Can MasterCoin threads please be moved to the alt coins section?

[Mike Hearn]

There are quite a lot of them in e.g. project development.

[tysat]

Isn't MasterCoin built on top of Bitcoin?  Maybe there needs to be a section for stuff like that, because altcoins seems like the wrong place.

[Akka]

Isn't MasterCoin built on top of Bitcoin?  Maybe there needs to be a section for stuff like that, because altcoins seems like the wrong place.

Like "Alternative Blockchain Uses".

I would be all for that. But a single Project IMO isn't enough to justify a separate Board.

[theymos]

Isn't MasterCoin built on top of Bitcoin?  Maybe there needs to be a section for stuff like that, because altcoins seems like the wrong place.

Namecoin is partially built on top of Bitcoin. Does that make it not an alt coin?

[tysat]

Isn't MasterCoin built on top of Bitcoin?  Maybe there needs to be a section for stuff like that, because altcoins seems like the wrong place.

Namecoin is partially built on top of Bitcoin. Does that make it not an alt coin?

I would argue that separate blockchain = altcoin.  I honestly know very little about MasterCoin, but it is built on top of the Bitcoin protocol and not a new blockchain, right?

[BadBear]

There are quite a lot of them in e.g. project development.

None of us care about mastercoin and have very little idea what it is, elaborate please, and why it isn't relevant to bitcoin. Keep in mind there's really only...3, maybe 4 people (including me) who can/will do anything about it.

 I honestly know very little about MasterCoin, but it is built on top of the Bitcoin protocol and not a new blockchain, right?

This is about the extent of my knowledge of it as well, beyond that I have no clue what it is, or what it does, or why I should care, or not care about it. This isn't the first complaint though, so I'd like to see this get hashed out one way or another, so we can be fair. Nobody has cared enough to do that up to this point, and nothing will change until that changes.

I'll give my quick impression of it here and why I've left the threads so far. My impression of it is that mastercoin is like a service that uses the bitcoin blockchain, like ripple is to xrp?  It seems relevant enough for the bitcoin forum based on that, though my impression is likely flawed.

[malevolent]

7 out of 40 topics on the first page in Project Development are in some way related to Mastercoin. Is that too many many? Maybe there should be a sticky similar to the one in the Gambling section?

Mastercoin is more like Colored Coins or Bitshares (less centralized) than Ripple though it's in its early stages and anything can change. Should they decide to move away from the Bitcoin blockchain and start their own one (it is a possibility) then I think it would be perfectly reasonable to have Mastercoin topics moved to Alternate cryptocurrencies.

[qwk]

Absolutely, there's an ongoing discussion about this here.

[Mike Hearn]

I don't think technical details really matter. MasterCoin tries to embed its own data into the bitcoin block chain, a rather controversial approach, but it is definitely an alt coin and not bitcoin - as the name implies.

[jackjack]

The amounts/balances/syntaxes/etc are no way related to the ones in bitcoin
Seems enough for me to define it as an alternative coin

Would you talk about a dog flea (its characteristics, digestive system, sub-species) on a dog forum?

[qwk]

I'll just quote myself from the other thread (I'm lazy )

No, seriously, this is the old librarian's problem, where should I put a book about "cooking with physics"? Cook book or Physics?

You're absolutely right that Mastercoin is not an Altcoin in the traditional sense.
On the other hand, it's also not exactly Bitcoin.

Look at it from the perspective of the average user of bitcointalk.org.
He (or she) is probably interested in reading about Bitcoin. Period.
Right now he's overwhelmed by the abundance of info on Bitcoin itself, all the nifty little gadgets, services, gory technical details, political discussion about it.
And that's when you throw something like "Mastercoin" at him. He won't understand it, he won't want to hear about it, he won't be interested at all. And he's absolutely right in not wanting to read about Mastercoin, I mean, why would he?

Some people might be aware that I personally am a (cautious) supporter of the Mastercoin project, and even I find myself thinking "not another Mastercoin thread " at times.

I think the Mastercoin supporters should accept the fact that the majority of bitcointalk.org readers don't want to hear about it, and that it's their absolute right not to have to. So, off to a forum section that can be easily ignored it is for us!

In lack of a better alternative, and seriously, not having the number of users right now to request a new top-level-forum, the most pragmatic solution is the Altcoin forum.

[coinbird]

Isn't MasterCoin built on top of Bitcoin?  Maybe there needs to be a section for stuff like that, because altcoins seems like the wrong place.

Like "Alternative Blockchain Uses".

I would be all for that. But a single Project IMO isn't enough to justify a separate Board.

+1
That would be perfect imo. Also moving the topics to the altcoin forum will possibly lead to confusion between SHA256 mastercoin (MSC) build on top of the blockchain and the scrypt mastercoin (MST).

[jackjack]

Also moving the topics to the altcoin forum will possibly lead to confusion between SHA256 mastercoin (MSC) build on top of the blockchain and the scrypt mastercoin (MST).

That's their problem, this should not influence the decision

[justusranvier]

 I honestly know very little about MasterCoin, but it is built on top of the Bitcoin protocol and not a new blockchain, right?

This is about the extent of my knowledge of it as well, beyond that I have no clue what it is, or what it does, or why I should care, or not care about it. This isn't the first complaint though, so I'd like to see this get hashed out one way or another, so we can be fair. Nobody has cared enough to do that up to this point, and nothing will change until that changes.

The Mastercoin project is an experiment in crowdfunding.

Mastercoins themselves are just an instance of colored coins created in a particular way.

The business model:

1) Programmers create some mastercoins for themselves in a process that isn't quite premining since the public is allow to participate as well.

2) Speculators bid up the price of mastercoins, allowing the programmers to fund the development of new services by selling their mastercoins.

3) The new services will all be paid for in mastercoins, not bitcoins.

4) Users will flock to these services, which means they have to buy mastercoins from the speculators.

5) Since these services are so wonderful and useful, the price of mastercoin relative to bitcoin will reach some stable value.

Note that nothing about these services inherently require special colored coins - that's a feature built into them for the benefit of developers and speculators.

In fact, any of these services which are open source could be trivially modified to not require mastercoins at all.

The Mastercoin promoters believe that the Mastercoin developers will have stronger incentives so will always be able to compete successfully with services which work directly with Bitcoin.

The entire premise of Mastercoin rests on whether or not Mastercoin developers can create services so good, and which nobody else can replicate, that users will be willing to buy an entirely different currency just to get access to them.

If that doesn't happen, the entire experiment falls apart.

[qwk]

The Mastercoin project is an experiment in crowdfunding.
[...]
The Mastercoin promoters believe that the Mastercoin developers will have stronger incentives so will always be able to compete successfully with services which work directly with Bitcoin.

That pretty much sums it up.
Or, even shorter, it's commercial software for colored coins.

[theymos]

Perhaps Mastercoin threads that are mostly about the Mastercoin currency should be in alt cryptocurrencies, but Mastercoin threads mostly about other Mastercoin-managed assets should be elsewhere.

[qwk]

Perhaps Mastercoin threads that are mostly about the Mastercoin currency should be in alt cryptocurrencies, but Mastercoin threads mostly about other Mastercoin-managed assets should be elsewhere.

No, that might make sense from a "technical" point of view.
From the users' perspective, though, it's pretty much "I want to read about Mastercoin" or "I don't".

With one Mastercoin-subforum, people could simply ignore that one.

[Raoul Duke]

I would appreciate some guidelines on how to deal with Mastercoin threads. The confusion has showed itself lately, indeed...

[dacoinminster]

We really want our own subforum, although it need not be mastercoin-specific - just an area for projects using the bitcoin block-chain for interesting stuff.

[justusranvier]

Perhaps Mastercoin threads that are mostly about the Mastercoin currency should be in alt cryptocurrencies, but Mastercoin threads mostly about other Mastercoin-managed assets should be elsewhere.

No, that might make sense from a "technical" point of view.
From the users' perspective, though, it's pretty much "I want to read about Mastercoin" or "I don't".

With one Mastercoin-subforum, people could simply ignore that one.

I'd be happy with a Mastercoin subforum in either "Service Discussion" or "Alt Cryptocurrencies"