Tradesatoshi - BEWARE! Blocking without reasons.

[xtraelv]

4. Some failed to complete it, because they had different data in their profile and their IDs. (they also couldn't change their data in profile - fields are read-only).

It appears that the majority of the issues stem from people using either fake, altered or erroneous identities when registering.

This is in breach of their terms and conditions which specifically state (these are their old terms and conditions from when people signed up).



https://web.archive.org/web/20170714045125/http://www.tradesatoshi.com/Home/Terms  (2016-2017 terms)

Use of the Platform As a condition of your use of the Platform, you represent and warrant to, and covenant with TradeSatoshi that: (a) you have reached the age of majority in your jurisdiction of residence; (b) you possess the legal authority to create a binding legal obligation; (c) you shall use the Platform in accordance with these Terms of Use and all applicable laws; and (d) all information supplied by you on the Platform is true, accurate, current and complete.

While is sympathize with people in this predicament it is a common thing people tend to do when they try to use a website using a false identity. (Give partially inaccurate or completely inaccurate identity).

I would recommend spending some $ and finding out the registered address of the exchange and sending a letter explaining the situation and providing written proof of identity. (Or if there are a lot of funds - change you name by deed poll if you gave a fake one)

It is possible that they checked the identity on a database and found no match. A lot of exchanges are forced by law to start KYC. Even some of the decentralized exchanges are on the radar of law enforcement.

https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2019/02/secs-action-against-decentralized-exchange-raises-constitutional-questions

https://bravenewcoin.com/insights/sec-enforcement-threat-driving-kyc-aml-implementation-at-decentralized

I haven't personally used Tradesatoshi for more than a year so I can't comment on whether much has changed.

[DiHunter]

...
It appears that the majority of the issues stem from people using either fake, altered or erroneous identities when registering.

This is in breach of their terms and conditions which specifically state (these are their old terms and conditions from when people signed up).

...

Use of the Platform As a condition of your use of the Platform, you represent and warrant to, and covenant with TradeSatoshi that: (a) you have reached the age of majority in your jurisdiction of residence; (b) you possess the legal authority to create a binding legal obligation; (c) you shall use the Platform in accordance with these Terms of Use and all applicable laws; and (d) all information supplied by you on the Platform is true, accurate, current and complete.

While is sympathize with people in this predicament it is a common thing people tend to do when they try to use a website using a false identity. (Give partially inaccurate or completely inaccurate identity).

I would recommend spending some $ and finding out the registered address of the exchange and sending a letter explaining the situation and providing written proof of identity.

It is possible that they checked the identity on a database and found no match. A lot of exchanges are forced by law to start KYC. Even some of the decentralized exchanges are on the radar of law enforcement.

I haven't personally used Tradesatoshi for more than a year so I can't comment on whether much has changed.

The issue you're talking about is: User agreed to pass the KYC-check, but the personal information, provided by him earlier was innacurate, so he can't complete it. This is only one aspect of this story.

But this is not the case, i'm talking about.
From one side, the exchange can ask for a mandatory KYC-check (normally with a notification in advance, which was not done by Traidsatoshi).
From the other side, user can deny to pass it. In that case he won't be able to trade anymore - this is ok. But, all the funds he had before KYC were deposited or traded by him under the Level 1 verification from Tradesatoshi, so they are all legal. So all this funds must be returned to the owner. By now the affected Tradesatoshi users are denied the right to withdraw their funds, which is totally unacceptable!

[xtraelv]

The issue you're talking about is: User agreed to pass the KYC-check, but the personal information, provided by him earlier was innacurate, so he can't complete it. This is only one aspect of this story.

But this is not the case, i'm talking about.
From one side, the exchange can ask for a mandatory KYC-check (normally with a notification in advance, which was not done by Traidsatoshi).
From the other side, user can deny to pass it. In that case he won't be able to trade anymore - this is ok. But, all the funds he had before KYC were deposited or traded by him under the Level 1 verification from Tradesatoshi, so they are all legal. So all this funds must be returned to the owner. By now Tradesatoshi is denying users to withdraw their funds, which is totally unacceptable!

Ultimately if you have used their platform - you agreed to the terms. By registering with a false or incorrect name or details you committed a fraudulent act or made a serious error when entering a contract.

Usually people don't need to "change their name details" unless they gave false details.

It is something you will need to sort out through their support ticket system. Ultimately though it comes down to a user error. (Deliberate or not)

The only way to check whether someone gave false details is to ask them to verify their identity which appears what they have done and appears consistent with their terms.

People will have opposing views on this but registering (entering into a contract) with a false name (alias) is a crime in some jurisdictions.

[DiHunter]

Ultimately if you have used their platform - you agreed to the terms. By registering with a false or incorrect name or details you committed a fraudulent act or made a serious error when entering a contract.

Usually people don't need to "change their name details" unless they gave false details.

It is something you will need to sort out through their support ticket system. Ultimately though it comes down to a user error. (Deliberate or not)

Take in mind, all the users had Level 1 verification from the exchange. So exchange approved their right to trade earlier.
At my request to provide any facts of fraudulent activity, the staff confirmed that this is a general check.
Also how can TS-staff know in advance whether the data is right or wrong before the KYC-check? It's a vicious circle, we're coming to.

[nutildah]

The issue you're talking about is: User agreed to pass the KYC-check, but the personal information, provided by him earlier was innacurate, so he can't complete it. This is only one aspect of this story.

But this is not the case, i'm talking about.
From one side, the exchange can ask for a mandatory KYC-check (normally with a notification in advance, which was not done by Traidsatoshi).
From the other side, user can deny to pass it. In that case he won't be able to trade anymore - this is ok. But, all the funds he had before KYC were deposited or traded by him under the Level 1 verification from Tradesatoshi, so they are all legal. So all this funds must be returned to the owner. By now Tradesatoshi is denying users to withdraw their funds, which is totally unacceptable!

Ultimately if you have used their platform - you agreed to the terms. By registering with a false or incorrect name or details you committed a fraudulent act or made a serious error when entering a contract.

Usually people don't need to "change their name details" unless they gave false details.

It is something you will need to sort out through their support ticket system. Ultimately though it comes down to a user error. (Deliberate or not)

The only way to check whether someone gave false details is to ask them to verify their identity which appears what they have done and appears consistent with their terms.

People will have opposing views on this but registering (entering into a contract) with a false name (alias) is a crime in some jurisdictions.

I remember when I signed up for Poloniex in 2014 I gave them a fake name, because I didn't necessarily trust them, as most people didn't. Then when their Circle acquisition came and they insisted everyone do KYC, I said screw that, because where I lived didn't even allow bitcoin exchanges and Poloniex would have certainly taken that into consideration. Poloniex also gave me the option of changing my customer name, which Trade Satoshi does not. They let me withdraw my coins, and I moved on. This is the standard I'm used to... It seems to me when an exchange uses KYC as an excuse to with-hold customer coins, something fishy is going on. BiteBTC has been engaging in the same behavior.

Then as was pointed out, some people performed the KYC to the best of their ability and were still denied access to their funds. I strongly believe Trade Satoshi recently turned to the darkside as they've racked up a huge number of complaints on social media as of late. They've always had their share of unhappy customers, but now they have way more than their share.

[JollyGood]

I remember when I signed up for Poloniex in 2014 I gave them a fake name, because I didn't necessarily trust them, as most people didn't. Then when their Circle acquisition came and they insisted everyone do KYC, I said screw that, because where I lived didn't even allow bitcoin exchanges and Poloniex would have certainly taken that into consideration. Poloniex also gave me the option of changing my customer name, which Trade Satoshi does not. They let me withdraw my coins, and I moved on. This is the standard I'm used to... It seems to me when an exchange uses KYC as an excuse to with-hold customer coins, something fishy is going on. BiteBTC has been engaging in the same behavior.

Then as was pointed out, some people performed the KYC to the best of their ability and were still denied access to their funds. I strongly believe Trade Satoshi recently turned to the darkside as they've racked up a huge number of complaints on social media as of late. They've always had their share of unhappy customers, but now they have way more than their share.

An excellent post. Thank you.

That is the precise reason I added Tradesatoshi to my scam alert signature.

They are by all intent and purposes using KYC as an excuse to seize funds. Those that do not comply are frozen out and many those that do comply with their KYC are also being given the run-around or point blank refused access. They have all the hallmarks of selective scamming.

Regardless of what opinions people may have of Poloniex, when they added their forced KYC policy at least they allowed users the option to change their aliases to their real names then comply with KYC and for those that did not want to do it they allowed them to withdraw - simple.

I will take a closer look at BiteBTC and if they have also decided to go rogue then I will add them to my scam alert signature as well as leave red trust too.

[xtraelv]

I remember when I signed up for Poloniex in 2014 I gave them a fake name, because I didn't necessarily trust them, as most people didn't. Then when their Circle acquisition came and they insisted everyone do KYC, I said screw that, because where I lived didn't even allow bitcoin exchanges and Poloniex would have certainly taken that into consideration. Poloniex also gave me the option of changing my customer name, which Trade Satoshi does not. They let me withdraw my coins, and I moved on. This is the standard I'm used to... It seems to me when an exchange uses KYC as an excuse to with-hold customer coins, something fishy is going on. BiteBTC has been engaging in the same behavior.

Then as was pointed out, some people performed the KYC to the best of their ability and were still denied access to their funds. I strongly believe Trade Satoshi recently turned to the darkside as they've racked up a huge number of complaints on social media as of late. They've always had their share of unhappy customers, but now they have way more than their share.

This is where there will be a division in opinion. Crypto is largely developed by those that believe in decentralization and anonymity.  On the other hand it cannot be dismissed that by using a fake or erroneous name the contract made is either fraudulent or contains a serous error. (And therefore in breach of their terms and conditions or a crime).

Because value is involved it could be argued that it is fraudulent activity to obtain a financial advantage and in breach of AML laws.

It is a bit of a catch 22 situation. You signed up with Poloniex using a fake name because you didn't necessarily trust them but used their services contrary to their terms and conditions. Thus proving that they can't trust you because you deliberately lied.

I don't intend to attack you personally or hold it against you but am just using it as an example.

Legally it could be argued that a user using a fake name is fraudulently using the platform contrary to their terms and conditions.  It is good that Poloniex recognized it as an issue and was sensible with the solution they offered.  However - others may go down a different path and report it to the authorities in the jurisdiction that they are in.
Allowing a user to change their name on the platform potentially could cause liability for the platform if it is done by a hacker that then drains the funds of a user. Phishing was less of an issue years ago. Currently phishing and compromised user accounts are a huge threat.

The reality is that this situation would not have occurred if the user had not lied about their personal details. It is the user that committed the legal wrong .

[DiHunter]

Legally it could be argued that a user using a fake name is fraudulently using the platform contrary to their terms and conditions.  It is good that Poloniex recognized it as an issue and was sensible with the solution they offered.  However - others may go down a different path and report it to the authorities in the jurisdiction that they are in.
Allowing a user to change their name on the platform potentially could cause liability for the platform if it is done by a hacker that then drains the funds of a user. Phishing was less of an issue years ago. Currently phishing and compromised user accounts are a huge threat.

The reality is that this situation would not have occurred if the user had not lied about their personal details. It is the user that committed the legal wrong .

How to find out whether the user's data are right or wrong? Is the wish to find it out by starting a KYC-check is enough ground to make a decision that funds are illegal and to withhold the funds?

How do you think, what procedural steps have been taken by the exchange to have a reason to call each particular case "criminal" and to block users funds?

By your logic, can Tradesatoshi consider itself both investigation authority and judicial authority? They started mandatory KYC-checks without reasons and blocked users funds without any evidence for uncertain time, simply because they themselves started the KYC-checks. Seems, they don't need any of those authorities to decide what is legal and what is not.

For example, Binance blocks accounts suspected of committing a crime for 3 days. In the absence of official documents on the beginning of the investigation after these 3 days, the blocking is removed.
By the way, many exchanges do not request user data at all until verification is required - only login and password. Binance, which is mentioned above, is one of them. Because there is no sense to ask for such data until KYC.

[nutildah]

I don't intend to attack you personally or hold it against you but am just using it as an example.

Legally it could be argued that a user using a fake name is fraudulently using the platform contrary to their terms and conditions.  It is good that Poloniex recognized it as an issue and was sensible with the solution they offered.  However - others may go down a different path and report it to the authorities in the jurisdiction that they are in.
Allowing a user to change their name on the platform potentially could cause liability for the platform if it is done by a hacker that then drains the funds of a user. Phishing was less of an issue years ago. Currently phishing and compromised user accounts are a huge threat.

The reality is that this situation would not have occurred if the user had not lied about their personal details. It is the user that committed the legal wrong .

No offense taken, and I do understand your point. However, asking for KYC after the user has already deposited funds and only when they are attempting to withdraw seems to be an uneven application of what it was intended for. They have no problem accepting funds but then suddenly its a problem when the user wants to make a withdrawal.

Outside of OP, there are dozens of complaints from users who are experiencing the same problem. And the problem doesn't seem to be contained to KYC issues, they seem to be locking people out of their accounts left and right. Even if the issues are related, blocking people from their funds and keeping them works out all too well for themselves. At the very least, people should be warned that they face this risk if they use this exchange, which isn't a common problem among legitimate exchanges.

What would be useful is to find out when Trade Satoshi first started asking for KYC, or when it first appeared on their website in the terms.

Also, the 3 accounts currently bumping their thread all sprang to life after problems started arising for them, around March 10th. They all respond to comments in the same style, by writing _above_ the quoted comment instead of below it. In my experience on the forum maybe 1 out of 20 users does this. I'm thinking they're all owned by the same person, maybe somebody who works for Trade Satoshi.

1. fratoshi - post gap from 12/19/17 to 3/25/19

Try with a bigger font and maybe the support guys on Tradesatoshi can read you better

I HAVE THE SAME PROBLEM WHEN I TRY TO LOGIN TO MY ACCOUNT SINCE 5 DAYS WHY!!!
I HAVN T TFA I CHANGED MY PASSWORD I DID DO ALL THIS AND IN THE END I CAN T LOGIN
PLEASE HELP ME
THANKS.

Just contact the support via their website and hope that you hear back from them. Posting here won't be of any help, your question will just be buried without getting an answer.  

2. bolivarcoin - post gap from 4/26/18 to 3/7/19

No worries just remember to post a comment here at least once a day and keep this thread first on the list

Thanks for asking for Bolivarcoin  

No need to thank - this was like going to the circus for free.

3. zombieapocalypsecoin - post gap from 6/10/27 to 3/20/17

Yes i know, the coin was very popular and attract a lot of people, but because a problem on the code, some bug we cannot fix it died slowly, so since then i been trying to do a relaunch, i though a waves token will be great, then ethereum but the DAO hit in, now i think maybe a TRON token will be great but i don't really understand that coin, so i am open to suggestions, i don't like the idea of ICO or raising any money, i prefer community help, i think the best is to get people involved in the code and graphical design, launch a social media campaign, there are many zombie fans out there and i can promote this on the zombie walks around the world, also comiccons.

I have to say that your roadmap is amazing and i am totally fully wholly entirely completely absolutely amazed by your roadmap

Will Tradesatoshi support the listing of the re-launch of Zombieapocalypsecoin?

i cannot afford the listing fee but the coin has a great utility use in the case of a future zombie invasion, so the survivors can use this coin to exchange items in the near future, i am also looking for investors to launch a couple of satellites to space so any survivor with a satellite disk can connect to the blockchain and broadcast their transactions

Its just bizarre to me.

[DiHunter]

Some important info!
Thanks to nutildah who have posted it here



*ModShin is from TradeSatoshi-team.

[JollyGood]

Some important info!
Thanks to nutildah who have posted it here



*ModShin is from TradeSatoshi-team.

What an absolute pathetic bunch of selective scammers Tradesatoshi have become.

The highlighted text in the image makes their intentions clear: "we are implementing KYC to all users in our site, and accounts failure to cooperate will remain frozen"

The low-life scammers think they can 'freeze' accounts at their discretion and then hold funds indefinitely but in simple terms that means that is an excuse to steal funds under the guise of failure to adhere to KYC which incidentally many users would have sent correctly.

Any real bonafide business would give the option to users of either complying to KYC or them being allowed to withdraw their funds and never use Tradesatoshi again, if they wish. It is clear Tradesatoshi are doing it with a view to selective scam their own users just as Rock Trading, Changenow/Changelly, Flyp.me and Holy Transactions have done

[turtlecoin]

I was also robbed of almost 100,000 doge  this was the majority of my account and the majority of my coins stored on exchange.


I have the correct info but do not wish to comply with KYC, does this mean i broke an agreement or don't deserve to withdrawal my coins? their move was a cash grab. plain and simple

[DiHunter]

I was also robbed of almost 100,000 doge  this was the majority of my account and the majority of my coins stored on exchange.


I have the correct info but do not wish to comply with KYC, does this mean i broke an agreement or don't deserve to withdrawal my coins? their move was a cash grab. plain and simple

Yes, exactly. And no hazy reasoning will not help to blame affected users and justify the scammers from Tradesatoshi.

[nutildah]

Look who else writes their reply above the quoted comment:

If you can't log into your account then you can open a support ticket here https://tradesatoshi.com/Support/Support and explain your situation.

I HAVE THE SAME PROBLEM WHEN I TRY TO LOGIN TO MY ACCOUNT SINCE 5 DAYS WHY!!!
I HAVN T TFA I CHANGED MY PASSWORD I DID DO ALL THIS AND IN THE END I CAN T LOGIN
PLEASE HELP ME
THANKS.

I mean, am I crazy, or does it appear that all these accounts are owned by the same person?

[DiHunter]

Look who else writes their reply above the quoted comment:

If you can't log into your account then you can open a support ticket here https://tradesatoshi.com/Support/Support and explain your situation.

I HAVE THE SAME PROBLEM WHEN I TRY TO LOGIN TO MY ACCOUNT SINCE 5 DAYS WHY!!!
I HAVN T TFA I CHANGED MY PASSWORD I DID DO ALL THIS AND IN THE END I CAN T LOGIN
PLEASE HELP ME
THANKS.

I mean, am I crazy, or does it appear that all these accounts are owned by the same person?

No, your guess looks reasonable.

[DiHunter]

Another scam-technic from Tradesatoshi!

Delist a coin and set the withdrawal fee high enough to make withdrawals impossible for some users. So, they will not be able to trade, they will not be able to withdraw. What will they be able to do? Leave coins to exchange, i guess ))
From the other side, exchange  will receive a good fee from those users, who are forced to withdraw coins due to the delisting and have enough balances for this.
Both are good for the exchange.


Look at some examples:


Fees before delisting:





Fees after announcement of delisting:

(750 coins according to the site service: https://i.imgur.com/KKnnYgb.png)



50 BTCP are worth almost 400 000 sat. Great fee! The same as it was for BTC not long ago: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5118992.msg50245384#msg50245384
Seems, after this complaint fee was lowered to 10 BTCP (according to the site service https://i.imgur.com/mKWMUtI.png). What a generosity, lol
For comparison - the BTCP withdrawal fee at Tradeogre-exchange is....0.01.

[nutildah]

More connections:



Pretty sure its now safe to say bolivarcoin is part of their staff.

[JollyGood]

What are the Bitcointalk usernames for Tradesatoshi? Time to leave red trust for them

This one was active long ago:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=902367

This one is currently active in their topic, he posts news:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=2326516

This one is a troll,which actively spams in Tradesatoshi-topic to hide all the complaints; has a signature "tradesatoshi", but I guess not from the staff.
His bolivarcoin is traded on Tradesatoshi at 99% from overall trading volume - 40$ )
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=543083

Still waiting for the OP to give appropriate feedback and trust to the users in the links.

Once done, I will do the same and hopefully others too.

[DiHunter]

Still waiting for the OP to give appropriate feedback and trust to the users in the links.

Once done, I will do the same and hopefully others too.

Added for first two. The last doesn't have a link to the Tradesatoshi site in profile, doubt if admin here will consider him as tradesatoshi staff.

More connections:



Pretty sure its now safe to say bolivarcoin is part of their staff.

Seem, so. May be bolivarcoin is all traidsatoshi staff here )

[JollyGood]

Still waiting for the OP to give appropriate feedback and trust to the users in the links.

Once done, I will do the same and hopefully others too.

Added for first two. The last doesn't have a link to the Tradesatoshi site in profile, doubt if admin here will consider him as tradesatoshi staff.

Done too. Hopefully others will follow