a day. If you are only using half the cores, you would be getting 0.003btc a day if your mining nonstop.

So by my calculations, you are using a mid range intel, probably a P4HT or a Core2Duo. Sound right? If so, then your "mass fortune" is all you earned. Get a gpu

fantastic
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July 01, 2011, 05:13:24 PM
 #5

He really is using an outdated model - the maximum forced tx fees are 0.0005, in most circumstances.
BitQuestr (BitCoinWorldMarket)
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July 01, 2011, 06:30:24 PM
 #6

Remember the bitcoin client still is set default to .01 btc for all the previous client versions. The new client is barely a couple weeks old.

I don't think you can call this a scam just because he hasn't updated his client yet. Yes he should update his policies and fees but don't go muddying his reputation by calling it a scam just because he hasn't yet.
BitCoinBarter
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July 01, 2011, 08:19:17 PM
 #7

IMHO this is a complete scam

I agree. See the thread I started at http://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?topic=17099.0 for more.

Do no evil,

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static
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July 01, 2011, 08:34:18 PM
 #8



this site was talked about on the newbies forum. the page doesn't stay open. it eventually logs you out after a few minutes. either it's a scam or just a poorly coded setup.
BCEmporium
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July 01, 2011, 08:47:14 PM
 #9

Jesus! This site needs a harder to push "scammer" button!

These folks jump into pushing "SCAM" out of the bitcoin network fee, which happens to be 0.01 btc except in the last versions when it changed to 0.0005 btc.

And go around calling "scammers" and "robbers" over cents... get real!
AtlasONo
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July 01, 2011, 11:17:31 PM
 #10

Even if transaction fees weren't the case, it's not really any more of a scam than deepbit charging 3%
Tasty Champa
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July 01, 2011, 11:29:16 PM
 #11

If you install that js miner on a decent hit website you make it a big target.
So, you better know what you are doing.
timsmith
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July 01, 2011, 11:35:26 PM
 #12

I've been using it pretty much since it started, mining 24/7 on a quad and 2 core 2 duo desktops (all 64 bit linux). I've also had about 7 other core 2 duo desktops (again all 64 bit linux) adding to that at weekends. Net result? Very little -- about 0.20BTC roughly.

But as has been pointed out, this is largely due to the inefficiency of the applet used: it's a CPU miner, not a GPU miner.

That said, the 0.01 transaction fees are a relatively new feature, and since they were introduced so quickly, they should have been reversed to 0.0005 equally quickly in my opinion. On top of that, the embedded miner earns the owner about 17% as I recall, so this guy is making a reasonable cut even if it is not a huge net total.

My biggest gripe, though, is that the payout is decreased every 2 weeks, supposedly as an "alternative" to the difficulty increasing. The explanation is that rather than increasing the difficulty, the payout is decreased instead. I have never understood the maths or logic behind that, and from my experiences of watching the mining on these machines, the difficulty indeed does increase (or more specifically, the frequency of payouts decreases) in conjunction with the payout value lowering. So this is a double-whammy: a reduction in payout amount, and a reduction in payout frequency. That annoys me a lot.
GeniuSxBoY
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July 01, 2011, 11:39:44 PM
 #13

if you think it's a scam, stop using it!

rocket science it is not.
BCEmporium
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July 01, 2011, 11:57:36 PM
 #14

That said, the 0.01 transaction fees are a relatively new feature, and since they were introduced so quickly, they should have been reversed to 0.0005 equally quickly in my opinion.

Don't know what version of bitcoind and OS are they running, the latest builds nags if they're using Debian 5 for an instance, so their fee may still be 0.01.
Anyway, CPU mining is inefficient and can't compete with GPU mining. So any possible earnings of CPU mining pools will be small.
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July 02, 2011, 12:00:15 AM
 #15

If anything, this just points out the potential problems of pool-mining. You are at the mercy of the operator, who sets the fees and such. Like others have stated, you have two possible choices. One, just quit, or Two - set up your own. That is just the way it is.

fortitudinem multis - catenum regit omnia
julz
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July 02, 2011, 01:05:02 AM
 #16

And go around calling "scammers" and "robbers" over cents... get real!

While I agree with you that the leap to use the word 'scam' isn't helpful
- neither I think is the implied attitude that 'cents' or even tiny fractions thereof don't matter.
They matter a great deal to new bitcoin users - who may have about 0.01BTC total and are interested in trying out the system.

Really - I think many must have walked away from bitcoin because it feels like their wallet is just being eaten up by fees - just like the ordinary banking systems.

I know bitcoin isn't really optimised for microtransactions, but due to the uneven wealth distribution - this is already a problem for uptake.

@electricwings   BM-GtyD5exuDJ2kvEbr41XchkC8x9hPxdFd
BCEmporium
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July 02, 2011, 01:19:10 AM
 #17

julz,

If you just have cents, you'll be eaten by fees no matter where in Earth. Is like a poker player with low stack being eaten by the blinds...

Just that I found somewhat nearly funny some guys come out like shouting scammer at some one or "call the «bitpolice» this address ALHLH12kbdjkbk12334... just robbed me 0.32 btc!!!!".
But I understand your point, back on that mtgox mess I lost over 20 btc and still didn't bother or complaint much (lesson learned: not use the same u:p combo in more than 1 site), as I've much more, but for someone with 20'something that would be almost all or all of what he have.
timsmith
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July 02, 2011, 07:10:29 PM
 #18

if you think it's a scam, stop using it!

rocket science it is not.
It's not a scam. But it is a poor deal.
BitcoinPorn
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July 02, 2011, 07:28:52 PM
 #19

tim, the set up it seems like you have, means that maybe there is a way to do a mini-pool of mining over just the computers you have, I believe that can be done and people in the forums would help with that.

Ekaros
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July 02, 2011, 07:52:08 PM
 #20

Not scam just poorly run and the issue was the inherit fee in the system.

Real life counterpart:
I go to shop by something for 0.98€, then I pay it with 1€ coin, I don't get my 2 cents back, as Finland don't use those. I'm not screaming scam, I just accept it...


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