[HAVELOCK] PETAMINE - 1,150 TH/S HASH RATE (1GH/S per Unit)

[cryptx]

Dear CryptX

Common sense and basic algebra.


1. How the number 0.00474B for this weeks dividend came about?
    I suppose it was calculated from the initial ("free") 20TH/s one weeks worth of work, i.e. approx 300B (even thou the PetaMine is  9.2TH/s as of now;so probably coming from your private earnings or reserves)?
 
2. Whats the running cost approximately?.

3. You are talking about reinvesting 35% of the net profit to increase the total PM hashing power.
Will it be upped regularly with every difficulty increase? Every week?(at least every month that's what your spreadsheet model says)
Does it mean the hashing power per share will increase proportionally to this reinvestment?(as the spreadsheet suggests, yet its not very clearly specified in your terms)

4. How exactly will this 35% reinvestment relate to the hashing power increase of PM? 35% of profits reinvested = X % increase in hashing power?
Whats in the spreadsheet is not enough to fight the difficulty and generate reasonable profits for too long.

5.Also if all 100k shares will become public, u add Another 100TH/s in December, does that mean 2GH/s/share by December (+all the compounded 35% reinvestments in Hashpower)??

6.I plugged more realistic growth of the HashPower of the whole network over time into your spreadsheet and the break even point moved to about June 2014 and the total profit per share shrunk to measly 0.068B after 40 months,i.e. approx 100% profit over 40 months (considering the over optimistic difficulty estimate I used + possibility of many other future unknowns in the BTC world the risk reward is not too good).

From all the above specifying that each share represents 1GH/s is clearly a bit misleading (since it is actually better than that).

thanks
f

1. We promised to start hashing at the end of September. The Bitburner Fury boards were not ready at that time (due to factors out of our control). Because of that we calculated a reasonable mining profit we could have made if we started mining at the end of September. So yes, the biggest part of the 300 BTC was paid out of our own pocket.

2. The first deployment of 20 TH/s at the end of September has a monthly total cost, including electricity, maintenance and hosting, of maximum 5,000$.

3. The spreadsheet model uses a fixed reinvestment percentage of 35%. (35% of an increasing number is always going to be higher) The 35% reinvestment policy can be changed when demanded by the market situation.

4. We will look for the best opportunities in the market to reinvest in. The 35% reinvestment pool of BTC will be used for this. There is no way to tell in advance how much X% in hashing power this will be.

5. I do not understand were the 2 GH/share comes from. 1 GH/share in December + 20TH/s now

6. Everybody has to make his own calculations since the ROI calculation is subject to a lot of unknowns.

I hope this gives you a better view on the situation.

Cheers

CryptX

[cryptx]

hashrate document with updates on deployment is nice, even better to have real time status. But you don't seem receptive to it. I do wonder about why hashrate goes down to 0 and up however, and also diff now is not 1919 but 2673?- these can make big difference to dividends

question for you
1) are board seats offered?
2) will you reserve ~16k shares privet? if not what is your other incentive to keep shares rising beyond ipo rate?

Hashrate = 0 because of technical problem + reorganisation
Difficulty = 267,730,000 (1919TH/s) until next change so mining income is calculated using current difficulty (1919)

1) We will look into this
2) 36,504 shares are in IPO, our first incentive is selling these shares, even after paying dividends to other shareholders

[ujka]

hashrate document with updates on deployment is nice, even better to have real time status. But you don't seem receptive to it. I do wonder about why hashrate goes down to 0 and up however, and also diff now is not 1919 but 2673?- these can make big difference to dividends

Column E in that spreadsheet is not difficulty, it's a number taken out of formula used to calculate BTC/day:
btcDay = myHashes / difficulty * 3600 * 600 / 2^32

Spreadsheet calculates column E as:
difficulty / (600 / 2^32 * 10^12), or, simplified: diffculty / 139500
(10^12 is in there because we are dealing with tera-hashes later in columns D and F)

[ishkur]

Well I'm happy to say I made a nice profit already from this.

Picked up quite a few on btct during the fire sale at the end. 

Friday collected dividend and sold  1/2

I'll jump back in when management has a real deployment plan

[dhenson]

Cryptx,

1) Now that the USD/BTC exchange rate is exploding and the mining hardware is priced in USD, the amount of hardware the mine is able to deploy should scale linearly with the btc/usd exchange rate (using IPO funds).  Could you please verify your plans in this regard?

2) What are your thoughts on the Cointerra tape-out delay. How will this effect roll-out plans?

3) Could you please update us on the status of the 20TH roll-out?

Thank you.

[cryptx]

Cryptx,

1) Now that the USD/BTC exchange rate is exploding and the mining hardware is priced in USD, the amount of hardware the mine is able to deploy should scale linearly with the btc/usd exchange rate (using IPO funds).  Could you please verify your plans in this regard?

2) What are your thoughts on the Cointerra tape-out delay. How will this effect roll-out plans?

3) Could you please update us on the status of the 20TH roll-out?

Thank you.

1) We always convert all received BTC's in fiat money, because we have to buy all mininq equipement in EUR/USD. This way we elimate the exchange risks involved. Even if the BTC rate would crash, we would still have to deploy the agreed GH/s.

2) According to Cointerra, they are still on schedule to deliver as promised. We have a hashrate protection in place if there are delays.
    (http://www.cryptx.com/faq/ look under "the insurance")

3) All boards are deployed now. However we are not able to reach the full 20 TH/s because of 2 reasons. First, we anticipated a higher hashrate per board after first tests had shown 4 GH/chip. Second, we have about 1 TH in broken boards and will try to get these fixed.

I hope this answers your questions;

[cryptx]

UPDATE 24/10/2013

http://eligius.st/~wizkid057/newstats/userstats.php/1KkMPX9oKxoYnb5DU2xCJDrgQF6r9g6jza


We would like to share our mining statistics with you (see link). Note that statistics are variable and not always reflect real time / accurate activity.

[bulltrap]

Cryptx,

1) Now that the USD/BTC exchange rate is exploding and the mining hardware is priced in USD, the amount of hardware the mine is able to deploy should scale linearly with the btc/usd exchange rate (using IPO funds).  Could you please verify your plans in this regard?

2) What are your thoughts on the Cointerra tape-out delay. How will this effect roll-out plans?

3) Could you please update us on the status of the 20TH roll-out?

Thank you.

1) We always convert all received BTC's in fiat money, because we have to buy all mininq equipement in EUR/USD. This way we elimate the exchange risks involved. Even if the BTC rate would crash, we would still have to deploy the agreed GH/s.

2) According to Cointerra, they are still on schedule to deliver as promised. We have a hashrate protection in place if there are delays.
    (http://www.cryptx.com/faq/ look under "the insurance")

3) All boards are deployed now. However we are not able to reach the full 20 TH/s because of 2 reasons. First, we anticipated a higher hashrate per board after first tests had shown 4 GH/chip. Second, we have about 1 TH in broken boards and will try to get these fixed.

I hope this answers your questions;

How about the reinvestment fund, will that be kept in usd or btc? I would think btc would make more sense as you could distribute the reinvestment fund to investors in case there are no reasonable options to expand the mine.

How are you planning to proceed with the reinvestment fund? What is the timescale of deploying hashing power and if there is no reasonable hardware investments to be made how long do you wait until distributing reinvestment fund to investors?

[hephaist0s]

UPDATE 24/10/2013

http://eligius.st/~wizkid057/newstats/userstats.php/1KkMPX9oKxoYnb5DU2xCJDrgQF6r9g6jza


We would like to share our mining statistics with you (see link). Note that statistics are variable and not always reflect real time / accurate activity.

Thank you, cryptx. And keep up the great work!

[dhenson]

Cryptx,

1) Now that the USD/BTC exchange rate is exploding and the mining hardware is priced in USD, the amount of hardware the mine is able to deploy should scale linearly with the btc/usd exchange rate (using IPO funds).  Could you please verify your plans in this regard?

2) What are your thoughts on the Cointerra tape-out delay. How will this effect roll-out plans?

3) Could you please update us on the status of the 20TH roll-out?

Thank you.

1) We always convert all received BTC's in fiat money, because we have to buy all mininq equipement in EUR/USD. This way we elimate the exchange risks involved. Even if the BTC rate would crash, we would still have to deploy the agreed GH/s.

2) According to Cointerra, they are still on schedule to deliver as promised. We have a hashrate protection in place if there are delays.
    (http://www.cryptx.com/faq/ look under "the insurance")

3) All boards are deployed now. However we are not able to reach the full 20 TH/s because of 2 reasons. First, we anticipated a higher hashrate per board after first tests had shown 4 GH/chip. Second, we have about 1 TH in broken boards and will try to get these fixed.

I hope this answers your questions;

Although unfortunate, I can understand the business reasons behind converting to fiat.  Thank you very much for posting the Eligius stats page URL, that should alleviate any fears that people had regarding using IPO funds to pay dividends.

I'm sure you are used to it by now, but after many bitcoin investment fiasco's, we shareholders are currently very distrusting.  I have found your actions so far to be very trustworthy and above board, thank you for the responses.

[Ashitank]

So with 16 Th/s mine each share is mining @ ~250 mh/s

[dhenson]

The 20 GH was an added bonus to spur ipo sales.  The base rate per share is 1 GH in december.

[hephaist0s]

Dividend received today of 0.00236235, or 3.63%. Great stuff.

[cryptx]

Dear shareholders,


We are going to issue a vote on cryptostocks.com about a possible hardware sale.

We like you to choose between continue mining with the existing hardware (+/- 16 TH/s) or sale of current hardware through our website www.asic-hardware.com

We anticipate to collect about 1000 BTC in the hardware sale. This will result in a one time dividend of about 20%-25%.

During the sale of the hardware, we will keep mining the equipement and keep paying dividends each friday of the mined BTC's.

This to outweigh if a one time dividend of hardware sale will return more than combined mining dividends.


Please vote here:
https://cryptostocks.com/securities/52/voterequests

[Digi7ech]

Can you explain this.^

Do you have new hardware in place? getting new hardware very soon?
Selling ALL current hardware?

Why sell? are you going to use the fund to purchase more efficient hardware? that is currently available? or pre-order scenario?

[cryptx]

Can you explain this.^

Do you have new hardware in place? getting new hardware very soon?
Selling ALL current hardware?

Why sell? are you going to use the fund to purchase more efficient hardware? that is currently available? or pre-order scenario?

The hardware that is hashing now, is an extra incentive given by CryptX to their shareholders. The actual mine will be deployed in December at 1 GH/share.

We want our shareholders to have the choice between collecting a weekly dividend of mining income or a one-time hardware sale dividend. (The hardware we sell is the Bitfury mine we have running now, not the hardware we are going to deploy in December.)

Each shareholder can make his/her own calculations and conclude what suits him/her the best.

Votes can be placed here:
https://cryptostocks.com/securities/52

[BenTuras]

I'll give it a try:

16TH = 16000GH. Each Furyburner board is 50GH, so around 320 boards available.
1000BTC/320=3.125BTC/board, around €600 which is a steep price in my opinion.

Selling:
25% available for dividend: 250BTC one time, then nothing till december mine comes operational.

Continue to mine:
164BTC mined during next 8 days
Then difficulty rise of +/- 40%, mine 9 days +/- 128BTC
Then difficulty rise of +/- 40%, mine 9 days +/- 91BTC
Then difficulty rise of +/- 40%, mine 9 days +/- 65BTC
Then difficulty rise of +/- 40%, mine 9 days +/- 47BTC
Then difficulty rise of +/- 40%, mine 9 days +/- 33BTC

All of the above might be too positive, but the answer is clear to me: continue to mine so I voted NO!

(I based my calculations on http://bitcoinwisdom.com/bitcoin/difficulty)

Please shoot holes in my estimate above, I am only human  

[cryptx]

I'll give it a try:

16TH = 16000GH. Each Furyburner board is 50GH, so around 320 boards available.
1000BTC/320=3.125BTC/board, around €600 which is a steep price in my opinion.

Selling:
25% available for dividend: 250BTC one time, then nothing till december mine comes operational.

Continue to mine:
164BTC mined during next 8 days
Then difficulty rise of +/- 40%, mine 9 days +/- 128BTC
Then difficulty rise of +/- 40%, mine 9 days +/- 91BTC
Then difficulty rise of +/- 40%, mine 9 days +/- 65BTC
Then difficulty rise of +/- 40%, mine 9 days +/- 47BTC
Then difficulty rise of +/- 40%, mine 9 days +/- 33BTC

All of the above might be too positive, but the answer is clear to me: continue to mine so I voted NO!

(I based my calculations on http://bitcoinwisdom.com/bitcoin/difficulty)

Please shoot holes in my estimate above, I am only human  

VERY IMPORTANT NUANCE

We will give a 100% dividend to shareholders!

20-25% is the ratio between one time dividend and share price:

• 1000 BTC in hardware sale
• 63496 shares
• dividend = 0.01575 BTC
• or 24% of original IPO price
• or 28% of today's price

[BenTuras]

The selling price of €600 is way too optimistic.
More and more people realize there is no ROI in high priced mining hardware.
More realistic is €250 per board, so that means 416BTC in one time dividend.
Continue to mine for the next 5 difficulty periods could bring in 528BTC.

I took a hefty 40% increase in difficulty to prevent being overly optimistic.
If I am too pessimistic, it could even be more than 528BTC.

Taking 40, 37, 34, 32, 30, ... is thinking too positive IMHO.
Many vendors are close to releasing new hardware.

I stand by my choice of No.

[bulltrap]

The selling price of €600 is way too optimistic.
More and more people realize there is no ROI in high priced mining hardware.
More realistic is €250 per board, so that means 416BTC in one time dividend.
Continue to mine for the next 5 difficulty periods could bring in 528BTC.

I took a hefty 40% increase in difficulty to prevent being overly optimistic.
If I am too pessimistic, it could even be more than 528BTC.

Taking 40, 37, 34, 32, 30, ... is thinking too positive IMHO.
Many vendors are close to releasing new hardware.

I stand by my choice of No.

There is no hardware cheaper than this available to be bought immediately. Also they are not auctioning the boards so if they can't sell for the price they are asking they will just continue hashing. I think there is nothing to lose by trying to sell.