Bitcoin usage and misaligned expectations

[helenfast69]

I believe there are some people in the community who are in the standpoint that "Bitcoin isn't successful" unless they can use it for "almost-zero fee" coffee transactions. But is it truly a failure?

Failure is on people who don't ride the wave where the price is still cheap, I guess they can not have easy access anymore whenever it is in the forum Earning, Trading, and Investing I guess it is too hard for them to really ride this kind of opportunity, Well I don't think that the technology of Blockchain is a failure because we can see that there are other uses for it instead of just using it on Online Ledger And these companies are highly positive with the technology of Blockchain.

I do not know who there may be considered an unsuccessful Bitcoin It seems that the numbers speak for themselves as well as the popularity of Bitcoin.
Speaking about the Blockchain technology, we can say that it is already used in some well-known world companies and is only gaining its popularity every day.

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[romero121]

It isn't a failure but there needs to be some advancement to make flexibility with the fee on some services or on any business. When we're buying a coffee worth $1 and $2 worth transaction fee then it is a failure. There are some occasions, that have caused people to experience such transactions. Further such kind of transaction should not take place relative to the service we get in exchange of bitcoin.

[Jeremycoin]

Bitcoin isn't a failure. If it really is, bitcoin wouldn't survive this long.

That's a really good point. Nothing in this world would be a failure unless it ceases to exist. (even you)

Bitcoin is not perfect. We did indeed expect that Bitcoin would replace fiat as a currency to buy things we need, give a paycheck, etc. But what some people don't realize now is that Bitcoin won't be the same as fiat. Bitcoin is its own currency. It has its own system. If they want something similar like fiat, why bother having an alternative? Bitcoin may not be as what we expected it to, but at least it has successfully fulfilled its main purposes.

[squatter]

It isn't a failure but there needs to be some advancement to make flexibility with the fee on some services or on any business. When we're buying a coffee worth $1 and $2 worth transaction fee then it is a failure.

That's the point about "misaligned expectations." Whether it's economical to buy coffee with was never the proper metric to gauge its success. The only reason on-chain transactions were viable years ago for micropayments was because adoption was so nascent; not many people were using Bitcoin yet. Now that adoption has grown so significantly, demand for block space is understandably much higher.

Ideally in the future, there will be many different protocols or applications with varying security models -- some offchain, some with varying degrees of trust or centralization -- and the cost to use these platforms will reflect their security model. With a fully centralized model like Flexa, customers pay zero fees for POS transactions. They just need to pay for one on-chain transaction fee to fund their Flexa/Spedn wallet. Would you want to keep all your bitcoins in Spedn? Of course not. But you could load it with a couple hundred bucks worth of bitcoins like a prepaid card or a checking account and the risk isn't a big deal.

Lightning is obviously a superior model, though it'll be a while before its usability is adequate for mainstream consumers.

[NathanJB]

I believe there are some people in the community who are in the standpoint that "Bitcoin isn't successful" unless they can use it for "almost-zero fee" coffee transactions. But is it truly a failure?

To a certain extent, that is considered a failure because the goal of Satoshi Nakamoto in creating Bitcoin was to provide a form of payment first and foremost. The payment has to be in the form of digital cash and is to be done on a peer-to-peer basis. But if we cannot buy a cup of coffee, which could represent the entire idea of payment, with Bitcoin then there must be something wrong. Something must have gone out of the right path so to speak. If the transaction fee is almost equal to that of a cup of coffee, it simply isn't right.

[Wind_FURY]

They fraudulently make newbies believe that the solution is simply to increase the block size, but without pointing out that it centralizes the network. It also requires a hard fork, which is another problem.

A problem for them, anyway.  

What I don't get is that it should be the easiest concept in the world to grasp.  If those securing the chain agree, it happens.  If those securing the chain don't agree, it doesn't happen.  But somehow they can't comprehend it.  There apparently has to be someone to blame for the simple fact they want something those securing the chain don't.  Why are some people incapable of understanding that their view isn't necessarily of interest to all the other people on this chain?  And why can't they be content with their own chain that the rest of us aren't a part of?  Then they could entertain whatever insanity they like.

If their ideas were really as good as they claimed, it would have happened by now.  But no, it's definitely a conspiracy of devs controlling the network.  

They'll never learn.

That's basically it. There are some groups of people in the Bitcoin community who want the Core developers, the developers who are the most competent and has the best interest of Bitcoin in mind, out.

They tried it twice with Roger Ver's BitcoinCash hard fork, and then the New York Agreement. The community didn't follow them, they lost.

[TheUltraElite]

It now seems something bad, because we have the ability to pay for the coffee of fiat money. But with the help of bitcoin, we can pay for something more substantial. And people do it and do not spare money to pay for the transaction. I think that soon everyone will get used to it and the transaction fee will not be considered a problem.

Its not bad because people think it to be bad. We humans have a bad habit of thinking everything new to be the next magic pill while the concept of magic pill itself is a fantasy and not reality. So people think bitcoin to be the source of everything good and that it will correct every problem in the economy. This is a wrong expectation as the OP has tried to express.

Paying for coffee? Use fiat for that, if you are not comfortable with bitcoin transaction fee. The two of them are not supposed to be opposite but to complement each other.

[fiulpro]

Hey

First it was the Segwit integrated wallet which gave us varied number of options to decrease our fee and then again after a year or so we saw the lightning network which for a very minimal fee transfers and receives the money most often instantly.
I think this fee is purely justified , since even the wallets needs some initial investments to rely their security settings continuously.

Other than that maybe we could just in the future have some card or something which can do the transactions without any payment and almost instantly.

[xWolfx]

It now seems something bad, because we have the ability to pay for the coffee of fiat money. But with the help of bitcoin, we can pay for something more substantial. And people do it and do not spare money to pay for the transaction. I think that soon everyone will get used to it and the transaction fee will not be considered a problem.

Maybe, but i still consider from my point of view that it will be a problem in the future. It might not be at all, but we could consider asking more questions about it and considering some options to implement in the mid-term if necessary. At the end, the team makes the decisions but the inspiration can come from the least expected places.

For now sure not the huge problem but eventually those little everyday transactions will need to be made possible without paying twice only because of the fees.

[Searing]

I believe there are some people in the community who are in the standpoint that "Bitcoin isn't successful" unless they can use it for "almost-zero fee" coffee transactions. But is it truly a failure?

not if it stays a store of value

the catch is with facebook libra my view is will it stay a few years from now, a store of value?

my own thoughts are that if LIBRa as an example works and is stable, that Facebook will make another coin, specifically for a store of value to displace bitcoin

every cartoon I've ever seen with evil villains has me sure of this point, that is how this always works!

but Libra and Facebook claim to have the speed and pockets to make libra the internet centralized currency of choice..even if they are not directly hurting bitcoin now

as so success of Bitcoin in the future to your point, yeah, the status of only being a 'store of value' like gold is somewhat limiting indeed to being a currency

what do I know?

Brad

[Glutius]

I believe there are some people in the community who are in the standpoint that "Bitcoin isn't successful" unless they can use it for "almost-zero fee" coffee transactions. But is it truly a failure?

Only uneducated people would think that. Bitcoin is not a simple tool. Not everyone is able to understand how it works and not everyone can appreciate the true purpose and benefit of bitcoin in the future.

[Hallmader]

I believe there are some people in the community who are in the standpoint that "Bitcoin isn't successful" unless they can use it for "almost-zero fee" coffee transactions. But is it truly a failure?

It depends on what basis one considers. As far as I am concerned, I don't think Bitcoin is not successful. But I also admit that its success is rather limited. If the real goal of Bitcoin is to be used as a currency then there is some failure in it because people, I mean the really huge majority, prefer to HODL it and not even spend a Satoshi. I am not sure but that might prod Satoshi Nakamoto himself to think whether there is something wrong with how Bitcoin evolved over time.

[lobster88]

I believe there are some people in the community who are in the standpoint that "Bitcoin isn't successful" unless they can use it for "almost-zero fee" coffee transactions. But is it truly a failure?

The economy is changing with new roles once in political portfolios every time so new amendments with the legal acts and rules in banking history is making many bitcoin users in a huge pause. At the end one is not willing to keep themselves in a sorrow situation.

[shoreno]

I believe there are some people in the community who are in the standpoint that "Bitcoin isn't successful" unless they can use it for "almost-zero fee" coffee transactions. But is it truly a failure?

It depends on what basis one considers. As far as I am concerned, I don't think Bitcoin is not successful. But I also admit that its success is rather limited. If the real goal of Bitcoin is to be used as a currency then there is some failure in it because people, I mean the really huge majority, prefer to HODL it and not even spend a Satoshi. I am not sure but that might prod Satoshi Nakamoto himself to think whether there is something wrong with how Bitcoin evolved over time.

i am hodler myself but i still do love to use bitcoin as a currency though the problem is that the fees were a bit expensive even on a small service/item that ill be buying online  . im sure that that is also the problem of other bitcoin users but when it comes to hodling i have no problem with that  . at the end of the day i can still say that bitcoin is succesful because its now popular  . if there is a miss aligned expectations , that is its price because people expect that its price can grow really high  .

[diahsw]

I believe there are some people in the community who are in the standpoint that "Bitcoin isn't successful" unless they can use it for "almost-zero fee" coffee transactions. But is it truly a failure?

Even though it had soared, the value of Bitcoin and other digital currencies increased. Although many parties are skeptical of the future of Bitcoin, few people are still awaiting great hopes in the digital currency. We will not be able to predict whether Bitcoin will last until when. What is certain is the price of Bitcoin is in harmony with the demand. The more people who use Bitcoin, the greater the value. bitcoin will continue to last with the development of technology, and many countries have used bitcoin for buying and selling transactions such as Japan, Korea and China. And it has also been widely used by many large companies in the world.

[TheUltraElite]

Only uneducated people would think that. Bitcoin is not a simple tool. Not everyone is able to understand how it works and not everyone can appreciate the true purpose and benefit of bitcoin in the future.

Its not about being uneducated. Its human nature to deny logic at times when it is being bitter to them. It gradually becomes acceptance as time progresses and they see a bigger picture. No human in this world would want to put their money in something that does not have a use case - its a simple fact. They know for sure that bitcoin being FUDed by the government makes its all the more reason to stay away from it.

So they tend to invest into other things. However it is true that they fail to appreciate the expectations and thus make blind expectations for the future.

[Anonylz]

Success comes with time, btc is on the process of being seen as successful, and judging from where btc is coming till date it will be very bias to call it a failure either, rome was not built in a day, it is a long road ahead but surely btc will get.

[Nnuego]

Nothing in life is free. The bank you invest on collect charges for storing up your money and atm maintenance fee. Government do collect money for tax also. Running transaction in bitcoin there are people who are managing and maintaining it,won't the get payed at the end. Free stuffs are not valued. We all have to pay in something in return for job well-done.

[Wind_FURY]

Only uneducated people would think that. Bitcoin is not a simple tool. Not everyone is able to understand how it works and not everyone can appreciate the true purpose and benefit of bitcoin in the future.

Its not about being uneducated. Its human nature to deny logic at times when it is being bitter to them. It gradually becomes acceptance as time progresses and they see a bigger picture. No human in this world would want to put their money in something that does not have a use case - its a simple fact. They know for sure that bitcoin being FUDed by the government makes its all the more reason to stay away from it.

So they tend to invest into other things. However it is true that they fail to appreciate the expectations and thus make blind expectations for the future.

Sometimes it depends on who gets to the newbies first. There's a constant misinformation campaign against Bitcoin, and they're very good in gaslighting.

[TheUltraElite]

Success comes with time, btc is on the process of being seen as successful, and judging from where btc is coming till date it will be very bias to call it a failure either, rome was not built in a day, it is a long road ahead but surely btc will get.

Bitcoin has taken its time to grow and become something that people are scared to talk against. So this fear makes them talk bad about it and spread false propaganda for their own gains. Those who want to analyze this should do their own research and not listen to what people commonly say. But that is lacking in 99% of the people in any area.

Sometimes it depends on who gets to the newbies first. There's a constant misinformation campaign against Bitcoin, and they're very good in gaslighting.

So our work is to make sure the newbies get the proper information. I think that is what a forum is for and even though you wont able to make everyone happy those who want to know more about it will seek out the correct information.