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Author Topic: Hard Numbers On How Much Money a Merchant Would Save If They Used Bitcoins  (Read 1569 times)
jimbobway
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August 28, 2011, 08:21:00 AM
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If I were to convince a merchant on how much they would save if they accepted bitcoins instead of credit card or paypal, the merchant may like to know dollar amounts of savings for their business.

I've heard 1-2% transaction fee charges for credit card or for using paypal.  But, I would like to know if anyone can give real dollar amounts of actual bitcoin savings.  I think companies like bit-pay.com could use this information as a marketing advantage.

Does anyone have any idea?

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SgtSpike
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August 28, 2011, 08:31:40 AM
 #2

https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_display-fees-outside
http://www.mastercard.com/us/merchant/pdf/MasterCard_Interchange_Rates_and_Criteria.pdf

Also, some credit cards tack on huge fees if you are missing the billing address and/or the security code when you run the card.  Like in amounts of $5.00 or so per transaction.
o
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August 28, 2011, 08:39:24 AM
 #3

It is difficult for them to advertise the low fee aspect because the fluctuation and exchange fee may take up 2% or may be more to reduce their rise. A better way is to advertise it the payment method can hide the credit card information like the bit-pay and attract international customers so that they can earn more.
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August 28, 2011, 08:47:35 AM
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I think bitcoin needs to be more upfront about its fees. Fees are inevitable, but bitcoin fees are so low that this comparison between visa/paypal must be made from the off.
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August 28, 2011, 09:05:11 AM
 #5

Here in Australia - some merchant bank accounts have a monthly fee irrespective of transactions too e.g $35/Month.
For a the really small scale merchant - or those starting out or just testing an idea.. this can make a difference.

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August 28, 2011, 10:56:47 AM
 #6

Don't forget to calculate in the fees the merchant will have to pay to the exchange he uses to insta-exchange bitcoins to a real currency and the wire-transfer fees.

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August 28, 2011, 03:16:08 PM
 #7

It is better to try and sell on the fact that random* bitcoin users get the fees instead of giant evil corporations.

* Not really, the biggest mining pools will become the big evil corps eventually. But there is a slight chance still for small miners I guess.
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August 28, 2011, 03:55:29 PM
 #8

Wouldn't the merchant be more likely to know who much they spend on CC and related fees than you or we would?

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August 28, 2011, 04:38:16 PM
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iv herd for some online retailers, its sometimes as high as 10%, and dont forget chargebacks. if you get chargebacked too much, then they can even drop you, so its a double lose.

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August 28, 2011, 06:06:22 PM
 #10

Extreme cases: international purchases
- 2% forex spread from buyer currency to USD/EUR (seller currency)
- 2%-8% wire transfer fee, or ~20 USD SEPA, or 0.5$+2.5% Paypal, or 0.5..1.5$ flat fee or 10-20$ a month + 1.5-3.5% CC merchant fees

So for a 100$ item, a buyer might pay at least 104$, or 122$, or 105.5$, or 104.5$, depending on chosen solution.

For a 100 BTC item (~10x the value) a buyer will pay 100 BTC, or if he has complex transactions, 100.0005 BTC, or whatever the fee will be set. Also this money arrives in your private pocket in ~5 minutes. Also he can't charge back, you don't need to pay insurance fees or charge-back fees on your processors, and you don't need to wait days or weeks to get the funds transferred in your private account/pocket.

Basically, you can confirm a purchase and complete a transaction in the time it takes you to have a proper bathroom break, if you use bitcoin.
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August 28, 2011, 06:11:47 PM
 #11

Basically, you can confirm a purchase and complete a transaction in the time it takes you to have a proper bathroom break, if you use bitcoin.
In that time.. you could probably even spend it with another merchant!


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BombaUcigasa
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August 28, 2011, 06:17:47 PM
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Basically, you can confirm a purchase and complete a transaction in the time it takes you to have a proper bathroom break, if you use bitcoin.
In that time.. you could probably even spend it with another merchant!


How could you spend it with another merchant if it's already confirmed in the blockchain?
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August 28, 2011, 06:29:07 PM
 #13

although on the long run the fees are the biggest selling point merchants maybe, for now with the high volatility and the little use of bitcoins for the merchant (he has to gox the BTC to $ and sepa them to his account) I would emphasise the extra turnover through bitcoin users. in every big city in the world, the first fast food restaurants to accept bitcoin with quality burgers will surely do some 200$ extra sales per month. same with hair dressers etc.

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August 28, 2011, 07:27:50 PM
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Basically, you can confirm a purchase and complete a transaction in the time it takes you to have a proper bathroom break, if you use bitcoin.
In that time.. you could probably even spend it with another merchant!


How could you spend it with another merchant if it's already confirmed in the blockchain?

You - being the merchant who just received the confirmed coins.
Why couldn't you?

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August 28, 2011, 08:00:47 PM
 #15

If I were to convince a merchant on how much they would save if they accepted bitcoins instead of credit card or paypal, the merchant may like to know dollar amounts of savings for their business.

I've heard 1-2% transaction fee charges for credit card or for using paypal.  But, I would like to know if anyone can give real dollar amounts of actual bitcoin savings.  I think companies like bit-pay.com could use this information as a marketing advantage.

Does anyone have any idea?

What a coincidence...

http://bitcoin-trader.blogspot.com/2011/08/bitcoin-factor.html

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August 28, 2011, 08:28:28 PM
 #16

Basically, you can confirm a purchase and complete a transaction in the time it takes you to have a proper bathroom break, if you use bitcoin.
In that time.. you could probably even spend it with another merchant!


How could you spend it with another merchant if it's already confirmed in the blockchain?

You - being the merchant who just received the confirmed coins.
Why couldn't you?

It requires 6 confirmations Tongue
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August 28, 2011, 08:34:41 PM
 #17

I think the real argument is how much more business would a merchant pick up by accepting Bitcoin now, and/or in the near future. Although the numbers look great on paper, the fact remains no merchant in their right mind will forego accepting payment via credit cards, PayPal, etc., just because of lower fees alone. They would lose more business than they receive via Bitcoin. Most merchants will wait for the critical mass of people using Bitcoin before they even commit.

Now, there are many businesses that don't accept CC because of the fees alone. They possibly are perfect candidates to approach and sway over to Bitcoin.



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August 28, 2011, 09:24:10 PM
 #18

Although the numbers look great on paper, the fact remains no merchant in their right mind will forego accepting payment via credit cards, PayPal, etc., just because of lower fees alone. They would lose more business than they receive via Bitcoin. Most merchants will wait for the critical mass of people using Bitcoin before they even commit.


There's no reason to stop accepting the other forms of payment.
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August 29, 2011, 06:25:03 AM
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Now, there are many businesses that don't accept CC because of the fees alone. They possibly are perfect candidates to approach and sway over to Bitcoin.

Actually, the grocery store I shop at won't accept credit cards. Debit, cash, food stamps. No Visa, MC, etc. They don't actually lose too many customers because of it, especially because they pass the savings on to the customers. The place makes Wal-Mart look expensive. (And even more crappy. The produce in particular is pretty much the best I can find in the area.)

I wish they would take my bitcoins. Smiley Sadly there's no viable buyer-in-person system for bitcoins at least at the moment. Sad

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August 29, 2011, 02:56:59 PM
 #20

Sadly there's no viable buyer-in-person system for bitcoins at least at the moment. Sad

Bitcoin Wallet on Android? All the merchant needs is an Android mobile to be able to accept Bitcoin payments from customers (who most likely will be using a mobile app themselves, but if they want to carry a laptop with them of course they could Wink

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