[HAVELOCK] [XBOND]

[LiteBit]

being in the ipo makes no difference if you are just going to sell the remaining units at the same price and with no time for scarcity related price appreciation.

TAT laid out all the details ahead of time. Plenty of time for everyone to understand what this offering was. A Bond, or loan, at a fixed price and with daily dividends, or interest rate. Understand what you are investing in. It doesn't matter share/person limit or how fast you get in on the IPO. The price is fixed unless YOU want to sell it for less than you bought it for.

[1713493692]

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[1713493692]

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[BlockChains]

Is the last tranch you posted that's 500k/500k the final one?

[mootinator]

being in the ipo makes no difference if you are just going to sell the remaining units at the same price and with no time for scarcity related price appreciation.

It's a bond, not something you price-speculate on.

Sounds like you wanted to screw people, not me.

Yeah, read the fine print, the point of these bonds is to ensure you're in on time to screw people on *future* IPOs, not *this* one. Sheesh.

[nexxai]

Is the last tranch you posted that's 500k/500k the final one?

Based on the number of outstanding shares, there is one mostly sold tranche, another one posted that hasn't quite started selling yet, and there will be one more after that.

[BlockChains]

One thing I don't understand (because I am slow to understand these things) is why is something like this listed on an exchange? If the face-value is fixed, why would anyone buy or sell at a price that is not the face-value?

Several reasons:

1. Emergency liquidity - If you need to sell your bonds for whatever reason, there may be buyers on the market that can provide faster, "cheaper" liquidity at any given moment.
2. Speculation - it is entirely possible for this bond to trade above its face value, because it also provides intangible value with its access to Pre-IPO purchases.
3. Facilitation - The host exchange provides all of the tools needed to manage the bondholders and interacting with them.

being in the ipo makes no difference if you are just going to sell the remaining units at the same price and with no time for scarcity related price appreciation.

It's a bond, not something you price-speculate on.

Sounds like you wanted to screw people, not me.

You said so yourself that it's something to price speculate on... (no offense, just saying)

[ThickAsThieves]

One thing I don't understand (because I am slow to understand these things) is why is something like this listed on an exchange? If the face-value is fixed, why would anyone buy or sell at a price that is not the face-value?

Several reasons:

1. Emergency liquidity - If you need to sell your bonds for whatever reason, there may be buyers on the market that can provide faster, "cheaper" liquidity at any given moment.
2. Speculation - it is entirely possible for this bond to trade above its face value, because it also provides intangible value with its access to Pre-IPO purchases.
3. Facilitation - The host exchange provides all of the tools needed to manage the bondholders and interacting with them.

being in the ipo makes no difference if you are just going to sell the remaining units at the same price and with no time for scarcity related price appreciation.

It's a bond, not something you price-speculate on.

Sounds like you wanted to screw people, not me.

You said so yourself that it's something to price speculate on... (no offense, just saying)

Yes, but I'm talking about 1-4%, and not a "flash in the pan" 2x spike, but a supported value.

[usagi]

being in the ipo makes no difference if you are just going to sell the remaining units at the same price and with no time for scarcity related price appreciation.

Don't you find the notion of price appreciation on a fixed face-value bond... non-intuitive?

[Exocyst]

Otherwise, I think most people find that I try to be both diplomatic and a purveyor of progress.

Still wondering what you meant by diplomatic... 

Are all future listings to be supported by this bond to be released on Havelock Investments? It seems you have had successful launches there recently (including this bond).

[ThickAsThieves]

Otherwise, I think most people find that I try to be both diplomatic and a purveyor of progress.

Still wondering what you meant by diplomatic... 

Are all future listings to be supported by this bond to be released on Havelock Investments? It seems you have had successful launches there recently (including this bond).

What I meant about diplomatic is that I do my best to be respectful while being respected, and I try to take people seriously when I'm not sure if they are serious. Being tactful on the internet ain't easy, and people like to make it even more difficult with trolling and dramatic overtures. Being diplomatic while trying to be progressive is even worse, being that many dislike or misunderstand change.

3. Any XBOND on any exchange can be exchanged toward Pre-IPO offerings on any exchange, so long as they are issued by TAT Investments.

See above, but generally an XBOND sold on any exchange is redeemable to any eligible IPO on any exchange. I'll post Pre-IPO details along with any IPO announcements. These details will include any schedules, specifications or limits (if any).

[Anonymousg64]

you cant have a supply/demand market with a fixed price, unless a fixed price is directly enforced.

[mootinator]

I see your point Anon. The thing that keeps a normal bond near it's face value is that at the maturity date, that's all you're getting for it.  A perpetual bond should either rise to the maximum point people still think the return is worthwhile or fall to the redeemable value.

[Exocyst]

But seriously just chill.  If you don't trust these guys with your money, then don't hold the shares.

It's not as simple as that. The greater issue here is the legitimacy of the market itself.

We care, so we kick and scream. I don't want issuers acting like scammers, or investors buying into scams, regardless of whether I hold shares.

It affects everyone. It affects the value of everything, and bitcoin's health in general.

I spotted the diplomacy I was looking for

Otherwise, I think most people find that I try to be both diplomatic and a purveyor of progress.

Still wondering what you meant by diplomatic... 

Are all future listings to be supported by this bond to be released on Havelock Investments? It seems you have had successful launches there recently (including this bond).

What I meant about diplomatic is that I do my best to be respectful while being respected, and I try to take people seriously when I'm not sure if they are serious. Being tactful on the internet ain't easy, and people like to make it even more difficult with trolling and dramatic overtures. Being diplomatic while trying to be progressive is even worse, being that many dislike or misunderstand change.

3. Any XBOND on any exchange can be exchanged toward Pre-IPO offerings on any exchange, so long as they are issued by TAT Investments.

See above, but generally an XBOND sold on any exchange is redeemable to any eligible IPO on any exchange. I'll post Pre-IPO details along with any IPO announcements. These details will include any schedules, specifications or limits (if any).

I realize you don't want to divulge secrets of upcoming releases, but I am more interested to invest in an index fund traded on Havelock or BTC-TC than BitFunder (no API), so let me be more direct: do you have a preferred market for listing new offerings? (Don't say BitFunder) 

[mootinator]

Looks like the third tranche is about 80% sold already.

[bitmillion]

Maybe i need to do more research, but i find it difficult to see an additional raise of funds close to 200,000 USD worth to TAT , having a hidden email contact on this forum, a gmail only contact on the havelock exchange, let alone thieves in the company name, and no website to be found via google that i can see. do you have a name ? office ?

[ThickAsThieves]

Maybe i need to do more research, but i find it difficult to see an additional raise of funds close to 200,000 USD worth to TAT , having a hidden email contact on this forum, a gmail only contact on the havelock exchange, let alone thieves in the company name, and no website to be found via google that i can see. do you have a name ? office ?

Think of all the "names" you know in bitcoin investing. Are they more, or less trustworthy than the well-known handles?

The exchange operators do know who I am, where I live, and my background in business (other than MPEx, since I have yet to issue there).

We have a legal firm working on formalizing TATI as we speak, not only in a business sense, but in the eyes of the SEC as well. We have a plan, and we are executing it.

I told you all in the past that I am trying to raise standards, and that's what I'm doing. TATI is bringing new concepts to the market, investing money into new bitcoin services, making new bitcoin legal accomplishments, and other surprises.

A website will come eventually...

[bitmillion]

Thank you, ya that all sounds respectable, and having at least the exchange owners knowing your personal info , along with the SEC as a valid fear factor after pirate40 guy i suppose your as credible as it gets in the crypto world. congrats on your fast almost complete sell off of xbond

[linko]

167515 / 500000 bonds left of the 4th (and final) tranche as of Sat, 03 Aug 2013 01:35:39 -0400

[Ninshatamoto]

4th tranch is completely sold out - looking forward to see how this develops!

[freedomno1]

4th tranch is completely sold out - looking forward to see how this develops!

Nice speed

[ThickAsThieves]

Looks like the offering sold out in about 14 hours.

Thank you everyone for making the release a success!

I'll post updates as they become available.