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BitterTea
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October 11, 2011, 06:58:05 AM
 #121

The hash rate is in fact decreasing, but very slowly. I'm thinking that BCE is still mining away, just starting to be affected by the difficulty increases.

Code:
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1318316231: block# 9548 - 4s (0.359881 block/s)
1318316232: block# 9549 - 1s (0.359905 block/s)

CoinHunter, where is that promised 51% invulnerability?
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October 11, 2011, 07:04:42 AM
 #122

For those keeping score, roughly 279,000 solidcoins have been generated in the last few hours.  I'm so hoping an exchange will open before I head to bed. =)


The real thing you need to hope for is that there are people dumb enough to buy your coins. An exchange is no use without buyers - and hard to see anyone buying at a price that will cover your power-costs (or the opportunity cost) until block generation is somewhere around where it's meant to be and there's some confidence SC won't close the chain and reopen a new one with more premined coins and a higher tax rate.
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October 11, 2011, 07:06:06 AM
 #123

The hash rate is in fact decreasing, but very slowly. I'm thinking that BCE is still mining away, just starting to be affected by the difficulty increases.

CoinHunter, where is that promised 51% protection?

Considering that coinotron alone is reporting about the same MH/s rate as it was in beta, whet the hash rates were showing up considerably larger than they are now.... it's easy to understand there are considerably more miners mining.  Considering BTX couldn't offer any evidence of what he did, even under duress of being banned yet you all still think he is still attacking the network must hint at something about you all.... but mamma always said if you don't have anything nice to say then don't say anything at all.

If Coinotron is finding all of those blocks, why are most of theirs Invalid?

edit... An additional point: why hasn't the difficulty caught up to the hash rate yet? Does it not increase by up to 4x as in Bitcoin?
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October 11, 2011, 07:08:29 AM
 #124

The hash rate is in fact decreasing, but very slowly. I'm thinking that BCE is still mining away, just starting to be affected by the difficulty increases.

CoinHunter, where is that promised 51% protection?

Considering that coinotron alone is reporting about the same MH/s rate as it was in beta, whet the hash rates were showing up considerably larger than they are now.... it's easy to understand there are considerably more miners mining.  Considering BTX couldn't offer any evidence of what he did, even under duress of being banned yet you all still think he is still attacking the network must hint at something about you all.... but mamma always said if you don't have anything nice to say then don't say anything at all.

If Coinotron is finding all of those blocks, why are most of theirs Invalid?

Maybe because the sc network is some kind of flooded?! I have no idea... lol
Just curious too...  

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October 11, 2011, 07:08:54 AM
 #125

So it took ~300 blocks for average block time to increase 0.3% from 2.76950005s to 2.778510996s

At that rate it would take ~385,000 blocks to reach proper block time (3 minutes).  Another way to look at it is 10 million solidcoins will flood the market in the next 9 days.  If BCE has a significant fraction of the hashing power that is millions of solidcoins he can dump  Grin

Wonder how long BCE can keep it up?  Is anyone naive enough to think a 0.3% block time increase over 300 blocks is normal?

Difficulty has increased by a factor of 130x and block times are STILL sub 3 seconds (1/60th of normal).  For block time to remain relatively constant that means hashing power is growing at the same rate as difficulty and that seems to unlikely to be a coincidence.  There isn't a max # of solidcoins are there?  If not then good thing because if SC had same 21 million cap as bitcoin it would exhaust it's own coin supply in less than 19 days!
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October 11, 2011, 07:16:25 AM
 #126

So it took ~300 blocks for average block time to increase 0.3% from 2.76950005s to 2.778510996s

At that rate it would take roughly 385,000 blocks to reach proper block time (3 minutes).

That would also mean 10 million solidcoins will flood the market in the next 9 days.  Grin

Wonder how long BCE can keep it up?  Is anyone naive enough to think a 0.3% block time increase over 300 blocks is normal.... when actual block time is 1/100th of where it should be?

Difficulty has increased by a factor of 130x and block times are still sub 3 seconds.  There isn't a max # of solidcoins are there?  Because if there were only 21 million every single coin would be mined in less than a month!
There's no max # of coins. Block discovery speed seems pretty messed up indeed, makes all previously mined coins kind of worthless imo. It's a restart that doesn't tell its name. Apparently SC took care to protect the network against "pump and dump", but not against "dump and pump" or "pump pump pump" like we see now. It seems that I can't even catch up with the chain... no chance to mine a valid thing in these conditions...

anyone know who bcx really is.
Who cares? I'm pragmatic, all I see is that SC2 is a mess at the moment, and that it's because the difficulty isn't being adjusted properly.

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October 11, 2011, 07:19:27 AM
 #127

In case anyone's curious... I'm going to bed now.

Code:
tail -f debug.log | gawk ' BEGIN{ last=systime(); start=1318289700 } /SetBestChain/ { now=systime(); block=substr($4,index($4,"=")+1); blockrate=(now-start)/60/block; toofast=3.5/blockrate; print now ": block# " block " - " now-last "s (" blockrate " minutes/block, " toofast " x)"; last=now  }'

1318317428: block# 9898 - 0s (0.0466896 minutes/block, 74.9632 x)
1318317430: block# 9899 - 2s (0.0466882 minutes/block, 74.9654 x)
1318317432: block# 9900 - 2s (0.0466869 minutes/block, 74.9675 x)
1318317434: block# 9901 - 2s (0.0466855 minutes/block, 74.9697 x)
1318317442: block# 9902 - 8s (0.0466943 minutes/block, 74.9557 x)
1318317444: block# 9903 - 2s (0.0466929 minutes/block, 74.9578 x)
1318317452: block# 9904 - 8s (0.0467017 minutes/block, 74.9438 x)
1318317452: block# 9905 - 0s (0.046697 minutes/block, 74.9514 x)
1318317458: block# 9906 - 6s (0.0467023 minutes/block, 74.9427 x)
1318317459: block# 9907 - 1s (0.0466993 minutes/block, 74.9476 x)
1318317464: block# 9908 - 5s (0.046703 minutes/block, 74.9417 x)
1318317467: block# 9909 - 3s (0.0467033 minutes/block, 74.9411 x)
1318317471: block# 9910 - 4s (0.0467053 minutes/block, 74.9379 x)
1318317476: block# 9911 - 5s (0.046709 minutes/block, 74.932 x)
1318317482: block# 9912 - 6s (0.0467144 minutes/block, 74.9233 x)
1318317485: block# 9913 - 3s (0.0467148 minutes/block, 74.9228 x)
1318317489: block# 9914 - 4s (0.0467168 minutes/block, 74.9196 x)
1318317496: block# 9915 - 7s (0.0467238 minutes/block, 74.9083 x)
1318317496: block# 9916 - 0s (0.0467191 minutes/block, 74.9158 x)
1318317497: block# 9917 - 1s (0.0467161 minutes/block, 74.9207 x)
1318317502: block# 9918 - 5s (0.0467198 minutes/block, 74.9148 x)
1318317503: block# 9919 - 1s (0.0467167 minutes/block, 74.9196 x)
1318317509: block# 9920 - 6s (0.0467221 minutes/block, 74.911 x)
1318317512: block# 9921 - 3s (0.0467224 minutes/block, 74.9105 x)
1318317515: block# 9922 - 3s (0.0467228 minutes/block, 74.9099 x)
1318317520: block# 9923 - 5s (0.0467265 minutes/block, 74.904 x)
1318317525: block# 9924 - 5s (0.0467301 minutes/block, 74.8981 x)
1318317532: block# 9925 - 7s (0.0467372 minutes/block, 74.8868 x)
1318317537: block# 9926 - 5s (0.0467409 minutes/block, 74.8809 x)
1318317541: block# 9927 - 4s (0.0467429 minutes/block, 74.8777 x)
1318317544: block# 9928 - 3s (0.0467432 minutes/block, 74.8772 x)
DeathAndTaxes
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October 11, 2011, 07:31:12 AM
 #128

Another 600 blocks and it looks like average block time is faster.

Block 8900 = avg block time from block 0 to 8900 -  2.7695 s
Block 9200 = avg block time from block 0 to 9200 - 2.7785 s (0.3% decrease over 300 blocks)
Block 9900 = avg block time from block 0 to 9900 - 2.7405 s (1.3% increase over 600 blocks)

So network isn't even slowing anymore.  9900 blocks = 316,800 blocks already mined.  Hell good news is that in ~16 hours total blocks mined will exceed CH 1 mil pre-mine stash.  In a week SC will pass Bitcoin in number of coins mined.  In 3 weeks it will have more coins that bitcoin will ever have!

What is the value of a solid coin if there are 21 million on the market in the first month?
How much are all the solid coins from SC 1.0 worth collectively?  Less than a bit penny?
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October 11, 2011, 07:31:52 AM
 #129

Maged banned him before he could really post anything. the ban was not in line with actions of any thing i have seen on these boards. as far as proof, the proof is clear. do you seriously think people believe that coinhunter designed a rate of 3-4 blocks per second at peak and increasing block rate following increasing difficulty.

is it normal for people still reporting huge gap in block count and diff and anthing other than two forks??

You really don't get it? Max factor per diff up retargeting is +13%. Looks like you completely missed all the other alternative chains and their beginnings, and still you post shit about "3-4 blocks per second" and design decision...

Show us the huuuuuge gap in block count and diff. All the previous posts show the exact same chain...
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October 11, 2011, 07:33:52 AM
 #130

edit... An additional point: why hasn't the difficulty caught up to the hash rate yet? Does it not increase by up to 4x as in Bitcoin?

No it does not. Solidcoin is designed to raise the difficuly slow (+ max 10% [Diff*1,1]) and lower it fast (- 75% [Diff/4]). The main design purpose in the beginning of SC was to make it "miner friendly". Or in other words: to get coins faster.
So if hash rate increases the difficulty will adapt slowly. And if hash rate decreases the difficulty will adapt faster.
And that is what happens now, difficulty started at very low (1). But the calculation power from start on was that high that with a difficulty of 1 the blocks are not generated evey 3 minutes but way faster. But instead of jumping to the correct difficulty (lets asume 2.500 [just an excample value]) it increases 10% step wise. So it will take a very long time till it reaches it's appropriate difficulty. And till then those people with high computing power / many CPUs will be able to get a lot of bitcoins in a short amount of time.

There is no hacking or anything like that, it is just the design of starting at difficulty 1 with a max increase of 10% each 240 Blocks (correct me if it was another number), coliding with a starting hash rate that is equivalent to a MUCH higher difficulty.
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October 11, 2011, 07:34:08 AM
 #131

Another 600 blocks and it looks like average block time is faster.

Block 8900 = avg block time 2.7695 s
Block 9200 = avg block time 2.7785 s (0.3% decrease over 300 blocks)
Block 9900 = avg block time 2.7405 s (1.3% increase over 600 blocks)

So network isn't even slowing anymore.  9900 blocks = 316,800 blocks already mined.  Hell good news is that in ~16 hours total blocks mined will exceed CH 1 mil pre-mine stash.  In a week SC will pass Bitcoin in number of coins mined.  In 3 weeks it will have more coins that bitcoin will ever have!

With higher diff the stale rate decreases, that means more effective hashing power... You really can't argument with blocktimes of 2-3 seconds... wait some hours until diff is much higher and blocktime longer...
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October 11, 2011, 07:42:13 AM
 #132

With higher diff the stale rate decreases, that means more effective hashing power... You really can't argument with blocktimes of 2-3 seconds... wait some hours until diff is much higher and blocktime longer...

The damage is already done.  Over 300K coins have been mined in hours.  Even w/ max difficulty adjustment well over 1 million coins will be mined in first two days. Difficulty is 1/70th of where it should be so in effect early miners are being paid 70x the value of future miners.  Now I am not talking about future miners a decade from now I am talking about future miners like next week.  Miners with same hardware, same electrical costs, same efficiency will net 1/70th the reward.  Worse an enemy of the network has likely ammased hundreds of thousands of coins which can be dumped on the market.  So much for fair distribution. The Solid Coin 1 coin holders just saw their coins devalue into nothing.  There coins which took weeks to mine have been debased by block of coins pumped out every couple seconds.

It would be better if it was an attack because if it was by design well the design was garbage. 

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October 11, 2011, 07:42:33 AM
 #133

I would like to show you the over all hash rate increasing, since more and more people are installing the solidcoin client and start mining, but since i don't have a graph of it to do so, i just have to hope you can imagine it.

Just keep in mind the number of people / computers mining SC may have increased over the last hours, not only the difficulty.
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October 11, 2011, 08:26:43 AM
 #134

Most of you are trying to pick apart something you don't understand and making poor assumptions in the process. Has anyone ever considered that their immense Bitcoin knowledge may not apply to Solidcoin2?
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October 11, 2011, 08:33:48 AM
 #135

So the battle is still going on...

So I guess betting on the outcome is pretty safe from now on
http://webetcoins.com/rounds/41

Tipjar: 1Jason9ipk7ErRV6XUMsJy88dyB4K3iwct
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October 11, 2011, 08:36:14 AM
 #136

It appears that CoinHunter decided to rip off Geist...or perhaps even top it in terms of block speed


Geist Geld, the experimental cryptocurrency, is ready for yet another SolidCoin collapse Wink

Feed the Lolcust!
NMC: N6YQFkH9Gn9CTm4mpGwuLB5zLzqWTWFw67
BTC: 15F8xbgRBA1XZ4hmtdFDUasroa2A5rYg8M
GEG: gK5Lx6ypWgr69Gw9yGzE6dsA7kcuCRZRK
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October 11, 2011, 08:37:29 AM
 #137

At the current rate over 1 million coins will have been mined in the first day.  What do you think that just did to the value of Solid Coin 1.0 coins?
C) crushing attack that EXploited a design flaw.

I see what you did there. Smiley

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Third score


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October 11, 2011, 08:48:49 AM
 #138

For me, the only viable explanation about the stable block production rate with difficulty increasing by 2 orders of magnitude is that there is some bug in the retargeting algorithm and the hash validation code which effectively cancels out the difficulty number with some operations.

Thus the client reports difficulty increasing, but the hash validation does not take into account.

Whatever attackers might do, it can't hold for so long and with such a difficulty increase.

If it is so, and if the source code was released on time, such a bug would have certainly been located by now. Unfortunately, testosterone does not help in code development and cooperation.

BTW, Coinotron works unbelievably slow. It's like they're sending bytes manually.


Fiat no more.
Δοκιμάστε το http://multibit.org - Bitcoin client τώρα και στα Ελληνικά
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October 11, 2011, 09:00:09 AM
 #139

Or maybe CH should rip off Geist and claim the newfound turbo-charged blockrate as a feature ? Cheesy

Geist Geld, the experimental cryptocurrency, is ready for yet another SolidCoin collapse Wink

Feed the Lolcust!
NMC: N6YQFkH9Gn9CTm4mpGwuLB5zLzqWTWFw67
BTC: 15F8xbgRBA1XZ4hmtdFDUasroa2A5rYg8M
GEG: gK5Lx6ypWgr69Gw9yGzE6dsA7kcuCRZRK
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October 11, 2011, 09:14:35 AM
 #140

At the current rate over 1 million coins will have been mined in the first day.  What do you think that just did to the value of Solid Coin 1.0 coins?
C) crushing attack that EXploited a design flaw.

I see what you did there. Smiley

my tribute since they banned him because maged get mad at him that he was actually winning.

Yeah, I thought the ban was unwarranted. If Maged wanted to ban someone, there's a much better target that's trolling all these threads.

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