MasterCoin: New Protocol Layer Starting From “The Exodus Address”

[Tachikoma]

I'm not sure if this has been discussed before but I couldn't find it. I'm trying to work on encoding Mastercoin data that's larger then just one public key and I'm wondering how we should split data across two keys.

The most space efficient way would be to just concat the two keys as it were and divide them in the middle. (I've added parentheses around the compressed key and sequence for easier readibility)

I.e.
(0201)00000014000000020000000005f5e10000000000000f424060000000000018
(0202)6a00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000

The last value here being 186a.

What we could also do is only have whole values per key. In that example the data would be divided as follows.

(0201)00000014000000020000000005f5e10000000000000f424060000000000000
(0202)186a000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000

I personally prefer the latter version as I think it's cleaner but it does reduce the available space in general.

Thoughts?

[1714152609]

1714152609

[1714152609]

1714152609

[1714152609]

1714152609

[Bitoy]

Concat the two keys seems to me the better option because of space saving.   

I'm not sure if this has been discussed before but I couldn't find it. I'm trying to work on encoding Mastercoin data that's larger then just one public key and I'm wondering how we should split data across two keys.

The most space efficient way would be to just concat the two keys as it were and divide them in the middle. (I've added parentheses around the compressed key and sequence for easier readibility)

I.e.
(0201)00000014000000020000000005f5e10000000000000f424060000000000018
(0202)6a00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000

The last value here being 186a.

What we could also do is only have whole values per key. In that example the data would be divided as follows.

(0201)00000014000000020000000005f5e10000000000000f424060000000000000
(0202)186a000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000

I personally prefer the latter version as I think it's cleaner but it does reduce the available space in general.

Thoughts?

[ASICSRUS]

Did you guys catch this Colored Coins vs Mastercoin thread?
(I know Willett did, he's replying out there)

re: yes'a Mastah(coin)~ who needs "colored" coins!  didn't think if that

[ripper234]

I'd like to inform you guys of a new alt coin that borrows some basic ideas from Mastercoin.
I'm talking about Nxt.

I just found it today and skimmed through the thread, so my understanding might be a little off.
They are doing some Mastercoin-style fundraiser, and creating a brand new Proof of Stake coin, where the initial stake is based on the donated funds. This does not use the Bitcoin blockchain at all, but is a separate blockchain that can be mined without any electricity burned (is it the first pure PoS alt?)

There are missing details, and I think the fundraiser was constructed rather clumsily (The end date wasn't set in stone when the fundraiser started, no bonus for early adopters). The op doesn't intend to actually raise a lot of money ... but the market might decide that they do want to invest in this new alt.

I believe the fundraiser ends Jan 3 2014, and you can see their version of 1Exodus at 1BCN1u.

Here is my first reply to their thread.

FYI, they don't see their creation as a feature-rich protocol such as Mastercoin, but rather just as one more alt that attempts to fix some of bitcoins flaws.

[Tachikoma]

I'm missing a whitepaper to read or at least some documentation. It's not in the OP. Do you know if it can be found somewhere else?

[dacoinminster]

Concat the two keys seems to me the better option because of space saving.   

I'm not sure if this has been discussed before but I couldn't find it. I'm trying to work on encoding Mastercoin data that's larger then just one public key and I'm wondering how we should split data across two keys.

The most space efficient way would be to just concat the two keys as it were and divide them in the middle. (I've added parentheses around the compressed key and sequence for easier readibility)

I.e.
(0201)00000014000000020000000005f5e10000000000000f424060000000000018
(0202)6a00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000

The last value here being 186a.

What we could also do is only have whole values per key. In that example the data would be divided as follows.

(0201)00000014000000020000000005f5e10000000000000f424060000000000000
(0202)186a000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000

I personally prefer the latter version as I think it's cleaner but it does reduce the available space in general.

Thoughts?

I think the parsing code should be simpler for concat. If we think of multisig as a transport layer, it won't care about the byte boundaries of the payload it is transporting - it's just a stream of bytes which need to get into the block chain.

[Tachikoma]

I will focus on concatting for now but I would love to hear from Grazcoin and Zarthras when you guys have the chance.

[dacoinminster]

I'd like to inform you guys of a new alt coin that borrows some basic ideas from Mastercoin.
I'm talking about Nxt.

I just found it today and skimmed through the thread, so my understanding might be a little off.
They are doing some Mastercoin-style fundraiser, and creating a brand new Proof of Stake coin, where the initial stake is based on the donated funds. This does not use the Bitcoin blockchain at all, but is a separate blockchain that can be mined without any electricity burned (is it the first pure PoS alt?)

There are missing details, and I think the fundraiser was constructed rather clumsily (The end date wasn't set in stone when the fundraiser started, no bonus for early adopters). The op doesn't intend to actually raise a lot of money ... but the market might decide that they do want to invest in this new alt.

I believe the fundraiser ends Jan 3 2014, and you can see their version of 1Exodus at 1BCN1u.

Here is my first reply to their thread.

FYI, they don't see their creation as a feature-rich protocol such as Mastercoin, but rather just as one more alt that attempts to fix some of bitcoins flaws.

It's hard to evaluate this project without whitepaper, source code, or even knowing who is behind it. Still, I won't be surprised if they raise a LOT of money. People have seen this fundraising method work for MSC (and pay off handsomely for our investors), and people will be a lot more willing to give it a try now that it has been proven to work.

This may not be a scam, but if we don't see some scam fundraisers using this model, I'll be amazed!

Proof of stake is very interesting to me. If we see a POS system take off, we might set up a parallel MSC on top of it someday, just to cover all our bases. Note that if we do something like that on ANY alt chain I'd want to look for a way to seed it by giving current MasterCoin holders the new coins, rather than starting with a new fundraiser.

[maxmint]

Here's a conversation I just had with J.R. via PM:

I don't know if you are familiar with ActiveMining, it's a mining company that used to trade shares on btct.co and bitfunder.com.
At current rates, their market cap is around 30.000 BTC.

Now that both exchanges seem to be shutting down, CEO Ken Slaughter is looking for a new way to trade their stocks.
They're even trying to come up with their own colored coin solution: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=297543.msg3325554#msg3325554

I think it would be great to get them interested in Mastercoin and our smart property feature.

Very interesting. We're still a few weeks away from doing smart property that they could use, but they would definitely be the sort of company who would be interested in using that feature!

I wonder if we should be thinking of setting up a bounty for the first users of our smart property for stuff like this. Maybe a bounty for the first smart property to trade more than $100k worth of something on our platform, and another bounty for the first property to trade more than $1M worth.

Feel free to post about this on the project thread

A bounty would be a great incentive. I'll try to contact Ken to let him know about Mastercoin – I'm not sure if he's aware about our project.

[ASICSRUS]

Here's a conversation I just had with J.R. via PM:

I don't know if you are familiar with ActiveMining, it's a mining company that used to trade shares on btct.co and bitfunder.com.
At current rates, their market cap is around 30.000 BTC.

Now that both exchanges seem to be shutting down, CEO Ken Slaughter is looking for a new way to trade their stocks.
They're even trying to come up with their own colored coin solution: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=297543.msg3325554#msg3325554

I think it would be great to get them interested in Mastercoin and our smart property feature.

Very interesting. We're still a few weeks away from doing smart property that they could use, but they would definitely be the sort of company who would be interested in using that feature!

I wonder if we should be thinking of setting up a bounty for the first users of our smart property for stuff like this. Maybe a bounty for the first smart property to trade more than $100k worth of something on our platform, and another bounty for the first property to trade more than $1M worth.

Feel free to post about this on the project thread

A bounty would be a great incentive. I'll try to contact Ken to let him know about Mastercoin – I'm not sure if he's aware about our project.

hope you know i'm reporting this to the big dogs upstairs~0ptions traders ! amazing project imo looking good!!!!!
  *on watch!*

[grishnakh]

Did you guys catch this Colored Coins vs Mastercoin thread?
(I know Willett did, he's replying out there)

Here's a fresh cc vs mastercoin thread: Colored coins VS Mastercoins - Which one is better?

[klee]

http://www.dailydot.com/crime/black-market-reloaded-shut-down-backopy-silk-road/

The time is now for Mastercoin to succeed!

Decentralized currency/security exchange and decentralized market needed now more than ever

[Super T]

I'd like to see a roadmap for nailing share ownership and trading capabilities, I think this should be the next priority.

Once built, a worthwhile use of foundation cash could be to use funds to buy shares in various Bitcoin denominated stocks (e.g. mining companies like Asicminer which were traded until recently on btct.co before it closed), then offer those stocks for sale at a modest discount via the mastercoin platform.

This would provide an opportunity to prove the capability whilst also attracting new users and further investment in MSC.

[Tachikoma]

I've created public keys for a  "Sell Mastercoin for Bitcoin" offer. I would appreciate it if an other developer could decode the keys and tell me what they think it says before I broadcast it to the world

Code:

020100000014000000020000000005f5e10000000000000f424060000000000018
02026a000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000

[dacoinminster]

I've created public keys for a  "Sell Mastercoin for Bitcoin" offer. I would appreciate it if an other developer could decode the keys and tell me what they think it says before I broadcast it to the world

Code:

020100000014000000020000000005f5e10000000000000f424060000000000018
02026a000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000

Wow. I guess I better be a bit quicker!

I've been pondering acceptance criteria for this feature. Here's my proposal:

Acceptance criteria:

• Minimum one PC wallet which can generate simple sends and these buy/sell messages, using Tachikoma's multisig
• Minimum two websites parsing such messages, and the resulting balance transfers
• Minimum one website showing BTC/MSC price charts derived from these messages
• Minimum 10 days of real-world usage with no major problems
• High bar for usability. (Current heavy traders like maxmint, lishbtc, and buybitcoin should be happy with the final product, if at all possible)

Payout criteria:

• 200 BTC for people who do the coding work on this feature
• 100 BTC for people who code-review, test, and find bugs (could be the same people, or could be other people entirely)
• Similar payout rules to last time, with heavy emphasis on sharing code, collaboration, posting frequent updates, and mutual evaluation of each other at the end

This is just brainstorming right now - not a promise! The board actually wanted me to spend even more money than this per feature, so they may not sign off on this plan. However, we've added several proposed features since that discussion, and I don't want to burn through our cash too quickly.

[zathras]

I've created public keys for a  "Sell Mastercoin for Bitcoin" offer. I would appreciate it if an other developer could decode the keys and tell me what they think it says before I broadcast it to the world

Code:

020100000014000000020000000005f5e10000000000000f424060000000000018
02026a000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000

Back to back meetings today but will take a look this evening

[dacoinminster]

I can't help but post this really interesting blurb from a thread about us on reddit. Apparently Peter Todd is working on "A survey of the representation and transferral of assets with Bitcoin" which provides this description of systems like MasterCoin:

Here are parts about Mastercoin:

    {Parasitic consensus systems}

    A proof-of-work blockchain, such as the Bitcoin blockchain, can be made use of parasistically for a secondary consensus system. Recall the two fundemental proofs that a blockchain provides: consensus ordering/timestamping and and proof-of-publication. A Satoshi-style blockchain can be used as an ordered message publication service - it is not possible to completely prevent the publication of data without whitelisting censorship ...Thus for a given block height i we have a set of blocks B={b_0 ... b_i} containing messages M={m_0 ... m_j}. By applying a fixed set of rules to that set of messages multiple parties can independently arrive at the same state of the system.

    ... (here goes description of "string bling" system used as an example)

    The Mastercoin system uses this principle. While not yet well developed, there exists an agreed upon set of rules that, from the contents of the Bitcoin blockchain, can derive a set of "Mastercoin" transactions and a final ledger state derived from data encoded in the Bitcoin blockchain.

    Parasitic consensus systems inherently gain the benefits of the security of the underlying consensus system. Though the "string bling" system may have only a handful of users interested in it, an attacker attempting to change the state of the consensus of what strings have what bling would need to attack the Bitcoin blockchain directly - a signififantly harder problem. A merge-mined or independently mined string-bling implementation would probably never be secure against an attacker with a budget of even just a few thousands dollars, by parasiticly using the Bitcoin blockchain the attackers required budget swells to tens of millions.

That's . . . a surprisingly good synopsis of how our project works.

I'd use the word symbiotic rather than parasitic, since I believe we'll be good for bitcoin in the long run. History will decide, I guess.

Source: www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1oo1h2/mastercoin_pays_out_25000_in_btc_msc_to_winners/cctxb5r

[zathras]

I've created public keys for a  "Sell Mastercoin for Bitcoin" offer. I would appreciate it if an other developer could decode the keys and tell me what they think it says before I broadcast it to the world

Code:

020100000014000000020000000005f5e10000000000000f424060000000000018
02026a000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000

Back to back meetings today but will take a look this evening

Hey Tachikoma,

I think you are missing a zero on your time limit, however other than that looks good.

Decoded it's a transaction for selling Test MSC for BTC.  Transaction type is 20 (00000014), currency type is test mastercoin (00000002), selling 1 Test MSC (0000000005f5e100) for 0.01BTC (00000000000f4240) with a time limit of 6 blocks (6, should be 06?) and a min fee of 0.001BTC (00000000000186a0).  The rest is just padding.

Thanks!

[Luckybit]

I'd like to inform you guys of a new alt coin that borrows some basic ideas from Mastercoin.
I'm talking about Nxt.

I just found it today and skimmed through the thread, so my understanding might be a little off.
They are doing some Mastercoin-style fundraiser, and creating a brand new Proof of Stake coin, where the initial stake is based on the donated funds. This does not use the Bitcoin blockchain at all, but is a separate blockchain that can be mined without any electricity burned (is it the first pure PoS alt?)

There are missing details, and I think the fundraiser was constructed rather clumsily (The end date wasn't set in stone when the fundraiser started, no bonus for early adopters). The op doesn't intend to actually raise a lot of money ... but the market might decide that they do want to invest in this new alt.

I believe the fundraiser ends Jan 3 2014, and you can see their version of 1Exodus at 1BCN1u.

Here is my first reply to their thread.

FYI, they don't see their creation as a feature-rich protocol such as Mastercoin, but rather just as one more alt that attempts to fix some of bitcoins flaws.

It's hard to evaluate this project without whitepaper, source code, or even knowing who is behind it. Still, I won't be surprised if they raise a LOT of money. People have seen this fundraising method work for MSC (and pay off handsomely for our investors), and people will be a lot more willing to give it a try now that it has been proven to work.

This may not be a scam, but if we don't see some scam fundraisers using this model, I'll be amazed!

Proof of stake is very interesting to me. If we see a POS system take off, we might set up a parallel MSC on top of it someday, just to cover all our bases. Note that if we do something like that on ANY alt chain I'd want to look for a way to seed it by giving current MasterCoin holders the new coins, rather than starting with a new fundraiser.

Please please design Mastercoin in a way to make attaching it to an altcoin profitable for the current Mastercoin owners. That would be a brilliant move.

[Tachikoma]

Hey Tachikoma,

I think you are missing a zero on your time limit, however other than that looks good.

Decoded it's a transaction for selling Test MSC for BTC.  Transaction type is 20 (00000014), currency type is test mastercoin (00000002), selling 1 Test MSC (0000000005f5e100) for 0.01BTC (00000000000f4240) with a time limit of 6 blocks (6, should be 06?) and a min fee of 0.001BTC (00000000000186a0).  The rest is just padding.

Thanks!

Yes you are right, good find, I read the specs wrong. Will fix that!