Livecoin is a shady exchange, Yobit is not

[erikalui]

The fact that Yobit did not prove to be an out-and-out scam and livecoin too hasn't been proved a scam exchange. Scam exchange would mean not paying any user like Cryptopia. Yobit can be considered shady (selectively paying out some and not the others) but not a complete scam and now as well yobit is paying out its participants without imposing any new rules or refusing payments which many members are taking advantage of as well.

The campaign anyways won't last long paying off 100+ members so I don't see an issue here but many members can end up getting banned as most of them are just spamming. It's again not something that can be termed illegal, fraudulent or scammy.

[TryNinja]

The fact that Yobit did not prove to be an out-and-out scam and livecoin too hasn't been proved a scam exchange. Scam exchange would mean not paying any user like Cryptopia. Yobit can be considered shady (selectively paying out some and not the others) but not a complete scam and now as well yobit is paying out its participants without imposing any new rules or refusing payments which many members are taking advantage of as well.

Selectively paying out people isn't considered scam for you?

Maybe I should start asking for loans in the forum. Pay only a few of them, and start getting called out for being "shady".

The campaign anyways won't last long paying off 100+ members so I don't see an issue here but many members can end up getting banned as most of them are just spamming. It's again not something that can be termed illegal, fraudulent or scammy.

What I can see it happening is they putting something like X BTC every week/month which can easily run out (due to the amount of participants flooding the forum with 15~20 posts day all that suddenly) and some people will get paid, while others won't. I believe this happened in their old campaign (older than their first appear here this year).

[johhnyUA]

In fact, i didn't find that anyone above tagged Yobit or supported flag againt it, so my second speech it's not to them.

First of all that is not correct information and second, not flagging/tagging something dozen times doesn't make it less shady/scam.

What is not correct?  

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=406594

Ehhm. Do you see in flag support or maybe in trust ratings nicknames "mindrust", "ETFbitcoin", "The Pharmacist"? Or who is DT member also and had written before my post were made.

In fact, I just can't to catch someone in double standarts just because in fact we doing promotion of another crypto forum and not Yobit itself.

[The-One-Above-All]

In fact, i didn't find that anyone above tagged Yobit or supported flag againt it, so my second speech it's not to them.

First of all that is not correct information and second, not flagging/tagging something dozen times doesn't make it less shady/scam.

What is not correct?  

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=406594

Ehhm. Do you see in flag support or maybe in trust ratings nicknames "mindrust", "ETFbitcoin", "The Pharmacist"? Or who is DT member also and had written before my post were made.

In fact, I just can't to catch someone in double standarts just because in fact we doing promotion of another crypto forum and not Yobit itself.

Your point seems unclear, can you clarify?

Are you saying you should be allowed to advertise for scammers if certain people tell you it is okay?

The initial poster of course has a very valid point.

Yahoo seems to be primarily concerned with making money. Or is he offering this service for free ?

[erikalui]

Selectively paying out people isn't considered scam for you?

Not exactly. The same reason why banks start freezing accounts of some and cheat some but not all and are still operating legally. Bounty campaigns here have done the same wherein they paid some and not others giving excuses. I would call these banks and campaigns fraudulent but others won't as they did not behave the same way with them.

Every exchange has the same history and I myself withdrew my BTC earnings via yobit by selling my coins and I know many users did not for God knows what reasons. I wouldn't consider using them at times but since they paid me, I might take a risk with few shitcoins which are worthless otherwise.

What I can see it happening is they putting something like X BTC every week/month which can easily run out (due to the amount of participants flooding the forum with 15~20 posts day all that suddenly) and some people will get paid, while others won't. I believe this happened in their old campaign (older than their first appear here this year).

Till Yahoo is managing the campaign, I feel everyone who deserves being paid will be paid. I don't see such a situation possible till Yahoo exists. Else, earlier we had nobody and hence yobit took advantage.

[johhnyUA]

Your point seems unclear, can you clarify?

Are you saying you should be allowed to advertise for scammers if certain people tell you it is okay?

The initial poster of course has a very valid point.

Yahoo seems to be primarily concerned with making money. Or is he offering this service for free ?

Sory, my dear friend, i'm full of russian local board trolls, so starting to flame with english famous troll it's beyond my powers.

But, about my last word i'll give a clarification to you.
In fact, as i said here - no one promotes yobit. People promotes Cryptotalk org. Do you have any proofs that cryptotalk is scam?

[The-One-Above-All]

Your point seems unclear, can you clarify?

Are you saying you should be allowed to advertise for scammers if certain people tell you it is okay?

The initial poster of course has a very valid point.

Yahoo seems to be primarily concerned with making money. Or is he offering this service for free ?

Sory, my dear friend, i'm full of russian local board trolls, so starting to flame with english famous troll it's beyond my powers.

But, about my last word i'll give a clarification to you.
In fact, as i said here - no one promotes yobit. People promotes Cryptotalk org. Do you have any proofs that cryptotalk is scam?

Have you not heard proof is one of those thing you should not wait for. Ask DT members, by the time you have proof then it is already too late? that is their mantra?

I am happy that we await proof before jumping to negative action personally. I am only pointing out clearly, that proof is only required IF IT DOES NOT STOP DT OR SCAMPAIGN MANAGERS EARNING MONEY.

Yobit are not a terrible scam compared to some. However, they are totally out of control turning off wallets and not updating wallets after years of being requested to do so. It can be thought of perhaps as a semi scam in the context of other REAL SCAMS like huge exit scams etc.

Please take up you disagreement with DT members. They say waiting for proof is folly and a ridiculous idea. Any probable connection to scamming or scams or even just whistle blowing is enough for a scam tag.

For that reason then yahoo should not be assisting them.

I mean is live coin worse than yobit? not in our books. Hhampuz left (under pressure, partly in fact due to yahoos comments about them) so this is a little confusing? then again double standards make things confusing don't they.

[TryNinja]

Not exactly. The same reason why banks start freezing accounts of some and cheat some but not all and are still operating legally.

And you think Yobit does this shit legally? Like just turning offline all wallets of a specific coin, making everyone have their coins stuck for months?

Bounty campaigns here have done the same wherein they paid some and not others giving excuses. I would call these banks and campaigns fraudulent but others won't as they did not behave the same way with them.

Yeah man, and usually these get called a scam and receive a nice negative trust.

Every exchange has the same history and I myself withdrew my BTC earnings via yobit by selling my coins and I know many users did not for God knows what reasons. I wouldn't consider using them at times but since they paid me, I might take a risk with few shitcoins which are worthless otherwise.

No, it does not.

"Many users did not [receive their withdrawals] for God knows what reasons", but... Yobit can't be considered a scam exchange. Nice.

Till Yahoo is managing the campaign, I feel everyone who deserves being paid will be paid. I don't see such a situation possible till Yahoo exists. Else, earlier we had nobody and hence yobit took advantage.

You do know that everything Yahoo is doing is banning the users who spamburst/shitpost, right? He doesn't count posts nor pay people. This is on Yobit and their shadiness.

[Hhampuz]

Until theymos blacklist signatures once and for all, who really cares?

[PrimeNumber7]

Would you rather have no campaign manager handling YoBit, or perhaps one of YoBit's own staff managing the campaign?

I would rather they have no manager, or a very poor manager.

I have no issue with people promoting Yobit, because as I said most people don't have problems with them.  They just don't address customer problems like they should, which is a stupid move on their part--and who knows, maybe they do it on purpose to scam a little here and there.  I wouldn't put it past them, but I really don't know.  

As far as their campaign goes, I would much rather see it with a good manager like Yahoo62278 than have a repeat performance of last time.  Everybody loses in a case like that--people get banned, Yobit loses their advertising, and the forum gets spammed.  No winners there.

There is a flag against YoBit that explains why it is dangerous to do business with them. Reasons include a history of YoBit conducting what appears to be something similar to Pump and Dump schemes on coins traded on their exchange.

As I explained, YoBit being unable to advertise is the key feature because of my belief they are untrustworthy and shady. The people who get banned are those who are spammers, which I also see as a feature. The YoBit spam is not as bad as it was before, however I have noticed a lot of useless posts by people advertising for YoBit, even if they do not qualify to get deleted/removed. With the spam not being as flagrant as before, we will see continued spam, instead of only a couple of days of spam.


I also found this post:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1oE7dAXf2tuKCtbpoc9Xx66qcCjWwbArnXlkuFQq-wcs/edit?usp=sharing Just posting this here for the record. These users are willing to support Livecoin and have made it on my own personal blacklist.

Any user on this list may be removed if they remove their application in https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5166711.0 this thread and pm me showing it is removed. Users in this list have 72 hours to do so, or they remain on the blacklist permanently.  July 23rd 6:20 am is the deadline

Given that both LiveCoin and YoBit have active flags with a lot of support, I am curious why LiveCoin advertisers were added to a blacklist, while YoBit advertisers are not.

[actmyname]

Given that both LiveCoin and YoBit have active flags with a lot of support, I am curious why LiveCoin advertisers were added to a blacklist, while YoBit advertisers are not.

It would be a good incentive to not participate in the campaign, though considering the quality of the participants, it's unlikely that they (or rather, most of them) would be seriously considered by yahoo in one of his other campaigns in the first place.

[Lucius]

YoBit is one of the shadiest crypto exchanges, there is no doubt about that considering the number of reported cases in this forum only. Although this is the indirect advertising of YoBit via some new forum, fact is that payment is done over YoBit, the same as the candidate application without any checking.

Personally, I was surprised by this sudden turn from yahoo62278 to support YoBit in their efforts to advertise on this forum. The reason for this is the attitude of most forum members toward YoBit as shady/scam exchange, making blacklist with users who promote them and even tag them for doing that. So how is it possible that now the main problem is only "how to handle spam", and not how to protect users of this forum to not be scammed by YoBit?

Given that both LiveCoin and YoBit have active flags with a lot of support, I am curious why LiveCoin advertisers were added to a blacklist, while YoBit advertisers are not.

That's a good question, and there are two possible answers - double standards or personal benefit, maybe both?

[MFahad]

-snip-
This matter has been discussed time and time again and we have said the same things.
This thread doesn't mean anything to you, then? List of banned participants in the Cryptotalk Campaign

The same things has been discussed many times in the already active threads. i do not see any reason to create a new threads for it again and again other than to gain some merits.
 

[unibitcoinist]

Did Yobit hire Yahoo for removing spammer or a group of people? Or Yahoo hired some others? Now it makes sense why the so-called forum lover who care about forum most, try to prevent scam, are so silent.

The same things has been discussed many times in the already active threads. i do not see any reason to create a new threads for it again and again other than to gain some merits.

Go and lick the ass of your boss shit spammer.

Until theymos blacklist signatures once and for all, who really cares?

Yahoo cares and that's why they he are managing the campaign. Didn't you offer anything to them for running Livecoin campaign 

[MFahad]

Did Yobit hire Yahoo for removing spammer or a group of people? Or Yahoo hired some others? Now it makes sense why the so-called forum lover who care about forum most, try to prevent scam, are so silent.

You can't see the spammers being banned or you are deaf.

The same things has been discussed many times in the already active threads. i do not see any reason to create a new threads for it again and again other than to gain some merits.
 

Go and lick the ass of your boss shit spammer.

Screaming and abusing  will not make you noble.

[unibitcoinist]

You can't see the spammers being banned or you are deaf.

Then why the hell are you still wearing signature, you moron.

OP is a self-admitted alt of some jackass.

Thank you for reminding me once again. Just a suggestion/request/advice whatever you think it is-
Don't post off-topic everywhere. If you want discussion on this matter (which I think you desperately want since you are posting this everywhere), please create a topic. I will join there politely without a single off-topic word unlike you.

[MFahad]

You can't see the spammers being banned or you are deaf.

Then why the hell are you still wearing signature, you moron.

Jealous because i am wearing something , the signature and You are naked    
You need to grow up !

[suchmoon]

YoBit is one of the shadiest crypto exchanges, there is no doubt about that considering the number of reported cases in this forum only. Although this is the indirect advertising of YoBit via some new forum, fact is that payment is done over YoBit, the same as the candidate application without any checking.

Personally, I was surprised by this sudden turn from yahoo62278 to support YoBit in their efforts to advertise on this forum. The reason for this is the attitude of most forum members toward YoBit as shady/scam exchange, making blacklist with users who promote them and even tag them for doing that. So how is it possible that now the main problem is only "how to handle spam", and not how to protect users of this forum to not be scammed by YoBit?

The forum doesn't moderate scams and will certainly not ban Yobit (or Livecoin) from advertising here due to being scam exchanges. The first Yobit campaign was banned not because the exchange is a scam but because it filled the forum with spam. We can either let them do it again and hope that theymos will bother to blacklist this new sig, or try to control it with tools available to us (mod reports, and reporting to yahoo62278).

I would prefer the campaign to not exist but that doesn't appear to be a viable scenario. Let's say the URL gets blacklisted - there is nothing stopping them from coming back with a dummy domain redirect or a URL shortener. They have already shown that they can run the campaign completely off site if they wanted to, and that there is no lack of suckers wanting to earn $1-2 per post. Having a quality control person (which is what yahoo62278 essentially does, not really "managing" it) is better than not having one.

Tagging users for wearing a signature pointing to a forum is too much IMO. It doesn't even link to the actual exchange.

[bouren]

Livecoin is a shady exchange but that doesn't mean any other exchange can't be shady. But as far as yobit goes many people might have had a few problems with yobit but all on all I have never seen a person experiencing scam from Yobit. They have a legendary member account who is continuously active here listening to various scam accusations of people. They might have been a lot slower in their customer support but at the end they play it quite safe with your funds unless you are foolish and yourself do some mistake.

[Lucius]

The forum doesn't moderate scams and will certainly not ban Yobit (or Livecoin) from advertising here due to being scam exchanges. The first Yobit campaign was banned not because the exchange is a scam but because it filled the forum with spam. We can either let them do it again and hope that theymos will bother to blacklist this new sig, or try to control it with tools available to us (mod reports, and reporting to yahoo62278).

I would prefer the campaign to not exist but that doesn't appear to be a viable scenario. Let's say the URL gets blacklisted - there is nothing stopping them from coming back with a dummy domain redirect or a URL shortener. They have already shown that they can run the campaign completely off site if they wanted to, and that there is no lack of suckers wanting to earn $1-2 per post. Having a quality control person (which is what yahoo62278 essentially does, not really "managing" it) is better than not having one.

Tagging users for wearing a signature pointing to a forum is too much IMO. It doesn't even link to the actual exchange.

I agree that it is better to do something than to let spam storm to happen again, although from what I see on the forum the situation is not good at all, pointless and poor quality posts are everywhere, which stems from the fact that the applications are completely uncontrolled - is it even possible to control hundreds of people in one campaign?

It is true that link from sig does not lead directly to YoBit, but to be paid user must register to that exchange which is more than obvious promotion of YoBit, and it is fun to see that exchange board is listed as second board from the top on that forum and that YoBit is have thread with most comments, coincidence or not everyone can judge for themselves...

What I see as a problem in this story is that the bad product is packed in new packaging, and it has hired a manager who has a reputation. Although I am aware that the forum is not moderate scams, on the moral side, it is wrong to help them in any way.