Livecoin is a shady exchange, Yobit is not

[suchmoon]

What I see as a problem in this story is that the bad product is packed in new packaging, and it has hired a manager who has a reputation. Although I am aware that the forum is not moderate scams, on the moral side, it is wrong to help them in any way.

Welcome to Bitcointalk

The same can be said about shamelessly scammy shitcoin threads and signatures that are given a platform here. If anything, Yobit - if they don't end up scamming campaign participants - at least pays in BTC and they now have an on-site "controller" plus a lot of people motivated to report the posts. I don't see that as helping them, more like trying to herd sheep in the right direction. Free speech FTW.

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[elda34b]

I agree that it is better to do something than to let spam storm to happen again, although from what I see on the forum the situation is not good at all, pointless and poor quality posts are everywhere, which stems from the fact that the applications are completely uncontrolled - is it even possible to control hundreds of people in one campaign?

I think solving that problem is quite easy. Several people already mentioned that Yobit should implement the usual signature campaign route: require approval before they got paid. If that's not implemented, then having thousands of members suddenly burst posting within a week is not impossible at all.

Even if Yobit was not shady, they'd attract spammers if they continue with the way it is.

[PrimeNumber7]

Given that both LiveCoin and YoBit have active flags with a lot of support, I am curious why LiveCoin advertisers were added to a blacklist, while YoBit advertisers are not.

It would be a good incentive to not participate in the campaign, though considering the quality of the participants, it's unlikely that they (or rather, most of them) would be seriously considered by yahoo in one of his other campaigns in the first place.

They are being allowed to participate in the YoBit campaign, which is a campaign Yahoo has the ability to remove participants from.

The only difference between LiveCoin and YoBit that I can see is that Yahoo is presumably receiving payment from YoBit.

It is disappointing that yahoo is not receiving the same pressure to close the YoBit campaign as Hhampuz received to close the LiveCoin campaign.

The current posts made by those receiving a lot of money to advertise for YoBit are not nonsense posts, even if they are not written by crypto experts. Those advertising for YoBit tend to have a “diverse” posting history and have been posting very little prior to joining the campaign. This leads me to believe many of these accounts are being farmed and were possibly bought. I am a strong believer in the free market but a lot of what appears to be happening with those involved in the YoBit campaign is highly frowned upon by many and the situation as a whole leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

[Little Mouse]

The only difference between LiveCoin and YoBit that I can see is that Yahoo is presumably receiving payment from YoBit.

It is disappointing that yahoo is not receiving the same pressure to close the YoBit campaign as Hhampuz received to close the LiveCoin campaign.

There's something we are missing I think. I was a little active in the cryptotalk forum and what I observed that, cryptotalk isn't a forum from Yobit. It's certainly a different company who wants to build an active forum. They are using Yobit for an easy payment, less work, no one to trust. Since Yobit is an exchange, certainly they will not commit fraud with the fund.
So, there's no problem with managing the campaign, cryptotalk has hired Yobit, yobit has hired yahoo.
Yahoo is not directly managing the campaign, participants acceptance is automated, anyone can apply even a lower rank member. But once they are found spammer, when yahoo check manually, they are being removed. It's not an easy task to get 100% qualified participants within week, right since the acceptance is automated.
My two weeks signature management experience-
I was trying to get the best promoters, quality posters although the pay was low. But out of 0.03 BTC budget in 1st week, I was able to spend 0.018 BTC which can never satisfy my boss. If yahoo goes with same strict rules, he will not get more participants as per budget. May be he will be able to spend 20% of the budget. What will you say, yahoo is incapable or bitcointalk has low good posters (which refers lack of real interested person). As well as the cryptotalk owner will certainly be not happy and recruit anyone less capable of mamaging spam either.
Once again, the main point is, no one promoting yobit here at all.

[eaLiTy]

Local Rule (if anyone follows)- Please no cryptotalk sig here.

There is no doubt that Yobit is a shady exchange but the difference here is that they are not advertising their exchange to have a wild discussion like this. But it all boils down to morality whether you want to take part in something like that.

Till Yahoo is managing the campaign, I feel everyone who deserves being paid will be paid. I don't see such a situation possible till Yahoo exists. Else, earlier we had nobody and hence yobit took advantage.

From what i understand Yahoo is just paid to monitor the spam and remove the users who spam the forum and he has nothing to do with the payment.

Until theymos blacklist signatures once and for all, who really cares?

If signatures are gone for good then no one will have any complaints whats so ever  . If we convert this site to trade goods and that is the main reason everyone was active here from the start and to sort bitcoin technical issues you will not get the traffic like we have now.

There's something we are missing I think. I was a little active in the cryptotalk forum and what I observed that, cryptotalk isn't a forum from Yobit. It's certainly a different company who wants to build an active forum. They are using Yobit for an easy payment, less work, no one to trust. Since Yobit is an exchange, certainly they will not commit fraud with the fund.

If there is no link between them then why would they use their platform to send out the funds .

[Little Mouse]

If there is no link between them then why would they use their platform to send out the funds .

Yobit panel for payout is thousand times better than manually check, counts and send. Moreover the campaign budget is huge per week (~5 BTC +), current campaign manager is trusted to us with holding this amount (I believe Yahoo will not run campaign if the project owner hold the fund), but may be admin isn't getting trust on him with this amount. That's why Yobit has been chosen.
I'm not 100% confirmed but this is what my observation is.

[Lucius]

We should not be naive and think that promoted forum and YoBit have nothing in common, they are obviously more than connected just by paying panel.

 - fact 1 : YoBit is Russian exchange, half of the forum is in Russian.
 - fact 2: Exchange board second from top // no wonder it's YoBit place for extra advertising.
 - fact 3: If you pack bad product is new packaging, it is easy to sell it and say it has nothing with the previous product or service.

Yet opinion of the most prominent members here is that it is better to keep them under any control, then to just let them do what they want.

Yobit panel for payout is thousand times better than manually check, counts and send.

How bot can be better in doing such task/s then human? Time, when bots are managing signature campaigns was over few years ago, and now is again come back, just because services like YoBit do not want to adjust their advertising to basic forum guidelines. In this way even with the check being done, many bad posters manage to withdraw before being caught and banned.

[Little Mouse]

Yobit panel for payout is thousand times better than manually check, counts and send.

How bot can be better in doing such task/s then human? Time, when bots are managing signature campaigns was over few years ago, and now is again come back, just because services like YoBit do not want to adjust their advertising to basic forum guidelines. In this way even with the check being done, many bad posters manage to withdraw before being caught and banned.

I was talking about payout system, manually you have to check the posts and count how much people posted, update the sheet. Send payments to 300 people. But all this thing has been automated with Yobit, the only problem was controlling spam. That's why they hired Yahoo.

[Zemomtum]

To me, both of them are shady exchanges characterized by volume manipulators and very few user bases. So, I don't see much difference between them

[Lucius]

I was talking about payout system, manually you have to check the posts and count how much people posted, update the sheet. Send payments to 300 people. But all this thing has been automated with Yobit, the only problem was controlling spam. That's why they hired Yahoo.

The system is actually bad, everything is automated and there is no control when submitting, paying or checking the quality of posts. Because of that, they need humans to repair all the chaos that YoBit system creates.

If everything is done manually the list of candidates would be much smaller, bad users wouldn't even get a chance to start spam. You are not too long in this forum, but few years ago there is more than one signature campaign with bot system, and spam levels were at least three to five times higher than today. Just imagine only one or two similar campaigns like this, what a forum would look like?