Merits Tree 2021 - Who gives merits to whom

[Timelord2067]

As with any statistics, I'm wondering how you've placed the merit senders in the order you've chosen?

By comparison, comparing to BPIP.org information, those users you name fall well down the scale of ranks when the "merit circle" as opposed to those they favour are taken into consideration.

For example:

1^st (10) (10 shown)

suchmoon - merit circle - 1st / 2920
LoyceV - merit circle - 2nd / 2732
dbshck - merit circle - 18th / 1139
El duderino_ - merit circle - 37th / 692
Ratimov - merit circle - 7th / 1863
JayJuanGee - merit circle - 10th / 1701
fillippone - merit circle - 21st / 1052
ETFbitcoin - merit circle - 5th / 1922
Foxpup - merit circle - 43rd / 647 (Must be that merit closed circle holding them back)  
DdmrDdmr - merit circle - 8th / 1785

2^nd ( 11 - 30 ) (16 shown)

xandry - merit circle - 9th / 1740
vapourminer - merit circle - 4th / 2179
hugeblack - merit circle - 12th / 1516
Welsh - merit circle - 25th / 946
LFC_Bitcoin - merit circle - 15th / 1201
Halab - merit circle - 13th / 1277
theymos - merit circle - 11th / 1574
qwk - merit circle - 41st / 654 - (Satoshi 300)
The Pharmacist - merit circle - 14th / 1206
DarkStar_ - merit circle - 19th / 1074
EFS - merit circle - 45th / 642
OgNasty - merit circle - 3rd / 2540 (Satoshi 350)
frodocooper - merit circle - 68th / 492
o_e_l_e_o - merit circle - 6th / 1881
1miau - merit circle - 38th / 686
paxmao  - merit circle - 17th / 1150

3^rd ( 31 - 50 ) (18 shown)


Vispilio - merit circle - 64th / 528
klarki - merit circle - 19th / 1074
Vlad2Vlad - merit circle - 464th / 130 - hornetsnest (390) - a full third of all their merits earned.
krogothmanhattan - merit circle - 58th / 573
nutildah - merit circle - 16th / 1163
Vod - merit circle - 27th / 934
malevolent - merit circle - 34th / 735
BobLawblaw - merit circle - 108th / 338
bitmover - merit circle - 24th / 971
CryptopreneurBrainboss - merit circle - 23rd / 1014
tyz - merit circle - 56th / 578
Royse777 - merit circle - 48th / 619
Jet Cash - merit circle - 31st / 782
cabalism13 - merit circle - 52nd / 592
OmegaStarScream - merit circle - 32nd / 775
COOLCRYPTOVATOR - merit circle - 30th / 804
Buchi-88 - merit circle - 129th / 318
SyGambler - merit circle - 152nd / 287


Just for context:

Timelord2067 - merit circle - 80^th / 446 - (ranked above four of the users who's scores are shown in red above)

As a side note, I've been consistently hovering between 78th and 80th on the merit circle ranking.  With more merits, I believe I can keep this position, or even improve on it considerably. (cue the DT Trolls who are about to say "if your posts had merit..." all the while distrusting me...)


The trickle down of merits that theymos was wanting just isn't happening with many at the top going on the record time and again that they'd rather dump up to fifty merits in one go to a single user rather than actively searching out those whose posts actually deserve merit.

OP:

Either as a side thread, or as a part of this thread, it'd be worth seeing if the second tier (i.e. first recipients of your TOP 50 list) actually do the hard yards and dispense the merits they have received, or, the merits bounce around at the top leaving many below languishing.

[BlackHatCoiner]

I've sent over a thousand merits in the last 120 days as an appropriate merit source, now tell me. How generosity does it need to be in a first position?!   (jk I know you haven't finished)

Seriously now, I'm glad to be in the second position once and in the third 6 times. Being the third most-chosen user of @o_e_l_e_o and the second of @pooya87 is nice, but having your account merited by @DannyHamilton makes you feel especially outstanding. He's cheap.

I definitely have the above three in my three-fav list. Bpip agrees.

[KingsDen]

What really bugs me is users receiving many merits and not sending enough.
As a merit source, I often question myself about this.

It is really a bug not only to you but also to the forum at large. But I have this to say about it.
If the merit hoarder is not a merit source, I think there is no much problem even if he hoards forever.
However, if the hoarder is a merit source, it is a problem to the community. A merit source has a duty of distributing merits to quality posts. If some merit sources refuse to carry out this function, it will tell on the other merit sources who work their ass out in other to cover their laggings.
In order to check this, @Theymos can decide to increase the amount of merit sources, this time around paying much attention to the availability of the merit sources.
He can also consider if it is time to implement what he said

There is currently no decay, but if hoarding seems to become a problem, I might add it.

Again, I read where people complain about some kind of merit gang. There was when I was giving credence to that. But after I stumbled on @Theymos reply below, I appreciate the essence of the merit system. The Merit System helps to prevent spamming, account farming etc. So, it is better for a merit source to keep meriting some few users producing quality posts rather than hoarding it or let the allocated smerits expire

If they complain about amounts, tell them to complain to me. It's best if sources try to exhaust their source allocations, even if it means giving posts higher amounts than is typical. If you have 150 source merit and you only see 3 merit-worthy posts in a month, then I'd rather you over-give each of them 50 merit than let the merit expire.That way there are more people capable of sending merit, and the "merit economy" is less top-down

About Legendary users not needing more merits.

a person with Legendary rank has no advantages in receiving merits, as much as in spending them to incremental the pool of reliable users (with high rank)

Though I have seen a Legendary user telling lower ranking members not to merit him that he has no need for the merits, rather the merits should be used to help others rank up.
No matter how good this sounds, I still believe legendary users deserve merits, because there might be changes or addition of ranks anytime.
Psychological this might give rise to an unsaid two methods of issuing merits.

• Post based meriting: Meriting a post by blinding your eyes against the user you are sending to. Meriting strictly based on the quality of the post.
• User based meriting: Meriting or not meriting a post based on the user that made the post
  

No matter how fictional the above may sound, it systematically plays out in some cases. That is why it is good to appreciate a good post with a merits and also the merit sender be appreciated for noticing a good post. To be frank, this space is to big.

[Ahli38]

this is very interesting . quite clearly shows who is the benefactor giving or sending merit.
but out of that as a beginner, of course I have to be the one who gives good and interesting posts so that there are benefactors who want to give me awards according to their standards. and this award is very useful for newbies like me

[Timelord2067]

If they complain about amounts, tell them to complain to me. It's best if sources try to exhaust their source allocations, even if it means giving posts higher amounts than is typical. If you have 150 source merit and you only see 3 merit-worthy posts in a month, then I'd rather you over-give each of them 50 merit than let the merit expire.  That way there are more people capable of sending merit, and the "merit economy" is less top-down

Well, if someone is a merit source and after a whole month they haven't found even four posts that are "worthy" of merits, then the question remains: "Are @theymos' choices for merit sources really that good that they can't find even *four posts* so they don't have to dump fifty posts on *just* three posts in a month?"  That's one post per ten days (thereabouts) - just how active are these merit sources?"

That way there are more people capable of sending merit, and the "merit economy" is less top-down

But they're not being passed down.  Not really.

[joker_josue]

As with any statistics, I'm wondering how you've placed the merit senders in the order you've chosen?

As I indicated at the beginning of the topic, I'm using the Top-200 from @Coin-1 as a base:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=4523027.0

This top is from the beginning of merits. And analyze that I present is only the data from 2021, hence there are these differences in classification.

It was just a way of choosing users to present. I didn't happen to remember using BPIP.org.

Either as a side thread, or as a part of this thread, it'd be worth seeing if the second tier (i.e. first recipients of your TOP 50 list) actually do the hard yards and dispense the merits they have received, or, the merits bounce around at the top leaving many below languishing.

I find this idea interesting. I can try to make this presentation below. Thanks for the tip!

I've sent over a thousand merits in the last 120 days as an appropriate merit source, now tell me. How generosity does it need to be in a first position?!   (jk I know you haven't finished)

Here is friend: 

◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇	◆◇	◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇	◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇
			► pooya87 (222)
	┌	o_e_l_e_o (182)	► NeuroticFish (134)
	│		► BlackHatCoiner (124)
	│
	│		► o_e_l_e_o (147)
BlackHatCoiner	┼	pooya87 (85)	► BlackHatCoiner (120)
	│		► ranochigo (101)
	│
	│		► BlackHatCoiner (10)
	└	DannyHamilton (61)	► PrimeNumber7 (10)
			► kano (10)

[Timelord2067]

But they're not being passed down.  Not really.

Case in point:

Here is friend:  

◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇	◆◇	◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇	◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇
			► pooya87 (222)
	┌	o_e_l_e_o (182)	► NeuroticFish (134)
	│		► BlackHatCoiner (124)
	│
	│		► o_e_l_e_o (147)
BlackHatCoiner	┼	pooya87 (85)	► BlackHatCoiner (120)
	│		► ranochigo (101)
	│
	│		► BlackHatCoiner (10)
	└	DannyHamilton (61)	► PrimeNumber7 (10)
			► kano (10)

No offense to anyone named.

[KingsDen]

<snip>
Well, if someone is a merit source and after a whole month they haven't found even four posts that are "worthy" of merits, then the question remains: "Are @theymos' choices for merit sources really that good that they can't find even *four posts* so they don't have to dump fifty posts on *just* three posts in a month?"  That's one post per ten days (thereabouts) - just how active are these merit sources?"

No matter the standard the merit source(s) set for issuing merits, there is no way a dedicated merit source cannot find atleast 10 merit worthy posts to distribute his smerits.
Saying about @Theymos choices of merit sources, it seems that some merits sources did not apply to be one. Maybe it was just handed to them by @Theymos.
You know the zeal to accomplish a task you applied for is different from the one used to accomish a task imposed on you.

[LoyceV]

But they're not being passed down.  Not really.

Case in point:

◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇	◆◇	◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇	◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇◆◇
			► pooya87 (222)
	┌	o_e_l_e_o (182)	► NeuroticFish (134)
	│		► BlackHatCoiner (124)
	│
	│		► o_e_l_e_o (147)
BlackHatCoiner	┼	pooya87 (85)	► BlackHatCoiner (120)
	│		► ranochigo (101)
	│
	│		► BlackHatCoiner (10)
	└	DannyHamilton (61)	► PrimeNumber7 (10)
			► kano (10)

BlackHatCoiner finds good posts and Merits them. BlackHatCoiner also makes good posts and receives Merit for them. That's how the Merit system is supposed to work If you want to complain about a "Merit circle", you should find a circle that Merits shitposts.

[naim027]

Good work OP. Very informative. I never knew about your thread. I am using a notification Bot for mention and merits. I just figured out that you mentioned my name here. I am not that old member. I just woke up last year and make my come back to the forum. It's a good achievement for me that at least I got some merits from reputed members.

Anyways, Thank you very much.

[o_e_l_e_o]

Since I've been notified 5 times that I am being dragged in to this nonsense drama which is being stirred up, I feel obligated to respond.

I frequent the technical boards. If you make good posts in the technical boards, then I will merit you. I pay little attention to who has made the post. There are a small subset of users which frequently make such posts and so I will merit them more. Such scenarios are the case for many other users or groups of users who frequently send merit in the WO thread, in the collectibles section, in their local boards, etc.

I would also point out that, at present, I have sent merit to the 6th highest number of unique users.

Any further concerns about my merit cycling can be directed to Foxpup.

[BlackHatCoiner]

Case in point:

If you want to complain about my meriting policy do it on the proper thread. You don't convince me to wear the Foxpup's avatar for this blame.

[Timelord2067]

(cue the DT Trolls who are about to say "if your posts had merit..." all the while distrusting me...)

Not one...

If you want to complain about a "Merit circle", you should find a circle that Merits shitposts.

Not two...

Any further concerns about my merit cycling can be directed to Foxpup.

Three raw nerves hit in one post.

If you want to complain about my meriting policy do it on the proper thread. You don't convince me to wear the Foxpup's avatar for this blame.

Good. 

Not that my post actually canvased that particular topic ^{1}, but still - nice to know you''re still trying to put spin on a bad decision.  My point you missed in your haste to click flame reply is that your merits are not going down the totem pole, just buzzing around at about head height.


^{1} - My use of the phrase merit circle comes from the BPIP page (example: https://bpip.org/Profile?p=theymos ) second section "Merit Information" last entry "circle"

[suchmoon]

(cue the DT Trolls who are about to say "if your posts had merit..." all the while distrusting me...)

Not one...

If you want to complain about a "Merit circle", you should find a circle that Merits shitposts.

You're lucky LoyceV has the skin of a hippo:



Although I doubt that your cringy begging here is going to earn you many other "merit fans".

[Timelord2067]

... Time to let it go ...

To quote what LoyceV has written on many an occasion...

Don't like what someone has written about you?

Boo Fucking Hoo!

(but it is interesting that you appear to be making threats on behalf of another person to withhold giving out merits...)

Collusion?  Or just bravado?  Either way... Time to let it go...

[suchmoon]

~

Lead by example. Apply for a merit source position. theymos has given those out to scammers and shitcoiners and other dross so your chances are good.

[joker_josue]

Take it easy guys (or girls). This topic aims to have a different view of the path that merits take.

Perhaps many of us hadn't noticed before that the merits tend to "go back" to whoever gave them initially.
There are many factors for this, but the main one I think is the fact that who is a source of merit tends to be someone who makes quality posts. One thing leads to another.

So, despite finding an interesting analysis, no one escapes this fact: we receive merits from those who give.
So it's not worth stressing about it. Each one has its own method of attributing merits. And the fact that there is no pre-established standard is what makes this tool impartial. Since each one gives the merits in the way that he/she thinks most suitable for him/her.

Even those who receive and do not give merit have their value, due to the work they do in the community that deserves these merits.

It is good to debate how merits are awarded. This shows other ideas of how they can be used, and allows some to change their criteria or refine them.

So, guys, let's continue to build beautiful trees of merit!  


EDIT:
More trees of merit soon! 

[BlackHatCoiner]

Good.

Just for your information, I never applied for merit source, I just woke up in noon and saw a PM from theymos. I keep meriting the same way I did before, but more frequently and with higher amounts. There's literally nothing bad about that. Don't be ironic to me (and to my fellow merit cyclers), your moaning to theymos.

BTW, merits have no value to people who are already above Sr. Member. It just shows respect.

[Timelord2067]

~

Lead by example. Apply for a merit source position. theymos has given those out to scammers and shitcoiners and other dross so your chances are good.

Are you prepared in 2022 to wipe the slate clean and start again?

Good.

Just for your information, I never applied for merit source, I just woke up in noon and saw a PM from theymos. I keep meriting the same way I did before, but more frequently and with higher amounts. There's literally nothing bad about that. Don't be ironic to me (and to my fellow merit cyclers), your moaning to theymos.

BTW, merits have no value to people who are already above Sr. Member. It just shows respect.

I actually said one time that anyone who is a merit source should be excluded from receiving further merits as I noticed a while ago that merits have a way (with out any deliberate intentions) to resurface near their origins.  I became Legendary prior to the merit system, so I look forward to the day I become "legendary" a second time having received ~1000 merits along with anyone trying to climb the ladder.

We're good, you and I.

Perhaps many of us hadn't noticed before that the merits tend to "go back" to whoever gave them initially.

That is, in essence, was the point I was trying to make.

Thanks for this thread, it's very insightful.

See also:

• Giving merit to people when you don't agree with them
• Spending smerits as you earn them.
• Merit Backscratchers: who scratched who's back the most?
• Merit Sources without activity in the past 20 days
• why hoarding Smerits?

More if I can find them.

[suchmoon]

Are you prepared in 2022 to wipe the slate clean and start again?

I want no part of your riddles. My suggestion was for you to become part of a solution instead of blaming others for your perceived merit issues.

Not that there is any actual issue. No one has ever produced any kind of damning list of good valuable posters being deprived of merits because there are circles or whatever.