Livecoin participants should be tag?

[johhnyUA]

Must be nice to be so ignorant. Do you always spout off at the mouth about things you do not know about? Just wondering cause it looks like you put a lot of effort into this post and basically have no idea if you are right or wrong.

My taxes are paid bud. I live in the USA and cash out my bitcoin via bitpay. Anything over 20k is reported to the IRS. Check their ToS, you'll see i'm correct

It was a question, my friend, cool your ass. Or KOOL AID ( nice reference, as for me)

Also, it doesn't matter what payment method I get from bounty campaigns or signature campaign owners. I do not make 1 single person join a bounty campaign. It's your choice

No one make a single person registering on Livecoin by force. It's their choice. We just wearing signatures and writing posts with useful information (unlike some Meta/reputation/gambling section "trusted" members)
But one people will be tagged, and another will tell "Oh oh, i'm trusted member, look at my nice reputation, join my campaign, because i'm not Sylon or jamaleez, i'm trusted". For honest, we tag both of them or no one  

I'm not attacking participants by tagging them for joining the signature campaign, although if I were a dick you'd be the 1st tag i'd give. It's my prerogative to make a blacklist and decide that users who are supporting the exchange are not trustworthy.

That's true, about your choice. And it's my choice to ask you or not where my money from Buzzshow. I will remind you, that some bounty managers got red tagged for promoting things where bounty participants were fooled.

You obviously didn't read the part in the scam thread where livecoin was trying to force the user to delete bad press against them before they'd respond to his claim? That in turn led to his money being held(which they 100% admit to). But we are hypocrites for your ignorance and you wanting to earn money from the scammers?

It's obvious that Yahoo didn't read Livecoin scam thread because if he did that he would know some interesting facts:
1. I wrote some posts there, addressed to exchange and "vitcim" and didn't get answered from both.
2. "Victim" couldn't tell us precise balance of it's own account (except 750 MONA coins). Not in english topic, not in russian (i remember my balance on Bitfinex before it famous scam after 3 years)
3. We are in anarcho capitalistic society at some point of view. If you want free crypto society you need to forget about "laws" and start to read ToC. If you need regulation than you must accept KYC, faceID, taxes (33 % in USA and more than 40 % (depends from country to country) in EU).

I think you are the hypocrite here and should probably not speak about a person unless you know what you're talking about.

I'm mostly asking. If Livecoin participants will be tagged, Hrampuz must tag Sportsbet.io participants, As i said abouve, it has 5 scam topics.

EDITED 1:

It almost feels like all you Russian users are joining together because Livecoin is in your backyard. Grow up kid.

I ask you again:

Don't you think that all this situation is weird, because all "victims" is russians with noob accounts?

It's problem, because as i said above i doubt that you (and many other people) saw alive russian. We don't even talk about to live through slavs or understanding of thinking (mind) patterns. I'll tell you, as person who helped to promote scams a long time ago, in real life (and i'm very ashamed of this fact in my life. I was a poor student and working in techincal support in some postUSSR offline hypes): Theese "victims" doesn't looks like real victims. They're not behave like many real victims (from my experience).

EDITED 2: I will not angry on Hrampuz if he would tag me, but as long as i'm in DT2, i'll  counter any negative feedback which would be placed on useful russian members (i saw few accounts in Livecoin topic). No offense to Hrampuz, but it's not fair (in terms of great justice) when good mathematician or bitcoin contributor will be tagged by bounty manager.

EDITED 3 3.03 PM: promoted scams a long time before ago

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[Vadi2323]

...
Also, it doesn't matter what payment method I get from bounty campaigns or signature campaign owners. I do not make 1 single person join a bounty campaign. It's your choice. My job is to check that the work is done and that tokens are distributed. Nothing more. I cannot force a team to list 2 seconds after the ICO ends...

Your work is also getting the warranties that all the participants will be paid for their work, but you think that only you must get the warranties. It calls "hypocrisy", my little boy.

I'm not attacking participants by tagging them for joining the signature campaign, although if I were a dick you'd be the 1st tag i'd give. It's my prerogative to make a blacklist and decide that users who are supporting the exchange are not trustworthy.

That's true, about your choice. And it's my choice to ask you or not where my money from Buzzshow. I will remind you, that some bounty managers got red tagged for promoting things where bounty participants were fooled.

Good idea!

[electronicash]

don't you think this is becoming centralize already?  livecoin has issues, its up to them to solve it but i think a warning to those participant of the campaign that they are helping a company that has an open accusation is enough. but tagging look a bit harsh. they are just same as me or anyone trying to earn few btc per week. just stating my opinion though its all still in your hands.

[Little Mouse]

If we can use the tagging system properly, there would be no complains, DT's misusing the trust system leads to misleading forum members as that trust is visible.

DT system isn't limited to DT, we all are responsible for choosing DT-1, thus DT-2. With our votes, DT get selected. So, if we all user the trust list system properly, no incapable DT will be selected.
Anyway, I also think that negative tag for this reason isn't appropriate. Hhampuz is giving them a warning because in Livecoin thread it's not possible to warn them, they are deleting the response. Hhampuz also admitted to remove the tag.

[No HATE]

don't you think this is becoming centralize already?  livecoin has issues, its up to them to solve it but i think a warning to those participant of the campaign that they are helping a company that has an open accusation is enough. but tagging look a bit harsh. they are just same as me or anyone trying to earn few btc per week. just stating my opinion though its all still in your hands.

You are right, of all the DT, it's weird that Hhampuz is the one tagging participants after he benefited from livecoin campaign, isn't it unethical?
But forget about that, he is misusing the trust system here like he doesn't care of the effect to the community and to the DTs who trusted him.

Anyway, I also think that negative tag for this reason isn't appropriate.

So we are in the same side here.

Hhampuz is giving them a warning because in Livecoin thread it's not possible to warn them, they are deleting the response.

Giving a warning by reg tagging? Did you hear yourself?

Hhampuz also admitted to remove the tag.

For a certain condition which is to withdraw the application? Who is he? Did he own the forum?
He made unreasonable judgement but he can correct that by removing the negged trust and just make his own blacklist.

[Hhampuz]

don't you think this is becoming centralize already?  livecoin has issues, its up to them to solve it but i think a warning to those participant of the campaign that they are helping a company that has an open accusation is enough. but tagging look a bit harsh. they are just same as me or anyone trying to earn few btc per week. just stating my opinion though its all still in your hands.

You are right, of all the DT, it's weird that Hhampuz is the one tagging participants after he benefited from livecoin campaign, isn't it unethical?
But forget about that, he is misusing the trust system here like he doesn't care of the effect to the community and to the DTs who trusted him.

I love people that are hiding behind alts to speak their minds, very nice, much brave. 

[electronicash]

don't you think this is becoming centralize already?  livecoin has issues, its up to them to solve it but i think a warning to those participant of the campaign that they are helping a company that has an open accusation is enough. but tagging look a bit harsh. they are just same as me or anyone trying to earn few btc per week. just stating my opinion though its all still in your hands.

You are right, of all the DT, it's weird that Hhampuz is the one tagging participants after he benefited from livecoin campaign, isn't it unethical?
But forget about that, he is misusing the trust system here like he doesn't care of the effect to the community and to the DTs who trusted him.

Anyway, I also think that negative tag for this reason isn't appropriate.

So we are in the same side here.

Hhampuz is giving them a warning because in Livecoin thread it's not possible to warn them, they are deleting the response.

Giving a warning by reg tagging? Did you hear yourself?

Hhampuz also admitted to remove the tag.

For a certain condition which is to withdraw the application? Who is he? Did he own the forum?
He made unreasonable judgement but he can correct that by removing the negged trust and just make his own blacklist.

they all have the right to mark red to them. its harsh but its just how it goes, those participants can quit the livecoin campaign if they don't wanna be tagged. seem like an ultimatum is being posted already. they can remain in the campaign but the risk is there. an account here in bitcointalk is very important, they'd rather be joining the IEO campaign than those companies with issues if they don't wanna be at risk.

[Little Mouse]

For a certain condition which is to withdraw the application? Who is he? Did he own the forum?
He made unreasonable judgement but he can correct that by removing the negged trust and just make his own blacklist.

Lol he don't own the forum, neither any of us. This forum is open for everyone. If things went with the ownership of the forum, theymos would delete all the ANN threads of scam project, ban any kind of scam project promotion and any kind of shitcoin promotion. But he don't do any of this.

[No HATE]

don't you think this is becoming centralize already?  livecoin has issues, its up to them to solve it but i think a warning to those participant of the campaign that they are helping a company that has an open accusation is enough. but tagging look a bit harsh. they are just same as me or anyone trying to earn few btc per week. just stating my opinion though its all still in your hands.

You are right, of all the DT, it's weird that Hhampuz is the one tagging participants after he benefited from livecoin campaign, isn't it unethical?
But forget about that, he is misusing the trust system here like he doesn't care of the effect to the community and to the DTs who trusted him.

I love people that are hiding behind alts to speak their minds, very nice, much brave.  

This doesn't answer my question. Can you talk with sense? Do I have to write again?

ban any kind of scam project promotion and any kind of shitcoin promotion. But he don't do any of this.

Because that's not subject to forum rules.

they all have the right to mark red to them. its harsh but its just how it goes....

So they have no difference with livecoin which they also have the right to scam because red tagging by misusing the trust system looks like a scam also.
It doesn't matter if it's harsh as long as it's justifiable, people will not complain on that.

[electronicash]

-snip
So they have no difference with livecoin which they also have the right to scam because red tagging by misusing the trust system looks like a scam also.
It doesn't matter if it's harsh as long as it's justifiable, people will not complain on that.

almost sure those guys will also have the heavy heart in doing this red tagging seeing those who participants are doing good in the forum. but if you have to do a poll, you may just lose here. i also think its not good but come to think of it. there is not much we can do about it. if they have to do it, they'd do it. i encourage you if your alt is part of it, you better take off that signature before its too late. there are more signature campaigns coming anyway.

[No HATE]

-snip
So they have no difference with livecoin which they also have the right to scam because red tagging by misusing the trust system looks like a scam also.
It doesn't matter if it's harsh as long as it's justifiable, people will not complain on that.

almost sure those guys will also have the heavy heart in doing this red tagging seeing those who participants are doing good in the forum. but if you have to do a poll, you may just lose here. i also think its not good but come to think of it. there is not much we can do about it. if they have to do it, they'd do it. i encourage you if your alt is part of it, you better take off that signature before its too late. there are more signature campaigns coming anyway.

LOL, who's they? It's only one DT who tagged participants while majority does express they wouldn't.

Why would he target the Livecoin only when there are campaign like sportsbet and bitcasino which have an open scam accusations?
I like him to answer this and please answer also if you have something to say.

[wwzsocki]

I use Livecoin exchange from the start frequently and never had a single problem. I know, they can not be trusted, but not more or less, as any other not regulated crypto exchange with no legal entity or registered in some tax heavens. I use Livecoin exchange, but never hold anything there - NOT YOUR KEYS NOT YOUR MONEY! Never send my full stack in one deposit and do larger amounts in small batches, deposit - sold/buy - withdraw, next batch. Of course, it cost me time, money, is annoying and not suited for many other traders, but is the only way to be safe and cut the losses, to the minimum on these exchanges.

Participated in the first campaign and don't see a reason why should I not advertise them further? Because of one scam accusation?

I was against ending the first campaign and to call them a scam if thousands of other people use this exchange with no problems every day. This scam accusation is very complicated and should be rather seen as a support issue and not a scam in the first place. We all know it was all done for a purpose and now is the next part of the drama.

There will be no other way as to stop all campaigns on the forum if this will go further because almost everything what is advertised here is to some extent not legal or finally turned out a scam.
OP mentioned already a few campaigns actually active and there are scam accusations against them.

How can Livecoin by judged so badly when there is only one accusation on Bitcointalk forum and no other victim so far?
This case is a really hard one, were the exchange keep providing answers from two years. The accuser is also not without a fault and to blame. Is obvious that he was lying a couple of times and spreading false information about the exchange and admitted it.

Just take a look at the whole picture and take into consideration all other campaigns which are running and there are multiple scam accusations against them. I was able to find scam accusations against all exchanges from the first 10 on Coinmarketcap. Checked also few gambling services actually advertised here on Bitcointalk in signatures and also there are many scam and other accusations. Some already resolved and many are not. Don't mention Cheapmixer which is totally not legal and will be closed as soon as they catch them, we have already seen this happening with many other mixers and last time was Bestmixer also advertised on the forum.

What effect do we have so far with all these flags against Livecoin and this new account? Is there anybody saved from using this exchange and not scammed? Or maybe something has changed and the accuser got the money back and TOS will be adjusted? NO!

The only outcome was that many members lost their spot in the campaign, Hhampuz a job and now it goes even further because we are already on the Yahoo blacklist and maybe 30 more members will be tagged for nothing. Disaster keeps spreading like a wave and nobody see it. This will end that all campaigns will be banned from the forum.

[electronicash]

i was about to join that campaign yesterday as it was announced it was reopened. the pay is good.

-snip
So they have no difference with livecoin which they also have the right to scam because red tagging by misusing the trust system looks like a scam also.
It doesn't matter if it's harsh as long as it's justifiable, people will not complain on that.

almost sure those guys will also have the heavy heart in doing this red tagging seeing those who participants are doing good in the forum. but if you have to do a poll, you may just lose here. i also think its not good but come to think of it. there is not much we can do about it. if they have to do it, they'd do it. i encourage you if your alt is part of it, you better take off that signature before its too late. there are more signature campaigns coming anyway.

LOL, who's they? It's only one DT who tagged participants while majority does express they wouldn't.

Why would he target the Livecoin only when there are campaign like sportsbet and bitcasino which have an open scam accusations?
I like him to answer this and please answer also if you have something to say.

one is enough. if they disagree, they can take that DT out in their list. if that doesn't happen then you can just assume it got support. we are talking about livecoin yet. that sportbet and bitcasino will handled but exclude it for now you can create another thread for it.

[TECSHARE]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1oE7dAXf2tuKCtbpoc9Xx66qcCjWwbArnXlkuFQq-wcs/edit?usp=sharing Just posting this here for the record. These users are willing to support Livecoin and have made it on my own personal blacklist.

Any user on this list may be removed if they remove their application in https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5166711.0 this thread and pm me showing it is removed. Users in this list have 72 hours to do so, or they remain on the blacklist permanently.  July 23rd 6:20 am is the deadline

In this situation I believe this to be the appropriate response and I would hope other campaign managers take similar action. With the DT1 endorsed flags on both Livecoin and Livecoin Manager we still have a slew of Hero and Legendary members applying for this signature campaign. If anyone should understand a flag you would think it would be these types of members.

We are seeing how ineffective DT1 is when money is involved. Flags are flags.. nothing more.. this shows that when money is there it doesn't matter what DT1 does, we can only warn.

yahoo62278 has taken the most reasonable action here and is showing people that money over ethics isn't welcome here.
So no, I don't thing tags will do anything here.. but I do support any campaign managers blacklisting from future campaigns.

I think this is the most reasonable course of action. Not everyone knows the details of Livecoin's issues, and not all of them deserve to be collectively punished via the trust system as a result of this. However individual users have every right to not want to deal with users because of this and this is basic free association. This is the right way to influence the community, social pressure combined with economic pressure via free association, not just hitting them with a stick (or in this case a button). This gives people choices instead of just metering out arbitrary deterrent penalties using the trust system, which has other detrimental effects.

[The Sceptical Chymist]

Used them many times, but as you all know they will keep your coins hostage and make you delete negative press before even considering dealing with you. That's a load of shit period. Users are allowed to have an opinion, positive or negative.

I've never used them, and the only thing I know about Livecoin is what I read in the scam accusation, but what you wrote above makes them sound even worse than Yobit.

As I wrote in another thread, I won't be tagging these campaign participants, but my guess is that some other DT members will be doing just that--and I have no problem with that.  I know this campaign is going to attract a lot of applicants since there aren't many signature campaigns left that I know of, but members really should not be prostituting themselves for what looks like a scammy exchange.  That damages their own reputation even if they don't get tagged.

I know that they can not be trusted but not more or less as any other not regulated crypto exchange with no legal entity or registered in some tax heavens.

I'm a bit confused as to how much of a scam exchange Livecoin is.  I supported the flag based on the evidence presented, and I'm fairly confident in doing that, but it sounds to me like it's an exchange that has scammy aspects to it much like Yobit does and that not everyone has problems or gets scammed.  Like I said, they do sound worse than Yobit but who knows.  And again, I wouldn't target the campaign participants with negative trust.  If Yahoo62278 blacklists them, that's pretty good disincentive for them not to join the Livecoin campaign.

[Findingnemo]

Isn't tagging them also a way of warning them? I mean those tags can be removed or changed to neutral anytime the issue with that account is resolved. In this case, withdrawing from the signature campaign.

Just too much work for the DT member to tag them and then change them to neutral or removed for hundreds of participants.SO just give warning and let them decide their own fate after that permanently.

You don't tag when you warned, red tagging is different by definition " You think that trading with this person is high-risk", don't deviate from the real meaning. Maybe tagging as neutral would be appropriate based on its meaning "Other comments.".

If we can use the tagging system properly, there would be no complains, DT's misusing the trust system leads to misleading forum members as that trust is visible.

When someone supporting scam activities with their knowledge then it can also be considered under your definition.You can ask the same question to red trust queen and what answer you will get.

[bones261]

I'm a bit confused as to how much of a scam exchange Livecoin is.  I supported the flag based on the evidence presented, and I'm fairly confident in doing that, but it sounds to me like it's an exchange that has scammy aspects to it much like Yobit does and that not everyone has problems or gets scammed.  Like I said, they do sound worse than Yobit but who knows.  And again, I wouldn't target the campaign participants with negative trust.  If Yahoo62278 blacklists them, that's pretty good disincentive for them not to join the Livecoin campaign.

     I think it is a good disincentive too for Yahoo62278. However, a legendary member can earn .01925 BTC per week off of that campaign. Not as good paying as the chipmixer campaign, but still pretty good. Some people may not give 2 shits about any blacklist or tagging with that kind of pay. Also, to be fair to Livecoin, I think Yobit is definitely worse.  Yobit has way more listings of dead and broken coins, or coins on the wrong chain. However, I don't think Yobit will freeze an account if you dis them on the internet....

[No HATE]

I'm a bit confused as to how much of a scam exchange Livecoin is.  I supported the flag based on the evidence presented, and I'm fairly confident in doing that, but it sounds to me like it's an exchange that has scammy aspects to it much like Yobit does and that not everyone has problems or gets scammed.  Like I said, they do sound worse than Yobit but who knows.  And again, I wouldn't target the campaign participants with negative trust.  If Yahoo62278 blacklists them, that's pretty good disincentive for them not to join the Livecoin campaign.

     I think it is a good disincentive too for Yahoo62278. However, a legendary member can earn .01925 BTC per week off of that campaign. Not as good paying as the chipmixer campaign, but still pretty good. Some people may not give 2 shits about any blacklist or tagging with that kind of pay. Also, to be fair to Livecoin, I think Yobit is definitely worse.  Yobit has way more listings of dead and broken coins, or coins on the wrong chain. However, I don't think Yobit will freeze an account if you dis them on the internet....

Enough for the scam accusations discussion as that has been discuss many times. I brought this topic here as I believe more exchanges or gambling sites will have a scam accusation in the future, regardless on how it looks, a scam accusation is a scam accusation and I appreciate some DTs who have a good judgement to the campaign participants which is not to tag them.

Yahoo's move is good but Hhampuz is unacceptable, the moment he knows the campaign has a scam accusation, he didn't stop the campaign immediately and waited until he got his pay, then stop it to play safe.

If DTs are not tagging sportsbet, yobit, and bitcasino, why would livecoin is treated not the same way?

If you trusted a member to be part of the DT, his decision affects your reputation too, so it should be resolve.

Trust is very important to campaign participants, as it's part of the requirement of the campaign, and it's never happening that a campaign participants possess risk or will scam money as most of them don't trade, they are just here to participate in the forum and earn if possible.

When someone supporting scam activities with their knowledge then it can also be considered under your definition.You can ask the same question to red trust queen and what answer you will get.

So sportsbet, yobit, and bitcasino participants are supporting scam sites? and how do we treat them? Why aren't they treated like livecoin's participants?

[nutildah]

Please push me to your own personal blacklist. After show it to your mom.

I don't recommend you joining the campaign for the simple reason that you have one of the best avatars of anybody on the forum and it would be a shame to see it go.

Livecoin isn't running a scam operation. They made some dumb moves, but they're not "scammers." If you want to see what a real scam exchange looks like, check out the problems users are having with BiteBTC and Trade Satoshi. Hundreds of user complaints cheating customers out of millions of dollars (in the case of BiteBTC -- Trade Satoshi is tiny and inconsequential by comparison -- yet still loads more complaints than against LC).

Everybody chiming in with their opinion about morals and ethics needs to chill out for a moment and go read Livecoin's terms. Nobody is forcing anybody to use the exchange. There's a hundred options for trading XMR, and even at the time of the 51% attack other options for trading MONA.

IF Livecoin suddenly started pulling this issue on other coins which didn't suffer well-chronicled exploits, then YES I would think something fishy was going on. Can you guys please find User #2 who has been negatively affected by Livecoin's harsh and unjust policies? Until then, the whole witch hunt against Livecoin just seems to be an excuse for people to cast judgment on others. Lame.

[johhnyUA]

~ Bla bla bla ~

Said person with signature of Sporstbet.io which has 5 (!!!) (it's in 5 time more than Livecoin) scam accusations. You know, we (slavs) have very precise and relevant catchphrase about such kind of people: "ты или кpecтик cними, или тpycы нaдeнь"