Calling top at $16500 (New speculation: Guess the price 19 Feb 2021!)

[JayJuanGee]

Dear sgbett,

For some parts (you'll have to do your best to determine what goes where): Hmm... I see... OK... Well I see what you're saying, and now that I think about it I don't like it when people are dicks to me in my threads either, so I apologize for being abrasive.

Other parts: My honest opinion is you've fallen down some sorts of conspiracy rabbitholes after rabbitholes and I acknowledge there's not much I can say to change your mind, so Imma bow out and let you have at it.

Let's agree to disagree as the kids say, and peace out.

Heheh, thats nice of you to say. Certainly we can disagree.

You are right about rabbit holes. The first one I fell was the Bitcoin one all those years ago. Back then I frequented slashdot a fair amount, and the abuse you got on there for being pro-bitcoin was quite something just wait til you hear my views on covid they get me in some right trouble

Your views on bitcoin are bad enough... .Please don't torture us with other topics.   

[1715539663]

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[1715539663]

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[Wind_FURY]

wait, you are still a BSV believer sgbett? 

I believe that Bitcoin will succeed wrt its goals & I believe that BSV is the most correct implementation of the Bitcoin described in the white paper.

A statement I can respect. But, shower thought, if Satoshi returned and said that his implementation as described in the white paper sacrifices decentralization for more transaction-throughput, and that he prefers that Bitcoin should sacrifice mass adoption/transaction-throughput for decentralization/censorship-resistance, would your belief change?

[Febo]

Can we have a crash because of a realisation we will not have enough vaccine ready before end of Spring?  Right now everyone have in their head, we will get vaccine in December and they will start vaccinate first medical staff and then elderly and sick. But there will be barely enough vaccine made for them until April. And only after April will be available for normal working people. Economy, stock market and Bitcoin might realise that right about in January. This plan seems to be the last rescuing straw for a $2483 bottom on 19 Feb 2021. But can it happen? I would say 99.999% nope.

[exstasie]

I believe that Bitcoin will succeed wrt its goals & I believe that BSV is the most correct implementation of the Bitcoin described in the white paper.

A statement I can respect.

Really? I'm not concerned about sticking to some dogma from a paper. Focusing on authority figures only blinds us from better solutions. I want Bitcoin to work first and foremost and that's why, for example, we can't keep increasing block size beyond actual real demand for block space. That would destroy the mining incentive that underpins the whole system.

I'm more concerned about security than what Satoshi would have wanted. How do we keep mining distributed, proof of work highly secure, and sufficient full node distribution to prevent Sybil or mining attacks? Those are the questions I would focus on, not which implementation is the most "correct."

But, shower thought, if Satoshi returned and said that his implementation as described in the white paper sacrifices decentralization for more transaction-throughput, and that he prefers that Bitcoin should sacrifice mass adoption/transaction-throughput for decentralization/censorship-resistance, would your belief change?

What if he did the exact opposite, and vouched for gigabyte blocks?

[buwaytress]

You are right about rabbit holes. The first one I fell was the Bitcoin one all those years ago. Back then I frequented slashdot a fair amount, and the abuse you got on there for being pro-bitcoin was quite something just wait til you hear my views on covid they get me in some right trouble

This just gave me some shivers. I was prowling around slashdot in my youth (heh) and lurking around, there were quite a few Bitcoin rabbitholers with the new wave of millennials (the actual generation born in the 1990s), actually wish I'd paid them a lot more attention.

I'd really like to hear your views on covid some day;) You are. Entertaining.

*from the occasional lurker on this thread*

P.S. Any thoughts from any of you on these new letters -- some interesting discussions on the earliest concerns when Satoshi released his white paper. Be forewarned, this is Coindesk, I'm not sure where their allegiance lies these days.

[Wind_FURY]

I believe that Bitcoin will succeed wrt its goals & I believe that BSV is the most correct implementation of the Bitcoin described in the white paper.

A statement I can respect.

Really? I'm not concerned about sticking to some dogma from a paper. Focusing on authority figures only blinds us from better solutions. I want Bitcoin to work first and foremost and that's why, for example, we can't keep increasing block size beyond actual real demand for block space. That would destroy the mining incentive that underpins the whole system.

I'm more concerned about security than what Satoshi would have wanted. How do we keep mining distributed, proof of work highly secure, and sufficient full node distribution to prevent Sybil or mining attacks? Those are the questions I would focus on, not which implementation is the most "correct."

He said, "I believe that BSV is the most correct implementation of the Bitcoin described in the white paper".

"He believes" it's the most correct implementation. It's not the usual BSVer disinformation campaign that, "BSV is Bitcoin" narrative.

But, shower thought, if Satoshi returned and said that his implementation as described in the white paper sacrifices decentralization for more transaction-throughput, and that he prefers that Bitcoin should sacrifice mass adoption/transaction-throughput for decentralization/censorship-resistance, would your belief change?

What if he did the exact opposite, and vouched for gigabyte blocks?

Then Satoshi himself would be risking Bitcoin's main value proposition.

[dragonvslinux]

Can we have a crash because of a realisation we will not have enough vaccine ready before end of Spring?  Right now everyone have in their head, we will get vaccine in December and they will start vaccinate first medical staff and then elderly and sick. But there will be barely enough vaccine made for them until April. And only after April will be available for normal working people. Economy, stock market and Bitcoin might realise that right about in January. This plan seems to be the last rescuing straw for a $2483 bottom on 19 Feb 2021. But can it happen? I would say 99.999% nope.

Appreciate the fundamental insight, it's not something I considered. I stopped caring about the whole flu and vaccine nonsense some time ago, but this is very relevant to whole lockdown and economy crisis right now. If this is price mooning is based on bullish hopium that a vaccine will be ready next month, then I think you're right, price will correct significantly when it's clear that production and distribution will take many more months. I've already ruled out life going back to normal until Winter 2021 personally.

I really hope we don't see $2.5K next year, for most, that could signal a multi-decade long correction of sorts  

[JayJuanGee]

Can we have a crash because of a realisation we will not have enough vaccine ready before end of Spring?  Right now everyone have in their head, we will get vaccine in December and they will start vaccinate first medical staff and then elderly and sick. But there will be barely enough vaccine made for them until April. And only after April will be available for normal working people. Economy, stock market and Bitcoin might realise that right about in January. This plan seems to be the last rescuing straw for a $2483 bottom on 19 Feb 2021. But can it happen? I would say 99.999% nope.

Appreciate the fundamental insight, it's not something I considered. I stopped caring about the whole flu and vaccine nonsense some time ago, but this is very relevant to whole lockdown and economy crisis right now. If this is price mooning is based on bullish hopium that a vaccine will be ready next month, then I think you're right, price will correct significantly when it's clear that production and distribution will take many more months. I've already ruled out life going back to normal until Winter 2021 personally.

I really hope we don't see $2.5K next year, for most, that could signal a multi-decade long correction of sorts  

At this point, anything below $5k (or even $7k) for any kind of meaningful period of time beyond a flash cash would bring bitcoin's various price prediction models into question, and perhaps some questions about fundamental understandings of what role(s) bitcoin is actually serving.. paradigm shifting finances, sound money and hedging etc.

Sgbett's proposition of $2.5k-ish bottom in 2/21 seems to have a lot of underlying assumptions that are just NOT playing out.. not even close... They did not seem to be playing out at the time that he made his prediction, either, but they seem to be playing out way less at this time, which reasonably sgbett should just admit that he was wrong at that time, and even now the way that bitcoin is playing out even demonstrates how wrong that he was then and how wrong he continues to be to even have any kind of reasonable hope of his scenario playing out... even though on the surface, some people might have concluded that he seemed to have been making a reasonable guess.. based on the 85%-correction that followed his early December 2017 prediction... which we can see that those kinds of 85%-ish corrections are not unusual in bitcoin's pattern of performance - especially given that at the time that sgbett made that prediction, BTC prices had already gone up somewhere in the 70x territory over the late-2015 to late 2017 period.

But projecting such a BTC correction out to February 2021 seems nearly pure nonsense, and based on various presumptions that are NOT even close to be playing out... so we should not be treating sgbett's vision anywhere close to seriously.

I believe that Bitcoin will succeed wrt its goals & I believe that BSV is the most correct implementation of the Bitcoin described in the white paper.

A statement I can respect.

Really? I'm not concerned about sticking to some dogma from a paper. Focusing on authority figures only blinds us from better solutions. I want Bitcoin to work first and foremost and that's why, for example, we can't keep increasing block size beyond actual real demand for block space. That would destroy the mining incentive that underpins the whole system.

I'm more concerned about security than what Satoshi would have wanted. How do we keep mining distributed, proof of work highly secure, and sufficient full node distribution to prevent Sybil or mining attacks? Those are the questions I would focus on, not which implementation is the most "correct."

He said, "I believe that BSV is the most correct implementation of the Bitcoin described in the white paper".

"He believes" it's the most correct implementation. It's not the usual BSVer disinformation campaign that, "BSV is Bitcoin" narrative.

You are giving sgbett too much benefit of the doubt, Wind_FURY.  Sgbett talks all kinds of nonsense, and spouts out the various Bcash and Bcash SV nonsense talking points.  Sgbett is no better than the run of the mill BSV troll or some of the other nutjobs on the interwebs, even though concededly he puts his ideas together better than the average troll, and he tends to be more polite than the average troll..  At the same time, politeness and articulateness is not necessarily a good thing for troll/shills to have in the sense that it could end up luring smarter people into believing his various misleading baloney in which normie peeps may well get duped into believing him, so in that sense he still talks a decent amount of nonsense that does not deserve much if any benefit of the doubt.. in my humble bumble opinion.

[Wind_FURY]

I believe that Bitcoin will succeed wrt its goals & I believe that BSV is the most correct implementation of the Bitcoin described in the white paper.

A statement I can respect.

Really? I'm not concerned about sticking to some dogma from a paper. Focusing on authority figures only blinds us from better solutions. I want Bitcoin to work first and foremost and that's why, for example, we can't keep increasing block size beyond actual real demand for block space. That would destroy the mining incentive that underpins the whole system.

I'm more concerned about security than what Satoshi would have wanted. How do we keep mining distributed, proof of work highly secure, and sufficient full node distribution to prevent Sybil or mining attacks? Those are the questions I would focus on, not which implementation is the most "correct."

He said, "I believe that BSV is the most correct implementation of the Bitcoin described in the white paper".

"He believes" it's the most correct implementation. It's not the usual BSVer disinformation campaign that, "BSV is Bitcoin" narrative.

You are giving sgbett too much benefit of the doubt, Wind_FURY.  Sgbett talks all kinds of nonsense, and spouts out the various Bcash and Bcash SV nonsense talking points.  Sgbett is no better than the run of the mill BSV troll or some of the other nutjobs on the interwebs, even though concededly he puts his ideas together better than the average troll, and he tends to be more polite than the average troll..  

Well sometimes Bitcoin-flat-Earthers can be respected for the moderate beliefs. Plus Bcash and Bcash SV are failed attacks, and do not threat and will never threaten Bitcoin.

At the same time, politeness and articulateness is not necessarily a good thing for troll/shills to have in the sense that it could end up luring smarter people into believing his various misleading baloney in which normie peeps may well get duped into believing him, so in that sense he still talks a decent amount of nonsense that does not deserve much if any benefit of the doubt.. in my humble bumble opinion.

Like franky1's gaslight attempts? NEVER!

[gentlemand]

Like franky1's gaslight attempts? NEVER!

It's remarkable how much more longevity and 'respect' you get simply by not being moronic or abusive, or rather overtly. For some reason that sows enough doubt for people to take them seriously who otherwise wouldn't.

'Well, he uses complete sentences and sometimes they're very long. Maybe... he has a point. He must have one in there somewhere, right?.'

[sgbett]

I'm articulate (sometimes) because I feel like its an important topic. Whilst I have no doubt many will make out like bandits from BTC price action, I think there will also be many that  "get REKT". Those people need to know the truth of what they are gambling on.

I'm polite because I don't see any point in being mad with y'all. I've always been polite because I'm not a troll, Wind_FURY correctly recognises what I am saying.

When people just dismiss it as nonsense, then there is nothing I can say - their mind is made up.

On arguments of censorship and decentralisation, we can't come to agreement because in the world of BTC these have become holy icons, pursued in and of themselves. Whereas if you look to Bitcoin you can see that they are not the goal they are means to an end (that being not having to trust a central authority). Ignoring the reasons behind is the cognitive bias of surrogation.

To be decentralised a system, simply needs to not have one central server. This has already been achieved with mining being a global operation carried out by big server farms in several different countries. You can trust the whole because you do not have to trust an individual.

If I assume correctly then the phrase censorship-resistant is being used to speak to the nature of it being extremely difficult to change the blockchain. This too has already been achieved.

Both of these pillars are supported by way of the enormous amount of capital at risk that miners have. They are profit seeking, driven to seek out other miners and collaborate wrt communications in order to maximise their profitability. A miner that doeas not do this is less profitable, a miner that tries to change the blockchain becomes a pariah they sacrifice future profitability because other miners will be less likely to trust them.

The convergence on the number of individual mining endpoints was spelled out in the white paper and has been borne out in the real world. Don't forget behind the mining endpoints of pools there are multiple miners, they too are subject to the same financial incentives detailed above, so in actual fact mining is way more decentralised than it might appear at first glance.

It seems to be the case as time moves on that the inevitability of CSW being Satoshi is causing the BTC die hards to move to a line of reasoning that it no longer matters what Satoshi said, and the the white paper is no longer important. Whats clear from this then, is you value the price of Bitcoin over its properties that allow it to be used as p2p digital cash. That you value your dislike of an individual over their argument. That you value your opinion over the truth of the matter.

To dismiss the relevance of the person that invented something implies you think they were wrong, I get the impression you certainly think CSW is wrong about a lot of things

I think it's interesting that once you get to know him you can see exactly what is going on. You guys only get to see his public face, so I can understand why you might feel the way you do about him. I hope you are able to overcome this. You. might cite this as an appeal to authority, and given the broad disagreement over whether or not Craig is a fraud, you would be right to call that. However, should it be the case that he is not a fraud then it makes him the architect of Bitcoin, as such his words will carry weight. It also makes him the 'owner' of Bitcoin and affords him certain legal rights.

Given his proclivity for courtroom drama, don't you think he might be inclined to exercise those rights. Wouldn't like to be HODLing when that day comes

Remember - don't buy BSV! Build on Bitcoin!

[sgbett]

You are right about rabbit holes. The first one I fell was the Bitcoin one all those years ago. Back then I frequented slashdot a fair amount, and the abuse you got on there for being pro-bitcoin was quite something just wait til you hear my views on covid they get me in some right trouble

This just gave me some shivers. I was prowling around slashdot in my youth (heh) and lurking around, there were quite a few Bitcoin rabbitholers with the new wave of millennials (the actual generation born in the 1990s), actually wish I'd paid them a lot more attention.

I'd really like to hear your views on covid some day;) You are. Entertaining.

*from the occasional lurker on this thread*

P.S. Any thoughts from any of you on these new letters -- some interesting discussions on the earliest concerns when Satoshi released his white paper. Be forewarned, this is Coindesk, I'm not sure where their allegiance lies these days.

I was born way before the 90's

COVID is a mass delusion, fuelled by mainstream and social media's insatiable appetite for controversy.

I have no doubt there is a real virus out there, I have no doubt that sadly many people have died from it. However when this is put into perspective, it is just A.N.Other virus passing through.

I'm incensed at the way governments have leveraged the opportunity to pass legislation that curtails individual freedoms. Even more so at the way the general public has cheer-lead them all the way through.

That's not even the controversial part!

Virologists readily admit that they still have very little understanding of the human virome. In fact its estimated that there are some 380trillion viruses in each and every one of us. The state we call "healthy" is the emergent property of these viruses interacting with all the other aspects of the human biome.

Viruses aren't malicious entities hell bent on killing humans. Indeed this particular virus does its work - it gets in the lungs and cleans them out. Unfortunately some people are already so broken by age, ill-health, or maybe even just bad luck that in doing its work their immune system shuts them down (the cytokine storm). Covid is at the scene and everyone agrees its a deadly virus that most be stopped at all costs case closed.

(this is similar to how cholesterol got maligned because it was present at the site of atherosclerosis - latest research suggest that actually the cholesterol was the thing trying to the fixing! who knew?)

What is that virus doing in the body of those that are lucky enough not to die from it (thats most people btw). What if its doing something beneficial (its certainly stimulating the production of antibodies, t-cells). If it is then all measures intended to stop people contracting it are actually preventing people from the benefits. COVID mortality by age is not particularly different from all cause mortality.

Numerous studies have shown the link between prior flu-season severity and subsequent covid severity. World Health organisation recently published its annual flu numbers, mysteriously this year there have been relatively speaking no flu deaths. (I forget it was 2 digit number, down from 5digits in every previous year the report covered).

I'm not entertaining conspiracy theories about it being a hoax, or bill gates trying to chip everyone etc im looking at the evidence from around the world, ignoring popular opinion and finding my way to the truth of the matter.

That's my method. (and its been my method for 10 years on Bitcoin related matters!)

Hope you were entertained.

I dont think much about those emails, perhaps they are real in which case the timestamp thing is a curiosity. Suspect its a CoinDesk sideshow designed to try and cast more doubt.

[buwaytress]

I was born way before the 90's
~snip

I was certainly entertained, thank you. We're probably in the same age bracket, definitely in the same generation, and maybe just separated by geographical circumstances but I can give credence to some of your opinions on Covid -- I won't share my complete views, I am forced to take a conservative approach that personally believes I am as vulnerable to it as any other virus, but also that some in my family could be more vulnerable. This is tempered by the fact also that I have one young mid 20s colleague who caught it and was fighting for his life at some point, and that I lost another to it, not much older than me.

Where I live as well, last year actually was its record high from flu-related deaths, in fact it broke a previous record made in the second world war. And there was nearly not enough panic registered, compared to Covid.

I suppose I apply the same conservative and balanced approach with Bitcoin. Personally, I'm with it with all my heart, but can't afford to practically "go all in" because of others around me who expect and require some predictability with financial matters.

[sgbett]

I was born way before the 90's
~snip

I was certainly entertained, thank you. We're probably in the same age bracket, definitely in the same generation, and maybe just separated by geographical circumstances but I can give credence to some of your opinions on Covid -- I won't share my complete views, I am forced to take a conservative approach that personally believes I am as vulnerable to it as any other virus, but also that some in my family could be more vulnerable. This is tempered by the fact also that I have one young mid 20s colleague who caught it and was fighting for his life at some point, and that I lost another to it, not much older than me.

Where I live as well, last year actually was its record high from flu-related deaths, in fact it broke a previous record made in the second world war. And there was nearly not enough panic registered, compared to Covid.

I suppose I apply the same conservative and balanced approach with Bitcoin. Personally, I'm with it with all my heart, but can't afford to practically "go all in" because of others around me who expect and require some predictability with financial matters.

I absolutely respect that approach - I'm s strong advocate for personal accountability! Sorry to hear you are in the vulnerable group. Hopefully you'll be on the right side of the statistics.

I'm exactly the same when it comes to Bitcoin, "dont invest more than you can afford to lose" gang. McCormack posting about taking out a $50k loan to buy BTC on twitter is the height of irresponsible imho, not because it isn't right for him, but cos suckas gonna follow him! Even if it pays it doeasnt mean it was the right thing to do. Hey ho.

20k breached nicely, lets see where it goes. February is just around the corner *sweats profusely*

[buwaytress]

I absolutely respect that approach - I'm s strong advocate for personal accountability! Sorry to hear you are in the vulnerable group. Hopefully you'll be on the right side of the statistics.

I'm exactly the same when it comes to Bitcoin, "dont invest more than you can afford to lose" gang. McCormack posting about taking out a $50k loan to buy BTC on twitter is the height of irresponsible imho, not because it isn't right for him, but cos suckas gonna follow him! Even if it pays it doeasnt mean it was the right thing to do. Hey ho.

20k breached nicely, lets see where it goes. February is just around the corner *sweats profusely*

Thank you for your words! Yes, it's unfortunate but such is life, and one must bounce back, to kick another day.

Couldn't agree more with McCormack and his cut of cloth -- I generally quite like maximalists, but also generally those who aren't self-professed. Can't put the blame fully on him and them though, if flocks of others follow as they always will follow someone. The last time Bitcoin got this high, some poor sod in the Mid East took out bank loans he eventually couldn't pay off, lost his job, etc. etc. And this was a single guy. There will be people putting up their kids' college funds because of this induced influencer fomo. Irresponsible, careless, misguided. sigh.

But oh yeah. Happy 20k. Spending some of mine for Christmas to get some joy out of this!

[sgbett]

Well, the time has come to go full BSVtard, my SIPP provider just sent me this message:

Important information - The FCA are banning the trade of certain types of investments you hold

Dear <sgbett>
 
The Financial Conduct Authority (FCA) have recently published rules which ban the sale of crypto-currency derivatives and Exchange Traded Notes (ETNs).

The FCA have asked that investment platforms like <redacted> remove these types of investments by 6 January at the latest. Having reviewed the FCA assessment, we’ve made the decision that from Friday 30 October you will no longer be able to purchase new units in the funds listed below.

You can continue to hold the units you already hold or sell them at any time.

Investment name
XBT Provider - Bitcoin Tracker Euro

We have outlined the FCA’s reasons for their decision below, we recommend you read these and assess your own position and whether or not your investments are meeting your needs.

Why have the FCA made this decision?

The FCA reviewed these products and have outlined the following as reasons for their decision:

• The inherent nature of the underlying assets means they have no reliable basis for valuation
• Extreme volatility in cryptoasset price movements
• Lack of legitimate investment need for private consumers to invest in these products

We understand this may cause inconvenience, but the regulation is very clear.

This letter is not investment advice. If you’re unsure if a particular investment is right for you please contact us for advice.

Yours sincerely,

<redacted>

I'm so grateful that the FCA are looking out for me by protecting me from outlandish returns

Anyway this is my only remaining exposure to BTC, so once I sell this I'm going to have to have fun staying poor.

You know what the hugest irony is?... The XBT position in my SIPP is actually larger than my BSV holding in USD terms because of the relative price movements lol.

So the question is - do I sell now or HODL until the last day... decisions, decisions!

[tertius993]

Well, the time has come to go full BSVtard, my SIPP provider just sent me this message:

Important information - The FCA are banning the trade of certain types of investments you hold

Dear <sgbett>
 
The Financial Conduct Authority (FCA) have recently published rules which ban the sale of crypto-currency derivatives and Exchange Traded Notes (ETNs).

The FCA have asked that investment platforms like <redacted> remove these types of investments by 6 January at the latest. Having reviewed the FCA assessment, we’ve made the decision that from Friday 30 October you will no longer be able to purchase new units in the funds listed below.

You can continue to hold the units you already hold or sell them at any time.

Investment name
XBT Provider - Bitcoin Tracker Euro

We have outlined the FCA’s reasons for their decision below, we recommend you read these and assess your own position and whether or not your investments are meeting your needs.

Why have the FCA made this decision?

The FCA reviewed these products and have outlined the following as reasons for their decision:

• The inherent nature of the underlying assets means they have no reliable basis for valuation
• Extreme volatility in cryptoasset price movements
• Lack of legitimate investment need for private consumers to invest in these products

We understand this may cause inconvenience, but the regulation is very clear.

This letter is not investment advice. If you’re unsure if a particular investment is right for you please contact us for advice.

Yours sincerely,

<redacted>

I'm so grateful that the FCA are looking out for me by protecting me from outlandish returns

Anyway this is my only remaining exposure to BTC, so once I sell this I'm going to have to have fun staying poor.

You know what the hugest irony is?... The XBT position in my SIPP is actually larger than my BSV holding in USD terms because of the relative price movements lol.

So the question is - do I sell now or HODL until the last day... decisions, decisions!

There is no last day you can continue to hold the investment (or sell it) you just can’t buy any more.

Though I agree it’s a daft decision, especially as HMRC don’t treat the gains as gambling winnings (which would be free of tax) but as Capital Gains (and therefore taxable).

[sgbett]

There is no last day you can continue to hold the investment (or sell it) you just can’t buy any more.

Though I agree it’s a daft decision, especially as HMRC don’t treat the gains as gambling winnings (which would be free of tax) but as Capital Gains (and therefore taxable).

Hmm, I read this as they have to remove it from the 6th Jan...

The FCA have asked that investment platforms like <redacted> remove these types of investments by 6 January at the latest. Having reviewed the FCA assessment, we’ve made the decision that from Friday 30 October you will no longer be able to purchase new units in the funds listed below.

But I see your point!

It's in a SIPP so there is no tax to pay on gains, it gets taxed as income when I draw it down and it can be bequeathed tax free in UK if I die!

I've messaged them and asked them what happens on 6th!

[tertius993]

There is no last day you can continue to hold the investment (or sell it) you just can’t buy any more.

Though I agree it’s a daft decision, especially as HMRC don’t treat the gains as gambling winnings (which would be free of tax) but as Capital Gains (and therefore taxable).

Hmm, I read this as they have to remove it from the 6th Jan...

The FCA have asked that investment platforms like <redacted> remove these types of investments by 6 January at the latest. Having reviewed the FCA assessment, we’ve made the decision that from Friday 30 October you will no longer be able to purchase new units in the funds listed below.

But I see your point!

It's in a SIPP so there is no tax to pay on gains, it gets taxed as income when I draw it down and it can be bequeathed tax free in UK if I die!

I've messaged them and asked them what happens on 6th!

See the bit I bolded in their message to you (quoted in your post).  I am certain it just means you cannot buy any more, unless you are a "professional investor" of course ...

[sgbett]

You are indeed correct!

Re: Important information - The FCA are banning the trade of certain types of investments you hold - 30 Oct 2020

Dear <sgbett>

Thank you for getting in touch, I hope you are well.

As you’re already invested, you can continue to hold these products up to and past the FCA’s 6 January deadline with the ability to sell online as usual whenever you choose. You will not be forced to sell your holding, nor will it automatically be sold on your behalf.

If there are any changes made to this ruling by the FCA that affects this, we will be back in touch to let you know.

I hope this clarifies matters but please get back to me if you have any further questions.

Best regards

<redacted>

Please note the information contained in this e-mail should in no way be construed as personal advice. If you are unsure about the suitability of a product or investment for your circumstances or do not know how best to proceed you should seek professional financial advice.

I guess now I just have to call the top again