Latest "China" *announcement* carefull "FUD"...& coindesk continued it??

[Doublelucky]

People on here still think it's just a rumour? lol denial

[dontek]

People on here still think it's just a rumour? lol denial

You have any proof? Other than 2 deleted messages and a bunch of blogs referring to those 2 deleted messages and "friends" as sources?

[TheJacob]

People on here still think it's just a rumour? lol denial

Aside from that article on coindesk and their "sources" what proof is there that anything has actually happened?

Its been hours now. Either those sources are being very tightlipped or its all fabricated.

[thecomputerscientist]

People on here still think it's just a rumour? lol denial

Aside from that article on coindesk and their "sources" what proof is there that anything has actually happened?

Its been hours now. Either those sources are being very tightlipped or its all fabricated.

If the rumours are untrue, then this almost qualifies as the biggest panic since the broadcast of "War of the Worlds" in U.S. 1938

[AnonyMint]

I see no problem with that, who cares if Chinese can't buy Bitcoins, the price will go down, we'll buy more coins and they'll be late to the party. What do you expect from a dictatorial government anyway?

From what I can glean from a very bad google translate Bitcoin and the exchanges aren't being banned.

It is the third party payment comapnies - in other words if you withdrawing bitcoin from an exchange account it has to go into your bank account directly.

Though I might be wrong because of the wording about the spring festival - but in my unqualified opinion the chinese are still in Bitcoin quite legally as long as they don't use any stop gaps between the exchange and their bank...

How can you move bitcoins into a bank account?

Wiring funds to and from BTC China's bank account.

This rumor only affects the 3rd party payment companies, not the banks.

This rumor doesn't add anything that wasn't already in that official document from China. The 3rd party payment processors were already banned from Bitcoin in the recent official document from China.

This panic selloff is probably a buying opportunity.

[Equilux]

http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1s61x1/what_the_actual_chinese_notice_not_summary_says/

[ORE]

I sense a buying opportunity.  

[GoldWater]

In Las Vegas last week, the CEO of BTC China - BOBBY LEE - was talking to everyone and explained that the Chinese Government has determined that the financial banking institutions in China will not get involved in Bitcoin. Banking institutions in China will stick to banking local currency, period.
Banks will not get involved in Bitcoin transactions.

OK! But what does it REALLY mean?

China recognizes Bitcoin as a "virtual asset" (which it is), not a currency (which it really isn't), and is allowing this new virtual asset economy to grow with new and upcoming companies, like BTC CHINA.
It is not banning Bitcoin.
SO what Bobby Lee was explaining, was how great this is because it will allow new types of companies to fill this void and business space, that the banking institutions cannot get involved with.

YES, this makes it a little bit more challenging to become involved with Bitcoin in China, RIGHT NOW-TODAY, but not forever, and not for very long...
This is the real opportunity in China, because new companies and technologies will be developed and created to fulfill these needs and new services.

If the financial institutions control the Bitcoin economy in any country, this whole thing has failed....so THIS IS REALLY A GOOD THING.

People are just panicking because there is so much disinformation being generated by these blogs that have zero credibility. Furthermore, Bitcoin is bigger than China, and this whole fiasco is only temporary...

[qiwoman]

I'd say it was a scam to drop the price low so some whales could get some cheap coins!

I totally agree that it could be a noob trap to get panic selling going. This is what has been happening for centuries in the traditional financial markets so as long as Bitcoin is primarily another speculation coin it is going to happen here so the Rich can hoard even more coin and fleece the inexperienced panic sellers yet again.

[GoldWater]

I'd say it was a scam to drop the price low so some whales could get some cheap coins!

I totally agree that it could be a noob trap to get panic selling going. This is what has been happening for centuries in the traditional financial markets so as long as Bitcoin is primarily another speculation coin it is going to happen here so the Rich can hoard even more coin and fleece the inexperienced panic sellers yet again.

I think what we all need to remember is that WE practically run this thing. Obviously this is an exaggeration, but Bitcoin is STILL so new, and the people here on this forum are at the forefront of it all, AND the miners. Mass media will be mass media, but I guarantee that we the people will not let this thing fail...

[Zangelbert Bingledack]

It's been around 12 hours since I woke up to something happening and some information about how the Chinese government is treating bitcoin from some sources, and I still have no clue what's going on.  LOL

Looks like someone noticed the immense information gap between China and the rest of the world, based on how much confusion the PBOC announcement caused, and is exploiting it to manipulate the market during this slow holiday season. Yet another round of cheap coins for those astute enough not to fall for it. Enjoy!

[seriouscoin]

It's been around 12 hours since I woke up to something happening and some information about how the Chinese government is treating bitcoin from some sources, and I still have no clue what's going on.  LOL

Looks like someone noticed the immense information gap between China and the rest of the world, based on how much confusion the PBOC announcement caused, and is exploiting it to manipulate the market during this slow holiday season. Yet another round of cheap coins for those astute enough not to fall for it. Enjoy!

Deep pockets are buying all the coins on GOX.

I'm actually surprised where all the fiat came from..... it must be from US exposure and real investors come it.

Ppl will find who those big players are.... just like how they're shocked to hear Richard Branson has millions worth of BTC.

[lindatess]

It isn't FUD. 

It's real, alipay and the other payment providers and financial institutions are not allowed to deal with the bitcoin exchanges anymore.

I told you guys the legal document was open for interpretation.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=358368.0;all

[GoldWater]

It isn't FUD. 

It's real, alipay and the other payment providers and financial institutions are not allowed to deal with the bitcoin exchanges anymore.

I told you guys the legal document was open for interpretation.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=358368.0;all

Financial institutions deal with currency, and the Chinese government wants to keep it that way.

Bitcoin Exchanges and related companies deal with Bitcoin, and the Chinese government wants to proceed this way.


It's only clarification of separation between THESE businesses, not Bitcoin in general.

[Melbustus]

It isn't FUD. 

It's real, alipay and the other payment providers and financial institutions are not allowed to deal with the bitcoin exchanges anymore.

I told you guys the legal document was open for interpretation.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=358368.0;all

Financial institutions deal with currency, and the Chinese government wants to keep it that way.

Bitcoin Exchanges and related companies deal with Bitcoin, and the Chinese government wants to proceed this way.


It's only clarification of separation between THESE businesses, not Bitcoin in general.

Agreed. A big part of the motivation is probably to stem potential capital flight out of China via bitcoin. Not there was likely much of that going on, but the gov probably wants to get out ahead of matters. Which means eliminating layers of financial intermediaries that could obscure identity (hence why "payment processors" might not be allowed to interact with bitcoin exchanges, but banks are ok).

All in all, it will probably indeed dampen the mania to some degree, but it's by no means as hostile as many are making it out to be.

For the record, we can fully expect governments everywhere to demand the equivalent of AML/KYC, which is more or less what this China action likely amounts to (though more rigidly). That AML/KYC status-quo permeates the global financial system; not just the US.

[dmartig]

http://www.businessinsider.com/china-bitcoin-crackdown-intensifies-2013-12

[pand70]

If the rumor is false why all those chinese people over at btcchina are selling like crazy? And why btcchina haven't made a statement already saying that this is FUD?

[AnonyMint]

It isn't FUD.  

It's real, alipay and the other payment providers and financial institutions are not allowed to deal with the bitcoin exchanges anymore.

I told you guys the legal document was open for interpretation.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=358368.0;all

Financial institutions deal with currency, and the Chinese government wants to keep it that way.

Bitcoin Exchanges and related companies deal with Bitcoin, and the Chinese government wants to proceed this way.


It's only clarification of separation between THESE businesses, not Bitcoin in general.

Agreed. A big part of the motivation is probably to stem potential capital flight out of China via bitcoin. Not there was likely much of that going on, but the gov probably wants to get out ahead of matters. Which means eliminating layers of financial intermediaries that could obscure identity (hence why "payment processors" might not be allowed to interact with bitcoin exchanges, but banks are ok).

All in all, it will probably indeed dampen the mania to some degree, but it's by no means as hostile as many are making it out to be.

Bingo!

Good to see you all are starting to understand finally.

For the record, we can fully expect governments everywhere to demand the equivalent of AML/KYC, which is more or less what this China action likely amounts to (though more rigidly). That AML/KYC status-quo permeates the global financial system; not just the US.

Yes and they will collect capital gains and/or VAT taxes on Bitcoin appreciation as an investment even if you are trying to use it as a currency (medium-of-exchange), thus it can not be a currency.

But developers of altcoins will rise to the opportunity and create truly anonymous coins. Anoncoin isn't it. Bitcoin isn't it. I will soon publish a whitepaper to explain why.

In short, you need to understand that Chaum mix-nets (e.g. Tor) are vulnerable to timing attacks, and even honeypotting given only 3 hops. They NSA and spy agencies in each country are likely still able to track your identity much of the time. And VPNs are likely all controlled/backdoored/hacked/rooted by the NSA. And exchanging through mixers and altcoins does not obscure your IP address no matter how many times you do it. Also even across these proxies, your identity is tracked in other ways such as browser plugins trojans, cookies, patterns of internet uses such as favored search terms, facbook et al tracking the way you type, etc..

Even if you are one of the lucky few who manages to keep your anonymity assured by careful mix of the above methods, the point is the majority will not. And thus it is very simple for the government to make your anonymous coins practically unspendable and useless. The government simply sends a tax bill and put criminal liability for all activity on a coin since mining until present, until those non-anonymous coins holders (or former holders) can provide the identity of whom they bought from and sold to.

Thus all users will become afraid and only accept coins and sell coins from those who provide their complete identity. Thus only a coin with widespread assured anonymity would be able to become a currency and remain immune to government control.

So clearly you can see that you never will have anonymity with Bitcoin nor any current altcoins. Thus Bitcoin and the current altcoins can never be currencies (unless the governments take them over somehow and make them legal tender), and the government will essentially control them.

Note one means anonymity I proposed thus far are a new way to do physical crypto-coins.

[jubalix]

It isn't FUD.  

It's real, alipay and the other payment providers and financial institutions are not allowed to deal with the bitcoin exchanges anymore.

I told you guys the legal document was open for interpretation.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=358368.0;all

Financial institutions deal with currency, and the Chinese government wants to keep it that way.

Bitcoin Exchanges and related companies deal with Bitcoin, and the Chinese government wants to proceed this way.


It's only clarification of separation between THESE businesses, not Bitcoin in general.

Agreed. A big part of the motivation is probably to stem potential capital flight out of China via bitcoin. Not there was likely much of that going on, but the gov probably wants to get out ahead of matters. Which means eliminating layers of financial intermediaries that could obscure identity (hence why "payment processors" might not be allowed to interact with bitcoin exchanges, but banks are ok).

All in all, it will probably indeed dampen the mania to some degree, but it's by no means as hostile as many are making it out to be.

Bingo!

Good to see you all are starting to understand finally.

For the record, we can fully expect governments everywhere to demand the equivalent of AML/KYC, which is more or less what this China action likely amounts to (though more rigidly). That AML/KYC status-quo permeates the global financial system; not just the US.

Yes and they will collect capital gains and/or VAT taxes on Bitcoin appreciation as an investment even if you are trying to use it as a currency (medium-of-exchange), thus it can not be a currency.

But developers of altcoins will rise to the opportunity and create truly anonymous coins. Anoncoin isn't it. Bitcoin isn't it. I will soon publish a whitepaper to explain why.

In short, you need to understand that Chaum mix-nets (e.g. Tor) are vulnerable to timing attacks, and even honeypotting given only 3 hops. They NSA and spy agencies in each country are likely still able to track your identity much of the time. And VPNs are likely all controlled/backdoored/hacked/rooted by the NSA. And exchanging through mixers and altcoins does not obscure your IP address no matter how many times you do it. Also even across these proxies, your identity is tracked in other ways such as browser plugins trojans, cookies, patterns of internet uses such as favored search terms, facbook et al tracking the way you type, etc..

Even if you are one of the lucky few who manages to keep your anonymity assured by careful mix of the above methods, the point is the majority will not. And thus it is very simple for the government to make your anonymous coins practically unspendable and useless. The government simply sends a tax bill and put criminal liability for all activity on a coin since mining until present, until those non-anonymous coins holders (or former holders) can provide the identity of whom they bought from and sold to.

Thus all users will become afraid and only accept coins and sell coins from those who provide their complete identity. Thus only a coin with widespread assured anonymity would be able to become a currency and remain immune to government control.

So clearly you can see that you never will have anonymity with Bitcoin nor any current altcoins. Thus Bitcoin and the current altcoins can never be currencies (unless the governments take them over somehow and make them legal tender), and the government will essentially control them.

emunie solves the anonymity problem

[coastermonger]

Just going to ask the obvious here.  So if 3rd party financial institutions are banned from working with bitcoin exchanges, and so are banks, then how do people move fiat into and out of the exchanges?

I feel like something was lost in translation here.  Either the chinese exchanges are going to basically die, or a there's a bit of a misunderstanding and they can still be used by another route.  

Another problem is that many here have a very vested emotional interest in a biased interpretation of the news.  Cold hard facts would be nice.