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The forum strives to allow free discussion of any ideas. All policies are built around this principle. This doesn't mean you can post garbage, though: posts should actually contain ideas, and these ideas should be argued reasonably.
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Gimpeline
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January 29, 2018, 01:20:29 PM
Last edit: January 29, 2018, 01:43:48 PM by Gimpeline |
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Yes it should be legal.
Got a excample from my own family of how terrible the law is.
My nephew is schizophrenic. He hears voices in his head.
He was ok for a few months and had stoped taking medicine.
Some time ago he had a fall back at school and got some mariuana to calm the voices down.
Result: 1 months suspention.
Now if he didn't do it and had given into the voices, the results could have been terrible.
So he got puniched for doing the right thing
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stantpro
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January 29, 2018, 04:25:51 PM |
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If all drugs are legalized, it then means that poison is also legalized for some combination
of drugs have chemical output very harmful to health.Hence, legalizing all drugs could abet
poisoning and fatality from those who may fall victim to the pangs of such ''hard drugs''.There
should be absolute control to drugs people are permitted to use.
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nessesthelle
Newbie
 Offline
Activity: 49
Merit: 0
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January 29, 2018, 05:22:31 PM |
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Most of drugs are fun, but don't we have the most useless ones legalized? I'm speaking about alcohol and cigarettes.
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bluefirecorp_ (OP)
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January 29, 2018, 10:51:04 PM |
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If all drugs are legalized, it then means that poison is also legalized for some combination
of drugs have chemical output very harmful to health.Hence, legalizing all drugs could abet
poisoning and fatality from those who may fall victim to the pangs of such ''hard drugs''.There
should be absolute control to drugs people are permitted to use.
Bleach is already legal my dude. Most of drugs are fun, but don't we have the most useless ones legalized? I'm speaking about alcohol and cigarettes.
Meh, alcohol's been around for a couple of millennium. Tobacco = taxes. |
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scutzi128
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January 29, 2018, 11:12:37 PM |
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If you make speed easy to get: every eg junior doctor and every lorry driver will end up having to take it in order to compete.
Valid points. However, that's the individual person's choice. My university has a strict no drugs policy. Work place rules could still be set to prevent drug use (especially while on the job). Also, considering no insurance provider covers you while under the influence now, I don't see why they would in the future. And dope: the prozzers will all be forced to take it, and factory workers will all take it.
As long as the people know the consequences of their actions, they'd be responsible for their own bodies. Just because you don't want to doesn't mean they don't want to. Most of those problems are caused by the black market effect. If it's illegal to even seek treatment for the condition, of course the condition is going to become terrible. If heroin was sold in safe needles and doses, you'd have less problems with a lot of those propaganda images. The problem isn't the drugs themselves rather the conditions surrounding the drugs.Do you really think people would be taking something someone cooked up in their shed if there was a safer, more effective, over the counter drug that's just as cheap (if not cheaper [mass production])? YES OF COURSE, only hepatitis was dangerous and AIDS! infection at needle point! dude, do you really think what you wrote? because do you know what heroin is? it is a very strong analgesic (make you feel really less your environment), increase your ocular tension (can give you glaucoma), slow your heart (you can have serious rhythm troubles, including heart stops!), and it's a very very strong respiratory depressor (you simply stop breathing when you fall asleep, because you get so high, so euphoric and happy in your head that you're body stop to think about breathing)! AND this is only short-term effects (I don't talk about mid and long-term effects).... all of this for what? 3h trip make you feel happy and euphoric? yuhuuuu, do you think that happy people, strong people, well psychological developed people need this thing to be happy? I'm ok for some drugs, but not for all for god sake! "black market black market" yes, legalize it to fight against black market, and it will be as simple as to get alcohol in US by asking an homeless to get some! do you think that every people on this earth will know "oh dude, it is heroin, don't take it before 18 and please, use clean spoon and needle" wtf dude, that is what you want to learn to your children? cannabis is super recreative, you chill with friends, grab a beer, get lazy on the sun with a good northern light reefer, but please dude, heroin... you just don't know what you're talking about... yes LSD should be fun once or twice "to discover his deeper mind (ahahaha)" (of everyday if you want to become schizoid), yes MDMA is super fun at parties, make you feel so hot and so connected to chicks, yes weed is super chill, make you so lazy, yes cocaïne give me a fucking high efficiency and control, but there is always a time where you get back to reality because that's where you live, not in your druggy dream... and what I love in your kind of people is that "we don't need no material world, happiness is in our heart, and it's so important to understand it" but don't you get that drugs are as material as could be a rolex? ahaha and do you understand that opening hard drugs for 21+ is opening the door for 16-21 also, oh no sorry, you have control for sure, you're shacking when you don't have your dime but "everything is under control" EDIT : and for people talking about "cigarettes and alcohol" what's the matter with these ones boyz? alcohol -> make the best parties of your life, make you discover yourself and get into a new age of your life! and I don't even talk about cigarettes... but no one of you think about dying people about hepatic-cellular insufficiency and cirrhosis, hepatocellular carcinoma, bronchic carcinoma, BPCO, spreading tumors... you make me laugh, really |
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JustADreamer
Newbie
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Activity: 98
Merit: 0
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January 29, 2018, 11:49:08 PM |
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I think the problem is not the single opinion of one country but the world and its leaders combined.
Compare to the incident where the entire Russian team was disqualified from the Olympics, it creates an 'unfair' advantage for others while some might not benefit from them so much.
Legalizing drugs would probably have some detrimental ripple effects starting with; School, Sports, and even gambling.
Before you know it we'll all be betting on the team that takes the 'purest' enhancers.
Some things should be prescribed medically but opening the cages entirely is out of the question for a while.
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bry0908
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January 30, 2018, 04:21:11 AM |
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well.. it depend on the kind of drugs. as long as it wont destroy the humanity it is ok to use and be legal. but like shabu, cocaine and other related drugs, they are sick on community. this drugs should be destroyed and much as possible, the person behind this illegal drugs should face charges and put imprison. we need drugs that will help our medical study, that can solve and treat cancer and other viruses.
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nhanhzam
Newbie
Offline
Activity: 52
Merit: 0
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January 30, 2018, 04:44:15 AM |
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Drugs should be legalized.
Drugs education is a must and is the key to solve all drugs related problems.
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bluefirecorp_ (OP)
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January 30, 2018, 04:02:01 PM |
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If you make speed easy to get: every eg junior doctor and every lorry driver will end up having to take it in order to compete.
Valid points. However, that's the individual person's choice. My university has a strict no drugs policy. Work place rules could still be set to prevent drug use (especially while on the job). Also, considering no insurance provider covers you while under the influence now, I don't see why they would in the future. And dope: the prozzers will all be forced to take it, and factory workers will all take it.
As long as the people know the consequences of their actions, they'd be responsible for their own bodies. Just because you don't want to doesn't mean they don't want to. Most of those problems are caused by the black market effect. If it's illegal to even seek treatment for the condition, of course the condition is going to become terrible. If heroin was sold in safe needles and doses, you'd have less problems with a lot of those propaganda images. The problem isn't the drugs themselves rather the conditions surrounding the drugs.Do you really think people would be taking something someone cooked up in their shed if there was a safer, more effective, over the counter drug that's just as cheap (if not cheaper [mass production])? YES OF COURSE, only hepatitis was dangerous and AIDS! infection at needle point! dude, do you really think what you wrote? because do you know what heroin is? it is a very strong analgesic (make you feel really less your environment), increase your ocular tension (can give you glaucoma), slow your heart (you can have serious rhythm troubles, including heart stops!), and it's a very very strong respiratory depressor (you simply stop breathing when you fall asleep, because you get so high, so euphoric and happy in your head that you're body stop to think about breathing)! AND this is only short-term effects (I don't talk about mid and long-term effects).... all of this for what? 3h trip make you feel happy and euphoric? yuhuuuu, do you think that happy people, strong people, well psychological developed people need this thing to be happy? I'm ok for some drugs, but not for all for god sake! "black market black market" yes, legalize it to fight against black market, and it will be as simple as to get alcohol in US by asking an homeless to get some! do you think that every people on this earth will know "oh dude, it is heroin, don't take it before 18 and please, use clean spoon and needle" wtf dude, that is what you want to learn to your children? cannabis is super recreative, you chill with friends, grab a beer, get lazy on the sun with a good northern light reefer, but please dude, heroin... you just don't know what you're talking about... yes LSD should be fun once or twice "to discover his deeper mind (ahahaha)" (of everyday if you want to become schizoid), yes MDMA is super fun at parties, make you feel so hot and so connected to chicks, yes weed is super chill, make you so lazy, yes cocaïne give me a fucking high efficiency and control, but there is always a time where you get back to reality because that's where you live, not in your druggy dream... and what I love in your kind of people is that "we don't need no material world, happiness is in our heart, and it's so important to understand it" but don't you get that drugs are as material as could be a rolex? ahaha and do you understand that opening hard drugs for 21+ is opening the door for 16-21 also, oh no sorry, you have control for sure, you're shacking when you don't have your dime but "everything is under control" EDIT : and for people talking about "cigarettes and alcohol" what's the matter with these ones boyz? alcohol -> make the best parties of your life, make you discover yourself and get into a new age of your life! and I don't even talk about cigarettes... but no one of you think about dying people about hepatic-cellular insufficiency and cirrhosis, hepatocellular carcinoma, bronchic carcinoma, BPCO, spreading tumors... you make me laugh, really You have a lot of misinformation in your post. Statically speaking, states that have legalized marijuana has seen a decrease in teen usage. That argument is entirely nil. Obviously there are health concerns regarding more illicit drugs, but those can be reduced with proper and safe dosages. Also, if the counter-agent is sold OTC, there'd be way less chances of overdoses. I believe people should have the right to choose what they put into their own bodies. |
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scutzi128
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January 30, 2018, 09:18:17 PM |
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You have a lot of misinformation in your post. Statically speaking, states that have legalized marijuana has seen a decrease in teen usage. That argument is entirely nil.
Obviously there are health concerns regarding more illicit drugs, but those can be reduced with proper and safe dosages. Also, if the counter-agent is sold OTC, there'd be way less chances of overdoses.
I believe people should have the right to choose what they put into their own bodies.
Maybe, all my data come from Europe, and especially from France, where it is illegal. I also came many times to Holland (as it is the nearest place where it's authorized). I was a bit aggressive in my message, because it's a concern that I'm really linked to. I hope I didn't offended you. I agree with all of your ideas, about black market, danger about uses (asepsis, counter agent) and education. But there are drugs that aren't nothing to do with human being in a common sense. I mean, do you know a drug called "krokodil"? I take an extreme instance to make me understand easily. The thing is that people that are coming to this drug are already addict people, and as they are starve about the product they used to take, they take this one indeed. I let you google for effects that this one had. Now, I think there is really two kinds of drugs, recreative ones, that should be allowed, and dangerous ones, that aren't good at all. This is exactly like drugs (I mean medicine drugs, as beta blockers, immunosuppressors, NSAIDs, corticosteroids, ...) which all have benefits/risks balance. Doctors use these with the knowledge that they could be harmful, and because of that, they are always used to try to get the maximum benefits effects, with minus harmful effects in a special case. But the thing is, that, in this situation, drugs are necessary to cure a disease or a state. So, they take risks because they know about benefits, and they always do it in the best positive balance. I think it should be the same with drugs, but when it's recreational, it is only to fulfill a desire from the user, so there is no "indication" imo. No real situation that need to use these drugs. And there is still risks. But with dangerous ones (heroin for me is a really a nice instance), you don't have "enough" good effects to counter risks, and even mid/long terms effects (as inward-looking attitude, paranoia, psychotic effects, skins effects, cardiovascular effects, there is so many...) So yes, it is important to improve all the conditions to do it safely, but I'm afraid that it could "create" dependance that should be avoid in an other way. I mean, I don't really care that people try to smoke a joint. But that's a really different problem if they try a fix of heroin imo. But I don't want to make myself judge of the devil "it could create new dependance blablabla", I know the pros and the cons, I'm just thinking as a good father, and I want the best for my children. That's all. |
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VolgaSmart
Jr. Member
Offline
Activity: 378
Merit: 1
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January 31, 2018, 12:44:53 AM |
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Most of drugs are fun, but don't we have the most useless ones legalized? I'm speaking about alcohol and cigarettes.
I would much prefer to be in a room full of people who are stoned, rather than a room full of people who are drunk. Drunk people have a far greater tendency to create trouble, whereas those who are stoned are the exact opposite. |
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bluefirecorp_ (OP)
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January 31, 2018, 07:26:05 AM |
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You have a lot of misinformation in your post. Statically speaking, states that have legalized marijuana has seen a decrease in teen usage. That argument is entirely nil.
Obviously there are health concerns regarding more illicit drugs, but those can be reduced with proper and safe dosages. Also, if the counter-agent is sold OTC, there'd be way less chances of overdoses.
I believe people should have the right to choose what they put into their own bodies.
Maybe, all my data come from Europe, and especially from France, where it is illegal. I also came many times to Holland (as it is the nearest place where it's authorized). I was a bit aggressive in my message, because it's a concern that I'm really linked to. I hope I didn't offended you. I agree with all of your ideas, about black market, danger about uses (asepsis, counter agent) and education. But there are drugs that aren't nothing to do with human being in a common sense. I mean, do you know a drug called "krokodil"? I take an extreme instance to make me understand easily. The thing is that people that are coming to this drug are already addict people, and as they are starve about the product they used to take, they take this one indeed. I let you google for effects that this one had. Now, I think there is really two kinds of drugs, recreative ones, that should be allowed, and dangerous ones, that aren't good at all. This is exactly like drugs (I mean medicine drugs, as beta blockers, immunosuppressors, NSAIDs, corticosteroids, ...) which all have benefits/risks balance. Doctors use these with the knowledge that they could be harmful, and because of that, they are always used to try to get the maximum benefits effects, with minus harmful effects in a special case. But the thing is, that, in this situation, drugs are necessary to cure a disease or a state. So, they take risks because they know about benefits, and they always do it in the best positive balance. I think it should be the same with drugs, but when it's recreational, it is only to fulfill a desire from the user, so there is no "indication" imo. No real situation that need to use these drugs. And there is still risks. But with dangerous ones (heroin for me is a really a nice instance), you don't have "enough" good effects to counter risks, and even mid/long terms effects (as inward-looking attitude, paranoia, psychotic effects, skins effects, cardiovascular effects, there is so many...) So yes, it is important to improve all the conditions to do it safely, but I'm afraid that it could "create" dependance that should be avoid in an other way. I mean, I don't really care that people try to smoke a joint. But that's a really different problem if they try a fix of heroin imo. But I don't want to make myself judge of the devil "it could create new dependance blablabla", I know the pros and the cons, I'm just thinking as a good father, and I want the best for my children. That's all. I've never heard of that drug before "krokodil". I took the time and looked it up. Seems like a cheap knock off (10% the effectiveness), dangerous form of heroin ( codeine and iodine derived from over-the-counter medications and red phosphorus from match strikers - yeah, let's just cook that up in my back yard as opposed to just buying the $30 bottle of bills from the store). But when someone mentions drug use legalization, your first conclusion is addiction. Addition is a disease. Treating a disease is the job of public services (imho). >Doctors use these with the knowledge that they could be harmful. Doctors don't always know what's best (at least in America... once they've earned their education, there's no continuing education... so you get doctors still prescribing old antibotics..)... >Doctors use these with the knowledge that they could be harmful, and because of that, they are always used to try to get the maximum benefits effects, with minus harmful effects in a special case. Ah, maybe I'm confusing medical doctors with doctoral researchers? I'm not sure why a doctor of medicine would be studying long term effects of any one specific drug. Yes, the obvious short cases exists, but with street drugs, how can you be sure? >Now, I think there is really two kinds of drugs, recreative ones I agree. Nuclear waste isn't a drug just like tide pods aren't food. > that should be allowed, and dangerous ones, that aren't good at all. I think we can both agree that taking iodine and codeine and cooking it with red phosphorus wouldn't meet even the lowest of standards for drugs, just as mixing bleach and pepsi wouldn't make a good soft drink. >But with dangerous ones (heroin for me is a really a nice instance), you don't have "enough" good effects to counter risks, and even mid/long terms effects (as inward-looking attitude, paranoia, psychotic effects, skins effects, cardiovascular effects, there is so many...) No one's suggesting that one should become addicting to the drug after trying it... continued usage should be warned against, but nothing should prevent someone from purchasing it over the counter. If there's a need for it, people will figure it out... >So yes, it is important to improve all the conditions to do it safely, but I'm afraid that it could "create" dependance that should be avoid in an other way. There's so many things in the world that people can become addicting to or things that "create" a dependence in a person. Shame we remove gambling? Gaming? Porn? I mean, societies seemed to have tried and failed multiple times with these objects... >I mean, I don't really care that people try to smoke a joint. But that's a really different problem if they try a fix of heroin imo. You're right, fixing heroin requires fixing the system as a whole, however legalization and taxation to confront and hopefully solve the issue makes a lot more sense than keeping them entirely illegal and ignoring the problem. >But I don't want to make myself judge of the devil "it could create new dependance blablabla", I know the pros and the cons, If one piece of art is created due to someone being high, it's a win. Some people believe drugs enhance their performance (and studies can back that up). If a person wants to burn their candle of life twice as fast, why not let them? Obviously, they'd be responsible for their actions. > I'm just thinking as a good father, I've met some pretty terrible fathers out there, good on you for trying to be a good one. Make sure your child doesn't eat a tide pod, and you're doing pretty well compared to some  >I want the best for my children. Don't you want your child to grow up in a place where criminals are always people who they should be scared of rather than just those who like to take an occasional puff? >That's all. Come on now, there's more to you than just being a father =) |
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krigger
Sr. Member
Offline
Activity: 518
Merit: 250
Presale is live!
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January 31, 2018, 01:19:39 PM |
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If all drugs are legalized, it then means that poison is also legalized for some combination
of drugs have chemical output very harmful to health.Hence, legalizing all drugs could abet
poisoning and fatality from those who may fall victim to the pangs of such ''hard drugs''.There
should be absolute control to drugs people are permitted to use.
Bleach is already legal my dude. Problem is addiction and no one gets addicted to bleach. |
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cry4crypto
Member
Offline
Activity: 140
Merit: 35
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January 31, 2018, 04:24:52 PM |
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Problem is addiction and no one gets addicted to bleach.
Plenty of people are additcted to tobbaco and more importantly alcohol though and they're both legal and widely accepted by society. In fact, statistics related to alcohol abuse are far more terrifying than these related to drugs. See for yourself: http://www.cityvision.edu/drug-and-alcohol-abuse-facts-and-statisticsAlso, check the links I posted earlier, it's hard to argue with facts. Countries where drugs were legalized / decriminalized benefited from it in a variety of ways. Also, as for the claim that no one gets addicted to bleach, you must have not heard about this charming lady: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBfw5NMgizU |
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scutzi128
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January 31, 2018, 04:36:09 PM
Last edit: January 31, 2018, 04:56:16 PM by scutzi128 |
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If all drugs are legalized, it then means that poison is also legalized for some combination
of drugs have chemical output very harmful to health.Hence, legalizing all drugs could abet
poisoning and fatality from those who may fall victim to the pangs of such ''hard drugs''.There
should be absolute control to drugs people are permitted to use.
Bleach is already legal my dude. Problem is addiction and no one gets addicted to bleach. you're totally right, how many cases are reported for bleach addiction? cry4crypto, you show us ONE video of a people addict to bleach... do you think that alcohol/tobacco health issues are the same that bleach addict issues? do you think that they can be compared? __ people make comparaison without knowing basic facts... for instance here, they compared "tobacco population" and "alcohol population" to "hard drugs population"... do you they think that we are talking about same size population? same thing about so many factors... "2.5 million years of potential life lost (YPLL)" for alcohol abuse... why they don't quote it for hard drugs/even soft drugs? ok, imagine we have 300 million people addict on hard drug... 500 million peoples addict on alcohol/tobacco... your average life expectancy is 35A with hard drugs when it is 75A with alcohol or tobacco, and normal life expectancy is about 85A... 500 millions x 10 years of life lost in average = 5 billions of years lost 100 millions x 50 years of life lost in average = 5 billions of years lost ....  ? "Alcohol kills more teenagers than all other drugs combined. It is a factor in the three leading causes of death among 15- to 24-year-olds: accidents, homicides and suicides." -> are they as many people that take drugs, that people that alcohol? then how can you compare people dying from cause if they are 100x more people in one group? = you can't compare but if you do people (ppl dying from a cause/number of ppl involved with this cause), you will have an accurate factor to compare two populations... "Youth who drink are 7.5 times more likely to use other illegal drugs and fifty times more likely to use cocaine than young people who never drink. One survey found that 32% of the heavy drinkers over 12 were also illegal drug users." -> do we know how much people that use hard drugs are poly addicted to many substances? i can do for all of their argues... you just expose facts without possible comparaison in both population... what about costs for tobacco/alcohol? maybe because they are many many many more people in alcohol/tobacco population than in hard drug population? to compare 2 populations between them, you must discriminate them by same factor.... then you have to report the number of people dying of each cause by number of population... i see that people use many argues without having any basics in epidemologic _____________ let's make simple instance... you make a clinical essay on a new antibiotic for meningitidis allright, you take two populations, A population with 1000 peoples, that take usual antibiotic as described in medical literature and protocoles B population with 20 peoples, that try new antibiotics allright, you save 20 peoples from meningitidis in your B population, when you only save 1990 peoples in your A population. then you have 100% survive in B population with new antibiotic, and only 99,5% survive in A population with old one. can you conclude that the new antibiotic is superior to usual one?;-) |
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cry4crypto
Member
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Activity: 140
Merit: 35
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January 31, 2018, 04:44:42 PM |
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scutzi128, I see where you're coming from, but take one important factor into consideration: the fact that drugs are illegal in most of the countries doesn't mean they're not easily obtainable. Seriously, look at the statistics from Portugal or the Netherlands, they speak for themselves.
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scutzi128
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January 31, 2018, 04:51:33 PM
Last edit: January 31, 2018, 05:02:04 PM by scutzi128 |
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scutzi128, I see where you're coming from, but take one important factor into consideration: the fact that drugs are illegal in most of the countries doesn't mean they're not easily obtainable. Seriously, look at the statistics from Portugal or the Netherlands, they speak for themselves.
dude I'm totally right with you, and I even go more deep with what you said: every people that want a thing, will obtain this thing. nothing can stop a man from having what he want, even how much illegal it is. that's really interesting to talking with you cause you seems to be open minded... here are basics of epidemiology : http://apps.who.int/iris/bitstream/10665/43541/1/9241547073_eng.pdfI have many good literature but 100% are in french langage, look a bit about it, it's really interesting. |
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cry4crypto
Member
Offline
Activity: 140
Merit: 35
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January 31, 2018, 05:18:36 PM |
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cry4crypto, you show us ONE video of a people addict to bleach... do you think that alcohol/tobacco health issues are the same that bleach addict issues? do you think that they can be compared?
I really just brought up the video as a curiosity, I remember seeing that show on TV and managed to find a YT link to rub it in krigger's face as a joke Nobody in the right mind would seriously compare bleach addiction to alcohol/drug/tobbaco addction, obviously! Btw, thanks for the link, I will check it out! |
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scutzi128
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January 31, 2018, 05:57:05 PM |
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cry4crypto, you show us ONE video of a people addict to bleach... do you think that alcohol/tobacco health issues are the same that bleach addict issues? do you think that they can be compared?
I really just brought up the video as a curiosity, I remember seeing that show on TV and managed to find a YT link to rub it in krigger's face as a joke Nobody in the right mind would seriously compare bleach addiction to alcohol/drug/tobbaco addction, obviously! Btw, thanks for the link, I will check it out! aha np, just don't want other people to use it as an argue:p you're welcome mate |
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