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Author Topic: FortuneJack Casino Refuses to Pay 20 BTC Won From Jackpot!  (Read 2317 times)
Lauda
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January 15, 2019, 09:53:14 PM
 #101

Not disagreeing with you, but it is pretty reasonable to have staff monitor a newly released game that was basically in a beta state where players were betting real money.
Quite reasonable, but these thing happen in every industry (see teeGUMES's post while I was writing). If there was no malice, then it was handled properly. However, if there was malice then the casino deserves consequences. Given that they had very little to gain from this, I highly doubt someone intentionally acted malliciously (given that you could destroy your reputation for pocket change).

Especially ones who make a 0.009BTC deposit?

There have been and currently are companies large and small, that grow too fast too quick. They see the influx of money and profit coming in and they get greedy. They do not hire the correct amount of staff, instill the proper securities, and instead spend the money on marketing.
Could say the same for Facebook, heh.

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January 15, 2019, 10:00:48 PM
 #102


Why are they sympathetic towards the OP if he is a cheat? It makes no sense at all.
 

OP is no saint here. He could have showed good moral judgement and messaged support. He instead decided to exploit the bug and ended up hitting a jackpot. Be it not for FJ irresponsible error of letting the public play a possibly buggy game with real money(all new games could have bugs, this is why you do BETA tests first), I would be vote for the casino.

I wasn't the one calling the OP a "saint". That would be fortunejack in their attempt at sweettalking the op into abandoning his win.

This goes to  FortuneJack

2- if you were so sure this player was abusing a bug on your system, why did you have to compensate him + give him his deposit back?

Hush money.
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January 15, 2019, 10:02:43 PM
 #103

Hello everyone thank you all so far for your numerous inputs and countless insights to the current situation that is in front of you. I believe I have a reasonable solution to all this which was in fact suggested by another user. If you could all please read and post +1 if you agree with this as a reasonable solution for both parties or simply - 1 for against.

We have ascertained many facts regarding this case. I had acquired roughly 2 BTC from the bugged money. During the 13 hours within casino grounds however I had not spent more than 0.2 BTC on any slot or casino orientated game and that at best I had not used more no more than 0.209 BTC throughout the whole night. Casino has acknowledged they were slow to respond to the situation which cause this whole mess to occur. Then would it be possible for the casino to agree that if they had given me their bug bounty of 0.2 BTC earlier before I had gotten my way over to the Plinko section. I would have in fact had reached the jackpot with their bug bounty money. I feel this is 99% possible and a very solid solution that would diffuse confusion of whether it was the bugged money at play or indeed my initial deposit. Would the community find this highly agreeable? As stated please comment simply with a +1 for and - 1 against.

Thank you all so far in helping me build my case and helping me reach a resolution with the casino. You guys have all been very helpful. Even the negative ones.
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January 15, 2019, 10:26:34 PM
 #104

I don't know if there was more malice behind this, but if FortuneJack knew verusfides was a plinko player and had a good plinko win coming up from his seed, they might have wanted him to win using "fake balance" to avoid paying out a large win.

This seems like a conspiracy theory at best, do you really think they are monitoring players like that? Especially ones who make a 0.009BTC deposit?

Probably not if they aren't even monitoring their own games paying 70 consecutive wins in a row and immediately contacting the effected players.

I guess that depends on several factors such as:

Do they have a specific system in place that can detect undetected bugs?
Did they have the correct personnel available at the time? (They should at all times, but perhaps they didn't at this time, right?)
Do they have it as normal protocol to monitor all games at all times? (Like some high tech security center at a vegas casino ((doubt it))).
Actually I read through some archives and they do have some program called a PBA? Which is short for Player Bet Analysis. I'm guessing it gives insight into whether players were betting very erratically as if they had acquired funds through exploits of casino grounds. It's in one of the resolved posts in AskGamblers FortuneJack complaints and mentioned in a staff members response to a player. Prior to that I had no knowledge they had that kind of software for players.
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January 15, 2019, 10:28:26 PM
 #105

Actually I read through some archives and they do have some program called a PBA? Which is short for Player Bet Analysis. I'm guessing it gives insight into whether players were betting very erratically as if they had acquired funds through exploits of casino grounds. It's in one of the resolved posts in AskGamblers FortuneJack complaints and mentioned in a staff members response to a player. Prior to that I had no knowledge they had that kind of software for players.
FJ should clarify why this was not caught by this detection system (if it exists/is being used?) or the staff sooner.

Also I'm reminding you again to merge posts. Smiley

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January 15, 2019, 10:33:11 PM
 #106

Actually I read through some archives and they do have some program called a PBA? Which is short for Player Bet Analysis. I'm guessing it gives insight into whether players were betting very erratically as if they had acquired funds through exploits of casino grounds. It's in one of the resolved posts in AskGamblers FortuneJack complaints and mentioned in a staff members response to a player. Prior to that I had no knowledge they had that kind of software for players.
FJ should clarify why this was not caught by this detection system (if it exists/is being used?) or the staff sooner.

Also I'm reminding you again to merge posts. Smiley
but I wanted it to be a separate post and unique in its own right as a means to end the ongoing problem with the casino in hopes we may all move on to greater things in life. Like taking unexpected shots at Lauda unexpectedly and out of the blue. Smiley
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January 15, 2019, 10:40:19 PM
 #107

Hello everyone thank you all so far for your numerous inputs and countless insights to the current situation that is in front of you. I believe I have a reasonable solution to all this which was in fact suggested by another user. If you could all please read and post +1 if you agree with this as a reasonable solution for both parties or simply - 1 for against.

We have ascertained many facts regarding this case. I had acquired roughly 2 BTC from the bugged money. During the 13 hours within casino grounds however I had not spent more than 0.2 BTC on any slot or casino orientated game and that at best I had not used more no more than 0.209 BTC throughout the whole night. Casino has acknowledged they were slow to respond to the situation which cause this whole mess to occur. Then would it be possible for the casino to agree that if they had given me their bug bounty of 0.2 BTC earlier before I had gotten my way over to the Plinko section. I would have in fact had reached the jackpot with their bug bounty money. I feel this is 99% possible and a very solid solution that would diffuse confusion of whether it was the bugged money at play or indeed my initial deposit. Would the community find this highly agreeable? As stated please comment simply with a +1 for and - 1 against.

Thank you all so far in helping me build my case and helping me reach a resolution with the casino. You guys have all been very helpful. Even the negative ones.

but I wanted it to be a separate post and unique in its own right as a means to end the ongoing problem with the casino in hopes we may all move on to greater things in life. Like taking unexpected shots at Lauda unexpectedly and out of the blue. Smiley

The quality of your posts is sharply decreasing. Stop trying to pander to the side that are partially against FJ/Lauda/FJ Sigs and stick to posting facts.
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January 15, 2019, 11:01:57 PM
 #108

Hello everyone thank you all so far for your numerous inputs and countless insights to the current situation that is in front of you. I believe I have a reasonable solution to all this which was in fact suggested by another user. If you could all please read and post +1 if you agree with this as a reasonable solution for both parties or simply - 1 for against.

We have ascertained many facts regarding this case. I had acquired roughly 2 BTC from the bugged money. During the 13 hours within casino grounds however I had not spent more than 0.2 BTC on any slot or casino orientated game and that at best I had not used more no more than 0.209 BTC throughout the whole night. Casino has acknowledged they were slow to respond to the situation which cause this whole mess to occur. Then would it be possible for the casino to agree that if they had given me their bug bounty of 0.2 BTC earlier before I had gotten my way over to the Plinko section. I would have in fact had reached the jackpot with their bug bounty money. I feel this is 99% possible and a very solid solution that would diffuse confusion of whether it was the bugged money at play or indeed my initial deposit. Would the community find this highly agreeable? As stated please comment simply with a +1 for and - 1 against.

Thank you all so far in helping me build my case and helping me reach a resolution with the casino. You guys have all been very helpful. Even the negative ones.

but I wanted it to be a separate post and unique in its own right as a means to end the ongoing problem with the casino in hopes we may all move on to greater things in life. Like taking unexpected shots at Lauda unexpectedly and out of the blue. Smiley

The quality of your posts is sharply decreasing. Stop trying to pander to the side that are partially against FJ/Lauda/FJ Sigs and stick to posting facts.
Sorry I'm just trying to be a little hopeful seeing as how the solution provided above are based strictly on facts. I'm simply demonstrating a solution where the casino could deem this scenario as something that would have most likely happened, if they had acted upon their initial wrongdoing sooner. I am in no way saying they should not acknowledge what clearly shows their own negligence but, allowing them to save a little face. I have already stated it's almost embarrassing  in regards to what the FJ representative David has shown for evidence. Which doesn't even come close to the amount of information I have provided this thread without any hidden logs. I was just trying to lighten the mood on the situation as it has caused a great amount of stress on me, but in no way have I forgotten why I have been forced to start a thread to prove to the casino and it's staff the way they are proceeding regarding my case is highly unprofessional. I advise you not to think so lightly of me that I would for a second forget how hard I have been fighting for this ever since they denied this from me.
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January 15, 2019, 11:22:08 PM
 #109

Sorry for the link issue, the link in response has now been updated and bets are now public and can be viewed on this link https://drive.google.com/file/d/1iLLzeap4MdHwMeVyun3lHA2JxUkPG8lg/view?usp=sharing
Without bugged wins, was it possible for player to place plinko bet and all other bets before they played plinko?

If answer is no, case closed. If answer is yes, you own them 20BTC, it is simple as that.
If you take a compensation (in this case a bug bounty), you are legally entitled to nothing. Demanding money like this afterwards is in fact illegal.
They took compensation for Adrenaline. 20BTC came from plinko bet.

Player won $42M, casino said it was slot malfunction and she took compensation (free meal)
https://youtu.be/FmNiiu6QrAA?t=130
$42 Million Win a Slot Malfunction?
According to articles, case was investigated by Colorado Division of Gaming and she was payed additional 7$:
https://www.denverpost.com/2010/05/19/42-9-million-slot-jackpot-should-have-been-20/
https://spectrum.ieee.org/riskfactor/computing/software/woman-who-thought-she-won-42-million-at-casino-gets-2018

Similar case, player won €43M because of slot error, casino offered him free dinner which player denied, case was taken on a court of law and rumor says settlement was €1M:
http://www.comps4free.com/merlaku-bregenz-slots-jackpot/
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2215072/Casino-rejected-mans-40m-slot-machine-win-software-error-agrees-pay-1m-settle-claim.html
https://www.thelocal.ch/20121011/swiss-mans-jackpot-win-slashed-in-casino-deal

OP hire a lawyer. This is best you can do right now.

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January 15, 2019, 11:40:17 PM
Merited by DarkStar_ (8), suchmoon (7), yahoo62278 (4), The Pharmacist (3), OgNasty (2), bones261 (2), marlboroza (2), Hhampuz (1), teeGUMES (1)
 #110

Credit to FortuneJack for making the bet history public. Although I disagree with their verdict, I appreciate the transparency in comparison to other casinos that have been in similar positions.

Here is my take on the matter after looking at the bets and withdrawal history more closely. I'd appreciate if both parties read it in its entirety before dismissing any points.

To start with, verusfides did receive 2+ BTC from the bugged rounds of Adrenaline. However, I think it is hard to say this is due to intentional abuse. Here is my reasoning for that:

1. Verusfides only doubled his bet sizing once, and that was after the second bugged round. I think this is pretty reasonable to do after doubling one's initial deposit, and 2 60x wins in a row doesn't necessarily indicate a game is bugged.
2. Adrenaline is essentially a re-skinned version of Moneypot. Setting an auto-cashout multiplier doesn't stop the player from manually cashing out at a certain point. Verus continued to manually cash out at low multipliers, even after upping the auto-cashout to 200x. If he was intentionally abusing what he perceived to be a bug, he would be losing money by doing this.
3. All of his higher wagers above .2 mBTC were not made during bugged rounds, and half of them did not have an auto cashout set. He actually lost money during this part.
4. Adrenaline was a recent addition to the website, and this was verusfides' first time playing. Owing to the nature of slot machine "jackpots", where users can trigger a set of bonus spins that award very high multipliers consecutively, it is entirely possible a new user might believe this to be an intended game mechanic.

Owing to the above reasons, I think it is fair to say that verusfides did not act in bad faith by continuing to play with his winnings.

The next question is did FortuneJack act in good faith as well?

According to FortuneJack's logs, verusfides immediately tried to cash out. This brought his bugged winnings to the site's attention. Indeed, FortuneJack manually reviewed his withdrawal and denied it. Rather than freezing his account, however, they allowed him to keep playing.

This means that FortuneJack was aware that verusfides' balance was illegitimate prior to winning the plinko jackpot, not after.

To me, it feels unethical to essentially "freeroll" a customer, allowing them to continue gambling with no intention of ever paying out in the event that they were to win anything else.

In my opinion, FJ should have frozen his account at this point, awarded him with the .2 BTC bounty for major bugs, and adjusted his balance accordingly. If that had happened, neither party would be in this situation.

It also seems to me unfair to retroactively penalize someone for hitting a jackpot they earned in good faith. Given verusfides not only identified a critical bug through his play, which in itself should have earned him the .2 BTC bounty, but also lost out on a large potential financial windfall through no fault of his own, I believe he deserves higher compensation.

First, I looked to see what would have happened if verusfides had been credited the .2 BTC immediately and placed the same wagers on Plinko. A graph of his balance is shown below.



Verusfides would have busted and been down over 1 BTC before finally hitting the jackpot. Given his previous deposits to the site total less than .5 BTC, it is unlikely he would have continued this betting pattern and achieved the same result. Therefore, I don't think FortuneJack should be forced to pay out the full 20 BTC.

What I propose as a reasonable solution, and I hope both parties will agree to this, is to re-evaluate verusfides' plinko bets as if he started with the .2 BTC balance FJ should have paid him anyway, instead of the 2.082 BTC he had at the time. Rather than take the face value of each bet, count them proportionally to what his correct bankroll should have been at the time, ie. 10% of what he actually wagered. This would result in verusfides hitting the jackpot for 2 BTC, instead of 20 BTC.

In my opinion, a 2 BTC payout is the fairest solution. This is arguably what the outcome would have been had FJ been more proactive with the situation, and also happens to fit nicely between the numbers both parties are offering by a factor of 10 on each side.
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January 15, 2019, 11:43:23 PM
 #111

~
Hm, ok...
Has everyone else received 0.2BTC as compensation for Adrenaline bug(not plinko bug) or only you?

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January 15, 2019, 11:45:40 PM
Last edit: January 16, 2019, 01:25:11 AM by teeGUMES
 #112

There are often places where you can receive free lawyer consultation up to 30minutes.
Nothing done or said in this thread will end in FortuneJack paying you the 20btc. What is currently happening is the decision to either leave it or to paint the trust page of FortuneJack with red negatives and have it be a shame to wear the FortuneJack signature/avatar. (Whether this does 20btc worth of damage to their reputation/traffic is debatable)

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January 16, 2019, 12:11:05 AM
 #113

~
Hm, ok...
Has everyone else received 0.2BTC as compensation for Adrenaline bug(not plinko bug) or only you?
I don't know also if I am the only one that did receive it that's something they should personally explain. Like I said I told them I wasn't even satisfied with their outcome in the first place. Which led me to question everything they've said to me which is why this thread even exists currently.

What really grinds my gears is that they knew of this whole thing in occurrence even before I had assumed my starting play position on Adrenaline. Like the other users have posted why didn't they just freeze the account or disable the game. They're in gross negligence aren't they?
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January 16, 2019, 12:17:18 AM
 #114

Thank you for that post @MadZ, I also think that would be a fair solution that everyone involved should be happy with.

What does OP think about it?

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.
MAJESTIC..
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January 16, 2019, 12:18:43 AM
 #115

~
Hm, ok...
Has everyone else received 0.2BTC as compensation for Adrenaline bug(not plinko bug) or only you?
I don't know also if I am the only one that did receive it that's something they should personally explain. Like I said I told them I wasn't even satisfied with their outcome in the first place. Which led me to question everything they've said to me which is why this thread even exists currently.

What really grinds my gears is that they knew of this whole thing in occurrence even before I had assumed my starting play position on Adrenaline. Like the other users have posted why didn't they just freeze the account or disable the game. They're in gross negligence aren't they?

I bet you're the only one who got 0.2BTC because you won the 20BTC, and they're hoping it will keep you quiet about the larger win.

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January 16, 2019, 12:19:59 AM
 #116

~
Hm, ok...
Has everyone else received 0.2BTC as compensation for Adrenaline bug(not plinko bug) or only you?
I don't know also if I am the only one that did receive it that's something they should personally explain. Like I said I told them I wasn't even satisfied with their outcome in the first place. Which led me to question everything they've said to me which is why this thread even exists currently.

What really grinds my gears is that they knew of this whole thing in occurrence even before I had assumed my starting play position on Adrenaline. Like the other users have posted why didn't they just freeze the account or disable the game. They're in gross negligence aren't they?

I bet you're the only one who got 0.2BTC because you won the 20BTC, and they're hoping it will keep you quiet about the larger win.

They have a bug bounty program that they've been talking about in their official Discord. It is meant for people to find bugs and get rewarded (They have different sizes of the reward).

I highly doubt that this would be anything close to hush money.

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..WIN 1 BITCOIN ON EVERY PREMIER LEAGUE MATCHDAY..
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January 16, 2019, 12:35:26 AM
 #117

~
Hm, ok...
Has everyone else received 0.2BTC as compensation for Adrenaline bug(not plinko bug) or only you?
I don't know also if I am the only one that did receive it that's something they should personally explain. Like I said I told them I wasn't even satisfied with their outcome in the first place. Which led me to question everything they've said to me which is why this thread even exists currently.

What really grinds my gears is that they knew of this whole thing in occurrence even before I had assumed my starting play position on Adrenaline. Like the other users have posted why didn't they just freeze the account or disable the game. They're in gross negligence aren't they?

I bet you're the only one who got 0.2BTC because you won the 20BTC, and they're hoping it will keep you quiet about the larger win.

They have a bug bounty program that they've been talking about in their official Discord. It is meant for people to find bugs and get rewarded (They have different sizes of the reward).

I highly doubt that this would be anything close to hush money.

True, I didn't properly research this. This is the official policy:
Small Bugs are awarded 0.02 BTC and include Visual, and Text Bugs; Medium Bugs which will be transactions or incorrect win/bet situations will be rewarded by 0.08 BTC; Large Bugs, the ones that touch Fairness Issue, are most rewarded by the company and are worth of 0.2 Bitcoins.

He was given 0.12BTC more than he should have been given. All other players were given 0.08BTC:

We decided to seize the winnings because of the valid reason, of the first win coming from the bug, you were refunded your deposit and given a bug bounty (like all other players affected by a bug) of 0.08 BTC.

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January 16, 2019, 12:42:16 AM
 #118

~
Hm, ok...
Has everyone else received 0.2BTC as compensation for Adrenaline bug(not plinko bug) or only you?
I don't know also if I am the only one that did receive it that's something they should personally explain. Like I said I told them I wasn't even satisfied with their outcome in the first place. Which led me to question everything they've said to me which is why this thread even exists currently.

What really grinds my gears is that they knew of this whole thing in occurrence even before I had assumed my starting play position on Adrenaline. Like the other users have posted why didn't they just freeze the account or disable the game. They're in gross negligence aren't they?

I bet you're the only one who got 0.2BTC because you won the 20BTC, and they're hoping it will keep you quiet about the larger win.

They have a bug bounty program that they've been talking about in their official Discord. It is meant for people to find bugs and get rewarded (They have different sizes of the reward).

I highly doubt that this would be anything close to hush money.

True, I didn't properly research this. This is the official policy:
Small Bugs are awarded 0.02 BTC and include Visual, and Text Bugs; Medium Bugs which will be transactions or incorrect win/bet situations will be rewarded by 0.08 BTC; Large Bugs, the ones that touch Fairness Issue, are most rewarded by the company and are worth of 0.2 Bitcoins.

He was given 0.12BTC more than he should have been given. All other players were given 0.08BTC:

We decided to seize the winnings because of the valid reason, of the first win coming from the bug, you were refunded your deposit and given a bug bounty (like all other players affected by a bug) of 0.08 BTC.

Apparently he was given 0.08 first, but then they increased it to 0.2BTC. If this was meant to be hush money, perhaps. I think they felt with the guy though (from the conversations I've seen screenshots of).

████████████████████████████
████████▀▀ █▀ █▀ ▀██████████
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MAJESTIC..
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.
..WIN 1 BITCOIN ON EVERY PREMIER LEAGUE MATCHDAY..
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.
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January 16, 2019, 12:48:42 AM
 #119

-snip-
Apparently he was given 0.08 first, but then they increased it to 0.2BTC. If this was meant to be hush money, perhaps. I think they felt with the guy though (from the conversations I've seen screenshots of).

Agreed. Would be nice to get some official FortuneJack statements though (are you able to ask them to respond?)

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January 16, 2019, 12:53:08 AM
 #120

~
Hm, ok...
Has everyone else received 0.2BTC as compensation for Adrenaline bug(not plinko bug) or only you?
I don't know also if I am the only one that did receive it that's something they should personally explain. Like I said I told them I wasn't even satisfied with their outcome in the first place. Which led me to question everything they've said to me which is why this thread even exists currently.

What really grinds my gears is that they knew of this whole thing in occurrence even before I had assumed my starting play position on Adrenaline. Like the other users have posted why didn't they just freeze the account or disable the game. They're in gross negligence aren't they?

I bet you're the only one who got 0.2BTC because you won the 20BTC, and they're hoping it will keep you quiet about the larger win.

They have a bug bounty program that they've been talking about in their official Discord. It is meant for people to find bugs and get rewarded (They have different sizes of the reward).

I highly doubt that this would be anything close to hush money.

True, I didn't properly research this. This is the official policy:
Small Bugs are awarded 0.02 BTC and include Visual, and Text Bugs; Medium Bugs which will be transactions or incorrect win/bet situations will be rewarded by 0.08 BTC; Large Bugs, the ones that touch Fairness Issue, are most rewarded by the company and are worth of 0.2 Bitcoins.

He was given 0.12BTC more than he should have been given. All other players were given 0.08BTC:

We decided to seize the winnings because of the valid reason, of the first win coming from the bug, you were refunded your deposit and given a bug bounty (like all other players affected by a bug) of 0.08 BTC.

Apparently he was given 0.08 first, but then they increased it to 0.2BTC. If this was meant to be hush money, perhaps. I think they felt with the guy though (from the conversations I've seen screenshots of).
yeah judging by everyone's outputs and my own opinion I feel they were trying to just quickly diffuse the situation knowing very well it could turn into something like this very rapidly depending on the person's knowledge of forums and ability to communicate accordingly with others. Idk why they are willing to take it this far though. Also regarding the bug bounties they never addressed it for Adrenaline. Wouldn't it have been in everyones best interest for them to not have allowed the game to continue running during the time the bug took into effect? Doesn't it really seem as is they let people play with money they couldn't withdrawal to prevent the casino from seeing any losses from players who played with the adrenaline bug in effect. I mean all of this seems so convenient to them but inconvenient to the players they claim to put first.
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