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Author Topic: General trading tips and guidelines  (Read 152 times)
MadZ
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February 14, 2018, 04:26:43 AM
Merited by Harlot (6), EcuaMobi (2)
 #1

Overview:

One thing I've noticed during my time on these forums is that a good percentage of p2p scam accusations originate from the Marketplace sub-forums. Since there don't seem to be any solid guidelines on how to mitigate this risk apart from a note regarding escrow, I thought I'd create my own thread on the matter. The purpose of this thread is to outline what I believe to be best practice when trading in this section and how to avoid being scammed. Most of this is simply common sense, but perhaps it will be helpful to some.


Guidelines

1. Don't be afraid to ask for escrow, even if the buyer/seller has a trusted reputation. Any reputable trader will agree to this request, it should raise red flags if they are hesitant. Remember that there is no rush when trading, it is better to take a few extra hours or pay 1% more for the item you are buying if it means lowering your risk of being scammed. A good list of active forum escrows can be found here.

2. When conducting transactions via escrow, ensure that you are corresponding with the escrow themselves. Scammers will often pretend to be your escrow of choice by sending you a fake Skype or Email account. Only contact Bitcointalk forum escrows through details they have directly shared with you. If possible, request a PGP signed message, as most will provide one.

3. Check user feedback thoroughly. Not all scammers will appear with negative feedback at Default Trust level. Remember to look at untrusted feedback and see if there any negative ratings with substantial evidence. Untrusted feedback is often just as useful when determining who is untrustworthy.

Important note: User trust is not visible to guests. To guests who are reading this, I highly suggest you create a forum account before trading with anyone so you can see their feedback, especially if they are selling via auto-sell.

4. Be cautious when dealing with new accounts. Chances are there is a reason they created a fresh account, and those reasons usually aren't good.

5. Account rank and trust ratings do not necessarily indicate someone is more trustworthy. Forum accounts are frequently sold or hacked and used to scam users under the guise of previous good feedback or high activity level. Make sure to check your trading partner's most recent feedback as well as search their username in the security log. A recent password or email change might indicate that you are not dealing with the original account owner.

6. Be wary of self-moderated threads. These are generally only used to curate feedback and delete negative posts. The same is true of locked threads, if there is no obvious reason the thread is locked, assume it is to avoid negative reviews.

7. I strongly recommend against purchasing items through automated selling websites such as selly.gg or rocketr.net. Auto-sell links are no safer than p2p transactions, these websites make no guarantee you will receive the item you are purchasing. While these options appear more convenient and slightly safer than traditional trading, they are actually more risky.

Extreme caution should be used when dealing with users who sell via auto-sell links in conjunction with a locked self-moderated thread, these are almost exclusively scams.

8. If a deal is too good to be true, it probably is.

This thread is a work in progress, feel free to comment with any guidelines you think might be helpful. Will try to bump this thread when I can so it remains visible.

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jenia1
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February 14, 2018, 05:22:47 AM
 #2

you forgot the most important part.

do not correspond with escrows via e-mail. only scammers use e-mail and pretend they are the escrow. an escrow will always message from within the forum

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MadZ
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February 14, 2018, 06:17:45 AM
 #3

you forgot the most important part.

do not correspond with escrows via e-mail. only scammers use e-mail and pretend they are the escrow. an escrow will always message from within the forum

Added, very good point. If you do correspond with an escrow outside the forum, ask for a Bitcoin or PGP signed message as proof of identity.
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February 16, 2018, 05:27:56 AM
 #4

Guidelines

1. Don't be afraid to ask for escrow, even if the buyer/seller has a trusted reputation. Any reputable trader will agree to this request, it should raise red flags if they are hesitant. Remember that there is no rush when trading, it is better to take a few extra hours or pay 1% more for the item you are buying if it means lowering your risk of being scammed. A good list of active forum escrows can be found here.

6. Be wary of self-moderated threads. These are generally only used to curate feedback and delete negative posts. The same is true of locked threads, if there is no obvious reason the thread is locked, assume it is to avoid negative reviews.

SMH. I'll take the points out of order for aesthetic sense.

6: Self-moderated & locked threads are the first and second lines of combat against post count bumping, and varying degrees of BS/trolling even if no advertising is currently in place or being built up to. They don't curate trust pages where feedback & reviews belong at the bare minimum.

1:
I've noticed "self-escrowing" & escrows not keeping up/being able to keep up with their deals. I've noticed an escrow telling the victim terms for release, then when met, going back on them & not releasing, leaving it up to the perpetrator to authorize release.

I can't remember ever using a bitcoin escrow (and can't find it in my oldest ratings), not even when I was a noob, and I think I had enough foresight of how escrow could go bad back then, that my opposition to escrow has been consistent. I've missed out on deals recently because people still want me to go through an escrow or send first (if not use a fucking exchange that "loses" deposits, balances, withdrawals) in spite of all my ratings, length of ratings, and all my cryptographic links to those ratings (including enough meatspace info to get me murdered), when they have none or almost none.

Receiving positive trust ratings only seems to be an asset to those who don't/can't keep their word.

I hate debt.
If "I" ever ask for/offer a loan, assume my account is compromised. If "I" ever accept or offer escrow services, assume my account is compromised. If "I" ever recommend or say one positive word about an exchange, assume my account is compromised. If "I" ever get into campaign managing, assume my account is compromised.

Saying that you don't trust someone because of their behavior is completely valid.
MadZ
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March 11, 2018, 10:17:34 AM
 #5

Guidelines

1. Don't be afraid to ask for escrow, even if the buyer/seller has a trusted reputation. Any reputable trader will agree to this request, it should raise red flags if they are hesitant. Remember that there is no rush when trading, it is better to take a few extra hours or pay 1% more for the item you are buying if it means lowering your risk of being scammed. A good list of active forum escrows can be found here.

6. Be wary of self-moderated threads. These are generally only used to curate feedback and delete negative posts. The same is true of locked threads, if there is no obvious reason the thread is locked, assume it is to avoid negative reviews.

SMH. I'll take the points out of order for aesthetic sense.

6: Self-moderated & locked threads are the first and second lines of combat against post count bumping, and varying degrees of BS/trolling even if no advertising is currently in place or being built up to. They don't curate trust pages where feedback & reviews belong at the bare minimum.

1:
I've noticed "self-escrowing" & escrows not keeping up/being able to keep up with their deals. I've noticed an escrow telling the victim terms for release, then when met, going back on them & not releasing, leaving it up to the perpetrator to authorize release.

I can't remember ever using a bitcoin escrow (and can't find it in my oldest ratings), not even when I was a noob, and I think I had enough foresight of how escrow could go bad back then, that my opposition to escrow has been consistent. I've missed out on deals recently because people still want me to go through an escrow or send first (if not use a fucking exchange that "loses" deposits, balances, withdrawals) in spite of all my ratings, length of ratings, and all my cryptographic links to those ratings (including enough meatspace info to get me murdered), when they have none or almost none.

Receiving positive trust ratings only seems to be an asset to those who don't/can't keep their word.

I hate debt.
If "I" ever ask for/offer a loan, assume my account is compromised. If "I" ever accept or offer escrow services, assume my account is compromised. If "I" ever recommend or say one positive word about an exchange, assume my account is compromised. If "I" ever get into campaign managing, assume my account is compromised.

This thread is intended to provide advice for newer users. Any escrow linked above is far more trustworthy than your average forum user. Along a similar line, your average self moderated thread should be avoided. Yes, there are acceptions to this rule (ie. yourself); however, take a look at who else makes use of self-moderates threads. They are generally not to be trusted.
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March 15, 2018, 03:32:00 AM
 #6

Bump
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March 15, 2018, 05:44:55 AM
 #7

Very solid points, I agree there is no guideline/what to watch for topic yet, so it's good you made one!

Point 8 is probably the easiest indicator. As well as, Jenia1 gives a good comment. It's always dangerous to go for trades online to my experience, definitely keep your eyes open. Also, fake users tempt to be more 'impatient', wanting to rush the trade.

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March 15, 2018, 10:12:30 AM
 #8

You could also add one that I have found to be pretty accurate

If the sellers claims he sells from EU( for example) but on the post he writes the prices on $ or any other currency... Usually they are scammers

I have PM some of these guys and usually they are scams , as it makes no sense that if you live in a place with a currency, to only write the prices on another currency.

MadZ
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March 17, 2018, 04:24:05 AM
 #9

Very solid points, I agree there is no guideline/what to watch for topic yet, so it's good you made one!

Point 8 is probably the easiest indicator. As well as, Jenia1 gives a good comment. It's always dangerous to go for trades online to my experience, definitely keep your eyes open. Also, fake users tempt to be more 'impatient', wanting to rush the trade.


Very true, scammers usually don't want to wait the time it would take to receive a legitimate offer at normal prices. Unfortunately, people often let greed get the better of them and disregard these red flags.

You could also add one that I have found to be pretty accurate

If the sellers claims he sells from EU( for example) but on the post he writes the prices on $ or any other currency... Usually they are scammers

I have PM some of these guys and usually they are scams , as it makes no sense that if you live in a place with a currency, to only write the prices on another currency.



Can you elaborate on this some more please? I've bought things without issue from users who are not US based but advertised prices in USD.
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March 17, 2018, 11:44:37 PM
 #10

thank you for the tips, it would be great help for us who are still beginning to learn the crypto system.. hopefully, as the years/days past by, we can adopt/learn it to our advantage.
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March 20, 2018, 09:18:17 PM
 #11

I agree there is no guideline
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