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Author Topic: Religion of Peace? Why Religion At All  (Read 683 times)
BADecker
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October 31, 2019, 06:12:59 PM
 #81

yes, that right , because religion can make some confilct, because religion people can hate each other,because religion,people can feel arrogant.
i still have no idea why people using religion for satisfy worldly passions.
basicaly, religion exists for create a peace,as time goes by,a handful of people, let's say the higher-ups in certain associations,began to abuse his leadership.
I don't care what religion is, all same to me, i mean all people who feel themselves holy and look down on sinners like me.

If you have Jesus-salvation, be humble. And stop being a sinner as much as you can. Boast in Jesus rather than yourself. Muslims fail just like Christians. But they don't have any Savior to boast in.

Cool

The goal of Islam was the power so what happen to the world? What they need? What if they conquer the world by their power? How will the christian do?

The Christian goal was different from Islam because they are ruled by God and also they have to do good for their 2nd life which is the heaven they want.

What happen to the world? How we can survive to some Islam out there who want the power they want?

Christians also believe that the whole world is ruled by God. It's just that God gives freedom, but Islam enslaves its people.

If God allows Christianity to formally fail, He will still take care of His people. After all, everyone dies, Muslim or Christian. But there will be a resurrection and a judgment, where God will judge everybody as to whose side they were on. This judgment is based on believing in Jesus-salvation.

Everybody dies. This whole world and life exist to give people the chance to be saved for eternal life in the new heavens and the new earth... the new universe God is making. True Muslims aren't going to be saved, because they don't have Jesus-salvation.

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November 01, 2019, 08:23:20 AM
 #82

yes, that right , because religion can make some confilct, because religion people can hate each other,because religion,people can feel arrogant.
i still have no idea why people using religion for satisfy worldly passions.
basicaly, religion exists for create a peace,as time goes by,a handful of people, let's say the higher-ups in certain associations,began to abuse his leadership.
I don't care what religion is, all same to me, i mean all people who feel themselves holy and look down on sinners like me.

If you have Jesus-salvation, be humble. And stop being a sinner as much as you can. Boast in Jesus rather than yourself. Muslims fail just like Christians. But they don't have any Savior to boast in.

Cool

The goal of Islam was the power so what happen to the world? What they need? What if they conquer the world by their power? How will the christian do?

The Christian goal was different from Islam because they are ruled by God and also they have to do good for their 2nd life which is the heaven they want.

What happen to the world? How we can survive to some Islam out there who want the power they want?

Christians also believe that the whole world is ruled by God. It's just that God gives freedom, but Islam enslaves its people.

If God allows Christianity to formally fail, He will still take care of His people. After all, everyone dies, Muslim or Christian. But there will be a resurrection and a judgment, where God will judge everybody as to whose side they were on. This judgment is based on believing in Jesus-salvation.

Everybody dies. This whole world and life exist to give people the chance to be saved for eternal life in the new heavens and the new earth... the new universe God is making. True Muslims aren't going to be saved, because they don't have Jesus-salvation.

Cool
Yes, everybody dies someday and until then it is good to do good to the one in need. Automatically peace will prevail all around the globe. There is nothing as a specific religion for peace, everything depends on the act of human beings. What we do now gets us to be on the side of God when our life ends.

 
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November 01, 2019, 08:31:29 AM
 #83

there will be a resurrection and a judgment, where God will judge everybody as to whose side they were on. This judgment is based on believing in Jesus-salvation.

I'll make an old argument, but it's still a valid one. A person's religion is generally determined by their parents' religion. People are Christians largely because their parents are, same for Muslims.

If God exists (and is not evil) then would he really condemn millions of people based on an accident of birth, on what amounts essentially to pure luck?

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November 01, 2019, 11:38:09 PM
Last edit: November 08, 2019, 01:14:32 PM by BADecker
 #84

there will be a resurrection and a judgment, where God will judge everybody as to whose side they were on. This judgment is based on believing in Jesus-salvation.

I'll make an old argument, but it's still a valid one. A person's religion is generally determined by their parents' religion. People are Christians largely because their parents are, same for Muslims.

If God exists (and is not evil) then would he really condemn millions of people based on an accident of birth, on what amounts essentially to pure luck?

You have to ask yourself what a good God is after in creating people at all. The Bible tells us that He wants children, and that people are designed to be His children. So, let's examine this, briefly.

If you have children, but they hate you, ignore you, don't give you credit even though you are supporting you, don't thank you, try to say that you don't exist, kill each other off, and all kinds of other things that you don't want your children to do, how would you feel? Sure, God is way more patient than we are. But He is way more sensitive, as well.

Is God getting the thing He wants? If He isn't, why in the world would he want this creation to remain. Do it over in such a way that He gets what He wants. And... He is God, so He is doing exactly that.

How is He doing it? By finding those people who are somehow willing to believe in Him, and be His children. Then, by letting this universe be destroyed, and taking His kids to the new universe He is making. His enemies - the kids who don't want Him - go down with the destruction of this universe.

Cool

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GideonGono
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November 08, 2019, 09:38:29 AM
 #85

If whatever you truly ask if you want to have the same religion, do you agree? What if there are some religion you need to be was the religion you didn't want so how can you accept the agreement?

I think even me I don't agree for that and that's why we'd never get the same religion anymore.

 
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November 09, 2019, 12:29:46 AM
Last edit: November 09, 2019, 04:02:02 AM by Balthazar
 #86

Because the majority of people have minor defects in their brain which are causing its malfunction when it comes to morality and related issues. Religion can be considered as either patch or workaround for Human OS and its basic core routines.

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November 09, 2019, 08:25:56 AM
 #87

Is God getting the thing He wants? If He isn't, why in the world would he want this creation to remain. Do it over in such a way that He gets what He wants. And... He is God, so He is doing exactly that.

How is He doing it? By finding those people who are somehow willing to believe in Him, and be His children. Then, by letting this universe be destroyed, and taking His kids to the new universe He is making. His enemies - the kids who don't want Him - go down with the destruction of this universe.

Let's take some extremes to illustrate a point:
  • Some people are nominal Christians, they call themselves Christian just because their parents do, but personally they have no interest in religion. They can't quote a word of the bible. Morally, meh. They do some good things and some bad things. Whatever.
  • Some people are extremely kind, saint-like, will do anything to help other people. Live their whole lives without a thought for their own self-interest. But they were born to Hindu parents and follow Hindu Gods rather than Jesus. They would agree with Jesus's teachings if they heard them, but they haven't heard them, they have their own cultural tradition and Hinduism is the way to go.

Person A goes to heaven and person B goes to hell, right?

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November 09, 2019, 06:20:15 PM
 #88

Is God getting the thing He wants? If He isn't, why in the world would he want this creation to remain. Do it over in such a way that He gets what He wants. And... He is God, so He is doing exactly that.

How is He doing it? By finding those people who are somehow willing to believe in Him, and be His children. Then, by letting this universe be destroyed, and taking His kids to the new universe He is making. His enemies - the kids who don't want Him - go down with the destruction of this universe.

Let's take some extremes to illustrate a point:
  • Some people are nominal Christians, they call themselves Christian just because their parents do, but personally they have no interest in religion. They can't quote a word of the bible. Morally, meh. They do some good things and some bad things. Whatever.
  • Some people are extremely kind, saint-like, will do anything to help other people. Live their whole lives without a thought for their own self-interest. But they were born to Hindu parents and follow Hindu Gods rather than Jesus. They would agree with Jesus's teachings if they heard them, but they haven't heard them, they have their own cultural tradition and Hinduism is the way to go.

Person A goes to heaven and person B goes to hell, right?

We don't know that.

St. Paul tells us that whatever doesn't come from faith is sin. That means that if an unbeliever in Jesus-salvation makes only one mistake, he is lost because nothing that he does comes from faith. Even the good things are all sin.

Conversely, if a believer in Jesus-salvation does only one good thing in his whole life, Jesus took the punishment for all those sins he did. All that's left is the one good thing. The good thing is done in faith because he is a believer. So he is saved by faith.

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November 10, 2019, 06:14:17 AM
 #89

St. Paul tells us that whatever doesn't come from faith is sin. That means that if an unbeliever in Jesus-salvation makes only one mistake, he is lost because nothing that he does comes from faith. Even the good things are all sin.

Conversely, if a believer in Jesus-salvation does only one good thing in his whole life, Jesus took the punishment for all those sins he did. All that's left is the one good thing. The good thing is done in faith because he is a believer. So he is saved by faith.

So:
Someone who does good for 99.99% of his life but doesn't believe in Jesus goes to hell.
Someone who does bad for 99.99% of his life but does believe in Jesus goes to heaven.

So someone can commit all kinds of horrible acts throughout their life, but one good act at the end redeems them? Assuming that act is made in good faith as they suddenly see the light?


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November 10, 2019, 01:40:21 PM
 #90

St. Paul tells us that whatever doesn't come from faith is sin. That means that if an unbeliever in Jesus-salvation makes only one mistake, he is lost because nothing that he does comes from faith. Even the good things are all sin.

Conversely, if a believer in Jesus-salvation does only one good thing in his whole life, Jesus took the punishment for all those sins he did. All that's left is the one good thing. The good thing is done in faith because he is a believer. So he is saved by faith.

So:
Someone who does good for 99.99% of his life but doesn't believe in Jesus goes to hell.
Someone who does bad for 99.99% of his life but does believe in Jesus goes to heaven.

So someone can commit all kinds of horrible acts throughout their life, but one good act at the end redeems them? Assuming that act is made in good faith as they suddenly see the light?


You got it, man... with certain explanation reservations.

If the first act that the guy does is his good one, and he lives a normal life to age 90, the bad acts will destroy his faith.

Jesus took the destruction punishment for all people. That's why anybody can have faith in Jesus-salvation.

Jesus, being the Son of God, had the strength to arise from death, so that He can give life to all people.

Unbelief is essentially rejection of salvation. The unbeliever will have the life that Jesus won for him. But that life will be away from God, as the unbeliever wishes. Where else for the eternal life of the unbeliever to exist?, but in the destruction of this universe where everything that is wrong will be destroyed... though that destruction takes forever. Eternal destruction for the unbeliever by his own wish.

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November 10, 2019, 09:03:02 PM
 #91


You got it, man... with certain explanation reservations.

If the first act that the guy does is his good one, and he lives a normal life to age 90, the bad acts will destroy his faith.

Jesus took the destruction punishment for all people. That's why anybody can have faith in Jesus-salvation.

Jesus, being the Son of God, had the strength to arise from death, so that He can give life to all people.

Unbelief is essentially rejection of salvation. The unbeliever will have the life that Jesus won for him. But that life will be away from God, as the unbeliever wishes. Where else for the eternal life of the unbeliever to exist?, but in the destruction of this universe where everything that is wrong will be destroyed... though that destruction takes forever. Eternal destruction for the unbeliever by his own wish.

Cool

Are we talking about the brown Arab Jesus, born from jew parents (Marie was jew, and god is Jew + Joseph was also Jew) in a Arab/jew country that speak a mix of Yiddish and Arabic ? 
 Jesus was not white, didn't have blue eyes and didn't speak Italian.

And also, Jew, Muslim and Christian all believe in Jesus Christ, and the same God (The same way BTC, BSV and BCH all refers to Satoshi Nakamoto as the first person to initiate their blockchain.  )

So the jew and the Muslim will also go to paradise (along side with the Christians)... On the other hand, The Hindu, The Buddhist and the Taoist will go to Hell ... I feel bad for the Dalai Lama  Huh



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November 10, 2019, 09:34:44 PM
 #92

On the other hand, The Hindu, The Buddhist and the Taoist will go to Hell ... I feel bad for the Dalai Lama  Huh


If you feel so bad for the Dalai Lama, why aren't you out there trying to convert him?

Cool

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November 11, 2019, 06:44:31 AM
 #93

And also, Jew, Muslim and Christian all believe in Jesus Christ, and the same God (The same way BTC, BSV and BCH all refers to Satoshi Nakamoto as the first person to initiate their blockchain.  )

So the jew and the Muslim will also go to paradise (along side with the Christians)... On the other hand, The Hindu, The Buddhist and the Taoist will go to Hell ... I feel bad for the Dalai Lama  Huh

Yes, exactly. Plus what about the people who would believe in Jesus, but haven't heard of him - not just uncontacted human tribes in the depths of the Amazon, but what about babies who die in infancy?

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November 11, 2019, 04:07:58 PM
 #94

And also, Jew, Muslim and Christian all believe in Jesus Christ, and the same God (The same way BTC, BSV and BCH all refers to Satoshi Nakamoto as the first person to initiate their blockchain.  )

So the jew and the Muslim will also go to paradise (along side with the Christians)... On the other hand, The Hindu, The Buddhist and the Taoist will go to Hell ... I feel bad for the Dalai Lama  Huh

Yes, exactly. Plus what about the people who would believe in Jesus, but haven't heard of him - not just uncontacted human tribes in the depths of the Amazon, but what about babies who die in infancy?

In the Gospels in the Bible, Jesus says that unless we become like little children, we won't make it to Heaven. Since faith in Jesus salvation is the only way, how can little children believe in something that they have never heard of? Here's how.

When God gave the authority for the whole universe over to Jesus - as spoken about in a reasonable number of places in the Bible - the authority wasn't limited to the time of Jesus. It covered the whole space-time continuum. So, it is Jesus Who is putting people together in their mommies' tummies. Since the only thing that a little child knows is Jesus (even though the child doesn't know how to express it), the child knows Jesus better than all the adults, who all have forgotten their original Jesus-experience, and filled their minds and spirits with the things of their adulthood.

If people of any other religion believe in Jesus-salvation, they are Christians, in addition to whatever else they believe in. If they believe in Jesus, and also believe in something that contradicts Jesus, God will have to decide what the true direction of their faith really is.

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November 11, 2019, 04:41:36 PM
 #95

Do Catholics with coeliac disease go to hell because they can't take communion? Because they are literally allergic to the body of Christ. So they are all devils, right?  Wink

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November 11, 2019, 04:57:21 PM
 #96

<...>

So in short, "Jesus-Salvation" is like a function, that the God coded so that he wouldn't worry when filtering out people from believers to non-believers. Then what's this quote in the bibble where "God treats/sees all of His children equally"? Can you explain what does this exactly implies?

IIRC, God created "everything", and when I say everything, I mean "every single thing". Then why did He created Hell? Why(?) so that in case people don't love him back you're gonna kiss your soul goodbye? So much for a "loving" God if you ask me. Now you might misunderstand and might brand me as an anti-Christ (then again, who are you to judge), but what I simply want is to understand it. Not to mention "Demons", what's the purpose of those? Does God really love "everything" He created so much that he just simply created a place (Hell) just for them? Then, what about the people that have been influenced by these creatures?

Another thing, if what God really wants is for people to worship/adore/believe Him, then why bother creating Humans if some of them would just disobey Him? What does "living" really mean then(?), if right from to the start you are to dedicate yourself to Him after all? Wouldn't it just be good to just not exist in the first place? Why bother finding ones-self?

Quote
If people of any other religion believe in Jesus-salvation, they are Christians, in addition to whatever else they believe in. If they believe in Jesus, and also believe in something that contradicts Jesus, God will have to decide what the true direction of their faith really is.

IIRC, you don't just have to "believe" in Jesus-Salvation. You need to embrace it as well, so how would you do that exactly?


 
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November 11, 2019, 05:21:06 PM
 #97

Another thing, if what God really wants is for people to worship/adore/believe Him, then why bother creating Humans if some of them would just disobey Him?

Yes. If God made everything, if he made me as I am and he made the way I think, and he did the same for everyone, then...

There are some people (e.g., me) who will never believe in God, and even if God is proven to exist I will still refuse to worship him.
But "God" made me this way. He made me so that I would never believe in him and never worship him.
When he made me, he knew that he was condemning me to hell, because he is omnipotent and omniscient and he knows everything I am and exactly how I will act in every circumstance.

This is a part of why some people (e.g., me) think that if God exists, then he is pure evil.

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November 11, 2019, 06:13:52 PM
 #98

Another thing, if what God really wants is for people to worship/adore/believe Him, then why bother creating Humans if some of them would just disobey Him?

Yes. If God made everything, if he made me as I am and he made the way I think, and he did the same for everyone, then...

There are some people (e.g., me) who will never believe in God, and even if God is proven to exist I will still refuse to worship him.
But "God" made me this way. He made me so that I would never believe in him and never worship him.
When he made me, he knew that he was condemning me to hell, because he is omnipotent and omniscient and he knows everything I am and exactly how I will act in every circumstance.

Disclaimer: I am neither an anti-Christ nor a worshiper.

Firstly, I said that I am not an anti (after all, they can do whatever they want), because some of the teachings in the Bible are indeed enlightening--then again, what I don't like about Religion is, the leaders, popes, pastors, saints, whatever, they tend to derail the supposedly "true" message, meaning behind it. If "history" doesn't teach you about Religion then I don't know what is.

And secondly, I am not a worshipper, even if I said that some teachings in the Bible are enlightening, I still have doubts. As "language" is indeed a "barrier", I do not trust the translations of the "Bibble" that we now know today. Is it really accurate? IIRC, "The Bible" (the legitimate one) is on a museum (don't @ me on this). And the legitimate content of it remains a mystery. Because as I come to age, I suddenly thought about the "bibble" we knew is another manipulative (a hoax) strategy of a certain organization that wants control over peoples' beliefs.

Quote
This is a part of why some people (e.g., me) think that if God exists, then he is pure evil.

This reminds me of a show called "The Saga of Tanya the Evil". The show has indeed tackled a number of points towards this "mighty, highly" being called God.

 
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November 11, 2019, 11:05:16 PM
 #99

Do Catholics with coeliac disease go to hell because they can't take communion? Because they are literally allergic to the body of Christ. So they are all devils, right?  Wink

Faith saves, not communion or lack of it. If they have faith in Jesus salvation, and in good faith think that their disease prohibits them from taking communion, their faith saves them.

The interesting thing is that any Christian can call any other Christian to serve him communion. If the other accepts the call, communion can be served by any Christian.

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November 11, 2019, 11:12:12 PM
 #100

<...>

So in short, "Jesus-Salvation" is like a function, that the God coded so that he wouldn't worry when filtering out people from believers to non-believers. Then what's this quote in the bibble where "God treats/sees all of His children equally"? Can you explain what does this exactly implies?

IIRC, God created "everything", and when I say everything, I mean "every single thing". Then why did He created Hell? Why(?) so that in case people don't love him back you're gonna kiss your soul goodbye? So much for a "loving" God if you ask me. Now you might misunderstand and might brand me as an anti-Christ (then again, who are you to judge), but what I simply want is to understand it. Not to mention "Demons", what's the purpose of those? Does God really love "everything" He created so much that he just simply created a place (Hell) just for them? Then, what about the people that have been influenced by these creatures?

Another thing, if what God really wants is for people to worship/adore/believe Him, then why bother creating Humans if some of them would just disobey Him? What does "living" really mean then(?), if right from to the start you are to dedicate yourself to Him after all? Wouldn't it just be good to just not exist in the first place? Why bother finding ones-self?

Quote
If people of any other religion believe in Jesus-salvation, they are Christians, in addition to whatever else they believe in. If they believe in Jesus, and also believe in something that contradicts Jesus, God will have to decide what the true direction of their faith really is.

IIRC, you don't just have to "believe" in Jesus-Salvation. You need to embrace it as well, so how would you do that exactly?


The term "Jesus-salvation" might be like a function. But Jesus salvation is this. God didn't make mankind because He didn't care. God wanted mankind to exist righteously, for His own purposes.

The only way mankind could remain after they had destroyed their own perfection, was if someone strong enough could take all the punishment that was due to mankind for their imperfection they had gotten themselves into, would take it. This included taking death for all people.

Jesus is the Son of God. He live a perfect life as a man, and being God, He was strong enough to take all the punishment for all mankind, including death. Since He did this, and then offered the salvation He won to all mankind, the rest of it is simply technicalities. The first and major technicality is faith in Jesus.

The embracing of Jesus salvation starts happening after the judgment. All we need in this life is faith.

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