₿ LIST ₿ Bitcointalk's ESCROW providers: Ranking & Blacklist ☠ Avoid Scam ☠

[philipma1957]

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I see issues in providing escrow I did not see. Possibly I won't ever do escrow again.

I do not want to get stuck  or have to stick someone.

Interesting.  I'm glad I got out of handling escrow when I did.  After reading your example, I can see how it would be an interesting court case if there was effectively a contract that says to send to a particular address, and then before release of escrow a buyer claims that he no longer has exclusive control of that address.

I'm glad I never encountered that.

I suppose as long as both parties agreed, it would be safe to modify the refund address.  However, if the selling party disappears it might become impossible to get their agreement.

Another option might be to state in the agreement that the refund will be sent to any address requested by the buyer once the refund conditions have been met.  As long as you can confirm that the person providing the refund address is the same person that agreed to the buyer side of the agreement, that might work properly?

Yeah  I have to ponder this  as I do escrow to grease the wheels of cryptocoins  more then making profit.  I am USA based  and   this new scam as described to me by OG  and his method to prevent it opens up  these other issues.

At times I do 10000 dollar plus escrows.. making 100 bucks or so at my 1% rate.

 I do not need to do a 35000 dollar escrow  and have this happen to me.

All for the sake of making 1%  say 350 usd.

I also do not need to have to follow  a locked in refund address and get sued for doing so As I burn the buyer by insisting  to send to the fixed refund address.

I am going to look this over a bit more. Before I figure what to do.

[1713251894]

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[SFR10]

I need escrow services for a quite big ICO. Better more than one.
Organizing payments and handle the moneyflow. A bit more than normal requests.
Pls hide me up if one of the trustfully escrows want join.

You should try contacting "CET": https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1938190.0
They seem to be suitable enough for your need.

[lockept93]

I need escrow services for a quite big ICO. Better more than one.
Organizing payments and handle the moneyflow. A bit more than normal requests.
Pls hide me up if one of the trustfully escrows want join.

You should try contacting "CET": https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1938190.0
They seem to be suitable enough for your need.

We tried, but unfortunately we don't find together.

So this service needing is still open.

[WaffleMaster]

The only thing you can do that would be legal, in that case, would be to abide by your contract. There is no fault in following the contract through, even if it means the coins are lost forever. Everybody knew the deal when they signed it, and just because some freak accidents happened doesn't mean you get to break the contract and open yourself up for a lawsuit. To avoid that you could have them provide multiple addresses for refund. Why does there only need to be one address?

That being said it's unfortunate a lot of people doing escrow are not feeling up to it anymore. It's really hard to use crypto for peer to peer trades. Nobody is protected unless there is an escrow.

[Financisto]

The only thing you can do that would be legal, in that case, would be to abide by your contract. There is no fault in following the contract through, even if it means the coins are lost forever. Everybody knew the deal when they signed it, and just because some freak accidents happened doesn't mean you get to break the contract and open yourself up for a lawsuit. To avoid that you could have them provide multiple addresses for refund. Why does there only need to be one address?

That being said it's unfortunate a lot of people doing escrow are not feeling up to it anymore. It's really hard to use crypto for peer to peer trades. Nobody is protected unless there is an escrow.

IMO that's the best approach to follow while doing your deals. You can even demand/insist that customer must use (or at least be fully aware of) addresses wich he or she controls the private keys himself/herself (so no exchanges' addresses should be allowed).

[monbux]

I'd like to be considered for this list as an escrow provider.

My thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=631008.0
My Trust profile: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=133846

[SebastianJu]

The only thing you can do that would be legal, in that case, would be to abide by your contract. There is no fault in following the contract through, even if it means the coins are lost forever. Everybody knew the deal when they signed it, and just because some freak accidents happened doesn't mean you get to break the contract and open yourself up for a lawsuit. To avoid that you could have them provide multiple addresses for refund. Why does there only need to be one address?

That being said it's unfortunate a lot of people doing escrow are not feeling up to it anymore. It's really hard to use crypto for peer to peer trades. Nobody is protected unless there is an escrow.

If you would send coins to an address when seller or buyer told you upfront this address can not be trusted anymore or is invalid then this might serve as a reason to sue if you still sent even being warned.

For big amounts it might make sense to send a small testtransaction to check out if the receiver really is the person you initiated the deal with. Wait some time to see if the real person intervenes and just then release the whole transaction.

Good posts lately. Made me thinking and revising my escrow details.

@philipma1957 What was the scam method happening. It sounds like I might know it but I'm not sure. Is there a link with full description?

[philipma1957]

buyer a
seller b  are the same person

buyer a sends coins with addy 12345

deal dies

buyer a says  addy 12345  is not good asks for refund  to addy 12346

seller never answers    so you decide to refund to addy 12346

buyer  a comes back says account was hacked you refunded to wrong addy


ogNasty  has his I only refund to send addy rule it stops this scam.

But in the isoneguy case  he did not have access to the send address and  he can prove it is still him.  they should have mediated with me.



I looked at it and see both points of view  but  losing a controlled btc addy can happen  and  if it does ogNasty's rule  does not protect the escrow  if he insists on burning the coins by sending to a dead account.

For instance your home  and core wallet floods out  no core the hdd store in a local bank  was also flooded.  refund is sent to a dead addy.

or I die (it will happen) wife proves I am dead and she does not  have password  to the core  but has access to say coinbase.

 Escrow sends to core money = dead  wife sues escrow.

So if I  the escrow act with  the rule 

send address must be  refund address    I am thinking of a few cases that I can be sued.

I am working on a modification to that rule. 

that protects :
 
1)escrow
2)buyer
3)seller

[SebastianJu]

buyer a
seller b  are the same person

buyer a sends coins with addy 12345

deal dies

buyer a says  addy 12345  is not good asks for refund  to addy 12346

seller never answers    so you decide to refund to addy 12346

buyer  a comes back says account was hacked you refunded to wrong addy


ogNasty  has his I only refund to send addy rule it stops this scam.

But in the isoneguy case  he did not have access to the send address and  he can prove it is still him.  they should have mediated with me.



I looked at it and see both points of view  but  losing a controlled btc addy can happen  and  if it does ogNasty's rule  does not protect the escrow  if he insists on burning the coins by sending to a dead account.

For instance your home  and core wallet floods out  no core the hdd store in a local bank  was also flooded.  refund is sent to a dead addy.

or I die (it will happen) wife proves I am dead and she does not  have password  to the core  but has access to say coinbase.

 Escrow sends to core money = dead  wife sues escrow.

So if I  the escrow act with  the rule 

send address must be  refund address    I am thinking of a few cases that I can be sued.

I am working on a modification to that rule. 

that protects :
 
1)escrow
2)buyer
3)seller

Was the buyer really hacked? In any case, there is not really something that can be done except providing a further safety level like asking the buyer for a refund address before the deal start. Like Danny suggested. Or buyer and or seller provides a signature or a pgp key that can be used in case a refund has to happen.

Besides that... escrow would have to trust on the identity of the user. User has to make sure that his account is safe and not hacked. Escrow otherwise has to assume that he still deals with the same person.

With bigger amounts it might help to send a small amount first.

I had it happen that someone got hacked. Not sure if one of the users was the hacker or if it was a third party. Hacker had access to the sellers account and changed the receiving address. I asked back 2 times and always only received the answer that it is alright and the right address.

It turned out that the hacker, if it was so, deleted fast every incoming pm I sent to the seller and answered to me. Then deleted it from outbox also. Seller did not receive a notice about what went on. Probably didn't check email or hacker also deactivated email for new pm's. Not sure anymore.

In any case it is hard to protect against. At some level you have to trust that you still deal with the same person and the trader has to protect his account.

[Dabs]

I'm in the process of handling a $100k USD escrow. But, as I have stated many times, it's not the fiat value, it's the bitcoin that matters. I'm also chomping it into smaller portions over the course of several days.

If the transaction is simple, I usually accept. If it looks too complicated, or I can't see how I can verify either end, I just refuse and refer them to anyone else listed on this thread.

And if it's multi-sig, ... me and Seb have done a few together.

Danny's description seems to be a good one for a proper escrow process. I'd add that for high value (or perceived high value) transactions, I would require users to know how to sign bitcoin messages and GPG/PGP messages.

When you're about to leak NSA secrets to the press, ... PGP was required (and a flight to Honk Kong.)

[Financisto]

I'd like to be considered for this list as an escrow provider.

My thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=631008.0
My Trust profile: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=133846

Just take a look at my last update: 

«UPDATE»

Newest changes:

↓monbux has been removed from the list because he was unable to reply our PMs confirming his Escrow service status and operations since February, 2017;

↓Zepher no longer offers escrow service and is out of the Crypto Escrow Team;

↑Seccour joined as Escrow agent.

List and all scores refreshed...

The reason is: you never reply my PMs (the last one I sent you in August 03, 2017, 01:53:51 AM)...

...but lets try once more.

If you wanna apply for this list, please post here (or send me PM with) the following info:

1) Which cryptocurrencies do you work with?

2) Minimum and Maximum amount of coins allowed/accepted while using your escrow service (in BTC or USD);

3) Your fees;

4) Do you work with PGP signed messages OR signed messages from an already staked* cryptocurrency's address?

[ * ] Stake your cryptocurrencies' addresses here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=996318.0

[menikmati]

Can we nominate some guys? I would suggest ranochigo... > https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1306343.msg13377210#msg13377210

[Financisto]

« UPDATE »

Recent changes:

↑Mitchell has joined the Crypto Escrow Team;

↑ranochigo has joined as Escrow Provider.

List and all scores updated...

P.S. I've noticed the overall score and trust points have decreased and some escrow providers have been downgraded as result. Has anything changed related to the forum's trust mechanism?

[Lauda]

Has anything changed related to the forum's trust mechanism?

It has not. Some members got booted from DT since your last update, and some negative ratings were thrown around. It was much worse a while back.

[mekar sari]

Buyer: mekar sari
Seller: ije07
Escrow fee covered by: lauda
Details of the deal: 200 MNX
Amount in Bitcoin: 0.1
Extra details: -

[Lauda]

Buyer: mekar sari
Seller: ije07
Escrow fee covered by: lauda
Details of the deal: 200 MNX
Amount in Bitcoin: 0.1
Extra details: -

This is not the thread in which you should post any escrow requests (not that this is a valid request as I am not covering anyone's fee, obviously).

[Silvercell]

please share where i can find trusted escrow list
i already searching but cant find it.thank before

[Lauda]

please share where i can find trusted escrow list
i already searching but cant find it.thank before

It's literally in the first post of this thread. It looks like you're a spammer though.

[Silvercell]

please share where i can find trusted escrow list
i already searching but cant find it.thank before

It's literally in the first post of this thread. It looks like you're a spammer though.

i read it on first page,and see the date is for years ago, and i need a newest info.
and why you judge me iam spammer

[Lauda]

i read it on first page,and see the date is for years ago, and i need a newest info.

You have not read anything.

«Last updated on September 17th, 2017»

"Years ago", when it was literally updated 4 days ago.

and why you judge me iam spammer