[Ann] BitAuction - BitBay Development Transfer

[CheekyChappy]

I have no idea who the main players who claim ownership of this auction site are because I never dealt with either of them, but a word of caution to all investors.

It is clear there are claims and counter claims and there is money involved. Both parties have different version of events and regardless of what may or may not have happened, it is best that everyone stays well clear of getting involved and investing until this matter is sorted out amicably by both parties.

From what I read on this thread and reading the skype transcript, the general tone of the words being written here as well as the skype thread it seems obvious which party I believe is telling the truth and I leave it to you to make up your mind but if the main parties sort this out before people invest it would be better for everyone all round as everyone can start with a clean slate.

[aTriz]

As an investor, I am pretty disappointed in this.

I guess I should of just asked this before but where exactly are you going to be able to buy/sell these shares? (IPO investment site, havelockinvestments, cryptostocks.com etc???)

That way there is liquidity and also for those people who aren't happy with what just transpired can buy/sell the shares at their discretion.

Lets see how things unfold in this situation. We are adults and we all share a common goal, crypto's success and adoption, let's not lose site of that.

[daemonfox]

This is all a bit too much to handle honestly...

While I am content to keep 10 shares in the auction site... there are a few things which are going to haunt this venture for a long time...

1. Justin, you may have the LLC and Trademark because you filed first, but any case opened will reveal through investigation what the timeline was and how things transpired... there is a possibility that 10% allocated is not enough and a suit would reward the plaintiff with a much more substantial amount... do your due diligence and get some representation to at least give you a bit of sound legal advice regarding this before you get too far in to minimize the damage.

2. It is now public record that you used funds generated by shares you sold that were allotted to you at the beginning of the project. With you filing an LLC AFTER the fact, you still have some liability to have used those funds responsibly for the company and not personal maters. What is transcribed in the Skype conversation is very worrying, and damaging... should someone bring a suit against you or bring a government entity into the picture, you will be hard pressed to show you used the raised funds accordingly, and may find yourself dealing with even more of a mess than just arguing over ownership and profit sharing. Again, you need to seek out some legal aide to define your position and help you understand these mistakes and what you can do about them.

3. Bitcoin is taxable, which means what you spent needs to be reported properly, and if you are not attempting to claim the physical property you spent the funds on as part of the LLC, you will be fined or at least audited and then possibly fined. Cashing out Bitcoin requires that you pay taxes on it, especially since you were not an LLC when you did so. With the controversy of what has happened, do not be naive enough to think someone is not going to report you in hopes you do get audited and caught with your pants down. AGAIN, seek legal aide ASAP for your share holder's sake.

With all that said, I hope this goes well and an amicable solution can be arrived at... there is nothing worse than bad publicity before a product can even get off the ground.

~Daemon

[CheekyChappy]

This is all a bit too much to handle honestly...

While I am content to keep 10 shares in the auction site... there are a few things which are going to haunt this venture for a long time...

1. Justin, you may have the LLC and Trademark because you filed first, but any case opened will reveal through investigation what the timeline was and how things transpired... there is a possibility that 10% allocated is not enough and a suit would reward the plaintiff with a much more substantial amount... do your due diligence and get some representation to at least give you a bit of sound legal advice regarding this before you get too far in to minimize the damage.

2. It is now public record that you used funds generated by shares you sold that were allotted to you at the beginning of the project. With you filing an LLC AFTER the fact, you still have some liability to have used those funds responsibly for the company and not personal maters. What is transcribed in the Skype conversation is very worrying, and damaging... should someone bring a suit against you or bring a government entity into the picture, you will be hard pressed to show you used the raised funds accordingly, and may find yourself dealing with even more of a mess than just arguing over ownership and profit sharing. Again, you need to seek out some legal aide to define your position and help you understand these mistakes and what you can do about them.

3. Bitcoin is taxable, which means what you spent needs to be reported properly, and if you are not attempting to claim the physical property you spent the funds on as part of the LLC, you will be fined or at least audited and then possibly fined. Cashing out Bitcoin requires that you pay taxes on it, especially since you were not an LLC when you did so. With the controversy of what has happened, do not be naive enough to think someone is not going to report you in hopes you do get audited and caught with your pants down. AGAIN, seek legal aide ASAP for your share holder's sake.

With all that said, I hope this goes well and an amicable solution can be arrived at... there is nothing worse than bad publicity before a product can even get off the ground.

~Daemon

Interesting points raised Daemon...

Am I correct in thinking that in this case, one person hired another person to program the website and that it can be described as her project (ie a boss hiring a rent-a-coder)?

Am I also correct in thinking that after the boss and the rent-a-coder fell out without each other, the rent-a-coder hired to program the website for reasons not fully explained has filed to register the name as Trademark first, even though he was an employee of the boss and a part of the project. And somehow he has access to funds as well?

If I have it wrong, someone please feel free to inform us all.

If I have it correct, then it would seem difficult to comprehend that in essence, somehow, a rent-a-coder has taken over a whole project (including investor funding) which he was supposed to be hired just to code. In that case the boss would still own all copyright code (except for the original sub-standard turnkey template website).

Probably best for everyone to stay clear of this project because if there is money involved then surely the project owner/boss would not let this go. I see a possible litigation on the horizon and would advise everyone to NOT invest and furthermore I would advise everyone who has invested to do the following things:

1) Ask for your money to be returned
2) Ask exactly how your investment is/was being used and 'invested'
3) Write to the person who originally started this project and ask her if she were still in-charge of the project how would your investment be used and 'invested'
4) Under no circumstances invest nor re-invest in this project until there is clarity as to who owns it and where it is going. You will probably have to wait for the outcome of a court case since neither party seems to be backing down.

I have hired coders to work on my projects in the past and made it clear that I own the code they write. If any rent-a-coder decided he was going to take over one of my projects because he did not like my strategy then I would remove him and continue with another rent-a-coder. If any rent-a-coder stole my ideas, registered a similar domain and/or trademark and then used a copy of my purchased code to create a competing website, I would not hesitate to go to court. I am not saying that anything like that has happened here but the situation is dire especially as far as withdrawals of investors funds is concerned and that could open up a whole new legal issue.

Stay away from this guys, at least until the law makes it clear who owns which part of this project and then use your initiative and decide if you feel on a moral basis you can invest and/or use the website after you know which party will be running it.

[CheekyChappy]

Our current live preview (Not the most recent code | Changes have not been submitted yet)  https://bitbay.cc

The site at http://bitbay.cc is a turnkey site that can be purchased for US$47.

Now, if someone uses that as a base to build their code around then it is not essentially a 'bad' thing. I regularly use open source software to build stores/sites, I just modify them to the point they are almost unrecognisable and have a different feel about them. I love using open source and existing ecommerce sites, my current project is based around one and I modify it all myself. Just when the real complex things cannot be done, I rent-a-coder and do the rest myself. I am all for using a template (open source or otherwise for any project) but transparency is totally paramount in cases such as these because there could be vulnerabilities to the code and investors need to know what is going on and how the site is being scripted, not just have a target date because the investment of staggering amounts of BTC as well as the hopes and aspirations of returns by the investors are HUGE.

The code he has is cheap off the shelf turn Key script not worth 100,000+ dollars in shares he wants to sell for himself.I tried to tell him that the shares where for Bitbays Development not him to spend as he wishes.

http://zonetheme.com/nulled-script/download-zeeauctions-ebay-clone-auction-php-script-software-nulled-scripts.html



http://zeeauctions.com/demo/



https://bitbay.cc




Investors, seriously, ask for your money back and only re-invest once you are satisfied the battle between the two protagonists is over. Not for me to say who is right and who is wrong here but surely investors should not be part of this. Pull your investment out immediately and re-invest if your heart desires after things become clear.

Then make sure the code is up to the job and make sure the file servers, image servers, db servers(s) and loadbalancers are set up to maximise your outlay. Questions about where to host, where to buy the EV SSL, which server/db configuration to employ, which periods/locations for DB back, where to store all master user/pass in case the main dev becomes unavailable or incapacitated and how investors can login themselves to check income/expenditure and receive daily/weekly/monthly cash flow documents so on and so forth.

These issues and others have to form part of the investors contract. Pull your investments out for now guys until everything becomes crystal clear.

--

[Cenron]

I am kinda new to this and wanted to try and invest, but from what I have seen, this site will end bad. I heard that this Justin guy is 17? How does a minor sign LLC papers? or be able to sell anything. All transactions made by a minor are null and void or the responsibility of the minor's guardians?

[paulthetafy]

BitAuction will allow the usage of a number of coins that the seller may choose from as a form of payment.
With the sudden loss of Bitmit we are looking to provide a permanent home for auctioneers looking to sell securely in cryptocurrency.

You guys might want to check out cryptothrift.com.  We are already live, accept BTC/LTC/FTC/XPM, provide escrow, have a good turnover of auctions, are NOT a turnkey operation, and get 30,000 page views a month and rising.  We are NOT looking for investment.

Sincerely yours,
paulthetafy/paulscreen
cryptothrift.com partner & developer

[daemonfox]

@justin,

You have a responsibility to allow us to revoke our shares for a full refund, or at least transference of the invested BTC back to Cassie.

Since you did not disclose that these were YOUR allotted shares that we were buying, every one of your early round investors were lied to. We bought shares of "Bitbay" not "coding enhancements by justin" and as such, you need to allow people that request a way to exit without loss.

Consideration on this is very important moving forward if you intend to maintain developing in this community. You basically absconded with investor's funds and forced us into your business model. That is theft, and should anyone decide to take you to court, you would be found guilty.

I would suggest you allow each member on the OP assets list choose what they want to do. Otherwise, you have a very big problem looming overhead.

Also, what is this about you are 17... you do realize if you are not a legal adult... you cannot sign anything legally binding without your guardian also signing, unless you are emancipated. If this is true, your parents are now responsible for all the funds you collected and spent, and they can be liable for reimbursement.

Very troubling to say the least...

10 shares .25 BTC 1DAemoNXFNQxeDQAeRdEg245WvYsCfdgE9

You do not even have to respond if you choose to straight refund me. I will delete my posts from this thread should you do the right thing.

[CheekyChappy]

Having read recent posts especially after my comments and screenshots, I have to agree in principle with what most of you feel. I am not an investor in this project nor do I know the two protagonists however from the off it seemed as though someone trying to taking control of a project in an underhand manner (and then saying it was to save the project) is just not right when their only remit was to 'code' a site. Furthermore, then for one person to openly state that he took funds from your investments for living expenses makes it clear the funds you have invested in the project are currently with the wrong person!

Startup money was generated already. The rest of the money was my payout. The 50% of the company that went towards paying shares was my 50%. I have plenty to continue development. The money recently has been used to keep me off the streets and working on BitBay and OpenEx. I have devoted my time accordingly and BitBay is going to be a success. BitBay official release which will not change is in 3 weeks from today.

@aTriz
You paid 3.75BTC for 50 shares? You are definitely doing the right thing requesting a refund because 3.75BTC is a lot but try and stick together in a group with other investors who want a refund as it is better to speak with one voice and not have individual requests for refunds.

@Cenron
I do not know where you obtained information about the coders age, but if he is 17 then surely that information was not openly declared otherwise I would find it hard to believe anyone would invest directly in the company via him. If his age is correct, many thanks are due to you for bringing this information to the attention of the investors

@paulthetafy
Nice site. I wish you success with it and hope you would not mind a little competition if BitBay does come along one day  

@daemonfox
With the greatest respect to you, I know you would like your investment back but please consider what your fellow investors want and by the look of it things are not good therefore probably all investors would ask for a refund. Maybe it is better for all investors to take a unified approach rather than tackling the issue one by one? I mean stronger in numbers...

The investors need to get their funds back as soon as possible before ALL your funds will be used as living expenses and other expenses related to the project which might not be proven actually have occurred but receipts might be provided upon questioning it.

No one knows how much of the funds remain so if you stand any chance of getting all or most back you need to take action NOW otherwise there might not be anything left!

[milly6]

@Justin Sorry to hear about Cassie, hope she has not taken too much of the startup money? Thanks for your efforts in continuing to push this project.

lulz

[justin7674]

@justin,

You have a responsibility to allow us to revoke our shares for a full refund, or at least transference of the invested BTC back to Cassie.

Since you did not disclose that these were YOUR allotted shares that we were buying, every one of your early round investors were lied to. We bought shares of "Bitbay" not "coding enhancements by justin" and as such, you need to allow people that request a way to exit without loss.

Consideration on this is very important moving forward if you intend to maintain developing in this community. You basically absconded with investor's funds and forced us into your business model. That is theft, and should anyone decide to take you to court, you would be found guilty.

I would suggest you allow each member on the OP assets list choose what they want to do. Otherwise, you have a very big problem looming overhead.

Also, what is this about you are 17... you do realize if you are not a legal adult... you cannot sign anything legally binding without your guardian also signing, unless you are emancipated. If this is true, your parents are now responsible for all the funds you collected and spent, and they can be liable for reimbursement.

Very troubling to say the least...

10 shares .25 BTC 1DAemoNXFNQxeDQAeRdEg245WvYsCfdgE9

You do not even have to respond if you choose to straight refund me. I will delete my posts from this thread should you do the right thing.

If you believe the site belongs to cassie then ask her for the refund. If you will excuse me I am working on BitAuctions. I will still release as planned. All share holders on the list are locked in.

[Cenron]

@justin,

You have a responsibility to allow us to revoke our shares for a full refund, or at least transference of the invested BTC back to Cassie.

Since you did not disclose that these were YOUR allotted shares that we were buying, every one of your early round investors were lied to. We bought shares of "Bitbay" not "coding enhancements by justin" and as such, you need to allow people that request a way to exit without loss.

Consideration on this is very important moving forward if you intend to maintain developing in this community. You basically absconded with investor's funds and forced us into your business model. That is theft, and should anyone decide to take you to court, you would be found guilty.

I would suggest you allow each member on the OP assets list choose what they want to do. Otherwise, you have a very big problem looming overhead.

Also, what is this about you are 17... you do realize if you are not a legal adult... you cannot sign anything legally binding without your guardian also signing, unless you are emancipated. If this is true, your parents are now responsible for all the funds you collected and spent, and they can be liable for reimbursement.

Very troubling to say the least...

10 shares .25 BTC 1DAemoNXFNQxeDQAeRdEg245WvYsCfdgE9

You do not even have to respond if you choose to straight refund me. I will delete my posts from this thread should you do the right thing.

If you believe the site belongs to cassie then ask her for the refund. If you will excuse me I am working on BitAuctions. I will still release as planned. All share holders on the list are locked in.

Wow this guy is a piece of work, you steal the money and use it to pay your personal bills, as referred to by the Skype logs, and then you wash your hands of it and try to pass the responsibility onto Cassie? Mods doesn't this buy deserve a perma ban for ripping off half the forum? FYI if anyone wants to sue the crap out of this guy, I think Cassie has his personal info from the LLC application he tried to submit.

P.S. Genius DaemonFox is one of your investors as refereed to by you on the first post of this, I took a nice screen shot of it and time dated it in case you try to pull any scummy moves like trying to remove it.

God i hate scum bags like this. You deserve a special place in hell.

[aTriz]

Respectfully,

Justin, you do not have to refund any of us if you do not want to, I get that. But sometimes in life you have to do the right thing and in the long run it will be for the better. For example my pool was just hacked and he managed to steal over 40 BTC. We could of just said o damn time to run away and make a new account. We didn't, we refunded over $25,000 dollars to our miners. We are now re-opening and we have had a tremendous amount of positive media from it.

I get that you are continuing your efforts with BitBay but from the way things are looking you should give the investors the opportunity to retract their investments seeing what has transpired here. If you don't the site will fail, no one will visit it after they see this thread and that is not good for you or us as investors.

[CheekyChappy]

@justin,

You have a responsibility to allow us to revoke our shares for a full refund, or at least transference of the invested BTC back to Cassie.

Since you did not disclose that these were YOUR allotted shares that we were buying, every one of your early round investors were lied to. We bought shares of "Bitbay" not "coding enhancements by justin" and as such, you need to allow people that request a way to exit without loss.

Consideration on this is very important moving forward if you intend to maintain developing in this community. You basically absconded with investor's funds and forced us into your business model. That is theft, and should anyone decide to take you to court, you would be found guilty.

I would suggest you allow each member on the OP assets list choose what they want to do. Otherwise, you have a very big problem looming overhead.

Also, what is this about you are 17... you do realize if you are not a legal adult... you cannot sign anything legally binding without your guardian also signing, unless you are emancipated. If this is true, your parents are now responsible for all the funds you collected and spent, and they can be liable for reimbursement.

Very troubling to say the least...

10 shares .25 BTC 1DAemoNXFNQxeDQAeRdEg245WvYsCfdgE9

You do not even have to respond if you choose to straight refund me. I will delete my posts from this thread should you do the right thing.

If you believe the site belongs to cassie then ask her for the refund. If you will excuse me I am working on BitAuctions. I will still release as planned. All share holders on the list are locked in.

@Daemon
Hmmm I think it is clear to see all investors have a MAJOR problem on their hands. If I were you I would get the backing of as many investors as possible and take things forward while your investments can still be retrieved. Ask Cassie to confirm what his age really is. If he is under 18 his parents need to be informed what he has done and what he is doing since they are legally liable for him if he has obtained funds without declaring the full facts and if he has used those funds for personal or illicit gains. If he (or his parents fail to convince him) to refund you then go to a local police station and file a crime report citing you gave money to someone who was economical with the facts at the time of investment and has used your funds for personal or illicit use and let the police interview him and his parents/guardians.

If he is over 18 then it could be as simple as going to a local police station with his name, address and date of birth and filing a crime against him and let him explain to the police what he did so you can circumvent his parents since they would not be liable.

Ask Cassie for his name, address, age, date of birth and any other information where the police can actually approach him with ease once a complaint has been filed. Then decide which one of you will file that complaint, better more than person does it in more than one city/state so it will get highlighted quicker.
ACT NOW BEFORE ALL OF YOUR INVESTMENTS ARE USED!

@aTrix
Well done my friend, you took a $25000 loss from your own pocket but you will get that back in a short time as miners will flood your pools because they know you are honest and reliable. Sites get hacked all the time, it is nothing new but giving miners the peace of mind they will be protected is a great PR move and morally correct on your part.

[justin7674]

Respectfully,

Justin, you do not have to refund any of us if you do not want to, I get that. But sometimes in life you have to do the right thing and in the long run it will be for the better. For example my pool was just hacked and he managed to steal over 40 BTC. We could of just said o damn time to run away and make a new account. We didn't, we refunded over $25,000 dollars to our miners. We are now re-opening and we have had a tremendous amount of positive media from it.

I get that you are continuing your efforts with BitBay but from the way things are looking you should give the investors the opportunity to retract their investments seeing what has transpired here. If you don't the site will fail, no one will visit it after they see this thread and that is not good for you or us as investors.

I would if any money was available. I am opting to continue development even through the FUD of the public because of this fact.

And right now anyone's chance at getting their money back is to just shut up and wait for the release. BitBay will never be released because Cassie can't code and neither can she file legal documentation let alone file taxes and obtain proper licensing for handling multiple currencies with escrow.


I may be 17 but I am not ignorant when it comes to business and programming. Quite frankly, Cassie has no business knowledge that is able to be used in this field. I know this because I worked with her. She is completely incapable of running any type of business without running it straight into the ground.


I will make this agreement with all the investors. If BitAuctions fails after release. I will gladly refund all of you. The only way I am following through with that promise is if all the FUD is removed from this thread.

[justin7674]

As an investor, I am pretty disappointed in this.

I guess I should of just asked this before but where exactly are you going to be able to buy/sell these shares? (IPO investment site, havelockinvestments, cryptostocks.com etc???)

That way there is liquidity and also for those people who aren't happy with what just transpired can buy/sell the shares at their discretion.

Lets see how things unfold in this situation. We are adults and we all share a common goal, crypto's success and adoption, let's not lose site of that.

For now anybody looking to jump out of this stake can sell their shares. If you sell your shares please notify me who received them and how many. For now share sells are going to have to be through some alternative method than a shares site. We will not be listed until release.

[Munz77]

17? You should've stayed at school dumbarse.

[CheekyChappy]

I would if any money was available. I am opting to continue development even through the FUD of the public because of this fact.

Hello Justin, this is my first post directly to you. Hope you are well.

Where is the money if it is not available? How much was invested originally and how much was taken by you and how much was left with Cassie at the time of your defection? What exactly were the funds you controlled spent on?

Being objective and all I was wondering exactly what development you are continuing with because as it currently stands you are using a $47 turnkey solution as your base and the site is hosted on a free cloudfront (http://whois.domaintools.com/bitbay.cc). I mean, you are probably not even paying for hosting at cloudflare as their starter package it is free.

Apart from the $47 purchase of a sub-standard turkey solution what exactly what are you developing that has a monetary value of the bitcoins invested by people here? Since it is only you who is sitting in front of your pc and logging in to the $47 sub-standard turnkey solution making a few cosmetic changes here  and there, that cannot be classed as developmental costs investors parted with their money for, nor did they part with their money so you can withdraw from their funds as living expenses.

As it currently stands you are judge, jury and executioner because you have the investors money, you claim to be coding the website and you have taken control of the domain. There is nothing stopping you from telling investors their investment as been used in this or that way, nor in the extremely unlikely possibility the site will ever see the light of day will the investors ever know what the factual income/expenditure is and will have to just take your word for it.

This my friend is as farcical as a farce can get and you have to do what is morally correct. Shares cannot be in lock-in because investors did not receive full facts from you before investing and the majority believed they were investing in a project run by Cassie, either way they did not sign up to allowing someone to take their funds and use them inappropriately.

Just to re-cap:
1) You paid $47 for a turnkey sub-standard site trying to pass it off to Cassie as your code
2) When she realised you could not deliver your promise of coding a cool site you rushed to register all you could to take control of the project (domain name etc)
3) You also ended up with a portion of the invested capital (yet unclear as to how much or how you intend to invest it, apart from spending it on yourself)
4) You host the cheap turnkey solution on a free or cheap cloud
5) Your total outlay for the project so far is $47 for the sub-standard turnkey solution and free hosting on cloudfare.com
6) You have taken funds from investors to spend on your living expenses
7) If shares are locked in or not it makes no difference since you are a one-man band working from home. Whether you have investors bitcoins or not will not affect your 'project' since YOU ARE THE PROJECT AND THE PROJECT IS YOU and investors would gladly want you to do what you like with your project so long as they get their investments back because they did not invest in a project that you controlled, they invested in a project run by Cassie, a project that you were involved with because you over-exaggerated your potential input: according to evidence available it means you lied

You have to give back all investors capital and I am sure they will gladly want you to keep 100% of any profits your site might generate if it gets launched. The three weeks you have left before site goes live is deemed by many investors as a smokescreen for you to siphon off more of their funds.

Please return their investment and keep 100% of the profits of your site when (or if) it goes live.

--

[justin7674]

I would if any money was available. I am opting to continue development even through the FUD of the public because of this fact.

Hello Justin, this is my first post directly to you. Hope you are well.

Where is the money if it is not available? How much was invested originally and how much was taken by you and how much was left with Cassie at the time of your defection? What exactly were the funds you controlled spent on?

Being objective and all I was wondering exactly what development you are continuing with because as it currently stands you are using a $47 turnkey solution as your base and the site is hosted on a free cloudfront (http://whois.domaintools.com/bitbay.cc). I mean, you are probably not even paying for hosting at cloudflare as their starter package it is free.

Apart from the $47 purchase of a sub-standard turkey solution what exactly what are you developing that has a monetary value of the bitcoins invested by people here? Since it is only you who is sitting in front of your pc and logging in to the $47 sub-standard turnkey solution making a few cosmetic changes here  and there, that cannot be classed as developmental costs investors parted with their money for, nor did they part with their money so you can withdraw from their funds as living expenses.

As it currently stands you are judge, jury and executioner because you have the investors money, you claim to be coding the website and you have taken control of the domain. There is nothing stopping you from telling investors their investment as been used in this or that way, nor in the extremely unlikely possibility the site will ever see the light of day will the investors ever know what the factual income/expenditure is and will have to just take your word for it.

This my friend is as farcical as a farce can get and you have to do what is morally correct. Shares cannot be in lock-in because investors did not receive full facts from you before investing and the majority believed they were investing in a project run by Cassie.

Just to re-cap:
1) You paid $47 for a turnkey sub-standard site trying to pass it off to Cassie as your code
2) When she realised you could not deliver your promise of coding a cool site you rushed to register all you could to take control of the project (domain name etc)
3) You also ended up with a portion of the invested capital (yet unclear as to how much or how you intend to invest it, apart from spending it on yourself)
4) Your host the cheap turnkey solution on a free or cheap cloud
5) Your total outlay for the project so far is $47 for the sub-standard turnkey solution and free hosting on cloudfare.com
6) You have taken funds from investors to spend on your living expenses
7) If shares are locked in or not it makes no difference since you are a one-man band working from home. Whether you have investors bitcoins or not will not affect your 'project' since YOU ARE THE PROJECT AND THE PROJECT IS YOU and investors would gladly want you to do what you like with your project so long as they get their investments back because they did not invest in a project that you controlled, they invested in a project run by Cassie, a project that you were involved with because you over-exaggerated your potential input.

You have to give back all investors capital and I am sure they will gladly want you to keep 100% of any profits your site might generate if it gets launched. The three weeks you have left before site goes live is deemed by many investors as a smokescreen for you to siphon off more of their funds.

Please return their investment and keep 100% of the profits of your site when (or if) it goes live.

--

The old script has been trashed on the dev server. I am starting from scratch. The investors will receive their money back after release. That is about as in depth as I am going.


It isn't that I am incapable of programming a cool and fully functional site. Cassie was the one who suggested to use a turnkey script and modify it to accept bitcoin. I can provide those skype logs where I refused.


Cassie has never released a single project. Oh but lets take a look; I am a lead dev of OpenEx.


So I think everyone should take a look: My work can be proven and shown. Cassie has no work to be shown.

[CheekyChappy]

The old script has been trashed on the dev server. I am starting from scratch. The investors will receive their money back after release. That is about as in depth as I am going.

It isn't that I am incapable of programming a cool and fully functional site. Cassie was the one who suggested to use a turnkey script and modify it to accept bitcoin. I can provide those skype logs where I refused.

Cassie has never released a single project. Oh but lets take a look; I am a lead dev of OpenEx.

So I think everyone should take a look: My work can be proven and shown. Cassie has no work to be shown.

Ok, point taken. Thank you for the update and mature stance you have taken.

We accept that you are a skilled coder and Cassie is no businesswoman, we can accept that but in the midst of it all the fundamental concerns do not change. Most investors want their money back and you have not provided any coherent reason not to refund them.

Whereas I along with others looking in horror at this project unfolding, you saying investors will get their money back is fantastic news however it is not fair to refund after the site is launched as we are looking at approximately 3 weeks from today and even then you might turn around and not refund them citing the need to wait until net profit builds up so you can afford the refunds. I urge you to please put the investors looking for a refund out of their misery and let them have it. It will only bring praise for you and your reputation considering it has already been badly affected by the spectacle unfolding before us.

Sure, if you sincerely believe in your project and are starting a new base with a self-custom coded website then go for it. We all wish you success but holding investors money to ransom until you release your website in the hope they will like it and thus stay is not the way forward. They need to be able to choose now and be able to stay for the long run if they wish or if they have had enough and want a refund it should be given immediately.

Please consider refunding investors now rather than later and repair the damage done to your reputation. Thank you.