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Author Topic: Why we should never trust anyone for being the real Satoshi.  (Read 1034 times)
20kevin20 (OP)
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June 17, 2020, 01:58:00 PM
Last edit: June 17, 2020, 03:24:35 PM by 20kevin20
Merited by suchmoon (7), ABCbits (4)
 #1

Bitcoin has been around for more than a decade now, but Satoshi's identity remains a mystery.
Many are still looking to find the truth, but only a handful of people think of the consequences this solution could bring.


THE CREATION OF BITCOIN brought upon various opinions, initially mostly negative especially as the darknet quickly became the narrative of its existence and real purpose. Before the usage of Bitcoin for criminal activity, only few knew about it and Bitcointalk, the main forum for the king of cryptocurrencies, has proven not to be pro-crimes along its journey of existence.

Ross Ulbricht launched The Silk Road back in 2011, when Bitcoin was still known by only few. Using Tor for anonymity and Bitcoin for payments, Ulbricht was able to create a completely censor-free and anonymous website. However, that was only under the ideal usage of it. In fact, Ulbricht, known under the name of "Dread Pirate Roberts", had probably made a few mistakes that cost his privacy, his site and finally - his freedom.

Although The Silk Road did allow criminal activity to happen under an anonymous identity, according to FBI, a CAPTCHA service leaked the real IP under which the uncensored website was running. This, together with a lot of research done by intel agencies, led to the finding of Ulbricht as the owner of it.

However, the finding of Ross Ulbricht by the FBI has sparked controversies as some started to believe that FBI has actually found Ulbricht's identity illegally unlike they made the story look. According to WIRED, something is missing from the story of finding his identity:

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As bureau agent Christopher Tarbell describes it, he and another agent discovered the Silk Road's IP address in June of 2013. According to Tarbell's somewhat cryptic account, the two agents entered "miscellaneous" data into its login page and found that its CAPTCHA—the garbled collection of letters and numbers used to filter out spam bots—was loading from an address not connected to any Tor "node," (...) the CAPTCHA data was coming directly from a data center in Iceland, the true location of the server hosting the Silk Road.

But that account of the discovery alone doesn't add up, says Runa Sandvik (...). She says the Silk Road's CAPTCHA was hosted on the same server as the rest of the Silk Road. And that would mean all of it was accessible only through Tor's network of obfuscating bounced connections. If some element of the site were accessible through a direct connection, that would represent a significant flaw in Tor itself (...). "The way [the FBI] describe how they found the real IP address doesn’t make sense to anyone who knows a lot about Tor and how web application security works," Sandvik says. "There's definitely something missing here."

(...)

Just a month earlier, Cubrilovic points out, a Reddit user had posted that he or she had found a vulnerability that would allow a similar attack in the Silk Road's login page. And that early May date matches up with a footnote in the FBI's statement that mentions an earlier "leak" of the Silk Road's IP address.

Does this mean that the FBI has illegally found who Ulbricht is? Anyways, the thing is that, although The Silk Road did indeed help illicit activity operate, I do believe that its existence helped Bitcoin grow up faster and gave it a big spark of hope overall. In all honesty, many of us have actually started researching Bitcoin and Tor starting from the moment we heard of either its insane price growth, the darknet or both.

SATOSHI'S DISAPPEARANCE remains a mystery. Although he mostly operated on clearnet websites to communicate unlike Ulbricht, intel agencies are acting as if they don't have a single idea about who the real identity of Bitcoin's creator truly is. Considering the FBI, NSA and CIA have been able to unlock some great mysteries out there, is it really possible that Satoshi has always operated under the 100% ideal conditions so that not even the best agency out there could get to 'crack the code'?

Controversy about the FBI is not only linked to The Silk Road's case. Only last year did we hear about a former FBI lawyer being accused of altering documents in order to initiate surveillance in Trump's 2016 campaign. According to PJ Media,

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Horowitz reportedly found that the FBI employee who modified the FISA document falsely stated that he had “documentation to back up a claim he had made in discussions with the Justice Department about the factual basis” for the FISA warrant application, the Post reported. Then, the FBI employee allegedly “altered an email” to substantiate his inaccurate version of events. The employee has since been forced out of the bureau.

(...)

Newly released text messages involving text messages between Strzok and former FBI lawyer Lisa Page revealed that Page (...) had apparently made “edits” to the so-called “302” witness report in the case(...). Page told Strzok on February 10, 2017 that she “gave my edits to Bill to put on your desk.”

It obviously doesn't stop here. There are lots of conspriacies surrounding events such as UFOs, JFK's death, Hitler's alleged suicide, 9/11 and many other large-scale events that have not been yet declassified or, if they have, appear to have potentially critical missing information without which the dots cannot be connected. This is conspiracy now, but we have to ask ourselves: once (if ever) someone comes up and proves to be the real Satoshi, how and why do we trust him? What if the so-called "real Satoshi" is a false prophet of Bitcoin, willing to destroy it?

CRAIG WRIGHT is the perfect anti-example of Satoshi. If he was the real one, all he would've proved is that unlike many thought, Satoshi was a liar full of bullshit and, apparently, full of himself. Wright tried forging documents, falsifying e-mails and recently even f***ed up by declaring he owns the address containing Mt. Gox's hacked balances. But what else did he try to do?

Wright launched Bitcoin SV, as in "Satoshi's Vision", as a currency that supposedly follows the real Satoshi's vision unlike what we consider today to be Bitcoin. However, his bullshit fell just as short as everything he said in Court, on social media and everywhere else. Bitcoin SV is only his attempt to take over something that was never his. In fact, he even tried to call Bitcoin and Bitcoin Cash creators basically thieves. Had his bullshit ever had a little bit of substance, Bitcoin might have been taken down long time ago already as we all would've thought the real Satoshi has returned.

Therefore, Wright is just an attempt of Thomas Edison, who has been accused of stealing inventions and claiming credits for something he did not really invent. Edison is, interestingly, part of a conspiracy: the fact that he might've been implicated in the mysterious case of the father of cinema who also misteriously disappeared not too long after his invention. However, unlike Satoshi's mystery, we do know who Louis Le Prince was before he vanished. According to Historic Mysteries,

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Edison, who couldn’t have been less of a stranger to patent lawsuits – as he regularly incited them himself, including and especially inventions that he obviously came second to creating, but wanted credit for anyways – fought hard. It was the rich and already established company man versus family of a nobody inventor who never lived to see his legacy; I’ll let you take a minute to consider who might have won.

This one sounds very similar to what would've most likely happened if Craig's words were taken for granted. In fact, there is a number of people who do take them for granted and support his coin. But taking a look back at the court history of Craig, it makes me wonder.. considering he still hasn't been punished for all the lies he made up in the court and for the forged papers, could he actually be working with an intel agency and under its protection in an attempt to change the course of Bitcoin's history?

TRUSTING SOMEONE TO BE SATOSHI COULD MEAN THE END OF BTC AS WE KNOW IT. If someone ever proves to be the real Satoshi with real evidence, it could prove to be a big danger for Bitcoin's future. Craig Wright has said multiple times that the actual course Satoshi wanted to take was creating a regulation-friendly coin. By the creation of Bitcoin SV, I would understand that Craig goes against the fundamental ideas of Bitcoin while allegedly following them.

As a lot of people are looking up to the real Satoshi, if anyone ever proves to be him (false prophet of Bitcoin or not), that entity will have a lot of influence over a lot of people.

It is quite well-known that intel has technology +50 years ahead of us. One example is quantum computers - if they became the norm tomorrow, too much of the Internet would become vulnerable to it, possibly including Bitcoin itself. But they own it and they could use it to change or prove things that aren't really true.

2020 is only one decade past Bitcoin's creation. The timeframe is still short enough for us to look for the truth and there are too many witnesses for someone to come up and change history.. but if we ever trust someone for being the real Satoshi, even with the most proof possible, we might fall into someone's trap. Digital means some things could be altered and forged well enough to create a false timeline of false events, unless verifiable.

Obviously, there is a significant difference between being against the law and being against laws that allow abuse. Most of the regulations we see being pushed every now and then go against privacy and against what Satoshi really wanted to create. Trading Bitcoin ETFs? Using third-parties and having to trust them when using a currency that was created to be trustless? Having the governments/companies hold the keys of our own coins when the keys should be our own..

Most of the authorities have shown they do not support Bitcoin by launching regulations and laws that supposedly go for Bitcoin's growth when, in fact, they really go against it. Take it as "attempting to kill the initial Bitcoin by making it non-trustless" - or changing the fundamental ideas of Bitcoin in a slow and steady way. One example I always mention is Know-Your-Customer, the regulation that allowed and still allows a lot of companies to legally seize and steal their own customers' money.

Trusting someone for being the real Satoshi might mean unknowingly trusting an entity who might want to destroy what the initial project meant to turn Bitcoin into and allowing a big change that may end up to be the death of Bitcoin as we know it.
It is a common myth that Bitcoin is ruled by a majority of miners. This is not true. Bitcoin miners "vote" on the ordering of transactions, but that's all they do. They can't vote to change the network rules.
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June 17, 2020, 03:13:29 PM
 #2

Trusting someone for being the real Satoshi might mean unknowingly allowing a big change that may end up to be the death of Bitcoin as we know it.

Not necessarily. Trusting CSW, for example, to be the real Satoshi does not make any change at all. Neither does trusting Dorian Nakamoto to be the real Satoshi cause the death of Bitcoin. Neither does trusting anybody else allow a big change in the Bitcoin universe.

That big change will only take place if the real Satoshi shows any sign of activity.


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serjent05
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June 17, 2020, 03:43:08 PM
 #3


Trusting someone for being the real Satoshi might mean unknowingly allowing a big change that may end up to be the death of Bitcoin as we know it.

Or if the real Satoshi comes to the surface and proves that he is really the one, then a possibility of Bitcoin growth can be observed.  We all know, in each circumstance there is always a possible two route.  One that OP believes may lead to Bitcoin death or the opposite which can possibly lead to Bitcoin thriving because there will be this go-to guy whenever a conflict in development occurs.  Thus making it possible for the development of Bitcoin network to be faster. Aside from that, it will also create an explosion in terms of advertisement making Bitcoin as talk of the town during the appearance of its true creator.  This is just an assumption and may or may not happen but I am positive that it will bring a positive impact if ever the real Satoshi comes out.


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June 17, 2020, 04:09:07 PM
 #4

Trusting someone for being the real Satoshi might mean unknowingly trusting an entity who might want to destroy what the initial project meant to turn Bitcoin into and allowing a big change that may end up to be the death of Bitcoin as we know it.
Even you trust someone as a real satoshi which he isn't then it wouldn't make any difference. Perhaps some people believe Craig Steven Wright is satoshi but we can't see any effect on bitcoin since this is a false claim. I am sure bitcoin wouldn't ended up this way with false claim. But if we found real satoshi with sign from his address then likely we will encounter huge impact on bitcoin either positive or negative. But still I can't believe it will ended up. Perhaps he is more brilliant than us who have created bitcoin and that's why he know what would happen. I believe he will revealed himself on perfect time.

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June 17, 2020, 04:10:29 PM
 #5

If the real Satoshi is wise he keeps a low profile and leave the spotlight to Wright. We already know that he is just a scam artist but he takes away the attention of the real one thus protecting him in a way. What do you think would the FED, the IRS and a boatload of lawyers do with the real Satoshi if he goes public? They will roast him till there is no tomorrow. All those old fashioned banking folks would unleash their rage on him, definately not a pleasant thought. I still think the late Dave Kleiman was the main Satoshi and some others like Wright and Hal Finney, Nick Szabo and the other boys were the lackeys.
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June 17, 2020, 08:52:34 PM
 #6

If the real Satoshi is wise he keeps a low profile and leave the spotlight to Wright. We already know that he is just a scam artist but he takes away the attention of the real one thus protecting him in a way. What do you think would the FED, the IRS and a boatload of lawyers do with the real Satoshi if he goes public? They will roast him till there is no tomorrow. All those old fashioned banking folks would unleash their rage on him, definately not a pleasant thought. I still think the late Dave Kleiman was the main Satoshi and some others like Wright and Hal Finney, Nick Szabo and the other boys were the lackeys.
It makes no sense that the real Satoshi will remain idle when there are many players in the market claiming to be Satoshi, he would have already signed a message from the genesis block and stop and end to this speculation that is hurting the bitcoin community. The surprise here is that you knew that Wright is a scam artist and you still think that he has something to do with bitcoin in the initial stages which is really weird.

@OP If anyone could sign the known addresses of Satoshi then you could trust him to be Satoshi.
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June 17, 2020, 11:16:23 PM
Last edit: June 17, 2020, 11:29:05 PM by famososMuertos
 #7

Actually like trusting something or someone when it is no longer necessary, the cards are drawn, the game has already started, it only remains to play it as best as possible, under the rules and trust of a consensus of users.

Understand me, SN's identity is important to the community! , for bitcoin! or for governments! Which of these three elements is really interested in knowing who is SN?

Anyway, it is worth trusting or not,  today, tomorrow or when it appears (if it happens) if bitcoin already has the confidence it needed and is represented in 17 million bitcoin circulating at a price of almost $ 10,000*.

SN and its million BTC are more a well-thought-out strategy than what bitcoin represents, confidence in the security of funds and anonymity, the main standards that led today's bitcoin to have the value of almost $ 10,000. That in a way represents trust in bitcoin more than an individual.


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*check marketplace for current prices.
SN: Satoshi Nakamoto.


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June 18, 2020, 02:24:58 AM
 #8

For security and safety, Satoshi keeps being anonymous, so if someone calls him real Satoshi does not believe him because there would be no people who would let himself. or herself was known by many people because it is such a dangerous activity. There would be many people who will be interested in you and try to attack you because they know that you are so powerful a person and have so much money. Satoshi is so great, wise, and rich person because he made the successful cryptocurrency which is the bitcoin so he chose to be anonymous to protect himself and his family as well.
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June 18, 2020, 03:15:29 AM
 #9

You are right that we should not believe them at all They usually spread these false rumors Satoshi Nakamoto made bitcoin he is there but no one knows his exact information. If he had given his identity long ago he would not have kept the information secret for so long Those who want to identify themselves as Satoshi should stay away from these people They are always doing harm and inventing new scams These should be avoided for your own protection.

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June 18, 2020, 03:38:05 AM
 #10

For security and safety, Satoshi keeps being anonymous, so if someone calls him real Satoshi does not believe him because there would be no people who would let himself. or herself was known by many people because it is such a dangerous activity. There would be many people who will be interested in you and try to attack you because they know that you are so powerful a person and have so much money. Satoshi is so great, wise, and rich person because he made the successful cryptocurrency which is the bitcoin so he chose to be anonymous to protect himself and his family as well.

Claiming satoshi's identity is useless, you need to prove a lot of things and probably there's no one like him. He is unique and wise enough when it comes to this kind of activities that involves money. Maybe, Satoshi wants to leave a mark and mystery to us that's why he don't want to become known or famous about his creation.

Bitcoin is now popular and the most outstanding cryptocurrency among all other cryptocurrency, and Satoshi is really successful on making a digital currency that is useful for its users. No one can claim Satoshi's identity, he is one of a kind and if you claim it, probably, your life will become at risk.

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June 18, 2020, 03:57:31 AM
 #11

Can anyone even pose as Satoshi at this point in time? A decade is more than enough for records to be passed down, to be accessed by others, and the like. Proof of Satoshi may even be on the hands of multiple people now, whether it be an intentional release by Satoshi himself or not. Additionally, even if the real Satoshi comes out, not much could be done to the system of Bitcoin. It's been set there and then when it was created, there isn't much difference in what would happen whether Satoshi reveals himself alive, or reveals himself when he dies. Although there is a difference if the one that reveals himself is a faketoshi like CSW, which as you said, brought about a no small amount of negative raves to BTC.

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June 18, 2020, 04:11:00 AM
 #12

If someone can not prove he is the real Satoshi Nakamoto, why should we trust that person? Without proving to the public, we can consider that he will try to scam many people, especially new people who don't have more information about who is Satoshi. I only think that after Satoshi announcing about blockchain technology and bitcoin, he got an invite to join in another big project, so he decides to keep anonymous and hide his identity to the public, and let them have questions about who is he.

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June 18, 2020, 04:57:42 AM
 #13

If someone can not prove he is the real Satoshi Nakamoto, why should we trust that person? Without proving to the public, we can consider that he will try to scam many people, especially new people who don't have more information about who is Satoshi. I only think that after Satoshi announcing about blockchain technology and bitcoin, he got an invite to join in another big project, so he decides to keep anonymous and hide his identity to the public, and let them have questions about who is he.

It's plain and simple, sign the wallet address of the first transaction in the genesis block and show it to the public. Though proving that you are the real satoshi will not incur any help, it will just make bitcoin's market in a complicated situation as we know, it is satoshi's decision to remain anonymous, and we should respect that decision for good.

This personality Craig Wright has just proven himself as an impostor and just created hype for his personal interests in bitcoin and cryptocurrency. It doesn't really benefit us, thus, we just waste time reading news about him over time.
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June 18, 2020, 05:14:03 AM
 #14

Let me quote what I always say with regards to the real satoshi topic.

There are lots of rumors and conspiracy who Satoshi really is but none of the proves their claim. Talking about the real identity of satoshi is truly a great entertainment but it doesn't mean that we need to force ourselves in disclosing an identity of a person who doesn't even want a spotlight  Wink.

In fact, satoshi can be an alien, man, woman, a company or a non-binary. Again, it is entertaining but it will never shed some light.

More info here:
[1] Who is Satoshi Nakamoto ? Suspects, frauds and conspiracies on bitcointalk

It will always serve as an entertainment for everyone because of too much conspiracies involved to the real identity of satoshi. The only thing we can for now is to educate ourselves rather than making spotflight to a person called "faketoshi" who doesn't even contribute for the betterment of the bitcoin community. Though, at least, he's making a free advertisement for bitcoin itself.


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June 18, 2020, 06:34:16 AM
 #15

So you say that if the real Satoshi Nakamoto comes out of the shadows(if he's still alive),this would put Bitcoin in great danger.Why and how?Bitcoin Core is existing without Satoshi Nakamoto for so long.
Do you think that the real Satoshi will try to destroy Bitcoin Core?I don't think so.
Trusting someone to be the real Satoshi without any good evidence is just pure stupidity.
Having trust in this or that person that has or had any role in the creation of Bitcoin is kinda pointless.
We should trust the idea and concept behind Bitcoin Core/blockchain,not Satoshi or some of the fake imposters of Satoshi.

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June 18, 2020, 06:47:29 AM
 #16

Let's be realistic. SATOSHI NAKAMOTO remains himself/themselves to be anonymous. I believe there is a good reason behind why he wanted to stayed as a secret identity.

Quote
TRUSTING SOMEONE TO BE SATOSHI COULD MEAN THE END OF BTC AS WE KNOW IT. If someone ever proves to be the real Satoshi with real evidence, it could prove to be a big danger for Bitcoin's future.

But what if the REAL Satoshi came up and claimed that he is the real one? Providing all the evidences? Can't we still trust him? If ever one day he comes out, it is for the better progress of this blockchain technology he created.
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June 18, 2020, 06:49:09 AM
 #17

If the real Satoshi is wise he keeps a low profile and leave the spotlight to Wright. We already know that he is just a scam artist but he takes away the attention of the real one thus protecting him in a way. What do you think would the FED, the IRS and a boatload of lawyers do with the real Satoshi if he goes public? They will roast him till there is no tomorrow. All those old fashioned banking folks would unleash their rage on him, definately not a pleasant thought. I still think the late Dave Kleiman was the main Satoshi and some others like Wright and Hal Finney, Nick Szabo and the other boys were the lackeys.
It makes no sense that the real Satoshi will remain idle when there are many players in the market claiming to be Satoshi, he would have already signed a message from the genesis block and stop and end to this speculation that is hurting the bitcoin community. The surprise here is that you knew that Wright is a scam artist and you still think that he has something to do with bitcoin in the initial stages which is really weird.

@OP If anyone could sign the known addresses of Satoshi then you could trust him to be Satoshi.

I see your point but I disagree. Satoshi putting out a message would just mean that he is still alive and would motivate people, and regulatory folks, even more to search for him. The damage, if you really want to call it that, of people speculating of a real Satoshi in comparison to class action law suits against its inventor are 1:100000. Speculating is something that has no permanent effect on the price, a law suit and legal actions would have.
As for my idea about Wright being involved, I think he really was but I also think he is not the inventor he claims to be.
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June 18, 2020, 08:18:03 AM
 #18

OP, or we should be ready in slowly disowning Satoshi. Bitcoin has moved on, it SHOULD move on. Plus with the expanded technical understanding of the network, and blockchain scaling, I believe Satoshi might admit that using the term "peer to peer cash" in the white paper might be a mistake. It colored our perception.

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June 18, 2020, 08:26:03 AM
 #19

It's plain and simple, sign the wallet address of the first transaction in the genesis block and show it to the public.

That will prove you control those keys, nothing else. It is of course extremely compelling but not definitive. I'm not sure anything is when someone's entire story has taken place via channels that can be passed on to someone else.

And a Satoshi turning up now and attracting a following would be so out of character from everything that has gone before that he'd attract just as much suspicion as our favourite tubby Australian.
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June 18, 2020, 09:12:47 AM
 #20

It's plain and simple, sign the wallet address of the first transaction in the genesis block and show it to the public.

That will prove you control those keys, nothing else. It is of course extremely compelling but not definitive. I'm not sure anything is when someone's entire story has taken place via channels that can be passed on to someone else.

Right, https://nakamotoinstitute.org/static/satoshinakamoto.asc

And a Satoshi turning up now and attracting a following would be so out of character from everything that has gone before that he'd attract just as much suspicion as our favourite tubby Australian.

He opted to remain out of the limelight for many years as to not attract any attention as compare to the Fake Satoshi who wants everyone's eye and concoct a lot of contradicting stories that you really know he is trying hard to fit and become Satoshi himself.
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