the RISK of FPGA mining

[Kryptowolf512]

@Sensless, im a big fan of your guys work. This will really change the future and we will have a really low power consumption for people around the world. Im a hobby miner and im paying 0.3$ per kW and this is really sad, im not making much profits but i love it.
The price of a FPGA is a lot currently so i cant afford it. But im sure it will change in the future.

Please dont get mad of this comments here on bitcointalk. There are a lot of douchebags that even dont know how hardware works.
Just keep the good work!

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[lexele]

and we will have a really low power consumption for people around the world.

Why should consumption be lower? People will just add more asics or FPGA because right now electricity is the limiting factor. So there's no way global consumption will reduce.

[Kryptowolf512]

and we will have a really low power consumption for people around the world.

Why should consumption be lower? People will just add more asics or FPGA because right now electricity is the limiting factor. So there's no way global consumption will reduce.

Dude, there is not a unlimited storage or production of FPGA's. There are only a few FPGA's currently on the market and look how much GPU's are floating around the globe. Im not sure about the amount of FPGA's, but Im sure that if we have just for example 10 Million GPU's there will be only like 50k FPGA's.
So just calculate that again, if the FPGA's only take 150W and one GPU 100-300W depend on the model!

[vapourminer]

https://discord.gg/M6CyRh

This invite has expired.  Do you happen to know of another?  Thank you...

https://discord.gg/jdw8jZB

[realaccountakira]

and we will have a really low power consumption for people around the world.

Why should consumption be lower? People will just add more asics or FPGA because right now electricity is the limiting factor. So there's no way global consumption will reduce.

Dude, there is not a unlimited storage or production of FPGA's. There are only a few FPGA's currently on the market and look how much GPU's are floating around the globe. Im not sure about the amount of FPGA's, but Im sure that if we have just for example 10 Million GPU's there will be only like 50k FPGA's.
So just calculate that again, if the FPGA's only take 150W and one GPU 100-300W depend on the model!

I agree with you and believe that FPGAs are a good step towards reducing the total energy consumed by crypto mining, as well as being a viable alternative to ASIC monopoly. The only problem I have with FPGAs is that they are more or less CENTRALIZED.

Why? Because getting an FPGA to mine crypto is technical. Not everyone, most especially your non-techy people, will be able to configure and run an FPGA. Although in the future, devs may release an extremely user friendly software for FPGAs, that is a long time further and besides, the cost of a single FPGA is also restrictive. Point is, FPGAs could be harmful to crypto blockchains because of the centralization of hardware to companies/individuals with deep pockets and who know how to use them.

[Sir William]

https://discord.gg/M6CyRh

This invite has expired.  Do you happen to know of another?  Thank you...

https://discord.gg/jdw8jZB

Thank you vapourminer.   

[protoberans]

Most of you guys tend to forget one think in comparison between CPUs, GPUs, FPGAs and ASICs


While CPUs and GPUs are generally available in all countries around the world and anyone can buy them from the shop, without the need to get in touch with customs etc.


FPGAs and ASICs are not available everywhere.

[senseless]

@Sensless, im a big fan of your guys work. This will really change the future and we will have a really low power consumption for people around the world. Im a hobby miner and im paying 0.3$ per kW and this is really sad, im not making much profits but i love it.
The price of a FPGA is a lot currently so i cant afford it. But im sure it will change in the future.

Please dont get mad of this comments here on bitcointalk. There are a lot of douchebags that even dont know how hardware works.
Just keep the good work!

Thanks, I can be a "little" dramatic trying to make a point sometimes. There's a lot of FUD circling around and these FPGA can be a source of good for the community and tech as a whole. I think once the coin developers start to realize what is possible on their coins by specifically targeting these devices things will change. I'm not speaking of proof of work (hashrates / performance), but actual useful work that can be accomplished.

Even if we did swap 10 million gpus over to 10 million fpgas reducing total power consumption by 1.5GW and yes, we've lowered the gap between ASICs and average miners; But, we're still spending 1.5GW doing useless/meaningless work. It's power enough for a small city and it's being used to prove it's being used.

[COINKING7]

Hi,

On June 19th, I purchased the XILINX 1525 with mods and DIMMs from the 1st bulk order on the Zetheron thread.
I have the receipt to prove it and I'm sure FPGA.land/Squirrels Research will back me up. It will arrive sometime
in August and then I can ship it out. I really wanted to run this card, as projections are $20-$50 per day.
Unfortunately, I need to sell it to pay off some debt. I'm asking $6,000 to cover taxes, shipping, fees, etc.
I know that may seem high but as far as I have researched, Batch 2 is not even close to ready, and people
could be waiting until next year sometime. I will accept ZEN, BTC, ETH and possibly PayPal.

PM me if interested. I'm open to reasonable offers. Highest offer gets it.

Thanks!

[lunobird]

Hi,

On June 19th, I purchased the XILINX 1525 with mods and DIMMs from the 1st bulk order on the Zetheron thread.
I have the receipt to prove it and I'm sure FPGA.land/Squirrels Research will back me up. It will arrive sometime
in August and then I can ship it out. I really wanted to run this card, as projections are $20-$50 per day.
Unfortunately, I need to sell it to pay off some debt. I'm asking $6,000 to cover taxes, shipping, fees, etc.
I know that may seem high but as far as I have researched, Batch 2 is not even close to ready, and people
could be waiting until next year sometime. I will accept ZEN, BTC, ETH and possibly PayPal.

PM me if interested. I'm open to reasonable offers. Highest offer gets it.

Thanks!

Lol. You do know we aren't in 2017 bull fomo trend. You will most likely have to sell at a slight loss. Everyone is pestamistic now and nobody will touch any miner with a 10 feet pole these days.  It's not the time to think about being greedy in this bear market.

[omali]

FPGA might have its disadvantage but it combines what I love the most in GPUs and ASICs. FPGA is that exact hardware and it is the new favorite in the mining community. In terms of  no limitation and flexibility (which coin to mine). And theres the thing about less power consumption. I dont own one right now, but I have been researching on it and plan to get it.

[vuli1]

fpga might be a trend for 2019. So far they are quite expensive and I hope that will change.

[JaredKaragen]

My only FPGA risk assessment:


Creating a FPGA based mining schism just entices another shitmain to come to fruition.

The future is seen through these eyes.  I see the future behind us.

[FFI2013]

My only FPGA risk assessment:


Creating a FPGA based mining schism just entices another shitmain to come to fruition.

The future is seen through these eyes.  I see the future behind us.

There's only greed now in crypto prices for fpga's will never go down only up once a greedy bastard like shitmain starts getting evolved just swapping one devil for the other 

[vuli1]

My only FPGA risk assessment:


Creating a FPGA based mining schism just entices another shitmain to come to fruition.

The future is seen through these eyes.  I see the future behind us.

There's only greed now in crypto prices for fpga's will never go down only up once a greedy bastard like shitmain starts getting evolved just swapping one devil for the other 

that's right. Too much greed is involved in crypto world and it is raising too high. It is shame.

[JaredKaragen]

My only FPGA risk assessment:


Creating a FPGA based mining schism just entices another shitmain to come to fruition.

The future is seen through these eyes.  I see the future behind us.

There's only greed now in crypto prices for fpga's will never go down only up once a greedy bastard like shitmain starts getting evolved just swapping one devil for the other 

that's right. Too much greed is involved in crypto world and it is raising too high. It is shame.

but also look at it this way:

What happened after the Americas were 'discovered'........... up to now.

It's human nature.   A "natural cycle" sadly.

The only thing we can do is try to prevent the bad behavior.  Not teach it to people.

A seemingly impossible task;  but something people should strive for.... to fix the parts about human nature that are least desirable.


But I digress.   I do what I can and this is just another wave in the cycle;  thus my final sentiment about our future being behind us.

[LTCMAXMYR]

A new risk, if the chip is locked by KEY, then the board is worthless unless you know the key, it  have no second-hand value like GPU

[senseless]

A new risk, if the chip is locked by KEY, then the board is worthless unless you know the key, it  have no second-hand value like GPU

The key doesn't prevent unencrypted designs from running. Keep in mind, if we didn't do this it would also open an attack vector where a developer could maliciously burn the efuse preventing any designs from operating but their own.

I'm pretty sure you were already told this on discord?

[LTCMAXMYR]

A new risk, if the chip is locked by KEY, then the board is worthless unless you know the key, it  have no second-hand value like GPU

The key doesn't prevent unencrypted designs from running. Keep in mind, if we didn't do this it would also open an attack vector where a developer could maliciously burn the efuse preventing any designs from operating but their own.

I'm pretty sure you were already told this on discord?

no, i did not talk on discord, i review it. also i found the pdf,xapp1267,eFuse is OTP,it can lock the chip to a key.

CAUTION! If this bit is programmed to 1, the device cannot be
used unless the AES key is known. Return material
authorization (RMA) returns cannot be accepted and the
Vivado Indirect SPI/BPI flash programming flow cannot be
used if this bit is programmed. You must have external
configuration memories programmed BEFORE you blow this
fuse if you intend to use Vivado for this programming.

why not use the RAM to store the key?

[senseless]

A new risk, if the chip is locked by KEY, then the board is worthless unless you know the key, it  have no second-hand value like GPU

The key doesn't prevent unencrypted designs from running. Keep in mind, if we didn't do this it would also open an attack vector where a developer could maliciously burn the efuse preventing any designs from operating but their own.

I'm pretty sure you were already told this on discord?

no, i did not talk on discord, i review it. also i found the pdf,xapp1267,eFuse is OTP,it can lock the chip to a key.

So if you reviewed the documentation you would know that the chip can still load unencrypted bitstreams (assuming you use the correct options).

Once the key is loaded, yes, the key cannot be changed.

The ram key is wiped when the board loses power. The board doesn't have a battery.