Bitcoin Forum
December 09, 2016, 03:39:10 PM *
News: To be able to use the next phase of the beta forum software, please ensure that your email address is correct/functional.
 
   Home   Help Search Donate Login Register  
Pages: « 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 [8] 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 »  All
  Print  
Author Topic: How many of you have been Zhoutonged?  (Read 24890 times)
cypherdoc
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1764



View Profile
December 20, 2011, 05:54:43 AM
 #141

How many?
1481297950
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1481297950

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1481297950
Reply with quote  #2

1481297950
Report to moderator
Advertised sites are not endorsed by the Bitcoin Forum. They may be unsafe, untrustworthy, or illegal in your jurisdiction. Advertise here.
zhoutong
VIP
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 490


View Profile WWW
December 20, 2011, 05:57:54 AM
 #142

How many?

A lot, seriously.

Founder of NameTerrific (https://www.nameterrific.com/). Co-founder of CoinJar (https://coinjar.io/)

Donations for my future Bitcoin projects: 19Uk3tiD5XkBcmHyQYhJxp9QHoub7RosVb
cypherdoc
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1764



View Profile
December 20, 2011, 05:58:55 AM
 #143


LOL!  Way to go Zhoutong.  I'm rooting for you. Wink
epetroel
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 428


View Profile
December 20, 2011, 06:01:19 AM
 #144

Count me in Smiley

tvbcof
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1988


View Profile
December 20, 2011, 06:14:45 AM
 #145


If getting 'zhoutonged' means getting reamed using Bitcoinica, what would be a good word for doubling one's money on the same platform?


zhoubling your money?

<chuckles>


Your suggestion scales best.  Needed because I've now zhoudrupled my money.

I'll re-iterate that a monkey could do OK on Bitcoinica if they guess right.  I'll take a breather to see if things retract a bit, then try yet again to loose it all.

phorensic
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 630



View Profile
December 20, 2011, 07:39:35 AM
 #146

I'm up like 20% for the day.  No zhoutongin' fo' me.
DonnyCMU
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 143



View Profile
December 20, 2011, 08:17:55 AM
 #147

Let me get this correct... So when the price spiked up and people were trading on Mt.Gox at $4.5,  Zhoutong's genius matching algorithm put the buy price at a $1 spread and force liquidate people's position at $4.9 Huh??  Angry

So when all these forced buy bitcoins are actually bought in Mt.Gox market at any price around $4.1-4.5, the all difference goes into Bitcoinica's pocket?

I've been Zhoutonged good!!!
Cluster2k
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1512


View Profile
December 20, 2011, 11:11:52 AM
 #148

So when all these forced buy bitcoins are actually bought in Mt.Gox market at any price around $4.1-4.5, the all difference goes into Bitcoinica's pocket?

The casino always wins.  It's an unregulated market in the financial equivalent of the Wild West.

Do not send bitcoins to me: 16b8s7pBJ9rUmsExNW25qD5VUqVqRPZuXu
100% solar powered bitcoin generation
Mushoz
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 686


Bitbuy


View Profile WWW
December 20, 2011, 11:14:27 AM
 #149

With those fast movements and shallow order book they _have_ to have big spreads, or Bitcoinica risks losing a lot of money on spikes. They would effectively be Zhoutonging themselves! I agree that those big spreads suck as a trader, though  Sad

www.bitbuy.nl - Koop eenvoudig, snel en goedkoop bitcoins bij Bitbuy!
FreeMoney
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1246


Strength in numbers


View Profile WWW
December 20, 2011, 11:40:23 AM
 #150

With those fast movements and shallow order book they _have_ to have big spreads, or Bitcoinica risks losing a lot of money on spikes. They would effectively be Zhoutonging themselves! I agree that those big spreads suck as a trader, though  Sad

Why not liquidate at Gox and give the customer whatever price they actually got?

Play Bitcoin Poker at sealswithclubs.eu. We're active and open to everyone.
Mushoz
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 686


Bitbuy


View Profile WWW
December 20, 2011, 11:43:31 AM
 #151

With those fast movements and shallow order book they _have_ to have big spreads, or Bitcoinica risks losing a lot of money on spikes. They would effectively be Zhoutonging themselves! I agree that those big spreads suck as a trader, though  Sad

Why not liquidate at Gox and give the customer whatever price they actually got?

Because although it will work most of the time, sometimes when the prices moves too fast, they aren't able to liquidate on time, which would effectively cause the account of that person who was liquidated to have a negative balance. And they can't be sure that person is honest enough to deposit more funds to make the balance go to zero or positive again. And if they don't deposit more, Bitcoinica would have lost money themselves.

Edit: Also, when a large position is liquidated, that in itself will push the price up or drive the price down. If that effect is big enough due to a shallow order book, that can also cause the liquidation not to be executed for the right price, which will leave a negative balance.

By calculating spreads, they are effectively calculating the risk and protecting themselves against it. This allows them to guarantee liquidity.

www.bitbuy.nl - Koop eenvoudig, snel en goedkoop bitcoins bij Bitbuy!
notme
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1526


View Profile
December 20, 2011, 12:10:46 PM
 #152

I have a lot of cash in my account. Is the only way I can get it out is by a wire or can I just use it to buy bitcoin?

If I have to use a wire... WTF....  If not, tell me how to do it:)

Thanks

Click "exchange" in top bar.  Put in amount of USD to "sell" for BTC, click "Exchange".  Poof, you have bitcoins.

https://www.bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf
While no idea is perfect, some ideas are useful.
12jh3odyAAaR2XedPKZNCR4X4sebuotQzN
Mushoz
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 686


Bitbuy


View Profile WWW
December 20, 2011, 12:11:40 PM
 #153

I have a lot of cash in my account. Is the only way I can get it out is by a wire or can I just use it to buy bitcoin?

If I have to use a wire... WTF....  If not, tell me how to do it:)

Thanks

Or withdraw to your Mtgox account via Mtgox codes, and withdraw your funds via Mtgox.

www.bitbuy.nl - Koop eenvoudig, snel en goedkoop bitcoins bij Bitbuy!
epetroel
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 428


View Profile
December 20, 2011, 01:49:51 PM
 #154

Quote
Because although it will work most of the time, sometimes when the prices moves too fast, they aren't able to liquidate on time, which would effectively cause the account of that person who was liquidated to have a negative balance. And they can't be sure that person is honest enough to deposit more funds to make the balance go to zero or positive again. And if they don't deposit more, Bitcoinica would have lost money themselves.

And it seems that doesn't always work either.  After my position was liquidated, I still had a -$69 balance.  I deposited some money to cover it, but I can't imagine that everyone would do that.
Mushoz
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 686


Bitbuy


View Profile WWW
December 20, 2011, 01:55:45 PM
 #155

Quote
Because although it will work most of the time, sometimes when the prices moves too fast, they aren't able to liquidate on time, which would effectively cause the account of that person who was liquidated to have a negative balance. And they can't be sure that person is honest enough to deposit more funds to make the balance go to zero or positive again. And if they don't deposit more, Bitcoinica would have lost money themselves.

And it seems that doesn't always work either.  After my position was liquidated, I still had a -$69 balance.  I deposited some money to cover it, but I can't imagine that everyone would do that.

Yeah, spreads only reduce the risk. They don't completely eliminate the risks. That's why they must find a good balance between dampening their risk and providing smaller spreads to stay competitive. That's exactly why the spread is increased in situations when there's more risks (High volatility and/or shallow order book) because they need to protect themselves against those risks, and later reduced again once the dust settles down.

www.bitbuy.nl - Koop eenvoudig, snel en goedkoop bitcoins bij Bitbuy!
cypherdoc
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1764



View Profile
December 20, 2011, 02:57:04 PM
 #156

Quote
Because although it will work most of the time, sometimes when the prices moves too fast, they aren't able to liquidate on time, which would effectively cause the account of that person who was liquidated to have a negative balance. And they can't be sure that person is honest enough to deposit more funds to make the balance go to zero or positive again. And if they don't deposit more, Bitcoinica would have lost money themselves.

And it seems that doesn't always work either.  After my position was liquidated, I still had a -$69 balance.  I deposited some money to cover it, but I can't imagine that everyone would do that.

Yeah, spreads only reduce the risk. They don't completely eliminate the risks. That's why they must find a good balance between dampening their risk and providing smaller spreads to stay competitive. That's exactly why the spread is increased in situations when there's more risks (High volatility and/or shallow order book) because they need to protect themselves against those risks, and later reduced again once the dust settles down.

the Voice of Reason. Cheesy
zhoutong
VIP
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 490


View Profile WWW
December 21, 2011, 12:01:40 AM
 #157

Let me get this correct... So when the price spiked up and people were trading on Mt.Gox at $4.5,  Zhoutong's genius matching algorithm put the buy price at a $1 spread and force liquidate people's position at $4.9 Huh??  Angry

So when all these forced buy bitcoins are actually bought in Mt.Gox market at any price around $4.1-4.5, the all difference goes into Bitcoinica's pocket?

I've been Zhoutonged good!!!

Can you send an email to support@bitcoinica.com about this? We'd like to compensate you on this.

While it's true that our algorithm sets the price by balancing and predicting the benefit and the risk, after all the trading, there's no point of predicting, and we can clearly see that the prediction was wrong. So we are perfectly okay to refund you the "unexpected profit" we made from you.

I hope this explanation makes sense.

Founder of NameTerrific (https://www.nameterrific.com/). Co-founder of CoinJar (https://coinjar.io/)

Donations for my future Bitcoin projects: 19Uk3tiD5XkBcmHyQYhJxp9QHoub7RosVb
cypherdoc
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1764



View Profile
December 21, 2011, 01:43:04 AM
 #158

Let me get this correct... So when the price spiked up and people were trading on Mt.Gox at $4.5,  Zhoutong's genius matching algorithm put the buy price at a $1 spread and force liquidate people's position at $4.9 Huh??  Angry

So when all these forced buy bitcoins are actually bought in Mt.Gox market at any price around $4.1-4.5, the all difference goes into Bitcoinica's pocket?

I've been Zhoutonged good!!!

Can you send an email to support@bitcoinica.com about this? We'd like to compensate you on this.

While it's true that our algorithm sets the price by balancing and predicting the benefit and the risk, after all the trading, there's no point of predicting, and we can clearly see that the prediction was wrong. So we are perfectly okay to refund you the "unexpected profit" we made from you.

I hope this explanation makes sense.

come one come all, Zhoutong proposes to refund you all?
zhoutong
VIP
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 490


View Profile WWW
December 21, 2011, 02:05:07 AM
 #159

Let me get this correct... So when the price spiked up and people were trading on Mt.Gox at $4.5,  Zhoutong's genius matching algorithm put the buy price at a $1 spread and force liquidate people's position at $4.9 Huh??  Angry

So when all these forced buy bitcoins are actually bought in Mt.Gox market at any price around $4.1-4.5, the all difference goes into Bitcoinica's pocket?

I've been Zhoutonged good!!!

Can you send an email to support@bitcoinica.com about this? We'd like to compensate you on this.

While it's true that our algorithm sets the price by balancing and predicting the benefit and the risk, after all the trading, there's no point of predicting, and we can clearly see that the prediction was wrong. So we are perfectly okay to refund you the "unexpected profit" we made from you.

I hope this explanation makes sense.

come one come all, Zhoutong proposes to refund you all?

Actually I did reverse/refund those obviously inaccurate forced liquidations. But it just happens that some were missing (excuse me hundreds of orders come at once).

Founder of NameTerrific (https://www.nameterrific.com/). Co-founder of CoinJar (https://coinjar.io/)

Donations for my future Bitcoin projects: 19Uk3tiD5XkBcmHyQYhJxp9QHoub7RosVb
cypherdoc
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1764



View Profile
December 21, 2011, 02:15:00 AM
 #160

Let me get this correct... So when the price spiked up and people were trading on Mt.Gox at $4.5,  Zhoutong's genius matching algorithm put the buy price at a $1 spread and force liquidate people's position at $4.9 Huh??  Angry

So when all these forced buy bitcoins are actually bought in Mt.Gox market at any price around $4.1-4.5, the all difference goes into Bitcoinica's pocket?

I've been Zhoutonged good!!!

Can you send an email to support@bitcoinica.com about this? We'd like to compensate you on this.

While it's true that our algorithm sets the price by balancing and predicting the benefit and the risk, after all the trading, there's no point of predicting, and we can clearly see that the prediction was wrong. So we are perfectly okay to refund you the "unexpected profit" we made from you.

I hope this explanation makes sense.

to be honest, i don't see any explanation as to why or how you determined "unexpected profits".
Pages: « 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 [8] 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 »  All
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Sponsored by , a Bitcoin-accepting VPN.
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!